2nd Best Religion

[jay_a2j]

Is that right? First of all, I'm not a Christian, though that's completely irrelevant. Secondly, faith is simply believing something either is or is not true without having proof of it. That IS what faith is. Nothing superficial about it...it just is.

"Faith is simply believing something is or is not true without having proof of it"? Really? That sounds like the definition of BELIEF to me.

Heb 11-1 "Now faith is being SURE of what you hope for and CERTAIN of what you can not see."

Some people believe in aliens.
Some people believe in Big Foot.
Some people believe in Santa.
Some people even believe in God.


And some people know there is a God.

[Woodruff]

Fast posted there.
Interesting scripture in James says "You believe in God? You do well. The devils also believe, and tremble."
The devils have faith? Why then aren't they "saved"? Like i said, your understanding is superficial.
Honibaz

That's about as sensible a statement as using the Bible to prove that the Bible is right. And you say my understanding is superficial. But your work here is done, amirite?

[Woodruff]

Is that right? First of all, I'm not a Christian, though that's completely irrelevant. Secondly, faith is simply believing something either is or is not true without having proof of it. That IS what faith is. Nothing superficial about it...it just is.

"Faith is simply believing something is or is not true without having proof of it"? Really? That sounds like the definition of BELIEF to me.
Heb 11-1 "Now faith is being SURE of what you hope for and CERTAIN of what you can not see."
Some people believe in aliens.
Some people believe in Big Foot.
Some people believe in Santa.
Some people even believe in God.
And some people know there is a God.

"Faith" and "Belief" are interchangeable terms, Jay. In fact, the definition for "belief" includes "confidence, faith, trust" and "a religious creed or faith"

[jay_a2j]

"Faith" and "Belief" are interchangeable terms, Jay. In fact, the definition for "belief" includes "confidence, faith, trust" and "a religious creed or faith"

Maybe in your mind. As Honibaz mentioned, "You say that you believe in God? Good! Even demons KNOW there is a God and tremble!"

There is a big difference between belief and faith. When people ask me if I believe in God, I always tell them "No, I know there is a God." Because belief, as you have so eloquently stated, is "to accept without proof". Faith goes beyond that. I believe 911 was an inside job, but I wouldn't sacrifice my life for that belief. Because you never know.... I could be wrong. The existence of God? Not even a question... absolutely, 100% sure, I have absolutely no doubt about it.

[Timminz]

I find fundamentalist people to be quite scary.

It is impossible to be a rational thinking person, if you believe (and yes, that's the right word) that this life is nothing more than a path to a better one. How do you get someone to care about the oppression they condone, when they honestly think they'll be rewarded eternally for it.

To believe that your belief is more than that, is foolhardy, and dangerous to more than just yourself.

[jay_a2j]

I find fundamentalist people to be quite scary.

It is impossible to be a rational thinking person, if you believe (and yes, that's the right word) that this life is nothing more than a path to a better one. How do you get someone to care about the oppression they condone, when they honestly think they'll be rewarded eternally for it.

To believe that your belief is more than that, is foolhardy, and dangerous to more than just yourself.

?????????????????????????


I never said, "this life is nothing more than a path to a better one". Care about oppression????? They condone?????????????? YOU are starting to scare me!

[Timminz]

I find fundamentalist people to be quite scary.

It is impossible to be a rational thinking person, if you believe (and yes, that's the right word) that this life is nothing more than a path to a better one. How do you get someone to care about the oppression they condone, when they honestly think they'll be rewarded eternally for it.

To believe that your belief is more than that, is foolhardy, and dangerous to more than just yourself.

?????????????????????????


I never said, "this life is nothing more than a path to a better one". Care about oppression????? They condone?????????????? YOU are starting to scare me!

Did I say you said that? I KNOW that I did not.

Fundamentalism is scary because of it's refusal to accept anything other than their own interpretations of texts/practices/beliefs/etc.

[jay_a2j]

I find fundamentalist people to be quite scary.

It is impossible to be a rational thinking person, if you believe (and yes, that's the right word) that this life is nothing more than a path to a better one. How do you get someone to care about the oppression they condone, when they honestly think they'll be rewarded eternally for it.

To believe that your belief is more than that, is foolhardy, and dangerous to more than just yourself.

?????????????????????????


I never said, "this life is nothing more than a path to a better one". Care about oppression????? They condone?????????????? YOU are starting to scare me!

Did I say you said that? I KNOW that I did not.

Fundamentalism is scary because of it's refusal to accept anything other than their own interpretations of texts/practices/beliefs/etc.

You implied. And you are way off base anyways. What a twisted view you have.

[Frigidus]

Thread hijacked by a guy with an inability to separate his self and his religion. Cool.

[jay_a2j]

Thread hijacked by a guy with an inability to separate his self and his religion. Cool.

I'd be impressed if you could find 10 threads that have not been "hijacked".

[BigBallinStalin]

.

[Woodruff]

"Faith" and "Belief" are interchangeable terms, Jay. In fact, the definition for "belief" includes "confidence, faith, trust" and "a religious creed or faith"

Maybe in your mind.

Maybe in my mind? Do you understand what the term "definition" means, Jay?

There is a big difference between belief and faith.

No, there is not.

When people ask me if I believe in God, I always tell them "No, I know there is a God." Because belief, as you have so eloquently stated, is "to accept without proof". Faith goes beyond that.

How is faith NOT "accepting without proof"?

I believe 911 was an inside job, but I wouldn't sacrifice my life for that belief. Because you never know.... I could be wrong. The existence of God? Not even a question... absolutely, 100% sure, I have absolutely no doubt about it.

You FEEL LIKE you know absolutely and without question. But you don't actually, as you cannot. I don't mean this in an attacking "You're wrong about your religion" way, so please don't take it that way. I actually have a healthy respect for most things religious. But part of that respect comes from their acknowledgement that it is something they believe in, not that they have proof of. Believe me, I'd LOVE to have proof of God. I'd LOVE to KNOW that there is a God. I truly and honestly wish it were possible. But as of yet, I have not seen the proof of it. There some healthy evidence in my view, but not nearly healthy enough, never mind conclusive.

[pmchugh]

You can't know anything 100%, except perhaps that you exist.

[jay_a2j]

You can't know anything 100%, except perhaps that you exist.

Fail. I know a lot of things 100%.

Fire is hot.
People need air to live.
Michael Jackson is dead.
Dogs are mammals.
If you cook something too long it will burn.
If I'm holding something and let go, it will fall to the ground.
If my electricity went out I wouldn't be able to finish this post.
If I drink a gallon of sulfuric acid I will die.
Rap really isn't music.

and there is a God.

[Maugena]

If you, for whatever reason, couldn't follow the religion you do right now, which religion would you follow? I don't mean "couldn't follow" in the sense that you're prevented from following it, this is just a theoretical thing.

Judaism



Now I'll ask you since you're an atheist: if you were forced to be a member of a religion, but got to choose which one, what would it be?

I'm atheist, technically, just thought I'd point that out.

[Maugena]

I was under the impression that Faith in God was the only way. Knowing God exist (in an absolute way) would not only be impossible but also counter to faith.

Win. Argument over.

[b.k. barunt]

A snorri multi?


Honibaz

[Maugena]

ok, first best religion Atheism (I know is not a religion).

Second, budhism

I really don't like Buddhism, in the slightest. It's just as mythical as the other major religions.

I'd probably go Satanism if I had to.

I wouldn't really call it mythical at all.
Other than Buddha himself... post-enlightenment. And I suppose reincarnation, if you consider that to be mythical... I personally don't.
I'm no expert at Buddhism, so don't consider starting an argument over possibly incorrect details.
While I don't fully believe in Karma, it is very possible that actions that are morally questionable can lead to consequences that are not desired.
I am a firm believer in the Chaos Theory as well as a theory that every possible outcome can happen and will at some point in time.
I'd say there is a universal rule that if you have done something morally questionable, you have a higher chance of having a consequence that is not of your liking.
As far as rebirth goes, I believe in it to a point. My idea consists of the idea that your conciousness derives from an atom in your brain. (I've just been thinking too much... I came to this conclusion through deduction of sorts.) When your body dies, your atom, or 'gateway' atom, as I like to call it, can go pretty much anywhere. Considering that there are many more atoms in this world, let alone the universe, than there are living beings, the chances of you coming back to life in... a vast span of time is... pretty much infinitely small. However, as an atom, you have no way of telling time, and thus, the moment you die is also the moment you live. You could say you never really die. But, forget the concept of a 'soul' that religions like Christianity portray. You do not retain a particular set of memories or anything. (Don't get me wrong, there most likely is something that you retain, and that is most likely what makes you, you.) You could be a dog, a cat, or some other creature that does not exist in this time-frame or part of the universe.
I don't believe in the cycle of samsara. I'd call it merely coincidence if your life was worse off in your next live because you lived a life that was more than morally questionable.
I do believe that the Four Noble Truths hold some *cough* ... truth in them. I believe these, mostly.
The Noble Eightfold Path is damn impressive, I might say. Only those who have reflected on their own selves and their beliefs for an immensive amount of time could have come up with this, in my opinion. Not to mention, they hammered out a code for it.
Middle Way is also impressive. Though, in some ways, it can lead you nowhere, I'd think. If you don't respond/react, change is harder to come by.

And blah, blah, blah... I'll get around to the rest of it later. This is exhausting.

[Maugena]

A snorri multi?


Honibaz

No, a friend of the OP that just decided to join the community to chat in Monkey Business because I like philosophical conversations and debating in general.

[Maugena]

I find fundamentalist people to be quite scary.

It is impossible to be a rational thinking person, if you believe (and yes, that's the right word) that this life is nothing more than a path to a better one. How do you get someone to care about the oppression they condone, when they honestly think they'll be rewarded eternally for it.

To believe that your belief is more than that, is foolhardy, and dangerous to more than just yourself.

I agree.

You implied. And you are way off base anyways. What a twisted view you have.

Twisted or realistic?

Thread hijacked by a guy with an inability to separate his self and his religion. Cool.

Hehehe...

You can't know anything 100%, except perhaps that you exist.

I think, therefore I am? YEEEE-HAW!

Side-note: Working on condensing responses when catching up on threads! Sowwy for the spam! &

[pimpdave]

A snorri multi?


Honibaz

No, a friend of the OP that just decided to join the community to chat in Monkey Business because I like philosophical conversations and debating in general.

WE HATE YOU

[Maugena]

A snorri multi?


Honibaz

No, a friend of the OP that just decided to join the community to chat in Monkey Business because I like philosophical conversations and debating in general.

WE HATE YOU

First 'enemy'? WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

[Woodruff]

You can't know anything 100%, except perhaps that you exist.

Fail. I know a lot of thongs 100%.

Fire is hot.
People need air to live.
Michael Jackson is dead.
Dogs are mammals.
If you cook something too long it will burn.
If I'm holding something and let go, it will fall to the ground.
If my electricity went out I wouldn't be able to finish this post.
If I drink a gallon of sulfuric acid I will die.
Rap really isn't music.

and there is a God.

There is an argument (not one I agree with) that you cannot even know that 100%, because everything may just be a figment of your own imagination. Your mind may be all that exists.

[Maugena]

Fail. I know a lot of thongs 100%.
If I'm holding something and let go, it will fall to the ground.
If my electricity went out I wouldn't be able to finish this post.

What happened to knowing about the magnetic forces preventing a metallic object in your hand from falling because the pull from an attraction to a charged object above your hand is stronger than the pull of gravity?
You clearly have some concept of electricity... don't know if you skipped out on magnetism, tho.
In this response, I'm just being an asshole. For the fun of it, to be honest.

[jonesthecurl]

I let go of a helium-filled balloon once. IMagine my surprise when it didn't fall to the ground.