CL8 Discussion Area

[macken]

Agreed with Donelladan.

Clear rules.
Comment on interesting issues arising from rules and other.

[PaulatPeace]

A report has been filed with me, concerning account sitting abuse. This will be looked into with the help of admin (king achilles), who have the tools to do so.

This thread is not the place to file reports of abuse or infractions, nor is it a place to discuss those issues. The proper way is to contact t[u]he TO, which is me, Lindax.

Please leave this up to us and stop the discussion (and mudslinging) here.

Lx

And where would be the place to discuss CL8 matter and mudslinging ? I think clan war threads used to be the place for such accusations and heated debate.
For the CL8, this seems to be the equivalent of the clan war thread, and therefore the appropriate place to accuse another clan of having no honour, integrity and such things.
I think clans players are interested in this discussion, also it make for some animation in the clan forum.
Everyone has been quite respectful of each other so far, therefore it seems there is no reason to ask us to stfu.
And I totally understand that whatever we says here will not influence the decision you'll take, it doesn't matter, the discussion can still happen, regardless of what you'll decision will be, just for the pleasure of discussing the matter between us.

My request is therefore, let us talk ! It doesn't hurt.
Clan forum shouldn't be completely clean and quiet.
When you follow sports, the supporters not only watch the game but also spend lot of times arguing about the game and referee's decision. That's part of the fun !


Now, on the topic itself, how this is treated is definitely of interest for everyone, and a more general discussion on the sitting could be made.
I am not talking of the S&M/TOP case here, I am speaking of the issue of how the sitting rules have to be interpreted. Those rules have been created after some serious clan sitting abuse was made. In order to avoid sitting abuse it has been decided that emergency sitting was allowed if the clock was below 2 hours. josko point of view on this matter and the interpretation of this rule by every clan may merit an open discussion as this is something that concern everyone.
What TOP is describing ( people wait for discussion but then go below 2 hours and someone else sit them and play their turn) is something that happened to LHDD as well, and I am quite sure to other clans too. Should CD take the decision that this kind of things have to be really exceptional and that it should be avoided at all cost ? This is something that concern everyone and is way above the S&M/TOP matter.
If we are not allowed to discuss it here, then please, create a new topic about Sitting in emergeny, and move all posts from the 1st post of josko in this new topic.

Very well said Don!

I actually came to this thread to ask the same question, but in a more general manner so as not to be interpreted as violating someone's directive. I have not been around these threads as long as most of you, but it does seem the appropriate place for such discussions. There have already been several topics to date that were included in this thread which specifically had to do with the CL 8, but we were asked to either stop talking about it or go somewhere else to do so. I too would like some clarification on why we should not be able to discuss things respectfully here...especially if they are pertinent to the CL 8 and also of interest to many of us in general. As Don alluded to, some of these topics are bigger than just one specific instance. Also as Shoop76 said "Why can't this be discussed here? Is it better to do it secretly?" TOP certainly has no problem with any accusations at any time levied against us being discussed out in the open. It will be of benefit for everyone to see what's happening. Maybe all of us can learn a few things. I am open to this!

I am presenting my message here in a general manner and not referencing anything specifically...so as to make sure I am not in violation of any warning.....but I will tell you this.....telling all of us to be quiet and stop talking about something...when we are doing so respectfully and this is OUR tournament....well it just doesn't set well with me...and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

Paul

[josko.ri]

I am happy that I can now continue discussion related to account sitting abuse done by FreeFalling123 in the Usa 2.1 game versus my clan.

Here is just an example how players who are not available later during the turn play their turn without discussion in S&M clan:

Game 17122838
2017-01-18 11:39:51 - BIG_John ended the turn and got spoils
2017-01-18 12:20:08 - ender_w99 received 3 troops for 11 regions
2017-01-18 12:24:36 - ender_w99 [team]: I had to take my turn tonight.

As can be seen, our player ender_w99 was quite busy that day because he was not sure that he will be back later that day to play this turn. Knowing that he may not be back to play his turn within the 24 hour timeframe, he went ahead and played it with 23.20 hours left on timer, without input and discussion from the other 3 teammates. He played respecting the site rules because it was his only chance during that day to be online.

Contrary to that in Usa 2.1 Game 17122839 FreeFalling123 sat in 2 of 3 opening turns played by his teammates, where I found that nibotha played turns in other games 14, 13, 12, 10 and 2.5 hours before FreeFalling123 sat for him so he was often online during that day and could normally play his turn in the Usa 21 game yet he decided to leave the turn to be played by 5 time more experienced sitter on Usa 21 map. Similarly, I found that jaybrake played turn in other game 17 hours before FreeFalling123 sat for him, yet he intentionally left the turn to be played by sitter who is 7 times more experienced on Usa 2.1 map.

Also, it is interesting to see what FreeFalling123 wrote in Hive Game 17122837 chat, so I will quote it here:

2017-01-15 14:55:12 - FreeFalling123: I really do hope he (Bruceswar) plays, but if he isn't joining this game expecting to play 50% of his moves, then by the rules your team must rehost and choose a different partner.
2017-01-15 14:56:38 - FreeFalling123: If we win, then we don't care if your best player plays every one of his moves, but if we lose, then surely I will be the first to complain on the rules and integrity of this game. I know Bruce is a good-hearted man just trying to do the best he can, so
2017-01-15 14:57:38 - FreeFalling123: nothing against him. Just play by the rules and feel free to call us out when we don't abide by them ourselves.

FreeFalling123 clearly stated that if our clan member does not play 50% of his moves, then the game need to be replayed with different partner. however, at the same time 50% of opening round turns in USA 2.1 game was played by sitter FreeFalling123 while original player was online earlier the same day playing other turns, so by using the same rules which FreeFalling123 mentioned in the Hive chat, we thought that we have basis to ask for the Usa 2.1 game to be replayed, given that in already 2 turns significant strategic advantage was used by TOP clan with more experienced sitter playing turn instead of original players themselves. Therefore, we went ahead and asked TO for replay of the Usa 2.1 game immediately after the second illegal usage of sitter happened. We did not want to ask for the replay of the game after only one infraction, but when it happened 2 infractions in only one round, we felt it was enough illegal strategical advantage taken by TOP that the game have basis in rules to be replayed. Finally, FreeFalling123 himself obviously agrees with us because he clearly wrote that if 50% of Bruceswar's turns will be played by sitter then he will ask for the Hive game to be replayed.

Also, I have question for PaulatPeace (or whoever else will give the reply). Why did not nibotha take his turn when he played 16 other turns just 2.5 hours before FreeFalling123 sat for him but he intentionally left the turn to be played by sitter, even sending message to FreeFalling123 to sit for him? I received answer from PaulatPeace by pm, but I want answer to be visible by everyone for clarification.

[fairman]

This problem can easily be solved ....
Josko.ri should play in TheOmegaPantheon clan.

[macken]

I have the feeling that a mountain has been made from a grain of sand.

I do not have so much time available for all these details.

But it is interesting.
And the rules should be clear and known by all.

[josko.ri]

I have the feeling that a mountain has been made from a grain of sand.

I do not have so much time available for all these details.

But it is interesting.
And the rules should be clear and known by all.

Rules are already known because there were past cases of several players doing the same what FreeFalling123 did who were Warned for their abuse. We already have precedent rulings on cases like this one.

[IcePack]

I'm not sure where you / FreeFalling are getting that 50% rule from. As far as I know, it doesn't exist. There is something about not putting in players who aren't expected to play (for example, a new game starts and a day later the player goes on a 2 week vacation and is covered by sitters) but I've never heard or seen any 50% rule that's being referenced, or that games be remade in that scenario.

The case is under review, waiting on some responses before anything is finalized.

[iAmCaffeine]

What happens if Aeternus receives our final warning? We just got our second because someone decided to quit CC and didn't inform me until after the deadline. We also had someone change their password and deadbeat out of the site. There are also other potential things affecting this but I need to look into it before I know if an admin is required or not.

[IcePack]

What happens if Aeternus receives our final warning? We just got our second because someone decided to quit CC and didn't inform me until after the deadline. We also had someone change their password and deadbeat out of the site. There are also other potential things affecting this but I need to look into it before I know if an admin is required or not.

The rules are here for infractions (section "rules and infractions" in the OP.

viewtopic.php?f=441&t=220019#p4857563

[iAmCaffeine]

What happens if Aeternus receives our final warning? We just got our second because someone decided to quit CC and didn't inform me until after the deadline. We also had someone change their password and deadbeat out of the site. There are also other potential things affecting this but I need to look into it before I know if an admin is required or not.

The rules are here for infractions (section "rules and infractions" in the OP.

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 9#p4857563

Ah okay, so if for whatever reason we miss a deadline in the future, we're going to forfeit games because somebody decided to quit the site and didn't tell me. Seems fair. How should I counter this? Do I need to ask all my players if they're intending to quit the site before I send an invite? Sure, I can check on the invites, but I'd already requested an extension for personal reasons and Lindax granted it. There wasn't anything I could do about this. I even tried to get the game filled as soon as I was informed about a player quitting, but the person I invited couldn't access CC that evening. I can prove that because it's said in a game, he missed a turn in a game with me, and it's in our Facebook group because the following day I asked if everything was okay when I saw the miss. Please tell me what else I could have done here, bearing in mind I'm not omnipotent. Otherwise, kindly remove the final warning.

[IcePack]

You might want to talk to Lindax? I'm pretty sure he doesn't follow this thread

[xroads]

Or you can do like the MOW of every other clan does. Talk to your players about games and spots and get them filled.

Its not like you dont know the deadline of every round or something.

In case you dont, You make your home games this Sunday, and you have to have them all filled by Thursday. Then you have until the following Tuesday to fill away games.

There, now you can start talking with your clan members about filling these 16 games.

Or you can ask to be put in the second division where you probably belong anyway

[iAmCaffeine]

Or you can do like the MOW of every other clan does. Talk to your players about games and spots and get them filled.

Its not like you dont know the deadline of every round or something.

In case you dont, You make your home games this Sunday, and you have to have them all filled by Thursday. Then you have until the following Tuesday to fill away games.

There, now you can start talking with your clan members about filling these 16 games.

Or you can ask to be put in the second division where you probably belong anyway

Maybe you should get a clue of what you're talking about before you try and throw some salt this way, completely-legitimate-player-xroads. "Probably belong in the second divison" lol. We earned our place, something you personally wouldn't be able to relate to.



For personal reasons - that I'm not going to share the details of with pathetic embodiments of skin, water and shit like yourself - I requested a deadline. I couldn't access the site often and requested the extension 2-3 days before the actual deadline. The extension was granted. Invites were sent out to players who had agreed to play in the Clan League and not expressed any desire to quit or stop playing entirely. It's not like these invites were random, they were expected by the players. Shortly after our extended deadline passed, one of our players informed me he was now quitting the site. This was not a real time conversation. I asked him if he would play the games I'd invited him to and was informed he would rather not. So, I sent those invites to other players who were happy to play. All but one were accepted. The one that expired was because one of our players couldn't access Conquer Club that evening; his internet was fine, but the site wouldn't work. He ended up missing turns, which I found out the following day and asked what happened. I then realised he would've missed the invite and re-sent it. Games were then ready to go. If not for my personal issues which are still ongoing and actually getting worse, I would've been able to check the status of our invites more regularly, but even then there is no guarantee this could have been prevented. I can prove all of this very easily.

As for my friend xroads, I would happily laugh at him choke on his dignity if he had any remaining.

[djelebert]

Click image to enlarge.

That was my contribution to this debate.

Let's see what CD will decide.

[MagnusGreeol]

Or you can do like the MOW of every other clan does. Talk to your players about games and spots and get them filled.

Its not like you dont know the deadline of every round or something.

In case you dont, You make your home games this Sunday, and you have to have them all filled by Thursday. Then you have until the following Tuesday to fill away games.

There, now you can start talking with your clan members about filling these 16 games.

Or you can ask to be put in the second division where you probably belong anyway

Maybe you should get a clue of what you're talking about before you try and throw some salt this way, completely-legitimate-player-xroads. "Probably belong in the second divison" lol. We earned our place, something you personally wouldn't be able to relate to.



For personal reasons - that I'm not going to share the details of with pathetic embodiments of skin, water and shit like yourself - I requested a deadline. I couldn't access the site often and requested the extension 2-3 days before the actual deadline. The extension was granted. Invites were sent out to players who had agreed to play in the Clan League and not expressed any desire to quit or stop playing entirely. It's not like these invites were random, they were expected by the players. Shortly after our extended deadline passed, one of our players informed me he was now quitting the site. This was not a real time conversation. I asked him if he would play the games I'd invited him to and was informed he would rather not. So, I sent those invites to other players who were happy to play. All but one were accepted. The one that expired was because one of our players couldn't access Conquer Club that evening; his internet was fine, but the site wouldn't work. He ended up missing turns, which I found out the following day and asked what happened. I then realised he would've missed the invite and re-sent it. Games were then ready to go. If not for my personal issues which are still ongoing and actually getting worse, I would've been able to check the status of our invites more regularly, but even then there is no guarantee this could have been prevented. I can prove all of this very easily.

As for my friend xroads, I would happily laugh at him choke on his dignity if he had any remaining.

- All joking/trash talk/ and enemies aside, I would like to sincerely say that I hope your RL issues get better Caff., You don't have to like TOP, We don't have to like you, Your a familiar persona here in CC, And this is a war game.

- Disliking attitude and hating are two complete separate things, I would not want anything bad happening to you or your family, and hope your around for many years so we can continue our rivalry ") GL in RL Caff!

-\M∆GS/-♎

[iAmCaffeine]

Thanks mate, same for you. Just because I dislike someone's attitude in an online game, or their persona or whatever, doesn't mean I'd wish anything bad upon them. Appreciate that.

[PaulatPeace]

The infractions section of the OP was updated:

R6 - S&M vs TOP: TOP players nibotha and FreeFalling123 committed account sitting abuse. First warning issued to TOP, one game will be remade/replayed.

TOP also received a warning for excessive account sitting during CL8 games. This warning is included in the first warning above.

Lx

This is a very interesting announcement! I am responding to Lindax's remarks here which I have every right to do!

A TOP player clearly took the turn in the USA 2.1 game for another player who was under the 2 hr mark. There may be speculation as to why the turn went below the 2 hr mark..... but if a turn is under the 2 hr mark for whatever reason...then clearly it is a "Emergency" situation and sitting is permitted.

The Clan Rules on Sitting state:

3. Emergency cover may be given if the person is in danger of missing a turn. A person will be in danger of missing a turn when:

a, There is less than 2 hours on the clock
b, When their turn expires at a time when they are not usually online. For example It is in the middle of the night their time, or if they do not take turns during work hours.

Guidance
Emergency cover is for when you have not directly been asked to sit by the person when there is less than 2 hours on the clock or when their turn expires at a time when they are usually not online.
For example. You may cover all turns that will expire in the middle of the night their time, until they would usually be online in the morning. Or if they do not take turns during work hours, you may cover all turns that would expire before they got home.

The Clan Sitting Rules clearly define the Definition of Emergency Sitting and TOP players have met both criteria!
- Nibotha's turn was 32 minutes from missing (Clearly below 2 hrs) ...&
- Nibotha was at work when his turn needed to be taken.



In IcePack's verdict regarding Josko's accusations of sitting abuse he states:

-

In general, the claims made were inconclusive.

-

-

As I stated, intent here overall is hard to prove, and based on the statements of Paul & the others, likely was not to intentionally circumvent the site or clan sitting rules.

-

Ultimately we will consider this a "educational" experience and ultimately just warn / note

I am not questioning IcePack's decision. TOP will accept a warning even though we do not feel we committed an violations of account sitting. IcePack clearly understands there was no intent to circumvent site sitting rules! He may feel that in this instance the sitting is worthy of a warning.....but remaking a game when it is between 2 very competitive clans in a hard battle.....this seems very extreme! There was no tactical advantage gained by FreeFalling123 taking the turn for nibotha. Both players are clearly experienced on the map and have winning percentages (Free: 63% - Nibotha: 60%).TOP is having a difficult enough time in games where the drop was bad for us and then our opponents got to go first. To tell us we now have to remake a game where we have a chance of winning....this is extreme and unfair!

I will ask you Lindax to reconsider your decision to have a game remade.

Paul

[josko.ri]

A TOP player clearly took the turn in the USA 2.1 game for another player who was under the 2 hr mark. There may be speculation as to why the turn went below the 2 hr mark..... but if a turn is under the 2 hr mark for whatever reason...then clearly it is a "Emergency" situation and sitting is permitted.

You are wrong here. It is not for WHATEVER reason. If the reason is that original player was not able to play his turn by himself earlier during the turn then it is ok to make emergency sitting. But, if the reason is that player intentionally left the turn to come under two hours in order that more experienced sitter plays the turn then it is not valid reason.

In this case I was also warned for doing the same what FreeFalling123 and nibotha did and have received disciplinary action "warning" for that:
viewtopic.php?f=239&t=145859

This is the C&A case with the most Views in history of CC so the result of the case and the precedent ruling that we are guilty are well known to the CC community. Notice, I was found guilty when there were not precedent similar cases while FreeFalling123 did the same type of abuse when they are already 3-4 similar precedent cases (included cases versus Chariot of Fire).

Ruling was clear (with underlined part which FreeFalling123 and nibotha broke):

For this case, at some point, josko.ri could/should have simply told the other players to stop relying on him to take turns for them. Account sitting is for a definite period of time and NOT for an indefinite period. You can't assign an account sitter to account sit for you for as long as his blood is running into his veins. Then you can now sleep soundly whenever or do other stuff because you know he is going to save you from missing a turn. If you are capable of taking your turn, then take it. Do not make someone be responsible for your own account or lean too much for his advise.

I think you should be happy that FreeFqaaling123 did not receive formal Warning for his abuse because it would be his second breaking rules infraction and therefore he would receive one month ban from CC. Remake of a single game is minor punishments compared to what type of punishments were issued before for the same type of abuse.

There was no tactical advantage gained by FreeFalling123 taking the turn for nibotha. Both players are clearly experienced on the map and have winning percentages (Free: 63% - Nibotha: 60%).

You seem to be interpreting the statistics on the way how is favorable for you. In fact, FreeFalling played Usa 2.1 map 52 times and nibotha played it 10 times, so FreeFalling is 5 times more experienced than nibotha on the map which is extremely hard to play and requires proper experience. Therefore, huge tactical advantage was taken by FreeFalling playing the turn instead of nibotha.

The infractions section of the OP was updated:

R6 - S&M vs TOP: TOP players nibotha and FreeFalling123 committed account sitting abuse. First warning issued to TOP, one game will be remade/replayed.

TOP also received a warning for excessive account sitting during CL8 games. This warning is included in the first warning above.

Lx

It seems that FreeFalling123 and nibotha are not isolated cases in TOP sitting abuses, as can be read rom Lindax's explanation excessive account sitting happened during many CL8 games.

Given all the facts, I think you should be grateful that no CC disciplinary actions such as Official warnings from king achilles or 1 month ban for repeated infraction was applied. When I or Chariot of Fire did similar abuse, the regular disciplinary actions were applied towards us.

[PaulatPeace]

A TOP player clearly took the turn in the USA 2.1 game for another player who was under the 2 hr mark. There may be speculation as to why the turn went below the 2 hr mark..... but if a turn is under the 2 hr mark for whatever reason...then clearly it is a "Emergency" situation and sitting is permitted.

You are wrong here. It is not for WHATEVER reason. If the reason is that original player was not able to play his turn by himself earlier during the turn then it is ok to make emergency sitting. But, if the reason is that player intentionally left the turn to come under two hours in order that more experienced sitter plays the turn then it is not valid reason. Actually.....if you look at the Rules....it does not say that. You are adding something that is not there based on your own personal bias. Additionally...at no time does TOP have "more experienced players take turns for less experienced players to gain some advantage! This again is a presumption on your part...but an inaccurate one! By anyone's standards nibotha is a very competent player on many maps including USA 2.1...and does not need anyone to take his turn for him because he is inexperienced! So....you can see that it is you who are wrong here Josko!!!

In this case I was also warned for doing the same what FreeFalling123 and nibotha did and have received disciplinary action "warning" for that:
viewtopic.php?f=239&t=145859 Again Josko....nibotha did not and does not need Free or anyone to take his turn for him because of some supposed inexperience as you are saying. This may have been true in your case...but it is not true in ours!

This is the C&A case with the most Views in history of CC so the result of the case and the precedent ruling that we are guilty are well known to the CC community. Notice, I was found guilty when there were not precedent similar cases while FreeFalling123 did the same type of abuse when they are already 3-4 similar precedent cases (included cases versus Chariot of Fire). Again.....your case is very different than this one here for us! I realize that some players have taken turns for less experienced players where a clan seeks an advantage in gameplay. You seem to be admitting that you indeed did this. I am sorry you felt the need! TOP does not do this!!! We never have and we never will! There is a huge difference here!

Ruling was clear (with underlined part which FreeFalling123 and nibotha broke):

For this case, at some point, josko.ri could/should have simply told the other players to stop relying on him to take turns for them. Account sitting is for a definite period of time and NOT for an indefinite period. You can't assign an account sitter to account sit for you for as long as his blood is running into his veins. Then you can now sleep soundly whenever or do other stuff because you know he is going to save you from missing a turn. If you are capable of taking your turn, then take it. Do not make someone be responsible for your own account or lean too much for his advise.

Nibotha and all of our players take their own turns unless an extenuating circumstance comes up. What was cited for you does not apply to our case or to TOP in general. If we have a player go missing for a while....we will sit his/her games till they return and announce it in chat. This has happened to us several times with a few of our players........but this did not happen here. Nibotha accepted the game invitation and indeed plays almost all of his turns in his games. There was a time recently his grandfather had a heart attack and he left to see him in the hospital in a different country. We sat for him then. But he was back for this USA 2.1 game and his intention was always to take his own turns. Your case in which you were reprimanded is very different than ours!

I think you should be happy that FreeFqaaling123 did not receive formal Warning for his abuse because it would be his second breaking rules infraction and therefore he would receive one month ban from CC. Remake of a single game is minor punishments compared to what type of punishments were issued before for the same type of abuse. He did NOTHING WRONG! Are you really that dense that you cannot see this??? He took a turn for another player who was low on time and was at work! This is obvious in the log. You are simply seeking to have a game remade in which you might lose in order to gain a strategic advantage in our match. Shame on you! That is despicable!

There was no tactical advantage gained by FreeFalling123 taking the turn for nibotha. Both players are clearly experienced on the map and have winning percentages (Free: 63% - Nibotha: 60%).

You seem to be interpreting the statistics on the way how is favorable for you. In fact, FreeFalling played Usa 2.1 map 52 times and nibotha played it 10 times, so FreeFalling is 5 times more experienced than nibotha on the map which is extremely hard to play and requires proper experience. Therefore, huge tactical advantage was taken by FreeFalling playing the turn instead of nibotha. WRONG AGAIN! Nibotha's 60% win ratio is impressive by any standard. Playing the game 10 times is more than enough to make him capable of taking his own turns. I wonder how may times Random has played USA 2.1. If experience was the major factor to determine success.....your team should be winning the game hands down!

The infractions section of the OP was updated:

R6 - S&M vs TOP: TOP players nibotha and FreeFalling123 committed account sitting abuse. First warning issued to TOP, one game will be remade/replayed.

TOP also received a warning for excessive account sitting during CL8 games. This warning is included in the first warning above.

Lx

It seems that FreeFalling123 and nibotha are not isolated cases in TOP sitting abuses, as can be read rom Lindax's explanation excessive account sitting happened during many CL8 games. "Excessive sitting" is a relative turn. Our players have real lives. One player's mother died and he left to go to the funeral. We haven't heard from him since and he is no longer playing in our CL8 matches. Another player had his 1st child born and has also left in mid games. We covered for him also, and he is also not in any more CL8 games for us. Nibotha's grandfather had a heart attack as I mentioned and we covered his games till he returned. There are countless real life experiences which come up daily for everyone. Perhaps you do not have a job, or a spouse, or children or anything else to do but play CC. This is not the case for us....and this is why "Sitting" is allowed. TOP has always sat for it's members according to the rules as they are stated! Additionally, an inspection of our IP addresses and game chat will reveal this to be true! If anyone thinks our sitting practice is "Excessive" and illegal......then kindly prove it......or shut up!

Given all the facts, I think you should be grateful that no CC disciplinary actions such as Official warnings from king achilles or 1 month ban for repeated infraction was applied. When I or Chariot of Fire did similar abuse, the regular disciplinary actions were applied towards us.

What I am not grateful for is your incessant nagging and obnoxious antagonizing of our members in the game chat, in PMs, on their Walls and in the forums! If there were warnings that could be issued for antagonizing pathetic behavior....you would have been issued many by now! If you were deserving of the disciplinary action you received....than that is between you and those who disciplined you. We have not done what you did. Additionally, any mistakes we make are unintentional and we correct them. Yours has been with full intent and malice! You apparently think the only way you stand a chance to win the CL 8 is to create a huge stink about something that was innocent, and by the Sitting Rules perfectly acceptable! Again Josko.....you should be ashamed of yourself. Trust me here....I am not the only one who sees this. You have lost much more than you hoped to gain by your actions. I feel sorry for you!

Paul

[iAmCaffeine]

Same shit every year.

[iAmCaffeine]

I wonder how xroads is enjoying his one week ban.

[BIG_John]

Josko and Random are the two biggest babies on this site! I see why everyone is leaving the site! Also nice to see the CDs backing the two biggest crybabies on here! I guess you have to try and handicap us because you can't beat us on normal terms so you have to rig it to give you a chance! Clan world = BIG JOKE!

[IcePack]

Josko and Random are the two biggest babies on this site! I see why everyone is leaving the site! Also nice to see the CDs backing the two biggest crybabies on here! I guess you have to try and handicap us because you can't beat us on normal terms so you have to rig it to give you a chance! Clan world = BIG JOKE!

Admin reviewed the sitting case, not the CD's. We don't have tools to look at account sitting abuse infractions. Has nothing to do with who reported or who was being reviewed, it's handled the same way.

[BIG_John]

I am talking about Josko in this forum after you said if anyone kept talking about it would face consequences and the person kept talking about it and nothing ands I remember in CL7 Paul lost a medal, first contact spot, and we got a clan warning but nothing for this person. I understand you guys don't like us but the rules are rules why do we get punished for it and they don't?