Chuuuuck [dead beating, pointdumping] [Noted] DCR

[VioIet]

4 games is not intentionally deadbeating...and is a far cry from 1000 games. Completely different circumstances. He is still a brig fro goodness sake...its not like he gave all his points away. Or started a bunch of public games and handed them away.

Stop being so butt hurt cause he was unreliable and YOU trusted him in your clans games. Its like you are looking for a scapegoat in case you lose this challenge.

Get this right...youre allowed to miss turns...Who knew??? You're allowed to leave cc and not announce it to the entire world?? Who knew right??

stop being so subjective please. changing your PW just before you decide to leave CC is a total different story and it's intentional team screwing.

I would have thought that permanently leaving the site and having your password known to others would be considered highly irresponsible. The powers that be should really applaud chuuuuuucks action.

I feel that some of you are being a bit hard on The Pack. Yes, I admit it was dumb, for lack of a better word, for The Pack to let Chuuck into their clan. But running a clan is hard work, and everyone makes mistakes sometimes. There were times when I let someone into my clan, only in retrospect to go, "wth was I thinking letting this person join." Now when I recruit, I base it both on play-skills and behavior, and try to do a thorough research of both. However, even the most selective of recruiting can still yield mistakes at times. There are some people who just talk a very good talk in the beginning, and you can't really tell how it would work out in the long run.

Roussallier and Answa are great examples for that. Rou was a great player, friendly, extremely dedicated- posted miles of texts in the game chat- analyzed for hours. Seemed to be exactly what we wanted. Fast-forward three months later- and he's nowhere to be seen. Now who would've expected that?

Take answa- a friend of mine that I met on another game site, and came over to CC with me, when that site went downhill. He was in the clan for over a year with no problems. Then in January, he suddenly decides to go bat-ape crazy, and get himself multiple bans and get kicked out of all the games we had him in. Talk about unexpected.

My point is, sometimes people will be people, and unexpected stuff happens. So yes, The Pack made a bad judgment call, and they know this now. They are paying for this mistake worse than any of us are, so we really don't need to rub it in. Also two wrongs don't make a right. Chuuck's behavior should not be excused just because people think, "oh well they shouldn't have let him into the clan in the first place." They could've let, Wicked, Yomiel, and IR into their clan for all we care. That still doesn't mean those at fault don't have to pay the consequences for the wrongs they did.

[jgordon1111]

4 games is not intentionally deadbeating...and is a far cry from 1000 games. Completely different circumstances. He is still a brig fro goodness sake...its not like he gave all his points away. Or started a bunch of public games and handed them away.

Stop being so butt hurt cause he was unreliable and YOU trusted him in your clans games. Its like you are looking for a scapegoat in case you lose this challenge.

Get this right...youre allowed to miss turns...Who knew??? You're allowed to leave cc and not announce it to the entire world?? Who knew right??

stop being so subjective please. changing your PW just before you decide to leave CC is a total different story and it's intentional team screwing.

I would have thought that permanently leaving the site and having your password known to others would be considered highly irresponsible. The powers that be should really applaud chuuuuuucks action.

I feel that some of you are being a bit hard on The Pack. Yes, I admit it was dumb, for lack of a better word, for The Pack to let Chuuck into their clan. But running a clan is hard work, and everyone makes mistakes sometimes. There were times when I let someone into my clan, only in retrospect to go, "wth was I thinking letting this person join." Now when I recruit, I base it both on play-skills and behavior, and try to do a thorough research of both. However, even the most selective of recruiting can still yield mistakes at times. There are some people who just talk a very good talk in the beginning, and you can't really tell how it would work out in the long run.

Roussallier and Answa are great examples for that. Rou was a great player, friendly, extremely dedicated- posted miles of texts in the game chat- analyzed for hours. Seemed to be exactly what we wanted. Fast-forward three months later- and he's nowhere to be seen. Now who would've expected that?

Take answa- a friend of mine that I met on another game site, and came over to CC with me, when that site went downhill. He was in the clan for over a year with no problems. Then in January, he suddenly decides to go bat-ape crazy, and get himself multiple bans and get kicked out of all the games we had him in. Talk about unexpected.

My point is, sometimes people will be people, and unexpected stuff happens. So yes, The Pack made a bad judgment call, and they know this now. They are paying for this mistake worse than any of us are, so we really don't need to rub it in. Also two wrongs don't make a right. Chuuck's behavior should not be excused just because people think, "oh well they shouldn't have let him into the clan in the first place." They could've let, Wicked, Yomiel, and IR into their clan for all we care. That still doesn't mean those at fault don't have to pay the consequences for the wrongs they did.

Well and clearly said, +1

[VioIet]

In this day and age, it wouldn't be impossible to auto-kick anyone out with less then 95% turn taken in all the games, have a couple of mods assigned only the deadbeats and have go thru them, explain why they missed so many turns, and should be up to the mods desecration before they are let back in. That would cure a lot multies, cheap tactics, point-dumping, cheating, game throwing.....

+++

I really like this idea.

[Leehar]

The odd thing is most of the players hollering in the negative here are not clan players,why is that?

On this case, or on sitting as a whole?
I'd say you were wrong on both counts.
For the case, because no offence to Pack, but I (and I think others that have posted as well) think it's Packs reward for the risks they took. Because it's not like they didn't know what came with the territory. The evidence was all there in Chuuck being an unreliable teammate;Chuuuck told us he quit TOFU because he didnt get along with COF from the CoF case that they're so willing to sweep under the rug.WTF u talking about us sweeping it under a rug. When I got wind of Chuuuck going to file a report against COF, I told him staight out how I felt about it and told him that what goes on in a clan stays in a clan even after leaving. Indeed, I think this exact scenario is one Cof mentioned in his rebuttal to Chuuck's C&A report, that Chuuck had changed his password before leaving on random absences? That wasn't enough for Cof to avoid the noose, but the signs were all there
I don't buy this excuse that they 'didn't know' because those details only come out after he had joined Pack, firstly because (as I think someone else mentioned), they still were fine with entering him into ID games after that fact! And secondly, why on earth did they think Tofu kicked him out anyway? You talk in hindsight and we did not know he was kicked out. You continue to appear to be a packer basher.

If you're gonna reply in my post at least colour your response rather than my comments?

Anyway, lets try this with a timeline
Chuuuuck joins Pack (and leaves/gets kicked out of Tofu)
Chuck puts up C&A report
Chariot's defense, illustrating Chucks character (the same features you now take umbrage with)
Pack puts Chuck into games against ID
/?

The sweeping under the rug, was in reference to griff and co. not wanting any reference to the cof case in here, when they're obviously related?
You didn't know he was kicked out? Did you not know he was in Tofu? And suddenly you recruit him, without knowing any of the circumstances on why he's no longer in Tofu?

Unfortunately I have better things to do, but if it makes you sleep better at night, feel free to call me a packer basher...

[GeneralRisk]

The odd thing is most of the players hollering in the negative here are not clan players,why is that?

On this case, or on sitting as a whole?
I'd say you were wrong on both counts.
For the case, because no offence to Pack, but I (and I think others that have posted as well) think it's Packs reward for the risks they took. Because it's not like they didn't know what came with the territory. The evidence was all there in Chuuck being an unreliable teammate;Chuuuck told us he quit TOFU because he didnt get along with COF from the CoF case that they're so willing to sweep under the rug.WTF u talking about us sweeping it under a rug. When I got wind of Chuuuck going to file a report against COF, I told him staight out how I felt about it and told him that what goes on in a clan stays in a clan even after leaving. Indeed, I think this exact scenario is one Cof mentioned in his rebuttal to Chuuck's C&A report, that Chuuck had changed his password before leaving on random absences? That wasn't enough for Cof to avoid the noose, but the signs were all there
I don't buy this excuse that they 'didn't know' because those details only come out after he had joined Pack, firstly because (as I think someone else mentioned), they still were fine with entering him into ID games after that fact! And secondly, why on earth did they think Tofu kicked him out anyway? You talk in hindsight and we did not know he was kicked out. You continue to appear to be a packer basher.

If you're gonna reply in my post at least colour your response rather than my comments?Why?? Who died and made u my boss??

Anyway, lets try this with a timeline
Chuuuuck joins Pack (and leaves/gets kicked out of Tofu)As far as we knew he quit.
Chuck puts up C&A report
Chariot's defense, illustrating Chucks character (the same features you now take umbrage with) Chuuuuck filled our ears, illustrating COF s character, and to me, if both of them were to be believed, COF appeared to have more character flaws then Chuuuuck.
Pack puts Chuck into games against ID
/? Yes

The sweeping under the rug, was in reference to griff and co. not wanting any reference to the cof case in here, when they're obviously related? Because you say they are related, does not mean they are related. That case has no bearing on this case.
You didn't know he was kicked out? No Did you not know he was in Tofu? Yes And suddenly you recruit him, without knowing any of the circumstances on why he's no longer in Tofu?No.
Your Honor, I would like ask the Court to recess, so you can entertain elsewhere.
Unfortunately I have better things to do, but if it makes you sleep better at night, feel free to call me a packer basher... Packer Basher is a fact, if you entertain elsewhere, it may let me sleep better. See ya later Mr. Entertainer, You are a funny F

[jgordon1111]

I am thinking about becoming a monk.

[GeneralRisk]

I am thinking about becoming a monk.

Please take Mr. Entertainment to the monastery with you.

[Dako]

I could not resist and urge and skipped a multi-colored post. Can't read it anyway.

PS - can we get a medal because we had IR and Chuck in our clan? Or do we need a third batshit crazy person for the gold?

[Extreme Ways]

I could not resist and urge and skipped a multi-colored post. Can't read it anyway.

PS - can we get a medal because we had IR and Chuck in our clan? Or do we need a third batshit crazy person for the gold?

You need GLG too, sorry!

[jgordon1111]

I could not resist and urge and skipped a multi-colored post. Can't read it anyway.

PS - can we get a medal because we had IR and Chuck in our clan? Or do we need a third batshit crazy person for the gold?

You might see if they will let albiestar on CC again,that dude deadbeated more than anyone else and got a reprieve,and did it again.

He might be clan material for you guys,and if you let him in yes you all deserve a medal for sure.

[Master Fenrir]

just maybe it was an elaborate scheme from TUFO to infiltrate THE PACK

I told jimboy on MSN last night that it wouldn't be long before somebody suggested this. Nine posts later, I'm proven correct.

stop being so subjective please. changing your PW just before you decide to leave CC is a total different story and it's intentional team screwing.

It's really not. It's just quitting and not wanting somebody to have your password and to do who knows what with your account, and read through your PMs, etc. The argument against that would be "If he's really quitting, why would he care who had his password or what happened to his account?" And the answers to that would be 1) some people are just more private than others and 2) who knows, maybe he'll feel like coming back after a long hiatus and not want to find his account jacked up.

Everything that LoVo has said has been 100% correct and anybody arguing with his stance is either an idiot, not very good at reading comprehension (like the rules or previous cases), or just too upset to think clearly, or some combination of the three. Seriously, has there ever been a point-dumping case in the past where the person busted lost less than 150 points? I've had bad weeks actually playing where I've lost more points than that.

I think GR had it right. He's guilty of being a dick and nothing more.

[simmons4]

The odd thing is most of the players hollering in the negative here are not clan players,why is that?

On this case, or on sitting as a whole?
I'd say you were wrong on both counts.
For the case, because no offence to Pack, but I (and I think others that have posted as well) think it's Packs reward for the risks they took. Because it's not like they didn't know what came with the territory. The evidence was all there in Chuuck being an unreliable teammate;Chuuuck told us he quit TOFU because he didnt get along with COF from the CoF case that they're so willing to sweep under the rug.WTF u talking about us sweeping it under a rug. When I got wind of Chuuuck going to file a report against COF, I told him staight out how I felt about it and told him that what goes on in a clan stays in a clan even after leaving. Indeed, I think this exact scenario is one Cof mentioned in his rebuttal to Chuuck's C&A report, that Chuuck had changed his password before leaving on random absences? That wasn't enough for Cof to avoid the noose, but the signs were all there
I don't buy this excuse that they 'didn't know' because those details only come out after he had joined Pack, firstly because (as I think someone else mentioned), they still were fine with entering him into ID games after that fact! And secondly, why on earth did they think Tofu kicked him out anyway? You talk in hindsight and we did not know he was kicked out. You continue to appear to be a packer basher.

If you're gonna reply in my post at least colour your response rather than my comments?

Anyway, lets try this with a timeline
Chuuuuck joins Pack (and leaves/gets kicked out of Tofu)
Chuck puts up C&A report
Chariot's defense, illustrating Chucks character (the same features you now take umbrage with)
Pack puts Chuck into games against ID
/?

The sweeping under the rug, was in reference to griff and co. not wanting any reference to the cof case in here, when they're obviously related?
You didn't know he was kicked out? Did you not know he was in Tofu? And suddenly you recruit him, without knowing any of the circumstances on why he's no longer in Tofu?

Unfortunately I have better things to do, but if it makes you sleep better at night, feel free to call me a packer basher...

first of all this is a very interesting timeline apparently we accepted chuck while he was still in tofu

next how many clans on this site would not have wanted to add a player with the experience of chuck before the cof case was posted which was when we MISTAKENLY allowed chuck to join the pack

the story that came out of how chuck and tofu separated in the cof case was not the story he told anyone in the pack

at that point how could we possibly know who was telling the truth in the cof case. do you believe the accuser(chuck) who was now your clan mate or the clan he reported for cheating. after the cof report was filed would there be any chance that a tofu member would come to his defense.

as far as putting him into games after we had accepted him into our clan DUH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Great-Ollie]

Ok I have stayed out of this long enough lol. First of all i do not think Chuuuuck's actions are a gross abuse of the rules. I believe his actions may be caused by a split personality. When he contacted me about joining our clan of coarse i entertained the idea. It took few pm's, then he began to skype with us. He seemed like a very nice, very educated, and very competitive player. Our agreement was to allow him into the clan and if either side never liked the outcome we would part ways. We talked for hours about strategy, game selection, and team selection. He also asked my permission to file the C&A report against COF. I told him we do not have any feelings either way if he filed it, and we hoped other clans would not perceive us backing up this report as it was none of our business. He asked me to cover for him one time when he was away for a basketball camp and I made sure i was very understanding of when he wanted covered until because we do not condone account sitting unless it is asked for by fellow clan mates. In retrospect, yes, i made a dumb move and i regret it. He played me, and talking to me on skype several times, i truly believed he could be trusted, and the Chuuuuckinator came out and he changed his pw, quit the site, and screwed us all over. I know believe he may be a little phsyco. I hope i learn from my mistake and when Leehar comes knocking on our door wanting to get in our clan, i will be a little more picky! Just kidding Leehar i actually think you are a good dude that loves to dis my clan, but i have became used to that, and we probably deserve it! The one good thin to come of this is ID has offered if they win our war by slim margin to do something about he Chuuuuck games as they do not want to win that way. High class clan, with all our respect but it is our fault and if we get beat they have earned it. Chuuuuck was leading those games anyways and after playing with him in a couple i actually think he belonged all by himself! LOL Bravo ID, Bravo TOFU for kicking out that tool, and Bravo Dako for taking over CC3. Let's get back to having fun!

[Swimmerdude99]

first of all this is a very interesting timeline apparently we accepted chuck while he was still in tofu

next how many clans on this site would not have wanted to add a player with the experience of chuck before the cof case was posted which was when we MISTAKENLY allowed chuck to join the pack

I wouldn't have wanted him in EMPIRE lol.

[lord voldemort]

The one good thin to come of this is ID has offered if they win our war by slim margin to do something about he Chuuuuck games as they do not want to win that way. High class clan, with all our respect but it is our fault and if we get beat they have earned it.

Id is nothing but class

[L M S]

Lets see if I have this right....


May 2012 - Chuck starts to become unreliable and requests cover
June 2012 - Whilst Chuck is being covered (still at his request) he then starts playing 1v1 Hive speed games without telling anyone
June 2012 - CoF finds out about the Hive speed games and also reads the gamechat from some of those that Chuck lost (quite an eye opener). TOFU make the decision Chuck isn't wanted in clan due to reliability issues and character traits.
July 2012 - CoF writes a friendly farewell letter to Chuck and suggests, due to his problems, maybe a break from CC would be good for him.
July 2012 - Chuck files a C&A report damning CoF for basically having covered his sorry ass for the previous two months. Where CoF went wrong was to cover the turns of other players in the games that Chuck had said he would lead (and of course didn't). So what CoF did was wrong, he accepts it, and has been given a 4 week ban and loss of premium. What Chuck did however was downright sinister, from the playing of the 1v1 speed games whilst supposedly absent, the malicious C&A report against someone who had helped him out, and ultimately the desertion of his new clan and the deadbeating of games in which he represented them.

[agentcom]

QUOTE

GO, excellent post. You are a classy fellow. Bravo you!

[Leehar]

QUOTE

GO, excellent post. You are a classy fellow. Bravo you!

Yup, stand-up post - open & honest! (if only all of yours could be this good ), and it's nice to know the flow of events from your guys perspective as well! Sorry about the dissing you feel I throw, but you do perhaps sometimes make it very easy!


Going back a bit to the matter at hand. I really can't see this as 'intentional' deadbeating, purely because he got kicked out of all his ongoing games. Perhaps if he was online, and only didn't take those turns with Pack because of malicious reasons, there may be a case; but it seems the guy just left to go on some of his basketball trips. It's neither unexpected (because he's unfortunately had to disappear before), or really 'intentional' in that there are people that just can't make their turns all the time because of rl (and where saying he 'should have' had a sitter, is a somewhat dubious requirement to impose)

[deathcomesrippin]

Locked.

[deathcomesrippin]

After much discussion, since it seems he has indeed quit for now, we are going to note this in case he returns and if he does get an answer then. But for the moment, it will be Noted and closed.