Tribe Medal & Tournament Questions/Discussion

[josko.ri]

How about awarding tribal medal for winners of each war? I think the best of 41 poly challenge meets requirements for awarding of tribal medal for winners.

This is not associated with Tribes at all, although Tribes attempted to get 1vs1 / poly events going without much response / luck.
It's possible something we can discuss in the future, but at this time I don't see that happening as we are giving clan medals for the winner, similar as 1vs1 events in the past.

IcePack

In the past there did not exist Tribes so you could not give tribal medal for winners of each 1v1 war, but now when they exist it would be unfair to not give medals for the whole completed war of 41 games.

You mean winner of the challenge receive clan medal, not winner of each poly war or ?

Correct, winner of the challenge (same as we had for 1vs1 event).
But Tribes work the same way, that only the winner of the auto tournament / tournament gets a medal. Not for each match up.

The other Tribal tournaments are set up on the way that only winner of the whole event gets a medal. However, these tournaments are not composed of full wars but are composed of a lot of mini wars which does not meet criteria to be judged as full war. The other Tribal tournament are similar like Clan League where only winners of the whole tournament receive medals.
However, this Poly event is similar like Conquerors' Cup because every war is full war of best of 41 games, so in my opinion medal awarding should be similar like in Conquerors' Cup, that every completed war gets Tribal medal.

If, for example, two clans decide to have best-of-41 Poly Tribal war (I dont know if this has happened so far but putting this as an example), would they receive Tribal medal for winner of the war? If yes, how is then different having a single Tribal war of best-of-41 and having best-of-41 Tribal war as a part of Poly tournament?

[IcePack]

How about awarding tribal medal for winners of each war? I think the best of 41 poly challenge meets requirements for awarding of tribal medal for winners.

This is not associated with Tribes at all, although Tribes attempted to get 1vs1 / poly events going without much response / luck.
It's possible something we can discuss in the future, but at this time I don't see that happening as we are giving clan medals for the winner, similar as 1vs1 events in the past.

IcePack

In the past there did not exist Tribes so you could not give tribal medal for winners of each 1v1 war, but now when they exist it would be unfair to not give medals for the whole completed war of 41 games.

Tribes did exist when this competition was conceived & planned. Tribe events are separate from clan events, and clan events for 1vs1 (traditional and now poly) are treated in the same manner, of only issuing to the winner. 1vs1 events in the past had 41 series w/ 5 games / series, and still only winners received medals. The poly actually has less games associated then the 1vs1 traditional event, that also had full wars.

You mean winner of the challenge receive clan medal, not winner of each poly war or ?

Correct, winner of the challenge (same as we had for 1vs1 event).
But Tribes work the same way, that only the winner of the auto tournament / tournament gets a medal. Not for each match up.

The other Tribal tournaments are set up on the way that only winner of the whole event gets a medal. However, these tournaments are not composed of full wars but are composed of a lot of mini wars which does not meet criteria to be judged as full war. The other Tribal tournament are similar like Clan League where only winners of the whole tournament receive medals.
However, this Poly event is similar like Conquerors' Cup because every war is full war of best of 41 games, so in my opinion medal awarding should be similar like in Conquerors' Cup, that every completed war gets Tribal medal.

as stated above, previous events had "full wars" but did not issue per war. There was some efforts which were put forth by Lindax to start poly and 1vs1 events under tribe tournaments, if interested I'd recommend letting Lindax know because I don't think he got much response there.

If, for example, two clans decide to have best-of-41 Poly Tribal war (I dont know if this has happened so far but putting this as an example), would they receive Tribal medal for winner of the war? If yes, how is then different having a single Tribal war of best-of-41 and having best-of-41 Tribal war as a part of Poly tournament?
Im not sure what the requirements are for Tribal medals. Lindax would be the guy to ask. Depending on the answer there, it might make more sense to run the event in the Tribes system in the future (that's what the area was meant for, plus the auto tournament system).

[Vid_FISO]

as stated above, previous events had "full wars" but did not issue per war. There was some efforts which were put forth by Lindax to start poly and 1vs1 events under tribe tournaments, if interested I'd recommend letting Lindax know because I don't think he got much response there.

If, for example, two clans decide to have best-of-41 Poly Tribal war (I dont know if this has happened so far but putting this as an example), would they receive Tribal medal for winner of the war? If yes, how is then different having a single Tribal war of best-of-41 and having best-of-41 Tribal war as a part of Poly tournament?
Im not sure what the requirements are for Tribal medals. Lindax would be the guy to ask. Depending on the answer there, it might make more sense to run the event in the Tribes system in the future (that's what the area was meant for, plus the auto tournament system).

The issue with tribes is that those comps are run as auto-tourneys not as wars. No maps and settings choices, no home and away, no privileges, a group of individuals against another group of individuals within the confines of auto-tourneys. The way that clans work doesn't mesh with tribes at all.

[IcePack]

as stated above, previous events had "full wars" but did not issue per war. There was some efforts which were put forth by Lindax to start poly and 1vs1 events under tribe tournaments, if interested I'd recommend letting Lindax know because I don't think he got much response there.

If, for example, two clans decide to have best-of-41 Poly Tribal war (I dont know if this has happened so far but putting this as an example), would they receive Tribal medal for winner of the war? If yes, how is then different having a single Tribal war of best-of-41 and having best-of-41 Tribal war as a part of Poly tournament?
Im not sure what the requirements are for Tribal medals. Lindax would be the guy to ask. Depending on the answer there, it might make more sense to run the event in the Tribes system in the future (that's what the area was meant for, plus the auto tournament system).

The issue with tribes is that those comps are run as auto-tourneys not as wars. No maps and settings choices, no home and away, no privileges, a group of individuals against another group of individuals within the confines of auto-tourneys. The way that clans work doesn't mesh with tribes at all.

You can run non team game wars with tribes (poly and 1vs1) but nobody has bothered to do it, so the only thing going there now is the autos

[Vid_FISO]

as stated above, previous events had "full wars" but did not issue per war. There was some efforts which were put forth by Lindax to start poly and 1vs1 events under tribe tournaments, if interested I'd recommend letting Lindax know because I don't think he got much response there.

If, for example, two clans decide to have best-of-41 Poly Tribal war (I dont know if this has happened so far but putting this as an example), would they receive Tribal medal for winner of the war? If yes, how is then different having a single Tribal war of best-of-41 and having best-of-41 Tribal war as a part of Poly tournament?
Im not sure what the requirements are for Tribal medals. Lindax would be the guy to ask. Depending on the answer there, it might make more sense to run the event in the Tribes system in the future (that's what the area was meant for, plus the auto tournament system).

The issue with tribes is that those comps are run as auto-tourneys not as wars. No maps and settings choices, no home and away, no privileges, a group of individuals against another group of individuals within the confines of auto-tourneys. The way that clans work doesn't mesh with tribes at all.

You can run non team game wars with tribes (poly and 1vs1) but nobody has bothered to do it, so the only thing going there now is the autos

Not bothered or too much work involved for the individual TO? 8 clans in a comp has 8 people creating and inviting, 8 tribes in a similar comp has one person trying to do the same thing?

[IcePack]

I'm not sure I follow? The TO wouldn't be making the games for 8 clans / tribes. In a similar comp in tribes, two tribe wars would be very similar to a clan war I believe (Lindax can confirm he knows more then I do on it).
The only time the TO would be doing it himself would be if it ran on the auto tournament system.

[Lindax]

I will try to answer the questions about Tribe medals, etc., here:

How about awarding tribal medal for winners of each war? I think the best of 41 poly challenge meets requirements for awarding of tribal medal for winners.

Clans and Tribes are two separate departments. Clan medals cannot be awarded for Tribe events and vice versa. The same way we cannot award a TO of a clan tournament with a Tournament Contribution Medal from the Tournament Department.

If, for example, two clans decide to have best-of-41 Poly Tribal war (I dont know if this has happened so far but putting this as an example), would they receive Tribal medal for winner of the war? If yes, how is then different having a single Tribal war of best-of-41 and having best-of-41 Tribal war as a part of Poly tournament?

Tribe tournaments and Tribal Wars are dealt with on a case by case basis. Every event is approved (or not) individually and for every event the rewards (medals, cc stars, cc credits) are also decided upon case by case. The Tribe department has more liberty and less restrictions/rules than the Clan department. In your example the best-of-41 Poly Tribal war would likely be approved as well as a Tribe medal for the winners. If you would run a similar POLY tournament to the one uckuki is running now in the clan department, in the Tribe department you could request a Tribe medal for the winner of every war/round. That may very well be approved, but again, that is decided on a case by case basis.

The issue with tribes is that those comps are run as auto-tourneys not as wars. No maps and settings choices, no home and away, no privileges, a group of individuals against another group of individuals within the confines of auto-tourneys. The way that clans work doesn't mesh with tribes at all.

This is not true. As I mentioned in my PM about the 1v1 Tribe Challenge, there are ways to choose home maps and settings, even with auto-tournaments. Now, you can't do everything the same with auto tournaments as with manually run tournaments, however, Tribe tournaments do not HAVE to be auto tournaments. Right now we have a tournament ongoing, which is a mixture of Poly, 1v1 and team games, partially created as auto tournaments and partially run manually. It is also possible to run complete tournaments manually. Either with the TO creating games, etc, as in standard tournaments, or with the use of privileges, exactly the same way as most clan tournaments and clan wars.

You can run non team game wars with tribes (poly and 1vs1) but nobody has bothered to do it, so the only thing going there now is the autos

Not bothered or too much work involved for the individual TO? 8 clans in a comp has 8 people creating and inviting, 8 tribes in a similar comp has one person trying to do the same thing?

I'm not sure I follow? The TO wouldn't be making the games for 8 clans / tribes. In a similar comp in tribes, two tribe wars would be very similar to a clan war I believe (Lindax can confirm he knows more then I do on it).
The only time the TO would be doing it himself would be if it ran on the auto tournament system.

Indeed Ice! The possibilities in the Tribe department are (almost) endless! The POLY and 1v1 Clan Challenges are ideal to be run in the Tribe department. They could be run exactly the same as in the clan department, if that's what you want. The only difference would be that you would NOT get a clan medal.

Lx

[Vid_FISO]

Hi all,

You're getting this PM because you expressed an interest in the 1v1 Clan Challenge. There does not seem to be enough interest do do this as a Clan Tournament. However, I could run something similar through the Tribe section with less tribes/clans and less players. The format would need to fit auto-tournaments though, so we would be looking at something like this Poly version: viewtopic.php?f=802&t=216992

With less tribes we'd play less rounds, but we could run the format twice if we use 8 players per tribe. Maybe use 2 home maps per tribe and the tribes can choose home settings. Every game would randomly choose a map from the home maps in this format. The example format is round robin by the way.

We could do it as an elimination bracket, with players playing each other between 2 tribes. Do that twice, home and away. And we can make it 3 games per 2 players.

Anyway, let me know if you're interested and if you prefer round robin or elimination bracket. You can also give me other suggestions for the format. Then I can come up with the exact format and post a sing-up thread.

Thanks,

Lx

Forgive me but this is the pm you sent out, the options that you outlined did not include running such a comp in the same way that the current clan poly comp is being run but rather with a much more restrictive (and clearly unpopular) set up. If my understanding of your pm and the possibilities available were in error you could have made this clear in a reply to my response to you,

Personally - no. I just don't like the tribes thing, nor the randomising of what (in my mind) should be a choice. The clan comp would be the individual players choosing which maps they want to play on and with their preferred settings and picking which opponents/ maps/ settings they were happiest with. This could easily put players on "home" maps that they are not comfortable with at all.

Of course no issues if you wish to try to put together a FISO team via CatchersMitt14, she'll probably get two thirds of the way there with serial entrants

Dave

but it is only now over a week later and nearly a year since Tribes were introduced that you offer this up. Did I really misunderstand or has something changed during the last week?

[IcePack]

Nothing has changed, in fact that very misconception was realized earlier this year and so we even ran a Platoon Report article specifically about Tribe Wars.

viewtopic.php?f=443&t=217306

Scroll halfway down under "Mess Hall". If 1vs1 wars or poly wars are what you are seeking, you can seek out or challenge other tribes (clans included) to do so. That is the place to do non team wars etc

[Vid_FISO]

So, the clan poly could (and should?) have been run in Tribes rather than Clans and each individual war would then have had medals awarded rather than just for the overall winner? Could have been mentioned when the idea was first brought up?

[IcePack]

So, the clan poly could (and should?) have been run in Tribes rather than Clans and each individual war would then have had medals awarded rather than just for the overall winner? Could have been mentioned when the idea was first brought up?

Again Clan Dept is technically different then Tribe Dept. Lindax runs Tribes seperately.

So the Clan Dept was trying to run its first ever poly event (like it had successfully done w 1vs1) to award clan medals.

Tribes can (and I believe did) try to start up a few of their own (maybe Lindax can provide more details) but this competition was through clans. I suppose in the future it could be done solely by Tribes, but there isn't anything keeping us (clans) from having one for Clan Medals. Concurrently, independently, or with slightly different structures.

To date most of the Tribe stuff has been auto tournaments, but it doesn't stop anyone from organizing their own Tribe event / tournament / wars.
But the set up could have also been set up through the tournament system, but we don't bring that up generally speaking either. Here, it's clan focused for clan life.

[Lindax]

Hi all,

You're getting this PM because you expressed an interest in the 1v1 Clan Challenge. There does not seem to be enough interest do do this as a Clan Tournament. However, I could run something similar through the Tribe section with less tribes/clans and less players. The format would need to fit auto-tournaments though, so we would be looking at something like this Poly version: viewtopic.php?f=802&t=216992

With less tribes we'd play less rounds, but we could run the format twice if we use 8 players per tribe. Maybe use 2 home maps per tribe and the tribes can choose home settings. Every game would randomly choose a map from the home maps in this format. The example format is round robin by the way.

We could do it as an elimination bracket, with players playing each other between 2 tribes. Do that twice, home and away. And we can make it 3 games per 2 players.

Anyway, let me know if you're interested and if you prefer round robin or elimination bracket. You can also give me other suggestions for the format. Then I can come up with the exact format and post a sing-up thread.

Thanks,

Lx

Forgive me but this is the pm you sent out, the options that you outlined did not include running such a comp in the same way that the current clan poly comp is being run but rather with a much more restrictive (and clearly unpopular) set up. If my understanding of your pm and the possibilities available were in error you could have made this clear in a reply to my response to you,

Personally - no. I just don't like the tribes thing, nor the randomising of what (in my mind) should be a choice. The clan comp would be the individual players choosing which maps they want to play on and with their preferred settings and picking which opponents/ maps/ settings they were happiest with. This could easily put players on "home" maps that they are not comfortable with at all.

Of course no issues if you wish to try to put together a FISO team via CatchersMitt14, she'll probably get two thirds of the way there with serial entrants

Dave

but it is only now over a week later and nearly a year since Tribes were introduced that you offer this up. Did I really misunderstand or has something changed during the last week?

Nothing has changed. I did not offer any other option at that point because what I offered was with me running it. I don't have the time to run another manual tournament, so it would be auto tournaments. Now, if somebody else would run it they can propose another format.

So, the clan poly could (and should?) have been run in Tribes rather than Clans and each individual war would then have had medals awarded rather than just for the overall winner? Could have been mentioned when the idea was first brought up?

No, a clan tournament cannot be run through the Tribe department, it would have to be a Tribe tournament. When the 1v1 and Poly challenges came up up earlier this year, the first thing I did was propose to run them through the Tribe department, but then obviously as Tribe tournaments. These are ideal tournaments for the Tribe department.

Lx

[josko.ri]

If, for example, two clans decide to have best-of-41 Poly Tribal war (I dont know if this has happened so far but putting this as an example), would they receive Tribal medal for winner of the war? If yes, how is then different having a single Tribal war of best-of-41 and having best-of-41 Tribal war as a part of Poly tournament?

Tribe tournaments and Tribal Wars are dealt with on a case by case basis. Every event is approved (or not) individually and for every event the rewards (medals, cc stars, cc credits) are also decided upon case by case. The Tribe department has more liberty and less restrictions/rules than the Clan department. In your example the best-of-41 Poly Tribal war would likely be approved as well as a Tribe medal for the winners. If you would run a similar POLY tournament to the one uckuki is running now in the clan department, in the Tribe department you could request a Tribe medal for the winner of every war/round. That may very well be approved, but again, that is decided on a case by case basis.

The issue with tribes is that those comps are run as auto-tourneys not as wars. No maps and settings choices, no home and away, no privileges, a group of individuals against another group of individuals within the confines of auto-tourneys. The way that clans work doesn't mesh with tribes at all.

This is not true. As I mentioned in my PM about the 1v1 Tribe Challenge, there are ways to choose home maps and settings, even with auto-tournaments. Now, you can't do everything the same with auto tournaments as with manually run tournaments, however, Tribe tournaments do not HAVE to be auto tournaments. Right now we have a tournament ongoing, which is a mixture of Poly, 1v1 and team games, partially created as auto tournaments and partially run manually. It is also possible to run complete tournaments manually. Either with the TO creating games, etc, as in standard tournaments, or with the use of privileges, exactly the same way as most clan tournaments and clan wars.

This is the answer I was expected to receive which means that essentially, best-of-41 Poly war as a part of Poly tournament has nothing different than best-of-41 single Poly war for which Tribal medal would be awarded. Tribal medals are anyway in the bottom edge of CC popularity so I think we should more expose and popularize those medals by making them more available, not less available. As Poly tournament is still in Round 1, I hope you may think twice about awarding Tribal medal for winner of every single Poly war, because every best-of-41 Poly war meet requirements to be called full Tribal war.

[Lindax]

Josko, maybe you missed one of the answers:

How about awarding tribal medal for winners of each war? I think the best of 41 poly challenge meets requirements for awarding of tribal medal for winners.

Clans and Tribes are two separate departments. Clan medals cannot be awarded for Tribe events and vice versa. The same way we cannot award a TO of a clan tournament with a Tournament Contribution Medal from the Tournament Department.

Not to mention that the sign-up for the Poly Clan Challenge was never open for Tribes other than Clans.

Lx

[josko.ri]

If, for example, two clans decide to have best-of-41 Poly Tribal war (I dont know if this has happened so far but putting this as an example), would they receive Tribal medal for winner of the war? If yes, how is then different having a single Tribal war of best-of-41 and having best-of-41 Tribal war as a part of Poly tournament?

Tribe tournaments and Tribal Wars are dealt with on a case by case basis. Every event is approved (or not) individually and for every event the rewards (medals, cc stars, cc credits) are also decided upon case by case. The Tribe department has more liberty and less restrictions/rules than the Clan department. In your example the best-of-41 Poly Tribal war would likely be approved as well as a Tribe medal for the winners. If you would run a similar POLY tournament to the one uckuki is running now in the clan department, in the Tribe department you could request a Tribe medal for the winner of every war/round. That may very well be approved, but again, that is decided on a case by case basis.

This is the answer I was expected to receive which means that essentially, best-of-41 Poly war as a part of Poly tournament has nothing different than best-of-41 single Poly war for which Tribal medal would be awarded. Tribal medals are anyway in the bottom edge of CC popularity so I think we should more expose and popularize those medals by making them more available, not less available. As Poly tournament is still in Round 1, I hope you may think twice about awarding Tribal medal for winner of every single Poly war, because every best-of-41 Poly war meet requirements to be called full Tribal war.

Josko, maybe you missed one of the answers:

How about awarding tribal medal for winners of each war? I think the best of 41 poly challenge meets requirements for awarding of tribal medal for winners.

Clans and Tribes are two separate departments. Clan medals cannot be awarded for Tribe events and vice versa. The same way we cannot award a TO of a clan tournament with a Tournament Contribution Medal from the Tournament Department.

Not to mention that the sign-up for the Poly Clan Challenge was never open for Tribes other than Clans.

Lx

In that case I suggest to move the tournament in Tribe area, because according to its structure it more belongs to Tribe area than in clan area. It is true that was not opened for Tribes other than clans to sign up but also there was not interest shown from these primitive Tribes to play in the tournament. If some primitive Tribe have shown interest to play, I am sure we would think about accepting them in the tournament as we were anyway eager for bigger participation.

I also suggest to put all future 1v1 and Poly tournaments in the Tribal department and open them for primitive Tribes as well because its structure is exactly that, Tribal.
I would also like to see this tournament moved in the Tribal department and medals to be awarded accordingly for each war. Maybe we did mistake by not making it at the beginning but while we can still fix the mistake, we should do it.

[Lindax]

Sorry, we can't just move ongoing tournaments from one department to another. For this tournament you'll have to do without medals per round.

Lx