LumpyDumpyBodkin & Hardline[closed]es

[misher]

(Yes I know, another secret diplomacy I'm reporting -.-)
Accused:

LumpyDumpyBodkin
Hardline



The accused are suspected of:

Conducting Secret Diplomacy



Game number(s):

Game 6960274



Comments: They have been previously reported and admitted to being cousins, was suggested by multi hunter at the time that lack of evidence clears them, and that they should avoid playing public games together, which they obviously haven'thttp://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=239&t=117733&p=2602387#p2602387. First red put the pressure on me by pushing a ton of his men on my border for no observable reason, so I naturally assumed he was just some crazy noob and pulled my reserves to defend. Then green does the same and then I become suspicious, red pulled about 60%(50 men) of his men from his defense against blue, leaving 1 man and put them on my border to invade asia, and then green pulls 25 and puts them on my australian border, naturally I don't have enough men to defend all fronts.

Why do I suspect secret diplomacy? Cause no chat has gone on between them in game log, thus to coordinate this move something is up? I have no problems against friends playing together, but negotiating alliances behind the backs of the other players is a secret diplomacy and thus illegal.

Btw I know the numbers look a bit smaller now cause I suicided there buildups a bit. And yes I'm about as strong as any 1.7 players in this, and thus even though it's a 5 way I can expect to be teamed, but teaming w/o discussion in chat is secret diplomacy. I'm about 90% sure they both did not decide randomly to place a huge mass of men on my borders at the same time. Also since they are each damn good players winning about 1/3 to 1/4 of there games I don't think red would just go out on a limb and place most of his army when he knows I can match it unless he'd already gotten green to go with it.

[Masli]

You are the one who is in the lead. You have the most army's and the highest bonus.
I would do the same as red did, the only way they have a chance in winning is to attack you!
Nothing strange going on !

[Evil Semp]

Comments: They have been previously reported and admitted to being cousins, was suggested by multi hunter at the time that lack of evidence clears them, and that they should avoid playing public games together, which they obviously haven'thttp://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=239&t=117733&p=2602387#p2602387.

Going to take a look into this.

Misher fyi the quoted part doesn't really apply because this game started before they were advised not to play public games together.

[misher]

Shit didn't think to check the dates, there in other games that aren't filled together though.

[misher]

Well this doesn't add much proof, red just atked me after I atked green.

[gcwca_4_life]

Well this doesn't add much proof, red just atked me after I atked green.

Ok.. Maybe he got scared and pissed his pants when he saw those 30 and 40 stacks on the other side of him, and wanted to hide behind you?

[misher]

Which is why I said it doesn't add much, cause I saw conceivable reasons for it -.-
Tsk I have some really sarcastic stuff I could say but this is for reporting abuse, not for flaming..thus I wrote it, laughed, and then deleted it

Never the less he doesn't seem like the kindda person who would blow away 40 men to prove a point considering he has other players besides me to deal with.

Yep I went from the lead in this game to last about, pretty much screwed. I'd also love to say red and blue have a secret diplomacy but I pretty much got no proof and prob the only way they could do that is through private messages.

Red and green have both suicided me with everything they got about -.-

[tims_girl_ashley]

whats up with the new spree of secreat deplomacy threads started recently

[Hardline]

I wondered the same thing. I've noticed that they typically come from higher ranked players who don't want to lose to lower ranked players.

As previously noted, Lumpy and I are related and have taken the advice of the admins not to start any further public games together, despite evidence that we attack each other MORE than we attack other players. It would have been nice if we could have continued playing against each other in public games which was the reason we both joined CC AND bought premium memberships, but seeing as it causes so much stress for some people, we've resigned to playing team games only.

I've found that whatever the game, and whoever the players, someone will always complain when you do anything unexpected, or make a move they wouldn't have made themselves.

As for the game in question with misher, he needs to check the logs before making accusations. I don't believe I had to opportunity to ever attack red and have been clinging to survival, poking bonuses in the hopes that someone would just wipe me out of a game I can't possibly win. Misher would also see that yellow and I have been at each other since round 1 and that going through Australia would be a much easier way to gain a territory than suiciding against one of the biggest stacks on the map.

But I guess it's easier just to open up a SD report.

[Hardline]

(I'd also be willing to send screenshots of my PM history or allow admins to access my account to prove that no PM strategizing is taking place.)

[gcwca_4_life]

(I'd also be willing to send screenshots of my PM history or allow admins to access my account to prove that no PM strategizing is taking place.)

Send me a beer while your at it.


And btw, there are more ways other than PMing.

[Hardline]

Yeah, I know. That was just the one that my accuser brought up =)

[jefjef]

Yeah, I know. That was just the one that my accuser brought up =)

Ronald Reagan DOES NOT conduct secret diplomacy. Well maybe some closed door stuff but never in writing!

At this point in the game I have to wonder why red(lumpy) in Europe only has 1 on his borders. One border with blue(Mountain Dew) and the other with pink(Misher). Are these 3 in cahoots against Hardline now?

Yellow meno71 has not hit pink that I saw at all. WTF is going on??????

[misher]

Look I saw weird behavior between them that was logically unexplainable, I checked there backgrounds, I saw that they had played together lots, I checked there play times in a few random games to see if evidence of multiing, I checked and found they had a previously reported case that was dropped due to lack of evidence. I don't just report every single person that beats me, if I did I would of been much more likely to report blue seeing as he will attack me when I have 9 men defending just for the heck of it, but will leave reds 1 man alone and will see his border as being safe with just 6 men defending.

I don't report unless I have evidence, and the evidence is there, the fact that this case wasn't closed immediately means that the it's being looked over. I doubt they'll get anything more than a 2nd warning seeing as there isn't hard evidence, especially since the last case I reported which was alot more clear cut didn't go through. Also I'll reiterate just because theres evidence does not mean there guilty, it could just be a huge coincidence, which is why we report things and leave it to admins to judge.

[Hardline]

In my opinion, there ought to be negative consequences for making an accusation that is cleared, or for making a certain number of accusations in a certain amount of time, as I see this isn't misher's first and probably isn't his last. That way certain players wouldn't make an accusation per game. Just sayin'

[SirSebstar]

there is.. you can foe him...

[jefjef]

In my opinion, there ought to be negative consequences for making an accusation that is cleared, or for making a certain number of accusations in a certain amount of time, as I see this isn't misher's first and probably isn't his last. That way certain players wouldn't make an accusation per game. Just sayin'

There are consequences for vindictive accusations and too many frivolous complaints. They issue warns and bans.

This complaint is neither of those. He has a concern and the evidence is very weak but he wants it looked at.

As for limiting a # of complaints thats BS too. I and others find and report lots of multis. To even suggest that someone gets punished for reporting to many cheaters is laughable.

If I were you I would deff take turns in this game that proves you 2 are not in cahoots.

Just sayin'

[Hardline]

Like I said, "my opinion". I'm not proposing we punish misher (although the foe's list thing is a done deal). There shouldn't be punishment for the number of accusations if they are legitimate accusations. However, one could make accusations a part of their regular strategy. For example...

In this thread, there's already been a suggestion or two that I prove my innocence by making certain moves or attacking certain people. My focus is now on proving my innocence as opposed to winning the round. Let's say misher was the weakest on the map at the moment and I was working towards eliminating him. He makes an accusation and now I'm forced to turn my attention to a non-strategic target, which takes the heat off of him and allows him to entrench. I've lost my opporunity and due to having to rapidly change my gameplan mid-game, I've probably lost hope of winning the map.

Because an accusation takes a player out of the game and puts the map into "will I get banned" territory instead of "will I win" territory, someone could take advantage by making regular accusations in any map they are losing. Find one thing that doesn't make sense ("why did he attack A instead of B?") and you can make an accusation.

Also, once a person has been accused and their name is in the forum, the frequency of accusations increases exponentially. Lumpy and I have been playing together since December, never had an issue, and just in the past month we've been accused three or four times. Our game play hasn't changed, so my only deduction is that we're now an easy target because we've been accused before.

I'm not saying that misher is taking advantage, but I'm not saying he's not. I'm saying that it'd be nice if safeguards were in place for the future.

[jefjef]

You have been accused because of what some have thought to be questionable game play. You 2 have a history and that is why it is questioned.

Play to win. Just be sure you don't play blatant favorites.

As far as peeps using c&a as a win strategy. Well if that was to happen it would be dealt with.

[Hardline]

Well, I guess that's what I have a problem with--that we have a "history" when nothing is going on. But whatever. Do what you gotta do, I guess.

I'm pretty disenchanted with things right now, so I may be done for good anyway, which is sad because I really enjoy this site.

[misher]

Believe me it doesn't work, very seldom are people banned before the game ends, they've always gone on to win before the admin takes action, probably to stop people from reporting just to win games. As for stopping the behavior because you've been reported...well if you have to stop what your doing because people who see it will find your abusing I think that would imply guilt right there.

Honestly I'm probably going to delete this report if I can figure out how, the maps changed quite a bit since I reported and you can no longer see the behavior I reported them for. Plus they've agreed to stop playing together and there's too much debate over it.

Btw if you'd like to make a suggestion I suggest you go to the suggestions part of the forum to make that suggestion, or maybe you can pm the hunters and ask there opinions since there the ones that have to go through this load of dross everyday. http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=4 I don't envy them, btw if you checked my records you'll see that I make less than 10? reports in 3 years/288 games, which is an avg of like once every 3 months or 1 every 30 games, though I admit when I first started playing this I made some stupid ones.

Oh! and if your volunteering to have your msg logs checked, feel free to have lumpy volunteered too, I have little to no evidence of it but I swear him and blue have some kindda agreement lol. I mean god look at them!

[Hardline]

I really don't care what happens at this point, man. I'm just going to let the admins do what they want and hopefully they see this thread for what it is. A waste of all our time.

One way or another, I'm probably done.

[Evil Semp]

OK guys, sorry it took so long.

Unless I over looked some game all there public multi player games that Lumpy and Hardline are in were started before the last decision was made. I don't see any reason to change anything from before. I am closing this report.