9/11 conspiracy, A BOOGA BOOGA BOOGA

[BigBallinStalin]

This is just random musings. I really don't know enough of the situation to fervently declare that this or that happened, but feedback, random musings, stories, and what not are all appreciated.


Did y'all read the Commission report? Give it a look-see if you haven't, and you don't want to then oh well. http://www.911commission.gov/report/911Report.pdf

There's a section in James Bamford's Body of Secrets (I'm sure it's this one, but it might be a later one of his) that goes in a lot more credible depth than the (mis)information from nearly every conspiracy theory I've encountered (I'm not implying that a lot of these conspiracy theories hold much water, but some pose interesting questions that are beyond my ability to answer easily). What's interesting is that the 9/11 Commission hardly questioned the NSA's role in this, so certain crucial information is missing that can either clear the US governments' (or a select few highly influential members') complicity or it can be damning. Since the 9/11 Commission failed to properly investigate the NSA, then it becomes difficult for me to say that there was no wrongdoing on the US's part since many crucial questions weren't asked or were outright ignored by the NSA...

As for those crack theories about having wiring technicians plant bombs in the towers, and what not, those are bit ridiculous. But according to NSA's records from Body of Secrets, what's interesting is that the NSA's whole computer system was shut down a few days before 9/11 (maybe a week or two at the most before), and this had them backlogged with tons of work before the events occurred. What's weird is that such a shutdown is extremely rare, and it looks too coincedental. Perhaps almost convienent, but this is only speculation since not enough information was collected on the NSA's role during the 9/11 Commission. All we can look at are the events that happened beforehand. The NSA definitely knew most of the going on's of these terrorists, but... somehow it happened,perhaps they were close to figuring out what was going, perhaps certain people were withholding information from the rest of the agency, perhaps.. well, a lot of things, but it's all speculation since the 9/11 Commission miserably failed in getting the good answers from the NSA.

Also, there's a mention of the question, "why wasn't that airliner alerted to anyone after it strayed of course?" Because when that happens without permission, there's jets scrambling in the air and control tower operators asking questions, but either the first jet's or the second's (probably both) off-course trajectories weren't really reported, which was odd because usually no one ignores such things when they happen.

Sure there was the bickering between the FBI and CIA in their respective CT deparments, but still that's an insufficient reason which explains why the US bungled this one up so badly.


Now, I'm talking out of my ass: I heard that the owner of the twin towers a few days before they fell, bought a hugely expensive insurance policy that covers for damage from airplanes--or at least terrorist attacks. If that's true, then it's just a coincidence, but an interesting one.

Also, I never could properly explain this one: People sometimes point at reruns of the building while it collapses and they comment, "Isn't that peculiar? It feel down so nice and neatly, because when buildings are purposely demolished, it takes careful planning and well-placed explosives to do the job right. But a huge jet collides into the side of the building and the building collapses more or less stably." Now, perhaps these buildings were designed to do that, I have no idea and I just can't explain that one, so some more insight would be appreciated.

Also, I see people pointing at pictures of debris flying out of the sides of the building several floors away from the impact area. I'm sure when a building collapses, air gets trapped and shoots out at random spots, so that probably explains that, but I don't know much about the workings of demolishing buildings.


So, that's pretty much all I know. Questions? Comments? Criticisms?

[muy_thaiguy]

[jay_a2j]

seconded.

[pimpdave]

I don't know much about the workings of demolishing buildings.

Neither do most of the tin-foil hatters. Yet that doesn't stop them or you from speculating as if you do.



There was a conspiracy on 9/11. It was carried out by these men:



/thread

[72o]

I don't know much about the workings of demolishing buildings.

Neither do most of the tin-foil hatters. Yet that doesn't stop them or you from speculating as if you do.



There was a conspiracy on 9/11. It was carried out by these men:



/thread

So I guess the moral of this story is, if you're going to hijack a plane and try to crash it into a building, make sure there are at least 5 of you.

[Titanic]

So I guess the moral of this story is, if you're going to hijack a plane and try to crash it into a building, make sure there are at least 5 of you.

Thats pretty good LOL.

[Neoteny]

I lol'd.

[natty dread]

I'm looking for 4 new buddies... anyone into jihad?

[Woodruff]

So I guess the moral of this story is, if you're going to hijack a plane and try to crash it into a building, make sure there are at least 5 of you.

<laughing out loud> I had never made that connection before - well done!

[Rustovitch]

What I like most about this thread is the very respectful title.

[BigBallinStalin]

Yeah

[BigBallinStalin]

I don't know much about the workings of demolishing buildings.

Neither do most of the tin-foil hatters. Yet that doesn't stop them or you from speculating as if you do.



There was a conspiracy on 9/11. It was carried out by these men:
/thread

I haven't at all assumed that I know a great amount on how to demolish buildings properly, so don't lump me in with the tin-foil hat whackos who think they do. The conspiracies that deny that terrorists destroyed the Towers or that the government directly blew them up are too far-fetched and are not at all convincing. I'm merely asking a question about the workings of building demolition to see if anyone knows more about that because it's a question that I can't really answer.

Also, most of my thread in no way denies that those men did not destroy the towers.
__________________________________________________________


What I found interesting is the lack of questions and lackluster effort to drive more crucial information from the NSA. If there was nothing to really hide, then why hide it? The NSA is well-known to defend themselves from any investigation if it goes against their interests.


From what I've read, which is Body of Secrets by James Bamford (who's no joke by the way, and he doesn't claim this or that on 9/11, he just delves into the NSA's publically accessible and extremely difficult information to get, holds interviews with them, and has made his connections within the Intelligence Community to simply write books on the NSA--not just 9/11, he only talked about NSA events during that time) and also the 9/11 Commission Report, it seems that there was a good chance that a certain group of people knew when and how those terrorists were going to attack us, and they decided to let it happen. By letting such a gruesome terrorist attack happen, one could easily get the excuse to become more militarily involved in other countries with huge--or at least large enough--support. Who exactly? No idea, not enough evidence. It's just suspicious that the NSA wasn't properly investigated--looks like a cover-up, like something's being hidden. Had the NSA been properly investigated, all avenues would've opened to what was going on at the time.

[pimpdave]

What I find interesting is that you're as articulate as you are for someone so clearly lacking even a basic education, you mouth-breathing idiot.

Screw Loose Change: The Not Freakin' Again Edition

[BigBallinStalin]

What I find interesting is that you're as articulate as you are for someone so clearly lacking even a basic education, you mouth-breathing idiot.

Screw Loose Change: The Not Freakin' Again Edition

I'll check out your 3 hour video, and thanks for being a dick.

If it doesn't touch on the 9/11 Commission Report and their handling of the NSA, then that would be lame, but I'm hoping for the best.

[BigBallinStalin]

Operation Northwoods: To bring up one argument against that video, the government did plan on having American civilian casualties, but it's right that Northwoods and 9/11 really aren't related. All Northwoods shows is that the Joint Chiefs of Staff in the early 1960s were capable of making some very twisted ideas.

Larry Silverstein's insurance plan: Like I said coincidence, but I was just wondering. 6 weeks before 9/11, not too big of a deal.

Air bases and jets ready to go: Ah, that's enlightening stuff. They aren't in fact ready to go in a moment's notice.

14:30ish: Too bad the link didn't work to look more into this section.

16:00: lol, that's low of them to place Hunter S Thompson's words out of context there.

18:45: A supposed insurance scam would'n't have been worth it. Ah, makes sense.

20:00: Finally, building demolitions. That's exactly what I wanted to know and couldn't explain myself.

I've never seen the Loose Change video (the original) and it's pretty laughable, so I skipped through the explanations for the things I already knew which were completely ridiculous and easy to counter.

So, pimpdave, thanks for the link. I asked a few questions, and it easily answered most of them. Once again, I've never taken the side that Loose Change and many of its followers have, but I'm always willing to question and find out the answers to things I can't answer on my own.

That stuff was nice, but I'm mainly interested in what happens beforehand. The security issue. How did this happen? I've talked to a couple FBI agents about it, and they explained how certain information was bungled, not properly shared, and what not, and that explained a lot. As far as the NSA is concerned, well they weren't properly investigated.

[Woodruff]

Air bases and jets ready to go: Ah, that's enlightening stuff. They aren't in fact ready to go in a moment's notice.

That actually depends very much on the particular air bases and jets, of course. Some certainly were (and are), but certainly not all of them.

[Phatscotty]

Obama Received Holiday Threat Briefing Before Attack Attempt....

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/01 ... k-attempt/

OBAMA KNEW!!!!!!!!!!

[vodean]

its all obamas fault.

[vodean]

I'm looking for 4 new buddies... anyone into jihad?

JIHAD!!!!!!!!!!!! just three more. where should we hit? white house?

[Titanic]

Obama Received Holiday Threat Briefing Before Attack Attempt....

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/01 ... k-attempt/

OBAMA KNEW!!!!!!!!!!

The official said the report did not mention Yemen, whose Al Qaeda affiliate is believed to have been behind Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab’s unsuccessful attack attempt on the airliner.

Right.....

[Phatscotty]

Obama Received Holiday Threat Briefing Before Attack Attempt....

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/01 ... k-attempt/

OBAMA KNEW!!!!!!!!!!

The official said the report did not mention Yemen, whose Al Qaeda affiliate is believed to have been behind Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab’s unsuccessful attack attempt on the airliner.

Right.....

#1, completely sarcastic (Bush knew!) #2 yes, Yemen is connected, but it was a Nigerian. it's a moot point really. and so is this thread

[jay_a2j]

Of the 4 hi-jacked planes NONE of the black boxes were found.(according to the FBI) An expert with over 30 years of aviation experience was asked what is the probability that none of the black boxes would be found, he replied, "almost zero".



But yeah, WE'RE the crazy ones.



Check this out:


Links to all episodes.... have fun debunking Jessie!

[Titanic]

Obama Received Holiday Threat Briefing Before Attack Attempt....

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/01 ... k-attempt/

OBAMA KNEW!!!!!!!!!!

The official said the report did not mention Yemen, whose Al Qaeda affiliate is believed to have been behind Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab’s unsuccessful attack attempt on the airliner.

Right.....

#1, completely sarcastic (Bush knew!) #2 yes, Yemen is connected, but it was a Nigerian. it's a moot point really. and so is this thread

I got the sarcasm. Yemen is the important part of the whole story and conspiracy.

[multilis]

"But a huge jet collides into the side of the building and the building collapses more or less stably" - That part imo is believable, heat weakened the entire structure where the plane hit, then gravity collapsed the buildings, each layer hit the next which caused it to collapse, like vertical dominoes.

You wouldn't need explosives to help bring down the lower floors... they have impact force of all the upper floors hitting them. Explosives in upper floor where fire is burning is illogical, fire would set it off.

"Of the 4 hi-jacked planes NONE of the black boxes were found" I believe 2 were found. Surviving 30 minutes in 1100C temp *then* tonnes of concrete hammering is not so simple, heat weakens metal over time.
...

IMO *if* there was a conspiracy it would involve non-action, letting real terrorists act like terrorists (and perhaps helping them a little), rather than a convoluted explosives or missile/plane switch conspiracy. Same thing is possible for 1993 attack on WTC if you read up on wikipedia article. You could blame American spies, Isreali spies, or Russian spies if you want to, each side could be claimed to profit, often for conflicting reasons.

[BigBallinStalin]

Jay and Phat: Don't post in this thread about different crap. Make your own, thank you.