Americans

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Fri Jun 15, 2007 3:55 pm

Iz Man wrote:
Anarchist wrote:The United States has that problem too, only the Black Market can garantee speedy delivery.
Not true at all. The waiting lists in the U.S. are not nearly as long as those in countries where the gov't controls health care.
Anarchist wrote: Universal healthcare allows you to choose any doctor, its the private form that forces you to choose which doctor to go to, through your insurance.
Half truths. Nationalized health care typically provides a narrow list of choices of physicians to chose from. When it comes to major surgeries, the list grows smaller and smaller, and even disappears in a lot of cases.
Insurance companies do also have lists from which to chose, but they are much larger lists and you also have the option to change insurance companies. This is an area in which I believe we need reform here in the U.S.
There needs to be an expansion on what services are provided by insurance companies.
I maintain again, I don't feel the gov't has any place in choosing the who's, when's, where's, & how's when it comes to health care.
As an "anarchist", I figured you'd feel the same.....

Oh, definately. I agree with everything you said about not trusting the government. I only feel that healthcare shouldnt be a proffit based business. Though it doesnt suprise me that government would find a way to screw anything up.(cant even water the lawn) I agree insurance companies should expand their policies. However having lived in the Netherlands, we never had a problem getting medical attention until we moved to America. Not to mention a few occasions where we were forced to go to the hospital. I'm not very fond of insurance companies, if I never need their services its practically government enforced theft.(do like the life insurance policy) Dont even get me started on what I think of Interest rates...

Stopper · Post by **Stopper** » Fri Jun 15, 2007 3:59 pm

Iz Man wrote:
Stopper wrote: Yes, hearts, kidneys, lungs, blood etc are all in short supply.

I'm curious to know how a private healthcare system is supposed to be able to have a better supply of these things than a public healthcare system...
Its not a question of supply. Obviously the main reason the U.S. does not have the shortage problems the U.K. does is sheer population. We also have a better donor system in the U.S. that allows quicker delivery.

It is not a question of supply?!?! The U.S. certainly has a younger population than the U.K. This probably does have a significant effect on the supply and demand for organs - nothing to do with public/private organisation (and not country size, either!)

Also, speed of delivery is not a problem that is greatly affected by whether you have private/public organisation, since for many organs, the length of time they can be kept is measured in the hours. Most organ waiting lists are there because you're waiting for people to die!

I only brought this up because it was meant to be a joke. I'd have thought it was blindingly obvious that there are a few much more important factors concerning transplants than whether you have a state system or not, so it was basically a very bad example on your part to pick in the first place!

And the subtext of my question was, how would a private healthcare system increase the supply of organs (which does matter!!!)? Offing people in the bloody street?!

Jeez!

Minister Masket · Post by **Minister Masket** » Fri Jun 15, 2007 5:40 pm

I'm still trying to figure out how an argument against Americans turned into a debate about the health department - of all things.
Couldn't we talk about a more pressing issue?
eg: The new Transformers movie, good idea or bad? Your views NOW!

got tonkaed · Post by **got tonkaed** » Fri Jun 15, 2007 5:41 pm

for what its worth...i write long posts and get jabbed at in one sentence, and then things tangent off away from anything i wrote....

way to invalidate my opinions you bums...

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 1:05 am

that happens quite alot! especially when they are using political correctness or including addition factors to the arguement.

Ofcoure nothing is absolute and always something else can be applied to any issue. The english language is incapable of expressing everything perfectly and we dont have editors to overlook what we wrote before publishing.

Jenos Ridan · Post by **Jenos Ridan** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:25 am

I perfer that neither the pirvate sector nor the state has sole authority over my affairs (in this case, healthcare). Instead, both should provide coverage at an adequete level for an acceptable rate.

Top three priorities I think most everyone could agree with

Defense
Education
Healthcare

I'm sure that if the budget could handle 15 nimitz carriers, a top-notch education system with high, strictly-met standards and an enviable healthcare system, then I figure that most everyone is going to love whatever country can met those goal. Well, save for the terrorists who hate how much we actually care for our citizens and can give foreign aid to theirs. Hmmm.....how far is that from the mark now?

Anarchist · Post by **Anarchist** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:43 am

Jenos Ridan wrote:I perfer that neither the pirvate sector nor the state has sole authority over my affairs (in this case, healthcare). Instead, both should provide coverage at an adequete level for an acceptable rate.

Granted I would rather get rid of both... but I agree.

Top three priorities I think most everyone could agree with

Defense
Education
Healthcare

I prefer the militia approach, making defense a minor priority.

I'm sure that if the budget could handle 15 nimitz carriers, a top-notch education system with high, strictly-met standards and an enviable healthcare system, then I figure that most everyone is going to love whatever country can met those goal. Well, save for the terrorists who hate how much we actually care for our citizens and can give foreign aid to theirs. Hmmm.....how far is that from the mark now?

Are you implying that our "caring" made us enemies?

Were farther away, ofcourse defense and education were hardly on the agenda.Healthcare for the elite.

Jenos Ridan · Post by **Jenos Ridan** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:28 am

Anarchist wrote:
Jenos Ridan wrote:I perfer that neither the pirvate sector nor the state has sole authority over my affairs (in this case, healthcare). Instead, both should provide coverage at an adequete level for an acceptable rate.
Granted I would rather get rid of both... but I agree.
Top three priorities I think most everyone could agree with

Defense
Education
Healthcare
I prefer the militia approach, making defense a minor priority.
I'm sure that if the budget could handle 15 nimitz carriers, a top-notch education system with high, strictly-met standards and an enviable healthcare system, then I figure that most everyone is going to love whatever country can met those goal. Well, save for the terrorists who hate how much we actually care for our citizens and can give foreign aid to theirs. Hmmm.....how far is that from the mark now?
Are you implying that our "caring" made us enemies?

Were farther away, ofcourse defense and education were hardly on the agenda.Healthcare for the elite.

The fact we even do anything to help is enough for the aytollas of the world to despise us. That, and really bone moves on the part of presidents past AND present (this ain't all Bush Jr.'s goin', maybe a third his).

As for the rest, again, no country is perfect.

Jolly Roger · Post by **Jolly Roger** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 6:36 am

got tonkaed wrote:for what its worth...i write long posts and get jabbed at in one sentence, and then things tangent off away from anything i wrote....

way to invalidate my opinions you bums... :cry:

That never happens.

So, who likes cinnamon?

Skittles! · Post by **Skittles!** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 6:42 am

Jolly Roger wrote:
got tonkaed wrote:for what its worth...i write long posts and get jabbed at in one sentence, and then things tangent off away from anything i wrote....

way to invalidate my opinions you bums...
That never happens.

So, who likes cinnamon?

Hm, Cinnamon toast makes me sick, and I almost vomit everytime I eat/smell it.
I also don't like Cinnamon on banana custard..

Minister Masket · Post by **Minister Masket** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 7:14 am

Blegh...cinnamon is vile!

Hate the stuff.

vtmarik · Post by **vtmarik** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 9:24 am

Jolly Roger wrote:
got tonkaed wrote:for what its worth...i write long posts and get jabbed at in one sentence, and then things tangent off away from anything i wrote....

way to invalidate my opinions you bums...
That never happens.

So, who likes cinnamon?

I make the best Cinnamon Pie in the world.

Skittles! · Post by **Skittles!** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 9:24 am

vtmarik wrote:
Jolly Roger wrote:
got tonkaed wrote:for what its worth...i write long posts and get jabbed at in one sentence, and then things tangent off away from anything i wrote....

way to invalidate my opinions you bums...
That never happens.

So, who likes cinnamon?
I make the best Cinnamon Pie in the world.

I must taste this 'Cinnamon Pie' you speak of.

ritz627 · Post by **ritz627** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 9:43 am

Skittles! wrote:
vtmarik wrote:
Jolly Roger wrote:
got tonkaed wrote:for what its worth...i write long posts and get jabbed at in one sentence, and then things tangent off away from anything i wrote....

way to invalidate my opinions you bums...
That never happens.

So, who likes cinnamon?
I make the best Cinnamon Pie in the world.
I must taste this 'Cinnamon Pie' you speak of.

Agreed. By the way, cinnamon toast rocks, Skittles. Anyway, how about those Americans...with thier apple pie and such...

Jenos Ridan · Post by **Jenos Ridan** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:51 pm

Apple Pie is a largely american thing I gather? As in we are the only people in the world who can eat it without gagging? Well, sure sucks to be you guys, now doesn't it?

DirtyDishSoap · Post by **DirtyDishSoap** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:58 pm

wow

i just noticed this was moved to funny farm

steve-O · Post by **steve-O** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 8:02 pm

i love apple pie. i think im going to go eat some right now

edocsil · Post by **edocsil** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 10:45 pm

speaking of pies apples and cinnimon i just had a slice of apple pie after dinner. less then 2 weeks till the for of July (for non americans thats our independance day

usa forever

Skittles! · Post by **Skittles!** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 10:48 pm

Jenos Ridan wrote:Apple Pie is a largely american thing I gather? As in we are the only people in the world who can eat it without gagging? Well, sure sucks to be you guys, now doesn't it?

I love Apple Pie, and no, American's aren't the only ones to have Apple Pie. It is so delicious. Oh, and so is Baked Cheesecake. Hmm.. Apple Pie.

Skittles! · Post by **Skittles!** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 10:49 pm

ritz627 wrote:
Skittles! wrote:
vtmarik wrote:
Jolly Roger wrote:
got tonkaed wrote:for what its worth...i write long posts and get jabbed at in one sentence, and then things tangent off away from anything i wrote....

way to invalidate my opinions you bums...
That never happens.

So, who likes cinnamon?
I make the best Cinnamon Pie in the world.
I must taste this 'Cinnamon Pie' you speak of.
Agreed. By the way, cinnamon toast rocks, Skittles. Anyway, how about those Americans...with thier apple pie and such...

Gah, I hate it. Always makes me sick. The other day I thought my friend was having it, and he was coming towards me, and I almost gagged.

ritz627 · Post by **ritz627** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 10:50 pm

Apple pie is by far the best pie ever. No question.

Skittles! · Post by **Skittles!** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 10:51 pm

ritz627 wrote:Apple pie is by far the best pie ever. No question.

What about Blueberry?

ksslemp · Post by **ksslemp** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:26 pm

I vote for Boston Cream Pie, Damn that stuffs good.

Wish i had a piece right now. yum yum

ritz627 · Post by **ritz627** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:39 pm

Skittles! wrote:
ritz627 wrote:Apple pie is by far the best pie ever. No question.
What about Blueberry?

Nope. Apple. The only one that comes close for me is strawberry-rhubarb.

Skittles! · Post by **Skittles!** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:40 pm

ritz627 wrote:
Skittles! wrote:
ritz627 wrote:Apple pie is by far the best pie ever. No question.
What about Blueberry?
Nope. Apple. The only one that comes close for me is strawberry-rhubarb.

Eh, never had strawberry-rhubarb, but I've had apple&rhubarb.
Apple Crumble, anyone?