Stronghold - updated 29/01/2015

by **koontz1973** on Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:56 am

ManB, will get with ian later this week and go over the map for all points to get the GP stamped soon.

A fdew things to check for me though in the mean time.
Font for region names. It looks to be in different sizes. Why?
Legend text - is going to be imposable to read when smaller. But again, it is an easy fix but again try to get the font size all the same for white and yellow texts.
Region names are in bold. Give the names a glow to make those ones stand out more.
Lower the grunge opacity. The top left cannot be seen easily without squinting.

by **ManBungalow** on Fri Sep 20, 2013 9:13 pm

koontz1973 wrote:ManB, will get with ian later this week and go over the map for all points to get the GP stamped soon.

A fdew things to check for me though in the mean time.
Font for region names. It looks to be in different sizes. Why? I don't think it's different sizes. I've used one size for all region names (excluding Stronghold), and two sizes in the legend (the white text is slightly larger than the yellow text, just to make it stand out more). Any particular region? Some letters in that font just look abnormally big, but I can go correct specific names manually.

Legend text - is going to be imposable to read when smaller. But again, it is an easy fix but again try to get the font size all the same for white and yellow texts. I may have to use a different font for the small map. And can remove the actual image frame for some extra pixels (like the difference between small and large images of the Ireland map). Will experiment later.

Region names are in bold. Give the names a glow to make those ones stand out more. I've been trying to stay away from using glow here, but I think you're right that a highlight on the all CAPS region names would work.

Lower the grunge opacity. The top left cannot be seen easily without squinting. I can probably do this with a layer mask.

Thanks!

by **cairnswk** on Fri Sep 20, 2013 11:17 pm

MB. on the GFX side...design....the legend is rectanuglar yet the map lines flow with lots of lovely curves.
It would be nice if the legend occupied that bottom corner and you could fit it into that area with a curved border rather than it being rectangular.

by **ManBungalow** on Sat Sep 21, 2013 7:25 am

cairnswk wrote:MB. on the GFX side...design....the legend is rectanuglar yet the map lines flow with lots of lovely curves.
It would be nice if the legend occupied that bottom corner and you could fit it into that area with a curved border rather than it being rectangular.

This is a good idea.

by **DearCyrus** on Sat Sep 21, 2013 5:38 pm

Maybe lighten it up overall, just a bit .

by **ManBungalow** on Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:10 pm

Minor updates in a couple of places and a different legend panel.

Click image to enlarge.

by **generalhead** on Mon Oct 07, 2013 8:38 pm

Neat looking map. One this I see is the region lines aren't touching.
I can't wait to see where this map goes.

by **Bruceswar** on Mon Oct 07, 2013 9:02 pm

generalhead wrote:Neat looking map. One this I see is the region lines aren't touching.
I can't wait to see where this map goes.

That is how it supposed to be.

by **ManBungalow** on Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:29 pm

generalhead wrote:Neat looking map. One this I see is the region lines aren't touching.
I can't wait to see where this map goes.

I'm looking into nudging a few lines around slightly.

I wanted to achieve the border style you see in the Gargoyle bonus, but it's not entirely consistent across the map.

by **koontz1973** on Wed Oct 09, 2013 1:37 am

OK, ManB, here is a list of things for you.
Legend.
Impassable: Mountains - Forests - Water (takes up a lot less room)
Bonuses, saying you get the bonus when you hold the entire kingdom is pointless, that is how it is done and players will know this. Remove this from the legend.
Again, saying the name for the bonus is in all caps, how is a non English speaking person to understand this? Give the bonus names a glow and make eack bonus area a slightly different shade of green. Then you can remove all of this from the legend.
The not part of any kingdom, again, this can just be removed. Saying those three are not part of the bonuses is not needed when the above different greens are done.
Autodeploys and bombardments.
Say this - Rebels (shield icon) receive a +2 auto deploy. Can bombard the stronghold.
Lower the +2 to a +1.
Bonus values:
Nexus 1
Sherwood 3
Gargoyle 3
Trout Bay 1
Darwin 1
Badlands 1
Salty Coast 1
Crown Plains 2
Gulf 2
Copper 2
These also need to be rearranged so the names in the legend read top left to bottom right.

Dak, RJ Beals, Koontz, they can attack and be attacked by the stronghold? If yes, then remove the arrows and make a break in the wall of the stronghold. The text for the stronghold win condition can go into the legend where it belongs. The extra space should allow you to make the text a lot clearer in the legend and allow you to make that flowing legend.

by **ManBungalow** on Wed Oct 09, 2013 10:42 am

Thanks koontz, I think that will mostly work very nicely.

by **ManBungalow** on Mon Oct 21, 2013 6:46 pm

I am going to update this soon...promise.

I've been so busy IRL recently, hardly have any time for this site at all.

by **DearCyrus** on Mon Oct 28, 2013 2:00 pm

We understand, life keeps us all busy. Look forward to what you come up with!

by **ManBungalow** on Sat Nov 02, 2013 1:36 pm

I'm having trouble with photobucket, but hopefully you can see this image:

Click image to enlarge.

How does it look?

by **koontz1973** on Sun Nov 03, 2013 7:51 am

You still say all bodies of water. Remove the all bodies part.

Rebel regions +1, you need to add the shield icons to the legend.
Bonuses are now in a glow, that is good and makes it easier to understand. Great work.
Rebel regions still says a +1 auto deploy. Why +1?
You still have the arrows on the map. Remove them. For the bridge it is pointless and for the stronghold, it detracts from the map.

by **sempaispellcheck** on Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:13 pm

First time checking out this thread in a while - boy, have I missed a lot. Great work, ManB! Please keep it up!

Spelling Notes (have to live up to my name):
There's a "b" in the legend where there shouldn't be one - you have "Rebel Regionbs" instead of "Rebel Regions."
Also, "run-off" ("Muddy Run-off" in Badlands bonus) doesn't need to be hyphenated. I wouldn't say it's necessarily wrong, but I also wouldn't say it's necessary.

Gameplay Questions (I did read through the whole thread, but I may have missed stuff - and I don't know squat about graphics, as anyone who followed my attempt at a Paris map can attest to):
Will the Rebel regions start neutral? If so, how many troops and what is my incentive as a player to take one? Do they connect, as has been suggested? What do they border, what do they bombard, and what bombards them?
How many neutral troops will the Stronghold start with?
Will the 3 armies start neutral as well? If so, how many troops will those have?
Regions whose names are in all caps (SHERWOOD, GARGOYLE, etc.) - are they actual regions that can be attacked, or are they just there to give the names of the bonus areas?

It's kind of a shame we picked classic gameplay - if you ask me, this would have been GREAT as a conquest map, with the Rebel regions as starting positions.

sempai

by **koontz1973** on Fri Nov 22, 2013 2:38 am

How are we doing with any update on this map?

by **koontz1973** on Sun Dec 01, 2013 6:13 am

ManB, just letting you know that the month for an update is up tomorrow. You know what happens then.

by **ManBungalow** on Sun Dec 01, 2013 8:07 pm

I've got this.

by **ManBungalow** on Tue Dec 03, 2013 8:05 pm

Summary of changes:

Changed rebel regions autodeploy +1 to +2
Destroyed the stronghold wall a little bit - removed arrows
Changed the bridge - removed arrow
Added shield icon to legend
Rounded off some lines that were irking me
Some other small changes you probably won't even notice

Current map image with proposed neutral starting values:

Click image to enlarge.

The neutral 2s are there to prevent a player from dropping a bonus. However, their necessity can be disputed.

So, I figure that I need a gameplay stamp now. What to change?

Also...

sempaispellcheck wrote:Regions whose names are in all caps (SHERWOOD, GARGOYLE, etc.) - are they actual regions that can be attacked, or are they just there to give the names of the bonus areas?

Like the 4 Star Meats map, the names in all caps double up as the name of the bonus and the individual region.

eg. I'd like the game log to read like follows:

ManBungalow conquered Sherwood from ____
...
ManBungalow receives _ troops for holding Sherwood Kingdom

by **ManBungalow** on Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:25 pm

Also, when do I need to start thinking about the XML? After the gameplay stamp?

I'm too busy to do it myself at the moment though.

by **koontz1973** on Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:30 pm

ManBungalow wrote:Also, when do I need to start thinking about the XML? After the gameplay stamp?

I'm too busy to do it myself at the moment though.

You are a long way of yet. Lets see what ian thinks then we can get you over to the graphics boys. Then you can think about it.

by **koontz1973** on Thu Dec 05, 2013 12:38 am

ManB, can you please edit the first post with a list of player numbers. How many regions does a player get in 2 player games, 3 player games etc etc. Then we can look at the stamp.

by **ManBungalow** on Thu Dec 05, 2013 9:40 am

I've updated the neutrals map to optimise the number of starting regions as so:

Click image to enlarge.

I'm adding the figures to the first post now.

by **iancanton** on Thu Dec 05, 2013 4:10 pm

this is a good move, but it's the 4-region bonuses that need the neutrals. move the neutrals from sherwood and olive trees to trout bay and brimstone? the gameplay is looking sound otherwise and, in fog or trench, this map has the potential to produce some intriguing strategies.

ian.