CYOC: TDT [6/22] Game Over! FREEDOM!!!

[edocsil]

Look at all of the last CYOC's (a deputy is INSANELY weak role in ideal circumstances) and try to find a weaker role. Unless my memory is Very poor, you will not find one. It is totally unverifiable, just like betiko's gov, and a perfectly ideal scum fake.

Also, this line is pretty damning.

As far as the scum hunt, I'd start with sheep and then let HotShot do his thing 'til he finds him.

I mean FTC in no vanilla? f*ck, I wish I was a vig.

[MudPuppy]

Look at all of the last CYOC's (a deputy is INSANELY weak role in ideal circumstances) and try to find a weaker role. Unless my memory is Very poor, you will not find one.

I haven't participated in or looked at prior CYOC's... but I don't disagree that it's a weak character.

It is totally unverifiable, just like betiko's gov, and a perfectly ideal scum fake.

Can't say I disagree with that analysis either. I would note that it is betiko's unverifiable role that is clearing you atm.

Also, this line is pretty damning.

As far as the scum hunt, I'd start with sheep and then let HotShot do his thing 'til he finds him.

I mean FTC in no vanilla? f*ck, I wish I was a vig.

I have no clue what FTC means or what you find damning in my statement. I'm simply stating that I find sheep the lead scum candidate largely because he didn't make a single post on LD1... he stated he was busy due to his new job and apologized, etc. which may be the case... but his lack of activity is still suspicious. I'm assuming we have a doc out there still so HotShot is likely protected and I can't see anything at all "damning" about stating we should let him continue investigating 'til he finds scum... preferably with a confirmation that he is a cop based on Doom flipping.

[jonty125]

I have no clue what FTC

Follow The Cop.

I believe the cop - so in my eyes Rodion is cult.

The Town Deputy claim is incredibly weak, is it lynchable ... not outright.

[spiesr]

Look at all of the last CYOC's (a deputy is INSANELY weak role in ideal circumstances) and try to find a weaker role. Unless my memory is Very poor, you will not find one. It is totally unverifiable, just like betiko's gov, and a perfectly ideal scum fake.

How about Tree Stump, or the one that made people unblockable in a game with no roleblockers? I had thought you were questioning how the game could include a role that required a town cop to be in the game.

And don't worry, I tried to give betiko a trick cop investigation that actually recruits people into cult. I am not allowed to rolegift recruits of any kind.

Doom, you just sound like when you create one of your crazy off topic threads. If it s true why would you reveal such thing? It would be very easy to find the other cultists... As far as I know your last cult friend would be edoc as all other investigated people are dead...

He is saying that he was not able to use his power to trick other people into recruiting into his cult despite his desire to do so.

I still think it's worth lynching Doom to confirm HotShot's claim and just in case DY has a way to hurt Town. I don't think he can hurt Town and I do think HotShot is a cop... but I'd feel better about it once Doom flips cult.

I agree with the idea of lynching DoomYoshi today. I also think that we should try to have you die in the horse game. What do you think about the horse game?

[betiko]

So no one is interested in kgb the scumariner?

It s all about sheep and puppies here.

[strike wolf]

Doomyoshi will probably be the lynch du jour regardless of what happens. I would like to investigate other options especially as Doom appears to be part of a leaderless cult whether he is telling the truth about the second cult or not but we are in a shortened day. I will hold my vote for now and vote for Doomyoshi if needed towards the end of the day. That being said, I tend to agree with Edocsil on the deputy point. With all the cool (or at least cool sounding) roles that have already been shown to be included procrastinator, time manipulator and canonizer to name a few, a deputy not only sounds like a weak role but a boring role. We've already have a cop, a corrupted role gifter, a watcher and a claimed second gifter who can give investigations, having a back up cop sounds like over kill in the investigative department. I need to look back on KGB and Sheep but they are definitely also up for discussion in my books. As of right now I prefer to:

Lynch Doomyoshi
Horse Mudpuppy

if it comes down to it. I am willing to hammer Doom and hand off the horse to Mud at the same point. In the mean time, I suggest keeping the horse away from him unless the day is about to end in case he tries to pull a stunt with the horse.

We have about 2 days left.

[strike wolf]

Oh and KGB last posted May 31st, 2 and a half days before LD1 endeed.

[sheepofdumb]

I am Kenny McCormick, Town Bulletproof. I can't be permanently killed. If I am "killed" I just wake up the next morning perfectly fine.



But we have a scummariner, cult, and a shaky deputy claim to go after. I don't know who to vote against.

[betiko]

I am Kenny McCormick, Town Bulletproof. I can't be permanently killed. If I am "killed" I just wake up the next morning perfectly fine.



But we have a scummariner, cult, and a shaky deputy claim to go after. I don't know who to vote against.

??? that sounds a bit unbalanced for mafia.

[kgb007]

not deliberately skipping out, real life work has gotten the best of me with 2 people quitting in the past 3 weeks. I have a friend visiting from out of town this weekend so I won't be on other than to take my turns either. I'd rather not claim since we've gotten multiple claims already (town deputy seems a little weak given the rest of the claims but whatever). we can't all possibly be town unless the people driving the conversation and naming us are in fact anti town.

after a quick glance, it looks like some players think there's only 1 cult left? did I miss something or were we to assume the cult leader turned 2 players? I found spiesr to be highly suspicious during the LD1 by taking SW's horse without an explanation when I got a town vibe from SW and he had led us to Sausage's eventual death. I think it was HotShot who mentioned SW was high on his cult list.

I'd like to ask that you give me a few more days and I'll post something additional Sunday evening, I may still try to build a case against Spiesr but I have to re-read. Can someone post a list of all claims, NA's clearing other players. It would save me some time for when I do post...

[edocsil]

??? that sounds a bit unbalanced for mafia.

Less powerful with cult in mix.

Look at all of the last CYOC's (a deputy is INSANELY weak role in ideal circumstances) and try to find a weaker role. Unless my memory is Very poor, you will not find one. It is totally unverifiable, just like betiko's gov, and a perfectly ideal scum fake.

How about Tree Stump, or the one that made people unblockable in a game with no roleblockers? I had thought you were questioning how the game could include a role that required a town cop to be in the game.

And don't worry, I tried to give betiko a trick cop investigation that actually recruits people into cult. I am not allowed to rolegift recruits of any kind.

Doom, you just sound like when you create one of your crazy off topic threads. If it s true why would you reveal such thing? It would be very easy to find the other cultists... As far as I know your last cult friend would be edoc as all other investigated people are dead...

He is saying that he was not able to use his power to trick other people into recruiting into his cult despite his desire to do so.

I still think it's worth lynching Doom to confirm HotShot's claim and just in case DY has a way to hurt Town. I don't think he can hurt Town and I do think HotShot is a cop... but I'd feel better about it once Doom flips cult.

I agree with the idea of lynching DoomYoshi today. I also think that we should try to have you die in the horse game. What do you think about the horse game?

All valid points, but at this 3rd cyoc I believe there are some differences in role generation, and more similar to the second rather than the first. And still, the block "blocker" is more bastard modding. It was very interesting, and very novel, just totally useless I agree with you and strike about the lynch/horse methods.

Look at all of the last CYOC's (a deputy is INSANELY weak role in ideal circumstances) and try to find a weaker role. Unless my memory is Very poor, you will not find one.

I haven't participated in or looked at prior CYOC's... but I don't disagree that it's a weak character.

It is totally unverifiable, just like betiko's gov, and a perfectly ideal scum fake.

Can't say I disagree with that analysis either. I would note that it is betiko's unverifiable role that is clearing you atm.

Also, this line is pretty damning.

As far as the scum hunt, I'd start with sheep and then let HotShot do his thing 'til he finds him.

I mean FTC in no vanilla? f*ck, I wish I was a vig.

I have no clue what FTC means or what you find damning in my statement. I'm simply stating that I find sheep the lead scum candidate largely because he didn't make a single post on LD1... he stated he was busy due to his new job and apologized, etc. which may be the case... but his lack of activity is still suspicious. I'm assuming we have a doc out there still so HotShot is likely protected and I can't see anything at all "damning" about stating we should let him continue investigating 'til he finds scum... preferably with a confirmation that he is a cop based on Doom flipping.

FTC is follow the cop. It's a good way to throw the game when the cop is known and there is a way to muck with the cops results (we have a confirmed roleblocker) There is no doubt that he is a cop, at all, in my mind. But he will be locked down if at any way possible. FTC is only good *IMO* when the cop claims a guilty and you policy lynch the guilty, blindly following the cop.

[spiesr]

I think I may have spotted a potential wrinkle in plans for today. Betiko appears to have made more than 3 posts while horseless without stealing one and should be dead as a result.

[edocsil]

Let me clarify a little more Puppy. Relying on the cop to win the game at night, rather than actively using our scum hunting prowess during the day, is a really bad idea to suggest, and when coupled with your incredibly weak claim it paints you as a clear scum.

[MudPuppy]

Let me clarify a little more Puppy. Relying on the cop to win the game at night, rather than actively using our scum hunting prowess during the day, is a really bad idea to suggest, and when coupled with your incredibly weak claim it paints you as a clear scum.

I hear you... and you do make a decent point but I certainly didn't intend for my suggestion that we let HotShot "do his thing" to mean in lieu of "using our scum hunting prowess" but rather in addition to using our scum hunting prowess. Certainly HotShot's investigations are of value even if there is a chance they get corrupted via a sinister power role, which I acknowledge is a distinct possibility. But nowhere did I suggest or intend that the cop should be the ONLY tool used for scum hunting... and my suggestion that we use his investigations isn't scummy... it's common sense.

[kgb007]

Well I am not going to have time before then to do anything meaningful. Let alone putting together an alternate case that will get discussed and gain momentum.

I don't want to lynch jak.

I could compromise vote Betiko but I have only skimmed so really need to see whos comfortable with lynching him and weather I am comfortable sheeping them.

FWIW my hunches from the late page 24 and page 25 pressure on jak are as follows (disclaimer: this is not considering later pages so could potentially be subject to change):
- jmac: lean scum (super opportunistic vote with nothing more than "policy lynch anyone who is anti-town"; if this was the case you should have FoS'd nearly everyone in this game)
- rodion: lean town (builds a rationale using the most important pro-town aspect of Zivels death: the reads we should be drawing from Zivs few interactions and reads - i.e. the last sentence)
- edoc: lean town (his post matches how I feel about the jak thing)
- Hotshot and Nark: Null (nothing in either post, though that in itself puts me a little on edge)
- aage: Null (the first half gives me a scum vibe simply because its a big ole wall of information and speculation with no real value to it, but offset by a town vibe from the second bit where he correctly analyses what was so wrong about jaks vig; not sold on the conclusion though...)
- SW: lean scum (same justification as jmac and then launches into some mechanics speculation which is more of a distraction than useful - this confirmation bias makes me think his whole activity thing is simply to appear town, but as I say pure confirmation bias: i have neve played with SW so can someone who has played with him as town tell me if this kind of thing is typical?)

Fastposted by betiko.

doing my best to re-read and catch up, found this interesting given what we know now about loot's alignment and gives his opinion on some players

[HotShot53]

I think I may have spotted a potential wrinkle in plans for today. Betiko appears to have made more than 3 posts while horseless without stealing one and should be dead as a result.

Mod... any comments or consequences from this? I'm guessing Betiko didn't realize he was the one without the horse... but he has posted a lot since he's been horseless.

[kgb007]

sorry for the double post but might as well post my own list of the unconfirmed alignment, leaving jonty off since he's risen from the dead, perhaps someone better at the scum hunting can gain more knowledge from the voting records. Has anybody not been in the horse game yet? I don't expect you to raise your hand and come to the forefront but some people are having their 2nd go

betiko - lean town, nark votes him to break a tie with 2 days to go before deadline D2, I don't believe scum would jeopardize one of their own with the vote being so tight and deadline looming, although I suppose he could be 3rd party, voted sausage D3

edoc - lean anti town/3rd party, SW can you check the last game and see what alignment edoc was when he "day killed"? reason being, I could see edoc wanting to get an overreaction, build a case and mislynch D1, also voted loot late in lost day 1, sort of a reverse psychological here, knows loot won't be the lynch since the case centered on jmac, maybe trying to buy some townie credit for later and distant himself from loot if/when he flips scum

betiko said he could clear edoc so many he can be our GF

doom - lean anti town, primarily bc of HotShot's claim/NA's, he also defended loot on D1, page 7, also i'm biased since Doom floated the idea i'm running the horse game, could be one of the one's aage recruited since he was the first to mention looking for clue's as to who aage might have recruited

during the lost day 1 doom voted hotshot to trying to protect sausage, can you elaborate since there wasn't any other evidence in that post from page 29?

sheep - lean town, conflicted over the case against jak D2, voted sausage D3, not much else

SW - lean town, primarily bc he offered the gift of sausage being scum D3

MP - could go either way, weak claim, nothing jumps out on his posts, if you forced me to pick i'd lean anti town/3rd party, maybe a recruiter victim?

Hotshot - lean town, no one has counter claimed and the info, while convenient, matches up

spiesr - lean town, rereading i suppose i made the taking of SW's horse a bigger deal in my head, also based on Hotshot's claim

we're closing for the day or I'd have added more random thoughts, i'll try my best to check over the weekend but will be tough with guests staying over

[HotShot53]

D1 2 of my votes were for scum. 1 of my votes ended up being the final wagon (no lynch).

D2 I started the proper wagon.

It doesn't matter how well you play, cult ruins everything.

Rodion was in a different cult than me. I am probably not the last cultist. I would say we should focus more on the other cult since I am no longer recuitable. I am Joan of Arc, the other rolegifter.

For those who seem to have missed this post... Doom admits being cult. So there really isn't any question about his alignment, the only question he tries to raise is if there is a second cult also (which I doubt).

after a quick glance, it looks like some players think there's only 1 cult left? did I miss something or were we to assume the cult leader turned 2 players? I found spiesr to be highly suspicious during the LD1 by taking SW's horse without an explanation when I got a town vibe from SW and he had led us to Sausage's eventual death. I think it was HotShot who mentioned SW was high on his cult list.

The cult recruiter was killed night 2, so he only could recruit 2 people, and one has already been killed. So assuming there is only one cult, doom is the last of them.

[HotShot53]

Well, mudpuppy and sheep have claimed... neither role is testable though, and bulletproof could be a scum role as well as town, so nothing is really proved. KGB decided to take the route of declining to claim, and tried to get more active giving his reads on everyone. He tries to cast doubt on pretty much everyone he can though... looks a little scummish to me to be honest. So basically the three of them are still my main suspicions.

[edocsil]

edoc - lean anti town/3rd party, SW can you check the last game and see what alignment edoc was when he "day killed"? reason being, I could see edoc wanting to get an overreaction, build a case and mislynch D1, also voted loot late in lost day 1, sort of a reverse psychological here, knows loot won't be the lynch since the case centered on jmac, maybe trying to buy some townie credit for later and distant himself from loot if/when he flips scum

Few things.

A: I don't throw under the bus, too easy to meta it one way or another.
B: I can think of 3 or 4 games with the DK joke. This is my 43rd game on this site, there are some very old jokes that I will run with
C: The case on mislynch D1 is a solid theory, but I would argue that my goofing about is STILL generating discussion day 6 (sorta?) ergo, discussion -> good -> Edoc Good. Difference of opinion, and I disagree, but still a reasonable idea.

[jonty125]

Regarding sheep's role ... I can't understand why pcm would make sheep unkillable (surely just standard BP for a role could bulletproof), how would the game ever end if he was mafia?

[kgb007]

Vc mod? Also still waiting for clarification the betiko horse thing

[MudPuppy]

Regarding sheep's role ... I can't understand why pcm would make sheep unkillable (surely just standard BP for a role could bulletproof), how would the game ever end if he was mafia?

Yeah, I'm a bit curious what his win condition is and how his invincibility works toward win conditions for whatever faction(s) are against him.
Those questions aside, I think it is an absolute perfect character and role combo for CYOC. I love it!!!

[spiesr]

Regarding sheep's role ... I can't understand why pcm would make sheep unkillable (surely just standard BP for a role could bulletproof), how would the game ever end if he was mafia?

The way he describes it he can be killed, he just won't stay dead. So if he was the last remaining scum and got lynched then the game would end before he could respawn.

[HotShot53]

I read it as he couldn't be night killed, he'd just wake up like normal... i.e. standard bulletproof. I don't think he is lynchproof also...