The Wild Beyond the Walls Mafia Spirits Wins!

[swang918]

At first I assumed whoever's water LC had poisoned would now be automatically killed during Night 2. But the text reads "everyone took sips of healthy water" and LC's bottle leaked a foul-smelling liquid. Why would the killer retained a poisoned liquid?

Everyone took healthy sips of water -- not sips of healthy water. So I read it as everyone drank a good amount of water, including the person whose bottle got poisoned.

[fusibaseball]

Everyone took healthy sips of water -- not sips of healthy water. So I read it as everyone drank a good amount of water, including the person whose bottle got poisoned.

You're right. Apparently I needed to read it three times.

So Strike is including this text to verify that the poisoned target drank ample water and will be killed Night 2?

[TrafalgarLaw01]

At first I assumed whoever's water LC had poisoned would now be automatically killed during Night 2. But the text reads "everyone took sips of healthy water" and LC's bottle leaked a foul-smelling liquid. Why would the killer retained a poisoned liquid?

Everyone took healthy sips of water -- not sips of healthy water. So I read it as everyone drank a good amount of water, including the person whose bottle got poisoned.

Agree. It's not quite clear, seems one of us is done for. Might be fusi to keep his trend of not staying alive before D3 except when he was the godfather

Seriously I think the poison did went trough. Anyway another question we must ask is who was the target of the mafia last night. Did the doc guessed right or what happened

FP by fusi

[swang918]

I'm going to assume Loose was 3p. Serial killer should be 3p and it doesn't make sense for a scum to be a serial killer.

So did Loose happen to be scum team's night kill?

Or is there some kind of roaming role that potentially confronts attacks people who are out and about at night? Seems farfetched.

Looking at the scene it does not appear to be some kind of role that kills whoever visits them. Basically, what sonic said, that the poisonee does not seem to be the same person as the killer.

I lean toward Loose being coincidentally the kill target for scum. Would explain why there is no scum kill.

Will need to think through why scum would choose to target Loose.

I'm leaning town on Fusibaseball. When we were on a scum team he didn't want to kill someone who got bounced early in previous game. So I assume a scum fusi would not want to kill Loose.

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Ah right loose might have been the Scum target

[Votanic]

My thoughts:
• Maybe LC was the scum target... but as others have wrote, if that is so, why LC?
LC said he was City, and I don't know why that would even be something to lie about... but possibly so.

• The "healthy' sips of water" does suggest that somebody has been poisoned... There might be a healer (poison doctor?) role that could save whomever was poisoned... but only if the healer knew who the poisoned one was... and that seems unlikely at this point.
@ strike" is 'eschewing' a typo for 'rescrewing'?

• The big question is why do we even know about the poisoning? Often something like that is not known until the after-game reveal.
My guess is strike is just being kind and giving us all (town and scum) a clue. Two deaths tonight seems likely, though not certain.
The fact that players know about the poisoning, but also drank the water, is probably just part of the convoluted nature of gameplay storytelling...

• In a game of this size, I doubt there would be more than one third party... and it seems very likely LC's role was third party (serial killer + purple type). A serial killer is usually a role that kills someone each night... Was the game designed to average two kills each night, at least at first?
In a situation like that the number of scum becomes harder to predict... At first, I thought we might now have 9 town, 3 scum... but since scum would also be third party targets (with chances of dying proportional to their numbers)... that could argue for a scenario with either more (4?) or less (2?) scum.

• The poisoner description does suggest that poisoning can sometimes be used in place of a typical scum kill... but that seems doubtful, especially with the reference to serial killer...

[strike wolf]

My thoughts:
• Maybe LC was the scum target... but as others have wrote, if that is so, why LC?
LC said he was City, and I don't know why that would even be something to lie about... but possibly so.

• The "healthy' sips of water" does suggest that somebody has been poisoned... There might be a healer (poison doctor?) role that could save whomever was poisoned... but only if the healer knew who the poisoned one was... and that seems unlikely at this point.
@ strike" is 'eschewing' a typo for 'rescrewing'?

• The big question is why do we even know about the poisoning? Often something like that is not known until the after-game reveal.
My guess is strike is just being kind and giving us all (town and scum) a clue. Two deaths tonight seems likely, though not certain.
The fact that players know about the poisoning, but also drank the water, is probably just part of the convoluted nature of gameplay storytelling...

• In a game of this size, I doubt there would be more than one third party... and it seems very likely LC's role was third party (serial killer + purple type). A serial killer is usually a role that kills someone each night... Was the game designed to average two kills each night, at least at first?
In a situation like that the number of scum becomes harder to predict... At first, I thought we might now have 9 town, 3 scum... but since scum would also be third party targets (with chances of dying proportional to their numbers)... that could argue for a scenario with either more (4?) or less (2?) scum.

• The poisoner description does suggest that poisoning can sometimes be used in place of a typical scum kill... but that seems doubtful, especially with the reference to serial killer...

Eschewing was autocorrect changing rescrewing which I didn't catch. I'll go fix it.

[Charle]

Ah right loose might have been the Scum target

Yes that might be right, but I ask myself the question, why LC? I still need to go through all Loose's posts but I don't remember him as any threat to anybody although I think it was lucky for town though. I am not experienced, but could it be a random choice?

The poisoner is also interesting, so hopefully he was on target to hit scum.

[SoN!c]

Wow...LC 3rd party again.
...

Separately, is there legitimacy to this villager vs city-dweller bit? Pal had come with the group from the city, so is the going assumption that city-dwellers are scum and 3rd party while villagers are town-aligned? Is an "Alabasian" a city dweller?

Is an "Alabasian" a city dweller?
"The First Night in the woods outside the village was one of excitement and fear for the Alabastians. The stars were almost fully blocked out by the thick canopy of leaves and the moon, half full and spilling, shone through the leaves casting patterns across the ground." makes me think the Alabastians/Alabasians (auto-correct?) are the city dwellers - they see the stars and moon producing a ghostly light through the trees for the first time. That can't be the jungle (forest) tribe villagers

As morning light filtered in, "the villagers and Alabasians" = the villagers and the city dwellers so YES i'd say the "Alabasians" are the City Dwellers.

quoting Vot here:

The city/village distinction may or may not have any significance, but in any case, lets keep track of it.
6 claim city: Votanic, DDS, Sonic, Devante, Loose Canon, Ewebasher
4 claim village: Charle, swang, Pmchugh, Pixar
3 have not claimed: traf, Kingm, Fusi
No claims are confirmed.

5 claim city: Votanic, DDS, Sonic, Devante, Loose Canon, Ewebasher
4 claim village: Charle, swang, Pmchugh, Pixar
3 have not claimed: traf, Kingm, Fusi

so is the going assumption that city-dwellers are scum and 3rd party while villagers are town-aligned?

That would make it real easy to find them no? But the numbers could give a clue?

So in the beginning of the game i was thinking an even number like 5 city dwellers and 5 villagers but i left that idea pretty soon- didn't think that would be possible with 13 players

(To be 5 city dwellers and 5 villagers it would mean there are just 2 scum spirits and to be 4-4 that would mean 5 scum/3P.) But now, with Loose a serial killer Vot could be right

At first, I thought we might now have 9 town, 3 scum... but since scum would also be third party targets (with chances of dying proportional to their numbers)... that could argue for a scenario with either more (4?) or less (2?) scum.

In any case i didn't think much of the village/city difference before - was thinking its just the story, not part of the actual game mechanics, as the scum are "spirits" but after N1 how does a "spirit attack" fit in here? It seems the difference is more important then at first

[pmchugh]

Didnt think about the delayed poison kill so been reading the N1 mod story and the D1 daybreak story again.
So 2 things: the city group has problems with the village group and who-ever killed Loose was a city dweller. That clears Pixar from being the Loose killer.

Where are you getting this from?

so is the going assumption that city-dwellers are scum and 3rd party while villagers are town-aligned?

That would make it real easy to find them no? But the numbers could give a clue?

So in the beginning of the game i was thinking an even number like 5 city dwellers and 5 villagers but i left that idea pretty soon- didn't think that would be possible with 13 players

(To be 5 city dwellers and 5 villagers it would mean there are just 2 scum spirits and to be 4-4 that would mean 5 scum/3P.) But now, with Loose a serial killer Vot could be right

That would be a lot of scum/3rd party. Like with 4 scum, a serial killer who kills one night delayed and say a survivor, the game could be over tonight. Unless it was 2 groups of two mafia, but then I wouldn't expect both groups to be city dwellers, but one to be city and one to be village.

Also, if all 3/4 wolves were one faction, they would surely not all claim truthfully it or it would be too big of a clue.

[DirtyDishSoap]

I don't think the numbers of city or villager is of a big tell. We only have one confirmed city and it ended up being a SK/Arson.
I don't think it was a Vig kill. (Don't reveal if it was). Think it was scum kill.

3P can be helpful though. Did Loose go after anyone in particular? Passive or otherwise that would warrant him being killed?

FPed but no change to my original

[Votanic]

I don't think the numbers of city or villager is of a big tell. We only have one confirmed city and it ended up being a SK/Arson.
I don't think it was a Vig kill. (Don't reveal if it was). Think it was scum kill.

3P can be helpful though. Did Loose go after anyone in particular? Passive or otherwise that would warrant him being killed?

FPed but no change to my original

LC claimed City, but his death scene doesn't confirm that.

[pmchugh]

I don't think the numbers of city or villager is of a big tell. We only have one confirmed city and it ended up being a SK/Arson.
I don't think it was a Vig kill. (Don't reveal if it was). Think it was scum kill.

3P can be helpful though. Did Loose go after anyone in particular? Passive or otherwise that would warrant him being killed?

FPed but no change to my original

Most of Looses posts are about vot and how he would be powerful as both town or mafia, I think he wanted rid of him to up his own chances of winning. That doesn't really tell us anything about vots alignment itself because Loose didn't know it.

I actually don't think Loose would have targetted vot night 1, because he said vot would be at the top of his list for protection, unless the poison mechanic can't be stopped by normal doc visit.

[DirtyDishSoap]

It doesn't, I'm asking if he had any suspicion on any particular player. There was, ironically, you, a vote on Pix and I believe Fusi as was well but I'm reluctant with the latter two.

FPed again. Bejesus!

[DirtyDishSoap]

Judging from what i read about Poison role, looks like it's inevitable unless a Poison Doc is present. Gl figuring that out though. I don't think LC would have chosen Vot as his first either for the record.

[Ewebasher]

Think it was scum kill.

3P can be helpful though. Did Loose go after anyone in particular? Passive or otherwise that would warrant him being killed?

He put Vot towards the top of his list I believe...

And to be honest I find SoN!c bigging up Vot (with agreement from Dev) on D1 a bit suss... not sure how inventing a sword, getting defensive after 2 joke votes, then trying to start a bandwagon against the next person to mention swords, never actually claiming city (just adding himself to his own list) makes him our best guide on D1...

[SoN!c]

... and who-ever killed Loose was a city dweller. That clears Pixar from being the Loose killer.

Where are you getting this from?

Your right, misread the text

"He made his way back to his tent but on the way, he ran into another one of their group. He tried to stay calm, sure that the stranger hadn't seen him, "hey. Kind of late to be out, isn't it? I guess we're both too anxious to sleep?""

"he ran into another of their group" = i was thinking "their group" = the city dweller group but next sentence is "the stranger" so that would make him part of the opposite group.

So "their group" in this sentence is probably the big group together (city dwellers and village together). It says 'their group" later on again in the story specific as the city dweller group Loose was part of so that got me confused.


and @ Vot :

LC claimed City, but his death scene doesn't confirm that.

Loose was Confirmed City:

"Everyone cleared out of the area and one of the braver ones approached, cloth over the face and IDed Pal Corno as one who had came with their group from the city."

[*Pixar*]

Not sure how I feel about any of this, other than as town we got lucky. PMC voting me is odd, not sure how or why he chose me other than the fact I have the topic on "Subscribe" so yes, I can read and respond immediately most times lol and we were ALL claiming villager or city at the time... I take it no one with importance has anything to report from last night?

[pmchugh]

Not sure how I feel about any of this, other than as town we got lucky. PMC voting me is odd, not sure how or why he chose me other than the fact I have the topic on "Subscribe" so yes, I can read and respond immediately most times lol and we were ALL claiming villager or city at the time... I take it no one with importance has anything to report from last night?

Why weren't you responding to any of the other posts if you have it on subscribe? Doesn't feel like model town behaviour to be reading everything but not responding and then jumping in to defend yourself as soon as someone tries to start something.

[Votanic]

Think it was scum kill.

3P can be helpful though. Did Loose go after anyone in particular? Passive or otherwise that would warrant him being killed?

He put Vot towards the top of his list I believe...

And to be honest I find SoN!c bigging up Vot (with agreement from Dev) on D1 a bit suss... not sure how inventing a sword, getting defensive after 2 joke votes, then trying to start a bandwagon against the next person to mention swords, never actually claiming city (just adding himself to his own list) makes him our best guide on D1...

No, they weren't joke votes, they were real votes, and that is exactly how scummy randwagons start on Day 1.
I still haven't taken back my FOS at pmchugh or fusi for pulling that stunt.

DDS also voted Traf early on tool, and he is known for being overly devoted to his own jokes... Thatcould just be excessive fluffplay ...but it could also be scum-assisting distraction. That's why I tried to tamp it down. I still don't want to waste time talking about swords or any other flavor nonsense...

Also, the whole idea that a player defending oneself from votes and accusations is scummy, is in itself scummy.
Don't panic about a vote, but don't ignore it either.
Ignoring a vote and hoping it will just go away (and won't be noticed by others) is what really looks scummy.
If someone accuses or suggests something you know is false, by all means, refute it!

...and, I declared my 'citizenship' long before any other player, ...so stop skimming, go back and reread.

FPed by Ppmchugh...
I don't see why you consider Pixar claiming to be scummy.
Actually, I want the last three unclaimed player to make a claim. (Traf even said he would...)
O

[SoN!c]

...That could just be excessive fluffplay .... That's why I tried to tamp it down. I still don't want to waste time talking about swords or any other flavor nonsense...
...
If someone accuses or suggests something you know is false, by all means, refute it!
...and, I declared my 'citizenship' long before any other player, ...
Actually, I want the last three unclaimed player to make a claim. (Traf even said he would...)
O

Vot, can you explain your recurrent comments about so much focus on who declared himself city dweller / forest town / who didn't declare his allegiance at all while thats just flavor?

I mean the entire time your saying the story is all "flavor nonsense" and "you don't want to waste any time talking about it " (the story or the story elements), but you are the only one who seems focussed (almost obsessed) with that part of the story (finding out who is forest village / who is city dweller in the story.. "citizenship" as you name it)

[Kingm]

I really don't want to say to much, since then I'm afraid I might not live through the next night, but I guess I have to say something.
I strongly belive that Votanic is scum, and killed LC last night, since LC was a serial killer, we should probably say thanks.

I will start the voting early and VOTE Votanic

[TrafalgarLaw01]

I really don't want to say to much, since then I'm afraid I might not live through the next night, but I guess I have to say something.
I strongly belive that Votanic is scum, and killed LC last night, since LC was a serial killer, we should probably say thanks.

I will start the voting early and VOTE Votanic

Hmmm have you got any info? I mean I kinda want Votanic as well cause I kinda agree with what ewe posted before. And feel his defense on 2 votes were kinda odd especially when later he tried to push a "joke" wagon for jokes with sword.

[fusibaseball]

What Vot has been saying is odd to me too. I was about to vote him earlier today but decided against it.

There's no way he actually thought those 2 votes from me and PMC were serious votes Day 1. I even put my text in huge size, bold, and underlined at the last second to make it obvious. And he's trying to use that as a basis for me and PMC to claim today...it's just weird.

@King: If you're an investigative role and pinged useful info on Vot last night, my opinion is you should divulge that. Worst case scenario is you are targeted tonight and we trade 1 Scum for 1 Cop, which is always a good trade for Town.

Vote Vot

[Kingm]

I really don't want to say to much, since then I'm afraid I might not live through the next night, but I guess I have to say something.
I strongly belive that Votanic is scum, and killed LC last night, since LC was a serial killer, we should probably say thanks.

I will start the voting early and VOTE Votanic

Hmmm have you got any info? I mean I kinda want Votanic as well cause I kinda agree with what ewe posted before. And feel his defense on 2 votes were kinda odd especially when later he tried to push a "joke" wagon for jokes with sword.

Yeah, let just say I saw both Votanic and LC together N1, and I guess there is probably some scenario that does not have Votanic involved in the murder, but I find it much more likely that Votanic is scum and killed LC.