Inform community about community related punishments

[Darwins_Bane]

this already exists...they get exclusive membership to the guests clan

the other thing is if you have a partner in a team game but they aren't speaking you can just visit their profile and see they have a forum ban. or you can visit someone's profile and see he has been busted 4 times for multies. or cleared or watevs.

[Queen_Herpes]

well then perhaps you could just modify the code you already have to do it. Print a line out to the user's profile when you bust them. It wouldnt take much more coding to do. basically if you ban someone it also prints out a line to their profile saying user cannot communicate. and if a multi is busted then same thing. since i already imagine you do something similar, it wouldnt be hard and would have a really easy place to check. the user profile of the person you're accusing. same thing could happen even if someone was cleared. this would probably clear up spurious complaints somewhat and also satisfy the suggestion here.

this already exists...they get exclusive membership to the guests clan

the guests clan makes sense, but what about other punishments?

[Darwins_Bane]

i fast-posted you QH LV to expand on what i said previously basically when you guest or ban someone I'm just saying that all you would need is lack or someone to write in an extra line of code so that when you clear or guest or ban someone it prints that out to a box in the profile of the "accused". (I use accused in parentheses because it isnt the right word for all cases but its close enough to get the point across.)

[TheForgivenOne]

Um i didn't know that if you had a Forum ban, you couldn't speak in Game Chats

the other thing is if you have a partner in a team game but they aren't speaking you can just visit their profile and see they have a forum ban. or you can visit someone's profile and see he has been busted 4 times for multies. or cleared or watevs.

Also Queen, i still think you literally don't know how many multi's they bust per day. You'd be spending a lot of time on here creating little 1 line codes saying they were busted with so-and-so.

[Queen_Herpes]

Um i didn't know that if you had a Forum ban, you couldn't speak in Game Chats

the other thing is if you have a partner in a team game but they aren't speaking you can just visit their profile and see they have a forum ban. or you can visit someone's profile and see he has been busted 4 times for multies. or cleared or watevs.

Also Queen, i still think you literally don't know how many multi's they bust per day. You'd be spending a lot of time on here creating little 1 line codes saying they were busted with so-and-so.

You are correct, I don't know how many multis they bust per day. No one does. Except them.

But I'm not looking for the name of the busted account that has been guested and has no chance of ever coming back. I'm looking for the name of the accounts (busted behind-the-scenes without a public report) which were the accounts that the multis were allowed to keep. For example, Kingburger created at least one multi, that "symbol thingy." The account Kingburger was allowed to keep was the "symbol thingy" account. So, if this was the situaion...then a post to that stickied-locked-busted thread would say "Symbol Thingy" busted plus two (or however many other multis kingburger had created.)

That being said, AAFitz made a good point when he said that listing the names of the guested multis might help the community to help the community to find future multis created by the user whose account was allowed to remain. For example, if I was a multi-creator and I always created multis with names like "scrum" "rugbyscrum" "scrumrugby" and "rugbyrugby" that might help the community in case an account is opened after I got busted called "scrumscrum."

[lord voldemort]

im not a massive fan of putting a big M on peoples profiles saying they were busted as a previous mutli. It would suprise you the shear number....and quite simply the people who have been busted in the past.

my mistake on the premium to freemie thing.
Its a small number the amount of busts who are premium. Even smaller once the serial multies are removed (duality etc)

[Darwins_Bane]

im not a massive fan of putting a big M on peoples profiles saying they were busted as a previous mutli. It would suprise you the shear number....and quite simply the people who have been busted in the past.

this basically happens already. you just have to search a little harder for it. yes some don't show up in the C&A reports (i have no idea how many) but i know that a lot of ppl have been busted and stuff...perhaps i want to put them on my foe list, but i cant currently because i don't know who they are.

[lord voldemort]

im not a massive fan of putting a big M on peoples profiles saying they were busted as a previous mutli. It would suprise you the shear number....and quite simply the people who have been busted in the past.

this basically happens already. you just have to search a little harder for it. yes some don't show up in the C&A reports (i have no idea how many) but i know that a lot of ppl have been busted and stuff...perhaps i want to put them on my foe list, but i cant currently because i don't know who they are.

You just answered your own question...search

[AAFitz]

I think perhaps the biggest reason for not making all busts public is that many of the private busts, probably do have some plausible deniability to them. There is the chance that the explanation the person gave is true, and while its probable enough to bust, its not probable enough to make public. The problem with making all busts public is that it would reduce the ability of hunters to bust, because it would require more certainty.

Its one thing to disallow another account because its a suspected multi, but quite another to brand that person a cheater because they are a multi. By keeping it secret, the hunters are ultimately able to rid the site of more possible multis, which is the ultimate goal, and reduce the impact of any mistakes, which are inevitable, and the main reason why all busts CANNOT be made public. It would simply take too much time, possibly unfairly brand players, and simply generate a bureaucracy of complaints about multis, that simply does not need to happen in most cases.

The current system is much better for the community in the long run, and a much more, if not infinitely more professional way to handle cheating. They should be applauded for keeping identities safe in this situation. Honestly, most sites wouldnt even entertain this idea for this long. Its a testament to the dedication of team CC that they have, but its insane to think we are privy to all dealings of CC that involve other players and accounts.

[king achilles]

Per suggestion from eddie2, create a locked and stickied thread in the C&A Forum titled "busts"
Post all punishments (not warnings) as a response to the thread like this:

* Comment: Queen Herpes [Forum Ban] (Include more information if necessary or per personal choice of the C&A mod who is posting.
* Comment: Queen Herpes [Multis] (Include more information if necessary or per personal choice of the C&A mod who is posting.) Per suggestion from AAFitz, include the total number of multiple accounts created. Also per suggestion from AAFitz, include the names of the banned usernames in the event that the usernames created are similar and can be recognized in the future.
* Comment: Queen Herpes [Communication Ban 1 month ends July 27, 2010] (Include more information if necessary or personal choice of the C&A mod who is posting.)

I am sorry but I do not agree with this suggestion. You are here to play your games. It is not your primary concern to find out who is punished or who has been busted. The moderators will do thier duties and handle the reports. There is no need for a list to see who has done what.

The C&A forum is there. You make a report, it will be looked at and the verdict will always be announced. There are times that you are already sure of what the outcome would or should be even before a verdict has been made. Still, we will come out with our own findings. If there was a mistake, we will correct it, but if there is none and you still don't like the result, you simply have to suck it up.

There are people who would rather stay anonymous when they want to report someone. That is why sometimes, you see people suddenly getting booted out or getting 'guested' without any public report about them.

Generally, whenever a punishment has been given, in almost all cases, the person usually disagrees with the ruling, does not acknowledge what he has done and always feels he has been wronged or misunderstood. Then you want him to be put up on a public "list"?

This "list" or whatever you may call it, will only spark more flame from those who may be put in that thread. Making a list of those who got punished comes down to branding these people. Again, you are here to play the games. Feel free if you want to mark certain people but we will not condone something that will help people get branded over their past violations or mistakes.

You have your common sense to follow the rules and guidelines and you will be answerable to your actions if you do break them. No need for a public "list" to inform people of some players' past violations.

[eddie2]

hi ka this is getting blown up for what is being asked

1)if there is a pos multi bust that has been finalised through e tickets post it let us know

2)if someone has a forum ban of more than 24 hours post it let us no.

i will give a example you are in 4 tournements some are the finals you get the second vacation from forum posts(3 days) this disallows pm's. the games are posted the day you go off with a 24 hour sign up time. why get punished 2 times for the forum ban if a list was availible then organisers can see that you are on this.

ok you are also saying that posting a cheat is not fair on them and should not suffer the humiliation of the cc public knowing all i can say is tough(http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=239)why should we not know who they are because it was a e ticket.


i am sorry but this is excuse after excuse for not allowing this.

first it was because it would take up to much mods time(this was fixed)

2nd it was it would take to much to program(this was fixed)


and now you are saying it is not fair to publicly say a cheats name

[king sam]

i never saw a viable solution come to the table for any of the discrepancies that were listed in this suggestion.. how was anything fixed?

[Queen_Herpes]

I am sorry but I do not agree with this suggestion. You are here to play your games. It is not your primary concern to find out who is punished or who has been busted. The moderators will do thier duties and handle the reports. There is no need for a list to see who has done what.

"You are here to play your games....not your concern to find out who is punished or busted...moderators will do their duty."

Actually, it is a community, hence the name "club." In a community, it is important for members to know what is going on. I don't shutter my windows at home when there is a break-in down the street. I don't turn a blind eye to a scam artist living in the area. A cheat in the conquerclub community should be outed. They gave up their right to privacy when they decided to cheat. In the past, I've attempted to defend players who were busted in a public thread. The response from some of the C&A Volunteers was that multiple accounts are considered cheating and "stated clear as day when you open your account." Ignorance of the law isn't an excuse, yet King Achilles just said, "Feel free if you want to mark certain people but we will not condone something that will help people get branded over their past violations or mistakes."

Players have the right to know if someone they are up against or considering to go up against are cheaters or not.

Players have the right to know.

The community has a right to know.

[lord voldemort]

no one gives up their right to privacy when they decide to cheat. Are you seriously going to foe every single cheater out there?
I fear you will struggle to get a game

But seriously. You really dont have the right to know. The public c&a forum is a good way for people who use the forum to report cheaters. And hence everything is dealt with in the forum. The e-tickets are a way for people to remain anonymus.
Your metaphors are not relevent QH....what you should be saying..because someone made a mistake. lets brand them and make them a target and make their life on cc hell...Have you ever made a mistake??

[eddie2]

The e-tickets are a way for people to remain anonymus.

do you really get that many people who hand themselfs in. because the only person who deserves the anon right is the person reporting

[Queen_Herpes]

no one gives up their right to privacy when they decide to cheat. Are you seriously going to foe every single cheater out there?
I fear you will struggle to get a game

But seriously. You really dont have the right to know. The public c&a forum is a good way for people who use the forum to report cheaters. And hence everything is dealt with in the forum. The e-tickets are a way for people to remain anonymus.
Your metaphors are not relevent QH....what you should be saying..because someone made a mistake. lets brand them and make them a target and make their life on cc hell...Have you ever made a mistake??

If the "right to know" is not there...then you should be considering a policy of "responsibilty to inform." The metaphors I mentioned are spot on target. In most societies it is the norm to identify wrongdoers. In fact, I challenge you to cite a society where identifying wrongdoers is NOT the norm.

As a player, I want to know if a potential opponent abuses the rating system. Why? Because I care about the ratings I receive. If they've been punished in the past, I want to know that so I don't elect to play games against them. Maybe I won't foe them, perhaps I will give them a chance and play them one year after their punishment.

As a player, I want to know if a player opened a multiple account. I want to know this in case they were avoiding something like ratings abuse or serial deadbeating or farming. I don't want to play games against players who are cheating and who are avoiding being publicly branded in a C&A Abuse case.

There seems to be a lot of mention of abuse that we players who peruse the C&A Forum do not know about. Are there cheaters who use "outlawed" scripts or special codes to give them an unfair advantage in a game? If so, I don't want to play against those players. I'm here for fair competition.

To answer your rhetorical question about making a mistake, yes, I have made mistakes. And in my society, my community members knew about those mistakes that I made. They helped me to make changes and learn to behave accordingly. In time, people forgot. I know that on the internet, everything is eternal. This is why I recommended having ratings expire with time. If there was a way to do it, I would suggest having information about players who were punished expire after, say, two years. However, I've already been cautioned to make this suggestion simple, without need for extensive programming.

[lord voldemort]

hmmm after 2 years you want to let the serial multies and trollers back?
Sex offenders are not pubically announced in australia...

The Australian football league does not announce drug abuse cases..

and outlawed scripts and special codes...lmao

[Bones2484]

hmmm after 2 years you want to let the serial multies and trollers back?
Sex offenders are not pubically announced in australia...

The Australian football league does not announce drug abuse cases..

and outlawed scripts and special codes...lmao

You sure spend a lot of time in this thread being a sarcastic prick to a well-intentioned idea by QH for someone who "doesn't have time to list a few names in a thread every so often".

Take a few lessons from King Achilles on how to respond to an idea you are not in favor of.

[Darwins_Bane]

hmmm after 2 years you want to let the serial multies and trollers back?
Sex offenders are not pubically announced in australia...

The Australian football league does not announce drug abuse cases..

and outlawed scripts and special codes...lmao

I remember this one case i read about. this sex offender had actually managed to get a pardon somehow before the legal system was changed to prevent it. 3 years later a news crew finally caught up with him in Mexico and showed him pictures of the children he abused, asking him if he remembered them. And most stuff is available if you ask nicely.
Yes this is an extreme case, but ppl don't get away scot free ever. its why a record never goes away even if you get a pardon. it still says you were pardoned.

[lord voldemort]

hmmm after 2 years you want to let the serial multies and trollers back?
Sex offenders are not pubically announced in australia...

The Australian football league does not announce drug abuse cases..

and outlawed scripts and special codes...lmao

You sure spend a lot of time in this thread being a sarcastic prick to a well-intentioned idea by QH for someone who "doesn't have time to list a few names in a thread every so often".

Take a few lessons from King Achilles on how to respond to an idea you are not in favor of.

It has been made perfectly clear by andy and king a that any suggestion that unreasonably increases moderator time wont go through.
Andmy points are that people shouldnt need to be branded when they cheat. Am i not allowed to make my point. Yes im not as articulated as king a and andy. Buuuuut its who I am

and darwins...im saying that the general public will never be aware of the identity of sex offenders....yes an extremem example. But its an example.

[SirSebstar]

If the "right to know" is not there...then you should be considering a policy of "responsibilty to inform." The metaphors I mentioned are spot on target. In most societies it is the norm to identify wrongdoers. In fact, I challenge you to cite a society where identifying wrongdoers is NOT the norm..

Found one.
The USA.
http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cjisd/fprequest.htm
You can ask for your own rapsheet or for certain backgroundchecks. Not the neighbour on the street wanting to see what the kid did 15 years ago.

[Darwins_Bane]

If the "right to know" is not there...then you should be considering a policy of "responsibilty to inform." The metaphors I mentioned are spot on target. In most societies it is the norm to identify wrongdoers. In fact, I challenge you to cite a society where identifying wrongdoers is NOT the norm..

Found one.
The USA.
http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cjisd/fprequest.htm
You can ask for your own rapsheet or for certain backgroundchecks. Not the neighbour on the street wanting to see what the kid did 15 years ago.

yes but when there is a case where someone did really anything, it goes in the news, and then gets published. everyone knows who it was. whether they choose it or not. the only people who have their names protected are minors.

[lord voldemort]

agreed...but it doesnt then go on a public database.

[JoshyBoy]

This topic is turning into more of a discussion/debate than a suggestion, isn't there any middle ground?

No, there isn't.

[lord voldemort]

sort of related...

Perhaps something to actually consider ...when someone is forum banned or kicked...an auto pm when you try to pm them or invite to games saying that this person is kicked or whatever..just to let you know...Not actual details. Just a hey this person wont get back to you for a while