Classic Art problem

[MrBenn]

I never pictured MrBenn as a commando

I do wear pants!

(for the Americans amongst us, when I say pants, I don't mean trousers, I mean pants)

I have no idea what this has to do with Classic

[sailorseal]

I never pictured MrBenn as a commando

I do wear pants!

(for the Americans amongst us, when I say pants, I don't mean trousers, I mean pants)

I have no idea what this has to do with Classic

I can tell you, classic has a gold star for popularity, like the one in your hand, the hand of a commando...


On topic:
I honestly think Classic would be far less popular if:
1. It's name was not "Classic"
2. It was not first on the list
3. It was not one of the original maps

[MrBenn]

On topic:
I honestly think Classic would be far less popular if:
1. It's name was not "Classic"
2. It was not first on the list
3. It was not one of the original maps

You have to take into consideration the number of games that were played on the map before it changed to the one(s) we have now... all the games on the original classic are attributed to Classic: Shapes too

[Merciless Wong]

I had some friends refuse to play it because they felt silly invading Picasso from Leonardo or whatever. Perhaps we can order every to play it because the Star Chamber made it.

Feel free to use Prince of the City as the new classic then - I'm happy to reformat the balls and boxes. Perhaps we can set up it up versus Classic Art for a 1 month period and see what gets play.

I mean how did anyone expect to come up with a great idea in the 48 hours they had to do Classic Art is beyond me.

[Incandenza]

Wow, that's very magnanimous of you to offer up your map as the site-wide replacement for Classic. I'm amazed at your generosity of spirit.

[Merciless Wong]

Finally, recognition.

I posted this elsewhere but worth mentioning it here:

I have found a CC competitor with an automated map process for vanilla maps and am testing it out.
They just approve everything and let the play statistics rank the maps.
For guys who want to contribute on gameplay but will never block off 6 months to volunteer for a website we pay to use - it may be the better solution. I only play with a set group anyway in our regular game and its free to join as well so they can move over.

I think the CC code has the advantage in being able to do more customized bonus structures but the fact that nothing has really caught on other than Classic Shapes and World 2.1 is a bad sign for the Foundry.
I survey waiting for players at any given time (48 pages, you can scan the first 9 or so quickly).
Besides the tournament stuff its Classic Shapes, Middle East, World 2.1, some vanilla geography maps, Circus Maximus and Doodle Earth. The Age Of... series and Feudal War is one of the few regularly played complex maps. Those are current waiting games and are not subject to data distortion.

As at 11 pm 22 April - we can see (doing one map at a time), Classic Shapes is still the regining champion.

Classic Shapes - 324 waiting for p , reigning champion

World 2.1 - 224 waiting for p, very goof vanilla

Classic Art - 185 waiting for p , much less than classic shapes, why?

doodle Earth - 122 waiting for p (but lots of tournaments up), very good

[whitestazn88]

Finally, recognition.

I posted this elsewhere but worth mentioning it here:

I have found a CC competitor with an automated map process for vanilla maps and am testing it out.
They just approve everything and let the play statistics rank the maps.
For guys who want to contribute on gameplay but will never block off 6 months to volunteer for a website we pay to use - it may be the better solution. I only play with a set group anyway in our regular game and its free to join as well so they can move over.

I think the CC code has the advantage in being able to do more customized bonus structures but the fact that nothing has really caught on other than Classic Shapes and World 2.1 is a bad sign for the Foundry.
I survey waiting for players at any given time (48 pages, you can scan the first 9 or so quickly).
Besides the tournament stuff its Classic Shapes, Middle East, World 2.1, some vanilla geography maps, Circus Maximus and Doodle Earth. The Age Of... series and Feudal War is one of the few regularly played complex maps. Those are current waiting games and are not subject to data distortion.

As at 11 pm 22 April - we can see (doing one map at a time), Classic Shapes is still the regining champion.

Classic Shapes - 324 waiting for p , reigning champion

World 2.1 - 224 waiting for p, very goof vanilla

Classic Art - 185 waiting for p , much less than classic shapes, why?

doodle Earth - 122 waiting for p (but lots of tournaments up), very good

nothing has really caught on other than classic shapes and world 2.1?

really? gtfo... what a ridiculous statement.

[Qwert]

sailorseal wrote:
On topic:
I honestly think Classic would be far less popular if:
1. It's name was not "Classic"
2. It was not first on the list
3. It was not one of the original maps

Interesting, who knows how will map be played if hes name "Land of Artist" instead Classic Art ,and to be not first on list.

[Ollie Sheehan]

I don't know about anyone else, but I am having a big problem with my maps; ie; The countries are not loading and all I can see is the numbers of soldiers each person has, I can not see countres, boarders, continents and I am having to second guess what I am doing, where I am depolying troops, acting reinforcing etc. Just wondering if anyone had any solutions. If you do please mail me on here at Ollie Sheehan. Thanx.

[LED ZEPPELINER]

I don't know about anyone else, but I am having a big problem with my maps; ie; The countries are not loading and all I can see is the numbers of soldiers each person has, I can not see countres, boarders, continents and I am having to second guess what I am doing, where I am depolying troops, acting reinforcing etc. Just wondering if anyone had any solutions. If you do please mail me on here at Ollie Sheehan. Thanx.

So are many other people
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=85692&view=unread#unread

[yeti_c]

Have you noticed how the play on the classic arts map has dropped off compared to the classic shapes map? Is there a message there?

Yeah - "Classic: Art" should be above "Classic: Shapes" in the alphabet.

C.

Poke.

C.

[gimil]

I think the CC code has the advantage in being able to do more customized bonus structures but the fact that nothing has really caught on other than Classic Shapes and World 2.1 is a bad sign for the Foundry.
I survey waiting for players at any given time (48 pages, you can scan the first 9 or so quickly).
Besides the tournament stuff its Classic Shapes, Middle East, World 2.1, some vanilla geography maps, Circus Maximus and Doodle Earth. The Age Of... series and Feudal War is one of the few regularly played complex maps. Those are current waiting games and are not subject to data distortion.

I know this was said a while ago but I feel it needs to be properly addressed.

Wong, if you are going to make that assumption you should back it up with facts. How do you justify what is and isn't a successful map? Is it by how many games are started a week? If so how many should it be to class a popular? 100? 200? 1000? 10000?

I can only assume that you haven't went through and done any stats work on all of CC's maps. Which means you can't doubt the work of the foundry unless you have evidence to support it (especially if you are doubting complex maps and claiming they arn't popular). I for one know that at one point (my states are out of date) poker club, siege, new worlds, ohama beach, peral harbour, water loo, conquer 4, treasure of galapodose, Arms race and supermax all had more games created per week (in some cases alot more than your example of middle east.

Although the stats are out of date may of the maps consistently (at the time) outranked middle east. A few may have dropped of from my first since the states were last run because they were new. The rest (I assume) would of stayed about the same.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=27288&start=0

[whitestazn88]

I think the CC code has the advantage in being able to do more customized bonus structures but the fact that nothing has really caught on other than Classic Shapes and World 2.1 is a bad sign for the Foundry.
I survey waiting for players at any given time (48 pages, you can scan the first 9 or so quickly).
Besides the tournament stuff its Classic Shapes, Middle East, World 2.1, some vanilla geography maps, Circus Maximus and Doodle Earth. The Age Of... series and Feudal War is one of the few regularly played complex maps. Those are current waiting games and are not subject to data distortion.

I know this was said a while ago but I feel it needs to be properly addressed.

Wong, if you are going to make that assumption you should back it up with facts. How do you justify what is and isn't a successful map? Is it by how many games are started a week? If so how many should it be to class a popular? 100? 200? 1000? 10000?

I can only assume that you haven't went through and done any stats work on all of CC's maps. Which means you can't doubt the work of the foundry unless you have evidence to support it (especially if you are doubting complex maps and claiming they arn't popular). I for one know that at one point (my states are out of date) poker club, siege, new worlds, ohama beach, peral harbour, water loo, conquer 4, treasure of galapodose, Arms race and supermax all had more games created per week (in some cases alot more than your example of middle east.

Although the stats are out of date may of the maps consistently (at the time) outranked middle east. A few may have dropped of from my first since the states were last run because they were new. The rest (I assume) would of stayed about the same.

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=27288&start=0

i thought i addressed it pretty well when i told him to gtfo...

[Merciless Wong]

I don't have access to any data other than game finder but I think you'll find that on a simple search of open public games you can see certain maps recurring. Complex maps get a little buzz at launch then disappear.

Instead of responding to invective just get the stats. I offered to ask Lack if pm'd his e-mail - the moderators who have access declined to share that. I think there was an old stats page but it stopped being updated.

I am not expecting a clique to be enthusiastic about looking at data, the less there is the more their subjective judgements can rule the roost.

I owe this forum very little at this point - so I have no interest in pursuing this issue. Not like I am taking anything than personal attacks anyway for my honesty anyway.

The forum is political and maps make their way through by assembling a coalition of allies to push it through and suppress criticism anyway. Enough people have left the forum or told me to just k*ss *ss to get the map through that I don't hold it in that much respect.

[AndyDufresne]

Actually I've been meaning to ask Lack to Run some Data on Maps, when he gets time (won't be for a while).

That said, What sort of data would you all be interested in seeing? What criteria? Timelines? etc?

I'm sorry to hear you've had such an unfortunate experience with the Foundry, Merciless Wong. But people come and go in forums, this I know, so Ahoy to all those coming.


--Andy

[whitestazn88]

I don't have access to any data other than game finder but I think you'll find that on a simple search of open public games you can see certain maps recurring. Complex maps get a little buzz at launch then disappear.

Instead of responding to invective just get the stats. I offered to ask Lack if pm'd his e-mail - the moderators who have access declined to share that. I think there was an old stats page but it stopped being updated.

I am not expecting a clique to be enthusiastic about looking at data, the less there is the more their subjective judgements can rule the roost.

I owe this forum very little at this point - so I have no interest in pursuing this issue. Not like I am taking anything than personal attacks anyway for my honesty anyway.

The forum is political and maps make their way through by assembling a coalition of allies to push it through and suppress criticism anyway. Enough people have left the forum or told me to just k*ss *ss to get the map through that I don't hold it in that much respect.

i dunno what you mean by cliques... this foundry produces quality work because we hold everyone to very high standards. my best example of that is probably mibi, who will tear you a new one if your map sucks. its too bad your map sucked. better luck next time

[wcaclimbing]

i dunno what you mean by cliques... this foundry produces quality work because we hold everyone to very high standards. my best example of that is probably mibi, who will tear you a new one if your map sucks. its too bad your map sucked. better luck next time

DiM would definitely top that list. If your map isn't good, he'd always be the one to let you know.

Too bad he hasn't been seen around here in a long time...

[gimil]

I think you'll find that on a simple search of open public games you can see certain maps recurring.

Open public gamesdoesn't mean jack when it comes to map popularity. Alot of public games open (exc. maybe classic and a few other high profil maps) tells me that those maps are struggling to fill because they are less popular.

Like I said my stats are propbably about 6 months old but most of the established maps generally held the same position in rank to other maps excpet occassions where tournements use a map alot more than is normal in a certain space of time for that map. Wong you have also not given me any idea as to what criteria or any numbers that you think a map needs in order to be 'popular' or 'successful'.

Most of your problems that you seem to present are much more theoretical and opinionated rather than anything with evidence of substance. I am not trying to belittle you but if you want to see change you have to start talking fact, not theory. For example you just said the foundry process is political and coilitions are created so that elite map makers can push through each others maps. This is not true. It is about how someone behaves in and work with the foundry.

Off the top of my head the best map new map makers I have ever witnessed in the foundry were benny and snapdoodle (NYC map) and nobodies and pikko (oceania). These guys had good ideas, well thought out processes and very good skills and attitude. They got their maps through the foundry quicker than I have ever got any of mine!

If you want to see change wong we have to see facts, all you ahve produced (as far as I see) is theory produced by your dislike of the foundry rather than concern. This may/may not be true but that is what I see.

[whitestazn88]

i dunno what you mean by cliques... this foundry produces quality work because we hold everyone to very high standards. my best example of that is probably mibi, who will tear you a new one if your map sucks. its too bad your map sucked. better luck next time

DiM would definitely top that list. If your map isn't good, he'd always be the one to let you know.

Too bad he hasn't been seen around here in a long time...

well i talked about mibi instead of dim b/c i always thought of dim as more of trying to change the system, and enhance gameplay. mibi to me has always just been that guy who talks shit about bad maps. (but you should finish skyscraper if you're reading this!)

[Merciless Wong]

Actually I've been meaning to ask Lack to Run some Data on Maps, when he gets time (won't be for a while).

That said, What sort of data would you all be interested in seeing? What criteria? Timelines? etc?

I'm sorry to hear you've had such an unfortunate experience with the Foundry, Merciless Wong. But people come and go in forums, this I know, so Ahoy to all those coming.


--Andy

-Just like to see number of games played by map, for a recent time period, excluding beta testing.
-Plus when the map was put up.
-Put it up and settle the issue.