Eliminate "invite" for Tournament Games [Implemented]

[BoganGod]

All of my tournaments I run are team tournaments. Some are mixed tournaments with dbs, trips, quads. I send game links with pw to team captains, who then invite their teams. For example a mixed round robin tournament with 8teams involves. The creation of 8doubles, 8triples, 8quads(the way I run some tournaments). That would be 32, 48, 64 = 144 invites that I would have to send..... Plus all the pm traffic, asking team captains to assign players, then waiting for their responses, the sending the invites, etc.

How many of these Team Captains actually use the Invite function when they give the games to their team, especially the games they are not in themselves? I guess that the large majority of them PM the games/passwords using one of the post-tags that can get players into games automatically.

For BoganGod and other tournament directors like him, this suggestion would limit his ability to provide quality events for the players to participate in. I think, based on the example provided, implementing this suggestion would cause problems.

ORGANIZERS, not directors. Only gold names are directors. Sorry, pet peeve of a distinction that is important in our tournament forums.

Most of the captains do use the invite function, as its easier than sending pm's. They join the games they are in, then invite other team members. Send pm's for the games they aren't in. Have watched the games fill up, and see that mostly invites.

[jrh_cardinal]

Interesting suggestion, but PLEASE DON'T run with it. As Night Strike has stated, please contact him if people are abusing the tournament invite system. I for one, would find it difficult/a lot more time consuming to run tournaments if this suggestion was implemented.

All of my tournaments I run are team tournaments. Some are mixed tournaments with dbs, trips, quads. I send game links with pw to team captains, who then invite their teams. For example a mixed round robin tournament with 8teams involves. The creation of 8doubles, 8triples, 8quads(the way I run some tournaments). That would be 32, 48, 64 = 144 invites that I would have to send..... Plus all the pm traffic, asking team captains to assign players, then waiting for their responses, the sending the invites, etc.

If this suggestion were implemented(mainly due to a few bad eggs, who can just be tournament banned), I would stop running complex fun tournaments which offer players choice in home maps, team allocations etc. With work, running clan wars, and my turns, I just wouldn't have the time to do the community service of running interesting tournaments.

Please consider the above folks.

lmao, I just sent 760 invites for 380 1v1 games on Wednesday (a couple thursday). That's the second set of games for that tournament, I've still got three more sets. Not to mention I've got a second tournament up that each update takes even longer than that one (though I send PMs not invites), and that's around 20 sets of games, since it's a full MLB season and I only send out about 9 games at a time to each person.

So lets say you don't have time to do all that, which is perfectly plausible. There are still two options (one for each type of tourney you would run).
1) it's just a quads tourney (or just dubs/just trips, whatever) so the whole team plays every game. Rather than just PMing the Team Captain, it's not very much work to PM all players on the team. If you're unwilling to do that, then I would say you are too lazy when running tourneys.

2) the teams are variable game to game so not everyone plays every game. Well, that means the team captain doesn't play every game either, so he has to send some games in a PM, why not all of them? It's not a huge deal.


While I agree it's not a huge problem, I fail to see any negatives. If you save the PMs (from option 1), you don't even have to type the names in every time there's a new round. You can just go to the old PM and hit reply all.
Your argument is not true. While you or the team captains may have to change your methods slightly, it adds little or no time. It's the change your scared of, not the time involved to do it the new way.

edit- sorry, forgot this. You say invites take too long. Then you say Team Captains invite their players where possible because it's easier than sending PMs. That is contradictory. If it's easier for you to send PMs, it's easier for them as well (just on a smaller scale)

[BoganGod]

Interesting suggestion, but PLEASE DON'T run with it. As Night Strike has stated, please contact him if people are abusing the tournament invite system. I for one, would find it difficult/a lot more time consuming to run tournaments if this suggestion was implemented.

All of my tournaments I run are team tournaments. Some are mixed tournaments with dbs, trips, quads. I send game links with pw to team captains, who then invite their teams. For example a mixed round robin tournament with 8teams involves. The creation of 8doubles, 8triples, 8quads(the way I run some tournaments). That would be 32, 48, 64 = 144 invites that I would have to send..... Plus all the pm traffic, asking team captains to assign players, then waiting for their responses, the sending the invites, etc.

If this suggestion were implemented(mainly due to a few bad eggs, who can just be tournament banned), I would stop running complex fun tournaments which offer players choice in home maps, team allocations etc. With work, running clan wars, and my turns, I just wouldn't have the time to do the community service of running interesting tournaments.

Please consider the above folks.

lmao, I just sent 760 invites for 380 1v1 games on Wednesday (a couple thursday). That's the second set of games for that tournament, I've still got three more sets. Not to mention I've got a second tournament up that each update takes even longer than that one (though I send PMs not invites), and that's around 20 sets of games, since it's a full MLB season and I only send out about 9 games at a time to each person.

So lets say you don't have time to do all that, which is perfectly plausible. There are still two options (one for each type of tourney you would run).
1) it's just a quads tourney (or just dubs/just trips, whatever) so the whole team plays every game. Rather than just PMing the Team Captain, it's not very much work to PM all players on the team. If you're unwilling to do that, then I would say you are too lazy when running tourneys.

2) the teams are variable game to game so not everyone plays every game. Well, that means the team captain doesn't play every game either, so he has to send some games in a PM, why not all of them? It's not a huge deal.


While I agree it's not a huge problem, I fail to see any negatives. If you save the PMs (from option 1), you don't even have to type the names in every time there's a new round. You can just go to the old PM and hit reply all.
Your argument is not true. While you or the team captains may have to change your methods slightly, it adds little or no time. It's the change your scared of, not the time involved to do it the new way.

edit- sorry, forgot this. You say invites take too long. Then you say Team Captains invite their players where possible because it's easier than sending PMs. That is contradictory. If it's easier for you to send PMs, it's easier for them as well (just on a smaller scale)

Quit trying to be Dr Freud..... I'm not scared of change. Read carefully kiddo, you call me lazy. I'm suggesting your too lazy to read my post. Its not just a quads tournament. The example I used was a mixed tournament not just a quads, or a dbs, or a trips as you suggested, in your unhelpful, misguided, shambolic answer... MIXED so including dbs, trips, and quads, a bit like TLO just on a smaller scale(respect, and hat off to LINDAX for the time and effort he puts into his tournament duties, and the TLO)...... Sending out team invites IS more complicated than smacking out 1vs1, especially when players are allocated by their team captain on a round by round basis, rather than the TO. The way I run my tournaments, is the most time efficent way for me. As stated I would have to dumb down my tournaments, and make them a lot less fun if the invite system was changed.

I stated how the proposed rule changes would affect me. Asked people nicely(for once) to consider my view point.

Jrh, I often agree with what you say, often you even make sense. In this case you have attacked the person with the different point of view to your own, rather than arguing your point of view.... The fact you just couldn't be fucked reading my post you quoted, and then gave a poorly thought out rebuttal of your misreading of my views. You fail to see negatives? Maybe you where in a state where you couldn't see when you made your post. Dude, I try to stay away from slightly serious posts when I'm drunk and the brain is switched to neutral, suggesting you do the same Cheers Bogan

In 4yrs time when you can drink, am more than happy to play drunken speed with you

[jrh_cardinal]

did you look at these two parts?

2) the teams are variable game to game so not everyone plays every game. Well, that means the team captain doesn't play every game either, so he has to send some games in a PM, why not all of them? It's not a huge deal.

edit- sorry, forgot this. You say invites take too long. Then you say Team Captains invite their players where possible because it's easier than sending PMs. That is contradictory. If it's easier for you to send PMs, it's easier for them as well (just on a smaller scale)

These were both addressing the mixed teams tournaments. It may not seem like a big deal for the team captains to use invites which takes a little longer than PMs, but they do take longer. Why can't the team captains just PM like you do?

I was not drunk (though I was really tired so that sort of accomplishes the same thing ), and I did not mean to unfairly attack you, your post was just contradictory imo

[danes]

Not implementing this suggestion can cause AIDS

Accidental
Invites
Drunkenly
Sent

[natty dread]

How about just disabling invites for singles games, while leaving them functional in team games?

[darth emperor]

How about just disabling invites for singles games, while leaving them functional in team games?

well the problem would be for random teams.... someone could still invite his own partner... and this could be worst, because maybe he's own partner is on the tournament too... that could make confussion

[JoshyBoy]

I like the invite feature for tournament games, as I personally prefer to use that instead of sending a mass PM and occassionally getting replies like "what's the password?" or "what link do I click?" etc.

I think this has been suggested already, but for tournament games, only the TO should have the power to send out invites.

[darth emperor]

I like the invite feature for tournament games, as I personally prefer to use that instead of sending a mass PM and occassionally getting replies like "what's the password?" or "what link do I click?" etc.

I think this has been suggested already, but for tournament games, only the TO should have the power to send out invites.

Well, this is what is saying the OP. Of course TO should have the ability to send invites... is much faster (altough i like more auto-join) and i do when its just 1 game (or few).... but the participants shouldn't have it the option to invite in tournaments

[JoshyBoy]

I like the invite feature for tournament games, as I personally prefer to use that instead of sending a mass PM and occassionally getting replies like "what's the password?" or "what link do I click?" etc.

I think this has been suggested already, but for tournament games, only the TO should have the power to send out invites.

Well, this is what is saying the OP. Of course TO should have the ability to send invites... is much faster (altough i like more auto-join) and i do when its just 1 game (or few).... but the participants shouldn't have it the option to invite in tournaments

Hmm, well then if that's a possibility, we have a winner here.

[darth emperor]

I like the invite feature for tournament games, as I personally prefer to use that instead of sending a mass PM and occassionally getting replies like "what's the password?" or "what link do I click?" etc.

I think this has been suggested already, but for tournament games, only the TO should have the power to send out invites.

Well, this is what is saying the OP. Of course TO should have the ability to send invites... is much faster (altough i like more auto-join) and i do when its just 1 game (or few).... but the participants shouldn't have it the option to invite in tournaments

Hmm, well then if that's a possibility, we have a winner here.

I think is possible...(im not a coder so im not sure) The way would be taking invite for tournaments for everyone... and then in the privileges of the TO have invite option...it seems the more factible and possible way

[ender516]

Concise description:

• Turn off the [Invite] button beside empty slots of tournament games on the Awaiting Players tab of My Games.

Specifics/Details:

• Once you join a tournament game, until it is completely filled, it appears on your Awaiting Players tab. But I should not be able to invite others into the game. I wouldn't do so, but I think I have seen tournaments messed up by novices who have done this. (At least, I know I have been in tournament games where a slot was taken by someone other than the intended player.) Why make it possible for someone to mess up the work of the Tournament Organizer(s)?

How this will benefit the site and/or other comments:

• Fewer mixups which force games to be recreated to fit the intended tournament format.

[TheForgivenOne]

Silly ender, you think you'd be able to use the search Merging this into the sticky'd topic.

[JoshyBoy]

Silly ender, you think you'd be able to use the search Merging this into the sticky'd topic.

I don't know about you TFO, but I don't see why this can't be submitted.

[ender516]

Silly ender, you think you'd be able to use the search Merging this into the sticky'd topic.

Strange, I thought I had searched for this. I suppose I searched "invitation" instead of "invite", or some such thing. Sorry for the clutter. I am glad that it is-being/has-been discussed. At a quick glance, I can see BoganGod's point: if tournament organizers delegate the filling of games to team captains, then this button may still be useful.

[Night Strike]

Silly ender, you think you'd be able to use the search Merging this into the sticky'd topic.

I don't know about you TFO, but I don't see why this can't be submitted.

I've already submitted to lack through Andy, along with a couple of other tournament requests.

[darth emperor]

Silly ender, you think you'd be able to use the search Merging this into the sticky'd topic.

I don't know about you TFO, but I don't see why this can't be submitted.

I've already submitted to lack through Andy, along with a couple of other tournament requests.

Well, the more it gets submiteed by different ways, the more chances this gets to work

[Night Strike]

Silly ender, you think you'd be able to use the search Merging this into the sticky'd topic.

I don't know about you TFO, but I don't see why this can't be submitted.

I've already submitted to lack through Andy, along with a couple of other tournament requests.

Well, the more it gets submiteed by different ways, the more chances this gets to work

Not really. As Head Tournament Director, I have a lot of direct input as to which changes to the tournament system get done by lack. If I had a strong rational argument against this idea, I could push it and it probably would not have gotten done. I also have the benefit of submitting them directly to lack for doing as a part of a whole tournament update when he makes his rounds back to our area of the site (his last update was the Tournament Database, which was massive). Some changes I've submitted directly to lack without input from others (besides the other Directors, but mostly administrative issues), some changes have come with discussion with other organizers, and some have come from public suggestions but were submitted to him with my support/encouragement to do sooner rather than later. It's why I make sure to keep my eyes on this forum every few days to check and follow good tournament ideas that I can help develop and recommend.

[TheForgivenOne]

Alright, since NS came forward and said he has this submitted to lack, i will be moving this one to Submitted.

[JoshyBoy]

Night Strike, you are the man. This is a good simple suggestion, and nice to see you're looking out for the tournaments.

[stahrgazer]

Couldn't there be legitimate situations where it is helpful for players to invite others to tournament games, like when you have team in a tourney??

Yes, there are legitimate situations where it is helpful for the players to invite others, rather than leave it all to the TO. Several team tourneys I'm in, the TO made it clear that it's up to each team captain to invite the appropriate persons, and I think this is a good option to keep to cut down on TO duties. The less duties an organizer is forced to do entirely on his (her) own, the more tournaments he or she might be willing to organize.

While I understand the concern about a player inviting the wrong player(s) to a tournament, I disagree that the fix for it should put everything to the Tournament Organizer. One tournament might have a hundred games each with 8 players. That's 800 invites left to one person. Much easier if the TO can unofficially designate someone else to do the appropriate inviting. The downside is, it makes each player responsible to review which games he or she is inviting people to join (and I can't see that as THAT much of a downside).

In one tourney's rules, the organizer specified that he allowed one substitution for the entire tourney. Under that specification, if whoever I might accidentally invite in place of the original team, refused to join the rest of the games, then my team forfeits the tournament (because with my accident, I would have made my one allowable substitution). If I caught it before finishing invites, I imagine I could apologize to everyone involved, explain my error, and tell the wrong persons to drop; if caught just after finishing invites, I imagine I could notify the TO to request that the game be remade so I could invite the right parties.. Either way, under these specifications, the responsibility would still be mine to observe I'd made an error.

[Night Strike]

While I understand the concern about a player inviting the wrong player(s) to a tournament, I disagree that the fix for it should put everything to the Tournament Organizer. One tournament might have a hundred games each with 8 players. That's 800 invites left to one person. Much easier if the TO can unofficially designate someone else to do the appropriate inviting. The downside is, it makes each player responsible to review which games he or she is inviting people to join (and I can't see that as THAT much of a downside).

That's why you send PMs with game numbers and passwords (or TO tags) instead of invites. There are other ways to get players into games than with invites.

[lackattack]

This has been implemented as requested by the Tournaments department.

[eddie2]

This is dumb it affects clan privs 2.