Suggestion: No card inheriting due to deadbeating

Wild_Tiger · Post by **Wild_Tiger** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 11:37 pm

Get rid of the new rule (however I missed it in the suggestions box before if it was) that players who deadbeat in team-games now not only give their territories to their partner, but also their cards. I think this encourages deadbeating.

aliakber1001 · Post by **aliakber1001** » Sat Dec 01, 2007 11:55 pm

yea i agree it gives the deadbeaters a better chance to beat me. i am against it

casper · Post by **casper** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 12:00 am

yeah wtf is this....? if anything we should go back to the original rules where the teammate gets nothing. not reward deadbeaters even more!!

xxtig12683xx · Post by **xxtig12683xx** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 12:19 am

truth, get rid of this stupid rule

Scott-Land · Post by **Scott-Land** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 1:20 am

Wild_Tiger wrote:Get rid of the new rule (however I missed it in the suggestions box before if it was) that players who deadbeat in team-games now not only give their territories to their partner, but also their cards. I think this encourages deadbeating.

You're absolutely right........ it's bad enough that the teammate gets his armies let alone cards.

AndrewB · Post by **AndrewB** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 1:33 am

How comes lackattack is changing the rules, without letting everyone know?

Anyhow, this "new" rules certainly does not make any sense...

jaydog · Post by **jaydog** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 2:13 am

I too disagree with this new rule, but i didn't even know it was changed, guess i should pay more attention

khazalid · Post by **khazalid** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:40 am

jaydog wrote:I too disagree with this new rule, but i didn't even know it was changed, guess i should pay more attention :?

yup. smacks of profit margins to me.

firstholliday · Post by **firstholliday** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 5:54 am

voted no

jiminski · Post by **jiminski** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 7:15 am

Please no,

There are enough ways for the determinedly bad spirited to exact victory upon the determinedly honest.

you've got to maintain some parity for us sad idiots who adhere to the letter of the law and tenor of fair play!
We check our game 30 to 40 times a day. We ensure a string of baby-sitters before even finding our passport to go on our honeymoon and or foreign family funeral.

Deadbeating must remain a disadvantage as well as anathema to the ethical.
We spit out the conjunctive term like a stray blue-bottle we know to have just feasted upon a cow-pat!
It ruins the flow of the game and upsets the nature of tactics, giving a boost to a losing team.

With card handover it may tip the balance, making it a viable winning strategy and not just an annoying losing one for those without imagination and skill.

right. i'm off to save the world!

Big Yuma Ripper · Post by **Big Yuma Ripper** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:41 am

jiminski...

LOL yea i agree with what you said : )

Thought i was the only one that lined up baby sitters, to assure time to play and borrowed lap tops to go on vacation, staying only in hotels that offer wireless internet!

NO please....

PLAYER57832 · Post by **PLAYER57832** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 1:48 pm

It seems unfair to NOT give the remaining player the countries -- after all, it is not that person's fault their partner deabeated. This happened to me. Effectively, it meant I was working alone against 4 other people.

Cards, though -- I can see arguments for both ways. But how often are cards involved? Unless someone knows they cannot continue, it seems folks who deadbeat tend to drop out early?? often before they even get cards????? Or am I mistaken on that?

dragon dor · Post by **dragon dor** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 2:26 pm

i don t like that cause i loose some of 1 team player missed 3 turned and after the other have lot country in larger map if he win he s card to lot players do some bad game

and i think in speed game lot do missed for x they re army i hate to maybe in speed game we do new rules and don t x army for missed

and in escalating it s end game

casper · Post by **casper** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 2:55 pm

PLAYER57832 wrote:It seems unfair to NOT give the remaining player the countries -- after all, it is not that person's fault their partner deabeated. This happened to me. Effectively, it meant I was working alone against 4 other people.

no it's not that person's fault but the deadbeat is on that person's team. it is a team game. if a teammate messes up and deadbeats, the remaining player should not be rewarded for it. that person should have been more selective about who he or she picks as a partner in the first place.

bottom line is it gives even more incentive for a team to deadbeat. i thought lack's goal was to minimize deadbeats, not encourage it.

Blitzaholic · Post by **Blitzaholic** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:06 pm

casper wrote:yeah wtf is this....? if anything we should go back to the original rules where the teammate gets nothing. not reward deadbeaters even more!!

agreed

MOBAJOBG · Post by **MOBAJOBG** » Sun Dec 02, 2007 5:31 pm

Click here for my game as described below http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=588351.

By Round 8, WNxHotSoup holding 4 cards missed his turn and was kicked out. Chaimpie who had already has 4 cards inherited WNxHotSoup's Hunter's Point(14) armies, 5 territories in S. San Francisco and 4 cards. Needless to say, Chaimpie cashed out 2 sets and won for Team 2.

Extracted out from the Log of Game #588351
2007-07-11 01:58:18 - Incrementing game to round 8
2007-07-12 01:58:18 - WNxHotSoup missed a turn
2007-07-12 01:58:18 - WNxHotSoup was kicked out for missing too many turns
...intentionally left out a few lines
2007-07-12 14:11:22 - Chaimpie cashed in a set of Castro, Fisherman's Wharf, and Alcatraz worth 10 armies
2007-07-12 14:11:31 - Chaimpie cashed in a set of Mission, Pacific Heights, and Golden Gate Park worth 8 armies

Extracted out from the Chat of Game #588351
2007-07-12 03:29:22 - kamoshirenai [team]: WHOA!!!!!!!! since when does yellow get all of blue's armies?!??! I had no idea that was going to happen!!!!
2007-07-12 03:30:02 - kamoshirenai [team]: holy crap... what a disaster. that changes everything.
2007-07-12 03:37:52 - MOBAJOBG [team]: ...and all of blue's (4) cards too.
2007-07-12 03:39:10 - kamoshirenai [team]: that is completely insane. what the hell?! when did that start happening????
2007-07-12 03:39:32 - kamoshirenai [team]: I was counting on blue being kicked out of the game. I suppose it truly is impossible to win now.

There was nothing anyone of Team 2's opponents who had played diligently and did not miss any turn could do to stop such a rampage. As a result, I lost my regular and trusted doubles teammate since kamoshirenai has stopped playing altogether in CC.

So, I'm hoping to be in the THOTA clan for the obvious.

Since then, I've decided to shun playing 6p doubles sequential cards games due to this awkward development.

jiminski · Post by **jiminski** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 8:52 am

Attica! Attica! Attica!

This is a travesty.. Can we galvanise some more support?
(Tiger brought my attention to it.) i suppose most of the Thotasians have been made aware.. How about your tribe Scott?

pascalleke · Post by **pascalleke** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:24 am

whats this

deadbeats and turnmissers are so sweet that they must need some extra bonus??

if you cant play without missing then just dont play

strange ideas you have crew

jennifermarie · Post by **jennifermarie** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:27 am

casper wrote: no it's not that person's fault but the deadbeat is on that person's team. it is a team game. if a teammate messes up and deadbeats, the remaining player should not be rewarded for it. that person should have been more selective about who he or she picks as a partner in the first place.

bottom line is it gives even more incentive for a team to deadbeat. i thought lack's goal was to minimize deadbeats, not encourage it.

(added emphasis mine)...I don't agree with selectivity, because some tourneys are based around getting random partners for different games, so you really can't select something. And if something unexpected happens to your regular partner (i.e. death in the family, internet issues, etc), then how would that be a selection problem? I think it is fair that the other player gets all the countries and cards. Once people start to realize that this rule has been in effect for a while and understand it, they will try harder to take out the team mate of the deadbeater, therefore alleviating the problem of country transfer

Baas K · Post by **Baas K** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:34 am

This is not a good idea (missed the rule change).

Getting the deadbeat's territories and armies is already more of a bonus than just the numbers themselves. Suddenly a continent that was held by 2 players, is now held by just one, also giving potential bonusses.

And on top of that you also get his/her cards to cash in and become unstoppable all at once? Not a good idea.....

MOBAJOBG · Post by **MOBAJOBG** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:04 am

jennifermarie wrote:
casper wrote: no it's not that person's fault but the deadbeat is on that person's team. it is a team game. if a teammate messes up and deadbeats, the remaining player should not be rewarded for it. that person should have been more selective about who he or she picks as a partner in the first place.

bottom line is it gives even more incentive for a team to deadbeat. i thought lack's goal was to minimize deadbeats, not encourage it.
(added emphasis mine)...I don't agree with selectivity, because some tourneys are based around getting random partners for different games, so you really can't select something. And if something unexpected happens to your regular partner (i.e. death in the family, internet issues, etc), then how would that be a selection problem? I think it is fair that the other player gets all the countries and cards. Once people start to realize that this rule has been in effect for a while and understand it, they will try harder to take out the team mate of the deadbeater, therefore alleviating the problem of country transfer

*Ahem*, you're right but just to a certain extent. Anyway, my version is ...Once people start to realize that this rule has been in effect for a while and understand it, they have come forward to protest and also, to explain its shortcomings and impracticality.

pascalleke · Post by **pascalleke** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:15 am

jennifermarie wrote:
casper wrote: no it's not that person's fault but the deadbeat is on that person's team. it is a team game. if a teammate messes up and deadbeats, the remaining player should not be rewarded for it. that person should have been more selective about who he or she picks as a partner in the first place.

bottom line is it gives even more incentive for a team to deadbeat. i thought lack's goal was to minimize deadbeats, not encourage it.
(added emphasis mine)...I don't agree with selectivity, because some tourneys are based around getting random partners for different games, so you really can't select something. And if something unexpected happens to your regular partner (i.e. death in the family, internet issues, etc), then how would that be a selection problem? I think it is fair that the other player gets all the countries and cards. Once people start to realize that this rule has been in effect for a while and understand it, they will try harder to take out the team mate of the deadbeater, therefore alleviating the problem of country transfer

i agree that irl can change things , but would it not be more wise and honest then to let a "sitter" play further?

SORRY BUT TO MANY PLAYERS ABUSE THE TURNMISS-ARMYMULTIPLIER "GADGET" wenn they are loosing and my expercience is that @#$ for many good fun games.

and this new "gadget" even more will cause such crap "tricks " in games.

SO ONCE AGAIN a simple question to your wise crew of cc : why make not a simpler and honest solution for deadbeats and turnmissers.
"sitter" like you have on travian, 2 each account , not by using a pass but with a function at the profile options.

is it ourfault that a turnmisser misses his turn? so why must we pay for it ????

jiminski · Post by **jiminski** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 12:34 pm

jennifermarie wrote: ...I don't agree with selectivity, because some tourneys are based around getting random partners for different games, so you really can't select something. And if something unexpected happens to your regular partner (i.e. death in the family, internet issues, etc), then how would that be a selection problem? I think it is fair that the other player gets all the countries and cards. Once people start to realize that this rule has been in effect for a while and understand it, they will try harder to take out the team mate of the deadbeater, therefore alleviating the problem of country transfer

This is surely a red-herring, i feel sorry for the people who get lumbered with random deadbeats but we eventually rid ourselves of this by playing with more reliable partners... it really does not take long (it took me 24 games)

Are we changing the rules to suit a tiny proportion of tournament games where you don't chose your partner or because of death causing a missed go?
If someone pops their clogs in the family, whose flaming go it is on CC is hardly relevant compared to the pain that will cause.

This new rule is going to encourage more 'manipulation' of the rules and will infuriate the die-hard players.

Do we honestly need more 'manipulation' (you know i mean cheating because of the 'emphasis' and apostrophe's right?) to counter good tactics?

My mum always said i could have stuff if i used the magic word: 'Please' no Mr Turtle!?

(My Dad always said if the magic word doesn't work with your mum; sue ... but then he did run off with a comely woman called Suzy.. ahh well nothing's straight-forward!)

insomniacdude · Post by **insomniacdude** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 4:42 pm

The new system doesn't penalize a good team player when a potential bad teammate deadbeats. When a teammate deadbeats, that swings the odds. In a doubles game, a deadbeat changes the game from an even 2v2 to an uneven 2v1. The team of 1 has the same amount of cards and countries as before the deadbeat, but now they must continue with half of the turns and half of the cards as the opposing team.

At the same time, it does encourage some of the more "clever" players to deadbeat at a certain time to give a player 9 cards and double the territories on their next turn.

The solution: maybe we can change the point distribution system for team games with deadbeats. The formula is applied as normal, but the non-deadbeat person gets 80% of the points, and the deadbeater just gets 20% of the points. (for doubles games, no idea how to work it into triples games).

jiminski · Post by **jiminski** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:05 pm

the problem is the greater opportunity for abuse.. apportioning different point ratio's won't deter this insomniac.

Suggestion: No card inheriting due to deadbeating

Do you think its fair to also get cards next to territories with deadbeaters?

Suggestion: No card inheriting due to deadbeating

Re: Suggestion: No card inheriting due to deadbeating

grrrr