McCain Is Not Constitutionally Eligable To Be President

[DaGip]

DaGip is that you singing on the guitar about Ron Paul from that youtube video you linked for your sig?

yeah, I know, I know...I suck. But at least I can sing and play guitar, as crappy as it is...

no I'm not saying your guitar playing is crappy I was just wondering if it was actually you

Yes, that is actually me. (I need to drop a few pounds, I know already!)

[jimboston]

But he's a USA citizen now right?
So you've just wasted everyones time by shoddy research, Da GIMP.
Thanks for that

Arnold is a US Citizen now... but not a natural born citizen. So he's no t eligible.

[jimboston]

So what? Repeal that amendment. That's a silly law anyways. I wanna see Schwarzenneger President.

You don't repeal the Constitution for one man.

Dumb idea.

... for the record I love Arnold... but you just don't do that.

You do that sort of thing in Russia and Pakistan... not in the US.

[jimboston]

The other condition of being a natural born citizen is having one parent who is an American citizen, regardless of birthplace. Seriously, try not to be a retard.

Thank you.

I wanted to say this... but wanted to first see if someone beat me to the punch.

[jimboston]

Gip

Your posts are somewhat funny... but some are quite dumb.

I think you need to go out and get some sun and fresh air.

I wouldn't mind this one... but you should at least have the courtesy of adding a GFY option to your poll... or an option like "shut up you are worng... he's a natural born citizen... go die". That would work too.

Jim

[jimboston]

You are probably correct. But the issue does contain legitimate weight. So first that part of the Constitution would have to be repealed, and then we can have Arnie for Prezinator!

The issue contains NO weight.

[jimboston]

The other condition of being a natural born citizen is having one parent who is an American citizen, regardless of birthplace. Seriously, try not to be a retard.

Read the post, McCain does not receive US citizenship by merely being born on a US Military base.

Did you even read what Colossus wrote???

He doesn't receive citizenship by being born on a military base.... he receives citizenship by Birthright by having one parent who is a citizen.

It might help GIP if you could understand what you read.

[Backglass]

Ron Paul still Rulles!

And when he loses (as we all have known he will for months), when exactly will the nation cave in? The end of the dollar? The end of the world as we know it from biblical prophesy?

Dates please.

[Frigidus]

Oh man, 6 posts in a row. Sorry jimboston, but

C-C-C-Combo Breaker!

[jimboston]

Kinda of funny. Obama's father is from Kenya while Mccain's linenage has been in the US for a long time. Yet it's more legal for Obama to be president than McCAin.

Um... if you believe Gip's verbal diarrhea then yes.

In reality NO.

Don't get me started on Obama....

[jimboston]

http://digg.com/2008_us_elections/McCain_not_Constitutionally_Eligible_to_be_President

Digg this.

Yes... excellent source.

[jimboston]

Oh man, 6 posts in a row. Sorry jimboston, but

C-C-C-Combo Breaker!

Sorry man.

I think the Gip here just knows how to push my buttons.

The thread should get moved out of IK... to a new section more appropriately titled... Unintelligent Konversation.

[Backglass]

Kinda of funny. Obama's father is from Kenya while Mccain's linenage has been in the US for a long time. Yet it's more legal for Obama to be president than McCAin.

Yes, technically it is. Do you disagree that McCain was foreign born & Obama is not? Or is it a double standard to you? (BTW Obama's lineage on his mothers side has been here a long time as well...but that probably doesn't count, does it.)

BTW if you want to condemn a man because if his ancestors, George Bush's ancestors are from Ireland, Bavaria & Canada. Should we send him "back whar he cum from"?

...and which lucky country gets him?

[moomaster2000]

8 More Years!

[DaGip]

Ron Paul still Rulles!

And when he loses (as we all have known he will for months), when exactly will the nation cave in? The end of the dollar? The end of the world as we know it from biblical prophesy?

Dates please.

June 28, 2008...something BIG is going to happen on that date! Write it down! I swear!

[Tyr]

does anyone realize that a natural born citizen is also a person born of two american parents where ever they are

[Hologram]

Thanks for repeating the point we've all been making and reviving an obviously dead thread.

[CoffeeCream]

June 28, 2008...something BIG is going to happen on that date! Write it down! I swear!

I'm probably going to regret this but what is going to happen?

[Hologram]

June 28, 2008...something BIG is going to happen on that date! Write it down! I swear!

I'm probably going to regret this but what is going to happen?

An enraged Libertarian assassin will be so fed up with everything political that he will kill every Presidential candidate except Ron Paul.

Of course he'll still lose, but that's what'll happen.

[DaGip]

does anyone realize that a natural born citizen is also a person born of two american parents where ever they are

Natural born citizens are citizens that are born within the 50 states and need NO special laws or guidelines to be or become a citizen of the United States. You are either a Natural Born Citizen or you are a Naturalized Citizen under United States law.

That means Ron Paul can legally become president because his existence needs NO specialized laws to citizenship, whereas, Mr. MadDog McCain is a citizen under such guidelines that allow him to be a NATURLIZED CITIZEN. Natural Born Citizen and Naturlized Citizen are not the same thing, sorry. Do your research.

The argument still holds weight, sorry Jimboston

[Hologram]

Alright Gip, pay very close attention. A natural born citizen is a citizen at birth.

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

With that pretext we move on to the next argument:

The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:
(a) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;
(b) a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe: Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property;
(c) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person;
(d) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year prior to the birth of such person, and the other of whom is a national, but not a citizen of the United States;
(e) a person born in an outlying possession of the United States of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year at any time prior to the birth of such person;
(f) a person of unknown parentage found in the United States while under the age of five years, until shown, prior to his attaining the age of twenty-one years, not to have been born in the United States;
(g) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 288 of title 22 by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person
(A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or
(B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date; and
(h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.

Note Clause A. That fact that it mentions citizens born within the United States as natural born citizens shows that the following clauses also define natural born citizen.

Now note Clause C. Senator McCain was born to two U.S. citizens, and they had a permanent residence either in the U.S. or the military base they were stationed in (outlying possession).

Therefore, Senator McCain is a natural born citizen and is eligible for the Presidency of the United States.

I really hope I cleared that all up.[/b]

[DaGip]

Alright Gip, pay very close attention. A natural born citizen is a citizen at birth.

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

With that pretext we move on to the next argument:

The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:
(a) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;
(b) a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe: Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property;
(c) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person;
(d) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year prior to the birth of such person, and the other of whom is a national, but not a citizen of the United States;
(e) a person born in an outlying possession of the United States of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year at any time prior to the birth of such person;
(f) a person of unknown parentage found in the United States while under the age of five years, until shown, prior to his attaining the age of twenty-one years, not to have been born in the United States;
(g) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 288 of title 22 by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person
(A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or
(B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date; and
(h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.

Note Clause A. That fact that it mentions citizens born within the United States as natural born citizens shows that the following clauses also define natural born citizen.

Now note Clause C. Senator McCain was born to two U.S. citizens, and they had a permanent residence either in the U.S. or the military base they were stationed in (outlying possession).

Therefore, Senator McCain is a natural born citizen and is eligible for the Presidency of the United States.

I really hope I cleared that all up.[/b]

McCain is a citizen of the United States, I do not disagree with you, but the question is,"Is John McCain a natural-born citizen?" Off the cuff, it has been said that he is, but it has never been seen in court. And if you have to go to court over your own citizenship, that means that you are not a natural-born citizen but a naturalized citizen of the United States at birth. They are two different things. One is undisputed citizenship without further issue by right of naturally being born on American soil, and the other confers or grants citizenship barring certain criteria is met, in which in such cases the individual is decalred a naturalized citizen at birth.

Just by McCain having to go to court over this issue would be enough to prove that he is not a Natural Born Citizen, as a Natural Born Citizen does not have to go to court over such things!

I don't know why this doesn't make sense to you?

If it doesn't go to court, then there is no problem, but if it does, it is bad for McCain, because that is all that is really needed to show that he is indeed not a natural-born citizen.

[Hologram]

Alright Gip, pay very close attention. A natural born citizen is a citizen at birth.

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

With that pretext we move on to the next argument:

The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:
(a) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;
(b) a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe: Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property;
(c) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person;
(d) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year prior to the birth of such person, and the other of whom is a national, but not a citizen of the United States;
(e) a person born in an outlying possession of the United States of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year at any time prior to the birth of such person;
(f) a person of unknown parentage found in the United States while under the age of five years, until shown, prior to his attaining the age of twenty-one years, not to have been born in the United States;
(g) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 288 of title 22 by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person
(A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or
(B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date; and
(h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.

Note Clause A. That fact that it mentions citizens born within the United States as natural born citizens shows that the following clauses also define natural born citizen.

Now note Clause C. Senator McCain was born to two U.S. citizens, and they had a permanent residence either in the U.S. or the military base they were stationed in (outlying possession).

Therefore, Senator McCain is a natural born citizen and is eligible for the Presidency of the United States.

I really hope I cleared that all up.[/b]

McCain is a citizen of the United States, I do not disagree with you, but the question is,"Is John McCain a natural-born citizen?" Off the cuff, it has been said that he is, but it has never been seen in court. And if you have to go to court over your own citizenship, that means that you are not a natural-born citizen but a naturalized citizen of the United States at birth. They are two different things. One is undisputed citizenship without further issue by right of naturally being born on American soil, and the other confers or grants citizenship barring certain criteria is met, in which in such cases the individual is decalred a naturalized citizen at birth.

Just by McCain having to go to court over this issue would be enough to prove that he is not a Natural Born Citizen, as a Natural Born Citizen does not have to go to court over such things!

I don't know why this doesn't make sense to you?

If it doesn't go to court, then there is no problem, but if it does, it is bad for McCain, because that is all that is really needed to show that he is indeed not a natural-born citizen.

That fact that he's going to court doesn't mean anything about his natural citizenship. It just means he needs the courts to clear up the law to say whether or not he was indeed a natural born citizen. Also, a naturalized citizen at birth is the exact same thing as a natural born citizen. It's what the name implies. All people born in the U.S. are naturalized citizens at birth and are therefore natural born citizens, and I'm sure that the federal courts will agree with me on this issue.

[DaGip]

Alright Gip, pay very close attention. A natural born citizen is a citizen at birth.

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

With that pretext we move on to the next argument:

The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:
(a) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;
(b) a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe: Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property;
(c) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person;
(d) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year prior to the birth of such person, and the other of whom is a national, but not a citizen of the United States;
(e) a person born in an outlying possession of the United States of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year at any time prior to the birth of such person;
(f) a person of unknown parentage found in the United States while under the age of five years, until shown, prior to his attaining the age of twenty-one years, not to have been born in the United States;
(g) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 288 of title 22 by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person
(A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or
(B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date; and
(h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.

Note Clause A. That fact that it mentions citizens born within the United States as natural born citizens shows that the following clauses also define natural born citizen.

Now note Clause C. Senator McCain was born to two U.S. citizens, and they had a permanent residence either in the U.S. or the military base they were stationed in (outlying possession).

Therefore, Senator McCain is a natural born citizen and is eligible for the Presidency of the United States.

I really hope I cleared that all up.[/b]

McCain is a citizen of the United States, I do not disagree with you, but the question is,"Is John McCain a natural-born citizen?" Off the cuff, it has been said that he is, but it has never been seen in court. And if you have to go to court over your own citizenship, that means that you are not a natural-born citizen but a naturalized citizen of the United States at birth. They are two different things. One is undisputed citizenship without further issue by right of naturally being born on American soil, and the other confers or grants citizenship barring certain criteria is met, in which in such cases the individual is decalred a naturalized citizen at birth.

Just by McCain having to go to court over this issue would be enough to prove that he is not a Natural Born Citizen, as a Natural Born Citizen does not have to go to court over such things!

I don't know why this doesn't make sense to you?

If it doesn't go to court, then there is no problem, but if it does, it is bad for McCain, because that is all that is really needed to show that he is indeed not a natural-born citizen.

That fact that he's going to court doesn't mean anything about his natural citizenship. It just means he needs the courts to clear up the law to say whether or not he was indeed a natural born citizen. Also, a naturalized citizen at birth is the exact same thing as a natural born citizen. It's what the name implies. All people born in the U.S. are naturalized citizens at birth and are therefore natural born citizens, and I'm sure that the federal courts will agree with me on this issue.

If you were born within the 50 States, you are considered a natural-born citizen, but if you are born in Germany (and your parents were American) then you are a naturalized citizen, there is a difference between the two. They sound similar, but legally they are two different terms. McCain is only being assumed to be a natural-born citizen, but it hasn't gone to court (and it may never go to court). If it doesn't go to court, then that is a plus for McCain's natural born status, but if it does go to court, I believe McCain will have a tough go of it (I know he has already got a bunch of lawyers ready to go to court if he has to over this issue). If he does go to court, it will be a learning experience for everyone on what exactly does a natural born citizen entail.

I think the problem arises because the founding father's planned a more Libertarian-style government, and they didn't envision us being all over the planet the way we are today. If anyone deserves natural-born status, it's McCain (I am still not going to vote for the old fucker)

[greenoaks]

does anyone realize that a natural born citizen is also a person born of two american parents where ever they are

Natural born citizens are citizens that are born within the 50 states and need NO special laws or guidelines to be or become a citizen of the United States. You are either a Natural Born Citizen or you are a Naturalized Citizen under United States law.

That means Ron Paul can legally become president because his existence needs NO specialized laws to citizenship, whereas, Mr. MadDog McCain is a citizen under such guidelines that allow him to be a NATURLIZED CITIZEN. Natural Born Citizen and Naturlized Citizen are not the same thing, sorry. Do your research.

The argument still holds weight, sorry Jimboston

your argument holds no wait DaGip because of the US constitution and your lack of understanding of the terms 'natural born' and 'naturalized'.

A naturalized citizen is someone who was not born on US soil and was not born to US parents but has lived in the US for a required number of years.

You are theorizing that because McCain was born in the Canal Zone, he was not actually qualified to be president. However, it should be noted that section 1403 was written to apply to a small group of people to whom section 1401 did not apply. McCain is a natural-born citizen under 8 USC 1401(c): "a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person."