Poison Rome [Quenched]

[cairnswk]

Quick proposal: I think that the Gaius Julius Caesar - Marica bonus should be a 1, because even tho it's a 2-child family, it and the neighboring Gaius Marius - Julia Caesaris 1 bonus can be held behind just one terit (Proconsul Caesar). It's basically a 5-terit Oceania.

And I think the Emperors should go back to 5's, or at least Caesar and Caligula, to prevent easy bonus pickups.

Does anyone else agree with Inca's proposal?

[yeti_c]

Quick proposal: I think that the Gaius Julius Caesar - Marica bonus should be a 1, because even tho it's a 2-child family, it and the neighboring Gaius Marius - Julia Caesaris 1 bonus can be held behind just one terit (Proconsul Caesar). It's basically a 5-terit Oceania.

And I think the Emperors should go back to 5's, or at least Caesar and Caligula, to prevent easy bonus pickups.

Does anyone else agree with Inca's proposal?

Yes.

C.

[gimil]

Love the title cairns

An idea that I thought up. How about adding a drop shadow to all the game area? May make it stand on top of the reds background to add a little athetics? Just a thought.

[cairnswk]

Love the title cairns

An idea that I thought up. How about adding a drop shadow to all the game area? May make it stand on top of the reds background to add a little athetics? Just a thought.

Gimil, as there is little space between most of these terts and the background is really dark anyway, and there is already a bevel on all terts (slight as it might be) i don't think your suggestion is going to enhance the map.

[cairnswk]

Any further comments?

[InkL0sed]

I think 5 is too high for the emperors - maybe a 4 to compromise?

[cairnswk]

I think 5 is too high for the emperors - maybe a 4 to compromise?

Does your request take into account that if an Emperor gets a God, then that is another two armies at the Emperor's disposal.
I think 5 is a good number for these Emperors because of this factor, and look at Julius Caesar....he's got two easy bonuses attached and a third easy one if you get Julia.
Let's keep it at 5, and make these Emperors worth a decent fight to get/

[InkL0sed]

That's true, I hadn't considered the Gods. 5 it is.

[yeti_c]

That's true, I hadn't considered the Gods. 5 it is.

I agree - 5 is good for me...

Should discourage for a little while so that the big bonuses aren't immediate.

C.

[iancanton]

firstly, let me apologise for not having posted here for a while, the main reason being that, almost every time i try to study this map in detail, my head starts to hurt.

if an Emperor gets a God, then that is another two armies at the Emperor's disposal.
I think 5 is a good number for these Emperors because of this factor, and look at Julius Caesar....he's got two easy bonuses attached and a third easy one if you get Julia.
Let's keep it at 5, and make these Emperors worth a decent fight to get/

5 neutrals for emperors is good. however, julius caesar isn't an emperor and cannot access the gods directly, so 3 neutrals for him is better.

the number of starting territories is 45, a bad number for two-player games, since player 1 can reduce player 2's deployment by winning only one territory from him on turn 1. there is only one single-child family without neutrals, so i propose that we put 3 neutrals on julia major to avoid anyone gaining this bonus from the drop, with the beneficial side-effect that the number of starting territories comes down to 44.

at the moment, the bonuses are heavily weighted toward the gods, with childless families being worth relatively more than families with children.

the marcus v agrippa with julia the elder bonus can be doubled from +4 to +8: it's undoubtedly the most difficult bonus to hold, as 6 members of that family are vulnerable to poison.

the drusus with antonia bonus can also be doubled, this time from +3 to +6: it's a lot more connected than any other bonus.

i'd further like to see the agrippina with germanicus bonus upgraded from +5 to +7, with all of the 2-child families being increased to +3, so that it's possible to counter someone who has lucky dice when attacking an emperor and thus has sole access to the gods.

ian.

[cairnswk]

firstly, let me apologise for not having posted here for a while, the main reason being that, almost every time i try to study this map in detail, my head starts to hurt.

Surely ian it can't be worse that Forbidden City

if an Emperor gets a God, then that is another two armies at the Emperor's disposal.
I think 5 is a good number for these Emperors because of this factor, and look at Julius Caesar....he's got two easy bonuses attached and a third easy one if you get Julia.
Let's keep it at 5, and make these Emperors worth a decent fight to get/

5 neutrals for emperors is good. however, julius caesar isn't an emperor and cannot access the gods directly, so 3 neutrals for him is better.

Thanks for pointing that out Ian, but while he might not be an emperor, he does still have 4 (if one can hold Julia) easy bonuses, and i think i'll compromise there and make him a 4. he'll be even stronger if one holds all the Proconsul and Aurelia terts above that.

the number of starting territories is 45, a bad number for two-player games, since player 1 can reduce player 2's deployment by winning only one territory from him on turn 1. there is only one single-child family without neutrals, so i propose that we put 3 neutrals on julia major to avoid anyone gaining this bonus from the drop, with the beneficial side-effect that the number of starting territories comes down to 44.

Agreed.

at the moment, the bonuses are heavily weighted toward the gods, with childless families being worth relatively more than families with children.

the marcus v agrippa with julia the elder bonus can be doubled from +4 to +8: it's undoubtedly the most difficult bonus to hold, as 6 members of that family are vulnerable to poison.

OK. good stuff.

the drusus with antonia bonus can also be doubled, this time from +3 to +6: it's a lot more connected than any other bonus.

i'd further like to see the agrippina with germanicus bonus upgraded from +5 to +7, with all of the 2-child families being increased to +3, so that it's possible to counter someone who has lucky dice when attacking an emperor and thus has sole access to the gods.

ian.

Done, with the Gaius JC and Marcia (ex Regii) upgraded also to 3, as it's a 3 child family.
Ian, excellent work, thanks do much.



Version 32 below.

[iancanton]

the Gaius JC and Marcia (ex Regii) upgraded also to 3, as it's a 3 child family.

though i wasn't clear about it, that wasn't meant to happen!

Quick proposal: I think that the Gaius Julius Caesar - Marica bonus should be a 1, because even tho it's a 2-child family, it and the neighboring Gaius Marius - Julia Caesaris 1 bonus can be held behind just one terit (Proconsul Caesar). It's basically a 5-terit Oceania.

Does anyone else agree with Inca's proposal?

Yes.

the two families mentioned form a 6-territory oceania (rather than the 5 stated above), so the bonus for the gaius julius caesar with marica family must not be more than +2. is it supposed to be marica or marcia?

ian.

[Incandenza]

^^^what he said

[cairnswk]

....
the two families mentioned form a 6-territory oceania (rather than the 5 stated above), so the bonus for the gaius julius caesar with marica family must not be more than +2. is it supposed to be marica or marcia?
ian.

^^^what he said

OK please refresh your browsers...is this correct now?

[InkL0sed]

I don't see any problems...

[iancanton]

i do. emperor nero has only 3 neutrals instead of 5 at the moment. perhaps all of the neutrals that do not relate to a god, emperor, poisoner or julius caesar ought to be reduced to 2 instead of 3, otherwise the knockout strategy in 1v1 appears to be to target nero, then all four gods.

ian.

[InkL0sed]

I like reducing the neutrals that should be 3 to 2 (I never understood why they had to be 3 by default anyway); and Nero is probably just a mistake.

[cairnswk]

I like reducing the neutrals that should be 3 to 2 (I never understood why they had to be 3 by default anyway); and Nero is probably just a mistake.

yes, mistake. Nero should be 5 neutral like the other Emperors.

[cairnswk]

i do. emperor nero has only 3 neutrals instead of 5 at the moment. perhaps all of the neutrals that do not relate to a god, emperor, poisoner or julius caesar ought to be reduced to 2 instead of 3, otherwise the knockout strategy in 1v1 appears to be to target nero, then all four gods.

ian.

OK. Nero is reverted to 5 neutrals ian.
Any feedback on reducing the other neutral non-emperor positions to 2.
Is this a reasonable piece of strategy?
Feedback please peoples.

[yeti_c]

Yeah - drop them to 2 - makes them more likely to be brought into play... and less likely to be used as barriers.

C.

[THE ARMY]

this doesn't even look like a map

[Incandenza]

this doesn't even look like a map

That's the beauty of it...

As far as the non-emperor neutrals, I can get behind them being 2's... tho the gods should definitely stay at 3.

[cairnswk]

this doesn't even look like a map

i guess that depends on your definition of a map

[cairnswk]

this doesn't even look like a map

That's the beauty of it...

As far as the non-emperor neutrals, I can get behind them being 2's... tho the gods should definitely stay at 3.

Cool...2 neutrals it is...

Click image to enlarge.

[cairnswk]

i guess if everyone is happy with this, we can proceed to xml????