Start an Advanced Game

[koontz1973]

Concise description:

• Change the start a game screen into two.

Specifics/Details:

• Allow the start a game screen to be split into two sets of options. With new game play options coming out (every month now ) it might be time to think about how we overwhelm new players and also existing ones. New recruits would be limited to the basic games only for five games as they are now. Ranked players will have an option to switch between basic and advanced options via a button and or in the players default menu. New players will have settings revealed to them after become ranked. These will either be invisible (like now) or greyed out.

How this will benefit the site and/or other comments:

• Should allow players to stay within the realms they are happiest with all the time and still allow players to switch to harder settings. The other big reason to do this is to allow the site to continue to add updates without overwhelming new players and still allow older players to play the most played settings without having to look through lots of buttons to see what to click.

Part one is the new start a game screen for basic games and new recruits. Players will be limited in game types. Only standard or doubles. As for settings,the majority have been taken away and only a bare bones system is left, these are the setting s the majority of games are played in. This will allow new recruits to learn the site and play settings that are most common, making sure they get games filled faster IMO.
Basic Play

Click image to enlarge.

Advanced Play

Click image to enlarge.

The only extra I have placed at the bottom of the basic screen is a button to go to advanced. Maps for the basic screen are limited to what new recruits get to play now.

show: Advanced screen of the future

[JamesKer1]

This looks really nice. You've got my support on it.

Maybe add a no round limit option as well? That way new recruits who have figured some stuff out could make it like that since they can't do advanced yet? Or is no round limit not allowed with new recruits?

[OliverFA]

Why are you leaving trench and FoW outside the basic options? New players should know they exist. It would be a pitty that players left CC without even knowing that they could have tried FoW and trench.

[koontz1973]

This looks really nice. You've got my support on it.

Maybe add a no round limit option as well? That way new recruits who have figured some stuff out could make it like that since they can't do advanced yet? Or is no round limit not allowed with new recruits?

The no round limit could easily fit into the area. I see no problem in adding that back in.

Why are you leaving trench and FoW outside the basic options? New players should know they exist. It would be a pitty that players left CC without even knowing that they could have tried FoW and trench.

I left them out as they are considered advanced options. Player will see advanced settings in the advanced settings screen but before a set number of games, would not be allowed to play them. The number I said was ten games before they become available, but this can go down to the 5 we have now before you get ranked. So get a rank, play advance settings.

[OliverFA]

I know that's a matter of opinion, but I don't see trench as "advanced" option. I believe that's is something that new players will expect to find, and the concept itself does not require an special effort to understand it. Your troops movements are limited each turn, just like every other strategy game, and just like many people use to play TheGameThatShallNotBeNamed

[SuicidalSnowman]

This looks really nice. You've got my support on it.

Maybe add a no round limit option as well? That way new recruits who have figured some stuff out could make it like that since they can't do advanced yet? Or is no round limit not allowed with new recruits?

The no round limit could easily fit into the area. I see no problem in adding that back in.

Why are you leaving trench and FoW outside the basic options? New players should know they exist. It would be a pitty that players left CC without even knowing that they could have tried FoW and trench.

I left them out as they are considered advanced options. Player will see advanced settings in the advanced settings screen but before a set number of games, would not be allowed to play them. The number I said was ten games before they become available, but this can go down to the 5 we have now before you get ranked. So get a rank, play advance settings.

While I see what you are trying to do, I don't think you are catching the main thrust of Oliver's issue here. It isn't that new players NEVER get to play these settings, it is that all of these cool and advanced settings are essentially a selling point of CC, and if players never even know about them, what is to keep them coming back?

CC is great, and one of the greatest things is that you can play settings that are not possible at a regular game board. Things like Fog and Trench. I think these NEED to be demonstrated to players. They are what makes the site great.

Thus, I think the current locking of "complicated" maps is sufficient.

[koontz1973]

I know that's a matter of opinion, but I don't see trench as "advanced" option. I believe that's is something that new players will expect to find, and the concept itself does not require an special effort to understand it. Your troops movements are limited each turn, just like every other strategy game, and just like many people use to play TheGameThatShallNotBeNamed

Why would a new recruit expect to see fog or trench settings. Till they even look at the site, they would not of even heard of these settings. I know I never did. I placed them in advanced as that is what I would call them. You cannot play fog of war at home, trench yes but very few if anyone would do that unless they have the time and space to have a board out. I am not saying new players cannot play these settings, I am saying they need to wait a few games is all. As with all settings, some will be seen as the norm, others will be seen as more advanced. A level needs to be found and as trench is not the norm for playing at home, then it belongs to the advanced setting. Parachute setting is pretty straight forward, but why is that in advanced? What about the new poly games or infected neutrals? With all of these new settings coming out, a line needs to be found to stop new recruits being overwhelmed. Hence the basic and advanced settings. Even the sites calls them Special Gameplay.

While I see what you are trying to do, I don't think you are catching the main thrust of Oliver's issue here. It isn't that new players NEVER get to play these settings, it is that all of these cool and advanced settings are essentially a selling point of CC, and if players never even know about them, what is to keep them coming back?

And I did not hide them or say they cannot play them. They would unlock after 5 games, same as ranks and maps do now. Any new recruit sees the over 200 maps on the home page but can only play 76 of them. Do new recruits leave because they feel cheated or is it because they join a game with fog, trench, no spoils on a strange map against a captain who understands all of these things. As a selling point, these settings are great, but we have a huge retention problem, I would believe that saying you get something for hanging around for 5 games would help keep those players for 5 games. Then they can unlock and players can have at them.

EDIT: Some of the settings we already have are not available to new players anyway. I will try to find out which ones they are but I know assassin, team and terminator are three of the locked ones. Poly is locked now for free members like speed. So a lot of settings are locked for some things.

[koontz1973]

OK guys, debate aside over trench and what not, would new recruits want to try and work all of this out. With the rate new things are being added, this is the start a game screen of the near future.

It has all of today things but I have added suggestions from submitted and the forum to it.
So soon I reckon we will get to
choose our starting colour
Play 5/6 player team games
Assassin team game
Terminator team game
polymorphic teams
Choose a style of map to reduce the list to a few
play order will have random
Spoils gets - espionage, zombie and anti fog
Reinforcements gets unlimited adjacent and unlimited parachutes
Special game play gets infected neutrals and random nukes
Round length gets 72/48 hours added

Click image to enlarge.

[SuicidalSnowman]

And I did not hide them or say they cannot play them. They would unlock after 5 games, same as ranks and maps do now. Any new recruit sees the over 200 maps on the home page but can only play 76 of them. Do new recruits leave because they feel cheated or is it because they join a game with fog, trench, no spoils on a strange map against a captain who understands all of these things. As a selling point, these settings are great, but we have a huge retention problem, I would believe that saying you get something for hanging around for 5 games would help keep those players for 5 games. Then they can unlock and players can have at them.

I'm not entirely convinced this is good or necessary, but I do like where your head is at. I think there are interface/design improvements to be made, and you have clearly taken a great approach to it. This one just isn't it for me.

[koontz1973]

And I did not hide them or say they cannot play them. They would unlock after 5 games, same as ranks and maps do now. Any new recruit sees the over 200 maps on the home page but can only play 76 of them. Do new recruits leave because they feel cheated or is it because they join a game with fog, trench, no spoils on a strange map against a captain who understands all of these things. As a selling point, these settings are great, but we have a huge retention problem, I would believe that saying you get something for hanging around for 5 games would help keep those players for 5 games. Then they can unlock and players can have at them.

I'm not entirely convinced this is good or necessary, but I do like where your head is at. I think there are interface/design improvements to be made, and you have clearly taken a great approach to it. This one just isn't it for me.

Everything aside, new recruits are already limited so how would you make the suggestion better?

[SuicidalSnowman]

Everything aside, new recruits are already limited so how would you make the suggestion better?

I would rather see the start a game interface cleaned up and streamlined! I don't think we need to limit new recruits any further, I think we just need better interfaces. Your split design shows a much cleaner design, which I like. I don't even really think that was the original thrust of your suggestion, just what I picked up on!

[koontz1973]

Everything aside, new recruits are already limited so how would you make the suggestion better?

I would rather see the start a game interface cleaned up and streamlined! I don't think we need to limit new recruits any further, I think we just need better interfaces. Your split design shows a much cleaner design, which I like. I don't even really think that was the original thrust of your suggestion, just what I picked up on!

It is cleaner as it has less of it. I believe we can all agree, new recruits aside, the design of start a game is becoming overwhelming now or soon will be if all of the suggestions are implemented. New recruits are already limited and cannot play trench, assassin, terminator and teams now. So I have not taken anything from them.

[Metsfanmax]

I don't think this is the cleanest way to implement this idea. I would prefer the start a game to all be on one page. By default, the 'advanced' options would be hidden but could easily be displayed by clicking a button (and you would be able to change the default as part of your user preferences). This way what the user sees initially is a very simple set of options, but if they want to see what else is available there would be a very obvious 'advanced game options' button. If they clicked it and got scared, they could just click it again to hide. I essentially support blake's idea in Oliver's thread. I'm not sure why we need multiple threads on this. Perhaps we should just start one thread with this discussion and work out what we think is best?

[koontz1973]

I don't think this is the cleanest way to implement this idea. I would prefer the start a game to all be on one page.

So would I and had a good long look at Blakes idea. The only reason I gave it two pages is to allow players to have the same clicks. If a default was put in, then I can not see any reason why one page could be displayed with a button to switch.

I'm not sure why we need multiple threads on this. Perhaps we should just start one thread with this discussion and work out what we think is best?

Olivers idea is different. I made that mistake when I read his idea. He wants a button for each setting so if you like trench and click trench, all other settings will be filled for you.

What ever the best way for this to happen, I believe it is going to become necessary at some point. Why not get it now before players complain about the page being crowded.

[agentcom]

+1 to this discussion. I agree with koontz' breakdown of advanced/basic (basically basic=the kind of stuff people play at home before coming to this site).

I think mets (if I'm reading him correctly) is on the right track of not putting this as a separate sidebar option but integrating it into one Start A Game screen.

I think Oliver is right that we shouldn't "hide" the advanced settings from people. Maybe gray them out or something and keep them a click away from the users who want them and who "qualify" for them (i.e. not NRs).

[koontz1973]

I cannot remember that far back, but does anyone know how new recruits see the start a game page now? Is it clean or are the settings greyed out?

Edited OP to show new consensus.

[koontz1973]

Thanks chap for the thread fix.

[koontz1973]

Time for the old bumping thread time guys.

[koontz1973]

Bumping this again as we are getting more and more things on this page. It is already becoming crowded and with more coming, something needs to be done.

[agentcom]

Bumping this again as we are getting more and more things on this page. It is already becoming crowded and with more coming, something needs to be done.

After all, bots got their own tab, so the functionality you're requesting is now built into the site. In fact, the bot menu is basically the simple menu that you want anyway.

[koontz1973]

Bumping this again as we are getting more and more things on this page. It is already becoming crowded and with more coming, something needs to be done.

After all, bots got their own tab, so the functionality you're requesting is now built into the site. In fact, the bot menu is basically the simple menu that you want anyway.

I never put that together. For some reason I stopped playing bots so had not looked at them for a long time but yes, that is basically the simple menu.

[ManBungalow]

I fully advocate this idea. I love the new updates, but the start/find game pages are getting ever more cluttered.

Great suggestion.

[Dukasaur]

Agree.

[koontz1973]

I fully advocate this idea. I love the new updates, but the start/find game pages are getting ever more cluttered.

Great suggestion.

Agree.

Thanks you and thank you.

[patrickaa317]

I think this is a good suggestion. Let's get it in.