EW's Semi-Open Matrix Madness

[Kingm]

Votecount:
No Lynch (3) - kingm, Loose Canon, Devante, Pixar
Swang (3) - fusi, kongming, PMC
Devante (3) - Charle, Strike, Swang
DDS (2) - Max, Ragian
PMChugh (1) - DDS
Loose Canon (1) - Votanic
Votanic (1) - Loose

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

But is see Loose is here twice, if we don't have LC and Loose?

[Maxleod]

That makes 4 no lynch EW. Anyway, DDS MUST DIE.

[Votanic]

Votecount:
No Lynch (3) - kingm, Loose Canon, Devante, Pixar

Hmm, King thats 1, LC thats 2, Dev 3, Pix 4

Actually it's only 3.
LC foolishly changed his vote in a desperate-scum attempt to lynch Town's eternal savior (et moi).

[DirtyDishSoap]

f*ck it.

I think DDS is the way to go. vote DDS

I can't get my head around his change of M.O. and not reading the rules. Feels like lazy scum.

[Extreme Ways]

Hush.

Votecount:
No Lynch (4) - kingm, Loose Canon, Devante, Pixar
Swang (3) - fusi, kongming, PMC
Devante (3) - Charle, Strike, Swang
DDS (2) - Max, Ragian
PMChugh (1) - DDS
Loose Canon (1) - Votanic
Votanic (1) - Loose

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Hush.

Votecount:
No Lynch (4) - kingm, Loose Canon, Devante, Pixar
Swang (3) - fusi, kongming, PMC
Devante (3) - Charle, Strike, Swang
DDS (2) - Max, Ragian
PMChugh (1) - DDS
Loose Canon (1) - Votanic
Votanic (1) - Loose

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Hmm so Loose has the avility to have 2 votes??

[TrafalgarLaw01]

I don't see anything in the matrix that says a player can have the ability to have 2 votes. Does anyone see something?

[Loose Canon]

It's a meritocracy. The count is still wrong though. I deserve 12 votes

[Maxleod]

Hmm... The Godfather (scum) has 2 votes. But EW is not supposed to us know that (I think?). Loose was next on my lynch list after DDS so if you all want to lynch Loose first I'll jump on the wagon.

[Votanic]

Hmm... The Godfather (scum) has 2 votes. But EW is not supposed to us know that (I think?). Loose was next on my lynch list after DDS so if you all want to lynch Loose first I'll jump on the wagon.

Intriguing idea, Max... and here I was thinking it was an error... but EW has yet to correct the count.

The game mods around here always think scum deserves extra breaks and privileges... so an unannounced double scum-vote is totally on-brand.

[Extreme Ways]

AAAAAH I should pay more attenrion

[Extreme Ways]

Hush.

Votecount:
No Lynch (3) - kingm, Devante, Pixar
Swang (3) - fusi, kongming, PMC
Devante (3) - Charle, Strike, Swang
DDS (2) - Max, Ragian
PMChugh (1) - DDS
Loose Canon (1) - Votanic
Votanic (1) - Loose

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Hmm so Loose has the avility to have 2 votes??

Fixed.

See my initial 3 count on NL was correct

[Maxleod]

Hush.

Votecount:
No Lynch (3) - kingm, Devante, Pixar
Swang (3) - fusi, kongming, PMC
Devante (3) - Charle, Strike, Swang
DDS (2) - Max, Ragian
PMChugh (1) - DDS
Loose Canon (1) - Votanic
Votanic (1) - Loose

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Hmm so Loose has the avility to have 2 votes??

Fixed.

See my initial 3 count on NL was correct

Nope, not buying it. It doesn't take 8 to lynch, only the most votes. EW's just trying to get us townies confused. As far as I'm concerned Loose has 2 votes and he better come up with a good reason for that. (actually, that doesn't change a thing, I was already onto him, he will die no matter what).

[Extreme Ways]

Hush.

Votecount:
No Lynch (3) - kingm, Devante, Pixar
Swang (3) - fusi, kongming, PMC
Devante (3) - Charle, Strike, Swang
DDS (2) - Max, Ragian
PMChugh (1) - DDS
Loose Canon (1) - Votanic
Votanic (1) - Loose

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Hmm so Loose has the avility to have 2 votes??

Fixed.

See my initial 3 count on NL was correct

Nope, not buying it. It doesn't take 8 to lynch, only the most votes. EW's just trying to get us townies confused. As far as I'm concerned Loose has 2 votes and he better come up with a good reason for that. (actually, that doesn't change a thing, I was already onto him, he will die no matter what).

It takes 8 to end the day by means of vote. If day ends earlier due to mod discretion (announced ~a week in advance), then the most voted option happens.

[DirtyDishSoap]

Hush.

Votecount:
No Lynch (3) - kingm, Devante, Pixar
Swang (3) - fusi, kongming, PMC
Devante (3) - Charle, Strike, Swang
DDS (2) - Max, Ragian
PMChugh (1) - DDS
Loose Canon (1) - Votanic
Votanic (1) - Loose

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Hmm so Loose has the avility to have 2 votes??

Fixed.

See my initial 3 count on NL was correct

Nope, not buying it. It doesn't take 8 to lynch, only the most votes. EW's just trying to get us townies confused. As far as I'm concerned Loose has 2 votes and he better come up with a good reason for that. (actually, that doesn't change a thing, I was already onto him, he will die no matter what).

[Kingm]

It takes 8 to end the day by means of vote. If day ends earlier due to mod discretion (announced ~a week in advance), then the most voted option happens.

Regarding that, will you soon announce something or are we about to have a D1 that last for a month?
Because to me it feels like this has already been going for weeks, but I see it "only" has been 8 days so far, so I'm clearly delusional.

[Votanic]

It takes 8 to end the day by means of vote. If day ends earlier due to mod discretion (announced ~a week in advance), then the most voted option happens.

Regarding that, will you soon announce something or are we about to have a D1 that last for a month?
Because to me it feels like this has already been going for weeks, but I see it "only" has been 8 days so far, so I'm clearly delusional.

A week in advance? This may become the longest Day 1 ever...

But let's not kid ourselves.
With the votes spread out all over like nutella on toast, the lynch might well be the work of a single sly player (not necessarily scum ...but probably scum)
Yes indeed, it could take only one, crafty player swooping in at the last minute to add his tie-breaking vote to the lynch of his choice...
I've bid on ebay auctions, I know how that works.

[pmchugh]

It takes 8 to end the day by means of vote. If day ends earlier due to mod discretion (announced ~a week in advance), then the most voted option happens.

Regarding that, will you soon announce something or are we about to have a D1 that last for a month?
Because to me it feels like this has already been going for weeks, but I see it "only" has been 8 days so far, so I'm clearly delusional.

A week in advance? This may become the longest Day 1 ever...

But let's not kid ourselves.
With the votes spread out all over like nutella on toast, the lynch might well be the work of a single sly player (not necessarily scum ...but probably scum)
Yes indeed, it could take only one, crafty player swooping in at the last minute to add his tie-breaking vote to the lynch of his choice...
I've bid on ebay auctions, I know how that works.

This stuff is good though, we want it to be on a knife edge where you have people making decisions that really matter, because then you learn much more about them than if they are under no pressure.

[Kingm]

It takes 8 to end the day by means of vote. If day ends earlier due to mod discretion (announced ~a week in advance), then the most voted option happens.

Regarding that, will you soon announce something or are we about to have a D1 that last for a month?
Because to me it feels like this has already been going for weeks, but I see it "only" has been 8 days so far, so I'm clearly delusional.

A week in advance? This may become the longest Day 1 ever...

But let's not kid ourselves.
With the votes spread out all over like nutella on toast, the lynch might well be the work of a single sly player (not necessarily scum ...but probably scum)
Yes indeed, it could take only one, crafty player swooping in at the last minute to add his tie-breaking vote to the lynch of his choice...
I've bid on ebay auctions, I know how that works.

This stuff is good though, we want it to be on a knife edge where you have people making decisions that really matter, because then you learn much more about them than if they are under no pressure.

Yeah PMC, this is exactly the same thoughts I had, thats why I want the "clock" to start, so the scums start to feel the pressure, and tries their best to get us to lynch a townie, so they get numbers to 10v3 for D2.
The time now before the clock starts feels a bit wasted to atleast me, don't think we will get much more feel for who is town and who is scum before we either gets some info from N1 or people is forced to vote etc. from starting the clock. Atleast thats my 2 cents

[Loose Canon]

I'm taking the double count of my votes thing as perhaps a sign from above that I shouldn't give up on arguing my core argument D1 just yet.

My assessment that the pros of traceability outweigh the cons is a gut feel estimation rather than anything I could attempt to prove mathematically.
It is a plan though and as has been pointed out by others I don't see any other plans out there.

I have been looking at the matrix again and leaving the "plan" aside there are some things I deduce from it.

a. There are 10 possible permutations of roles.
b. Mafia roleblocker is in all of the 10 permutations
c. Mafia goon is in 4 of the permutations
d. Mafia odd night role cop is in 2 of the permutations
e. Mafia 2 shot watcher and mafia 2 shot tracker are each in 2 of the permutations

From this I deduce that Mafia don't yet know exactly WHICH of the 10 permutations of roles we are playing.

I also think they we must presume Mafia will be able to calculate which permutation of roles we are playing before Town does
I think I'm right in saying that as soon as a TownPR is eliminated Mafia will be able to calculate exactly which permutation of roles are in play.
Town will be at least one step behind in calculating exactly which permutation of roles are in play.
It might need elimination of 2 TownPRs or maybe 3PRs for Town to calculate which permutations of roles are in play.

DO players agree with the above deductions?

(I don't think they probably sway the arguments for or against traceability one way or another by the way)

[Loose Canon]

I don't want the clock to start - there is a possibility that I may have outlined a plan which benefits town and that this plan can still win players over to it.

[Extreme Ways]

Regarding dayphase end, it ends on Sunday the 19th 5pm CCT. Any posts after this will not be considered.
Check what this means in your local timezone: https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/g ... nt=cursive

Imo we have had a productive dayphase with movement and activity still ongoing, so I dont mind the long day 1 much.

[strike wolf]

It takes 8 to end the day by means of vote. If day ends earlier due to mod discretion (announced ~a week in advance), then the most voted option happens.

Regarding that, will you soon announce something or are we about to have a D1 that last for a month?
Because to me it feels like this has already been going for weeks, but I see it "only" has been 8 days so far, so I'm clearly delusional.

A week in advance? This may become the longest Day 1 ever...

But let's not kid ourselves.
With the votes spread out all over like nutella on toast, the lynch might well be the work of a single sly player (not necessarily scum ...but probably scum)
Yes indeed, it could take only one, crafty player swooping in at the last minute to add his tie-breaking vote to the lynch of his choice...
I've bid on ebay auctions, I know how that works.

This stuff is good though, we want it to be on a knife edge where you have people making decisions that really matter, because then you learn much more about them than if they are under no pressure.

This.

It takes 8 to end the day by means of vote. If day ends earlier due to mod discretion (announced ~a week in advance), then the most voted option happens.

Regarding that, will you soon announce something or are we about to have a D1 that last for a month?
Because to me it feels like this has already been going for weeks, but I see it "only" has been 8 days so far, so I'm clearly delusional.

A week in advance? This may become the longest Day 1 ever...

But let's not kid ourselves.
With the votes spread out all over like nutella on toast, the lynch might well be the work of a single sly player (not necessarily scum ...but probably scum)
Yes indeed, it could take only one, crafty player swooping in at the last minute to add his tie-breaking vote to the lynch of his choice...
I've bid on ebay auctions, I know how that works.

This stuff is good though, we want it to be on a knife edge where you have people making decisions that really matter, because then you learn much more about them than if they are under no pressure.

Yeah PMC, this is exactly the same thoughts I had, thats why I want the "clock" to start, so the scums start to feel the pressure, and tries their best to get us to lynch a townie, so they get numbers to 10v3 for D2.
The time now before the clock starts feels a bit wasted to atleast me, don't think we will get much more feel for who is town and who is scum before we either gets some info from N1 or people is forced to vote etc. from starting the clock. Atleast thats my 2 cents

This is generally why I am against setting sights on no lynch early D1. IMO, D1 doesn't have to end in a lynch but if everyone assumes that it is going to, then there is no pressure on anyone and we learn little. Especially in a game like this where we're not likely to have much information come from N1 actions. I also feel we are kind of overdue to have a lynch result come out of D1. I think each of at least the last 5 games has resulted in No Lynch and that has definitely become the overwhelming trend recently in CC Mafia. So I really do think a lynch today to remind everyone that D1 lynches can happen would be a good thing. Ultimately, D1 cases have advantages because scum is more likely to slip up under pressure and even in the admittedly likely scenario of an early mislynch, it can be used to analyze behavior and voting patterns later on.

On that note, I'm sticking to my Dev vote. His latest post didn't sway me and I don't buy PMC's counter-argument about his VT slip being newbie town as more likely than newbie scum. A scum slipping in that they're a VT claim day 1 is indeed probably not something that's happened too often in the past but Scum trying to establish an early alibi for their later fake claim is definitely something that's happened quite often.

Also, just remembered I never got around to addressing Fusi's long post and I'm probably not going to go over the full thing right now but I do disagree with him on the idea of leaving helpful players alone D1. Most of those helpful players are also ones that I would say are more experienced players who would also be difficult to catch as scum. So when they say something odd, like PMC posting a vibe list before multiple players even posted, they should at least be questioned.

[Maxleod]

Regarding dayphase end, it ends on Sunday the 19th 5pm CCT. Any posts after this will not be considered.
Check what this means in your local timezone: https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/g ... nt=cursive

Imo we have had a productive dayphase with movement and activity still ongoing, so I dont mind the long day 1 much.

Too long. I'm already bored. I don't see anyone adding anything of value in the next week.

[pmchugh]

I'd rather go swang or DDS than dev, but would rather dev than no lynch. Is anyone happy to make a lynch pact? Where we agree to bandwagon people to avoid no lynches?

I will start;

Lynch Pact Signatories
1. PMC