alfredhcy [ka]

by **-outcast-** on Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:46 am

Accused:

alfredhcy

The accused are suspected of:

Conducting Secret Diplomacy

Game number(s):

Game 16009134

Comments:2015-12-08 15:27:33 - Liam Connor: Alfred has sent me a message about our truce, assuring me that although he is taking my card spot away he is still wanting to truce
2015-12-08 15:29:41 - Liam Connor: I have thanked him for his explination and told him that all discussion of the game needs to be in the game chat
2015-12-08 15:29:57 - Liam Connor: As things currently stand, Alfred and I still have a truce

alfredhcy is trying to conduct secret diplomacy in messages to only one player pf another team about a truce. He is not posting in the game chat. Liam Connor is following the rules by telling other teams what alfredhcy is sending him in messages.

by **Liam Connor** on Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:34 am

Not sure that this is worth a report at the moment, I don't think that he is attempting to carry out secret diplomacy as from the game chat you can see that we have had a truce for a few rounds before he sent me the message. I think he was trying to clarify the situation of our truce and didn't realise that he shouldn't do it away from the game

This is what he sent me

Hi Liam,

Not sure if we are in an alliance or truce, but it seems like you're losing the fight against red and about to crumble.

I have moved up my troops to apply pressure on red so he has to think twice if he wants to conquer you cause that will leave Berlin exposed.

You have my word, I won't attack you unless I see red is about to eliminate you and take your cards and bonus. Then I will come in to thwart that. For now I will apply pressure on Berlin to buy you time to rebuild.

Cheers,
Alfred

My reply

Hi Alfred, I appreciate the gesture, my focus was going to be on red and staying in the game for a bit longer and as I said in the game chat for now a truce works for me, I have no expectation of winning any more.

Make sure you make a statement about this in game chat - something like - Liam you are safe from me while I fight with red. All talk of alliances and truces needs to be open and in the chat or you are breaking a rule about secret diplomacy, the only person you can have a private discussion with about strategy is your team mate

Liam

Having spoken with Alfred outside of the game chat I wanted to make sure that what was said was open for everyone else.

by **clangfield** on Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:37 am

Liam Connor wrote:Not sure that this is worth a report at the moment, I don't think that he is attempting to carry out secret diplomacy as from the game chat you can see that we have had a truce for a few rounds before he sent me the message. I think he was trying to clarify the situation of our truce and didn't realise that he shouldn't do it away from the game

This is what he sent me

Hi Liam,

Not sure if we are in an alliance or truce, but it seems like you're losing the fight against red and about to crumble.

I have moved up my troops to apply pressure on red so he has to think twice if he wants to conquer you cause that will leave Berlin exposed.

You have my word, I won't attack you unless I see red is about to eliminate you and take your cards and bonus. Then I will come in to thwart that. For now I will apply pressure on Berlin to buy you time to rebuild.

Cheers,
Alfred

My reply

Hi Alfred, I appreciate the gesture, my focus was going to be on red and staying in the game for a bit longer and as I said in the game chat for now a truce works for me, I have no expectation of winning any more.

Make sure you make a statement about this in game chat - something like - Liam you are safe from me while I fight with red. All talk of alliances and truces needs to be open and in the chat or you are breaking a rule about secret diplomacy, the only person you can have a private discussion with about strategy is your team mate

Liam

Having spoken with Alfred outside of the game chat I wanted to make sure that what was said was open for everyone else.

It's worth a report, but will most likely end up with a warning not to do it again.

by **iAmCaffeine** on Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:39 am

There should be no game discussion from opposing players in a game, regarding that game, outside of the game. End of.

by **MagnusGreeol** on Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:02 am

iAmCaffeine wrote:There should be no game discussion from opposing players in a game, regarding that game, outside of the game. End of.

- I think this is how the rule should be worded ,Maybe add a bold PERIOD at the end. ")

\MGM/♎

by **owenshooter** on Wed Dec 09, 2015 1:50 pm

Liam Connor wrote:Not sure that this is worth a report at the moment, I don't think that he is attempting to carry out secret diplomacy as from the game chat you can see that we have had a truce for a few rounds before he sent me the message.

sorry, but this is the TEXT BOOK example of secret diplomacy. you many not discuss the game/truces/alliances outside of the game chat. that is called SECRET DIPLOMACY. i never realized the rule could be open to interpretation... wow... the black jesus is stunned..-Jésus noir

by **king achilles** on Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:04 pm

If you still have this pm, go to your inbox again and open that message. While viewing the message, please click on the little ! near the Quote button and it will give us an official copy of this pm.

by **Liam Connor** on Thu Dec 10, 2015 4:08 am

owenshooter wrote:
Liam Connor wrote:Not sure that this is worth a report at the moment, I don't think that he is attempting to carry out secret diplomacy as from the game chat you can see that we have had a truce for a few rounds before he sent me the message.

sorry, but this is the TEXT BOOK example of secret diplomacy. you many not discuss the game/truces/alliances outside of the game chat. that is called SECRET DIPLOMACY. i never realized the rule could be open to interpretation... wow... the black jesus is stunned..-Jésus noir

What I mean is that I don't think he is intentionally trying to cheat, I think he was unaware that it is against the rules to contact me in this way. I hope that my response to him and making it clear in the game chat that he contacted me should alert him to the fact that it is against the rules and hopefully that will be enough for him not to do it again.

I had a similar situation a few weeks back where someone sent me a pm to talk about a truce, I told him to ask in game chat as it was against the rules and he apologised, said he didn't realise and we then talked truce in the game chat.

Maybe I am too willing to see the best in people but I don't think he is intentionally trying to cheat.

by **MagnusGreeol** on Thu Dec 10, 2015 5:09 am

- I can understand giving benefit of doubt, And We would still like to, the only thing I can see that disrupts thàt, is he joined in 2009, and has almost 90 wars under his belt. Though 90 wars is a low count since 2009, It weighs in favor of the expected knowledge of SD. But one can never assume or expect, just throwing it out there.

\MGM/♎

by **alfredhcy** on Thu Dec 10, 2015 11:11 am

Hi guys,

Liam has been very kind to provide evidence to the community so hopefully everyone can now see things from both angles. After reading everyone's message I understand that I've broken the rule about secret diplomacy which I wasn't aware of so I'll have to apologise for that.

I'd like everyone to have a look at the content of the message I sent to Liam, it was more of a clarification of my truce to Liam and assure him that I wasn't intent on breaking the truce rather than plotting anything secretly that would change the tide of the game. Looking back, I should have just written in public chat but I did not do that cause I was tired of hearing more of outcast's constant bickering on public chat.

Outcast has been very aggressive towards me and played with cheap tactics via making lop-sided truce/alliance proposals to enemy players, just so that he could ensure his victory because I'm second strongest in the game and am a serious challenge him. He would manipulate players by deflecting attention on his own alarming number of troops being stacked up, territories held, cards held, bonuses held, etc to my situation, and create a false sense of crisis to make players all gang up against me, so that meanwhile he could stack up troops to prepare for an assault when all enemy players are weaker. It's cheap, and I've been vocal and called him out on his act cause it was plainly insulting people's intelligence - obviously he's not happy about it and has taken it very personally. His own teammate has already calmed him down several times in open chat, telling everyone to just play the game. Outcast if you are reading this, please heed to your own teammate's advice and just play the game.

That's all I have to say, I've now put this story into context. I have inadvertently broken a rule of secret diplomacy and will not dispute that but it please understand that it was not intentional as you can see by the content of the message (there was no secret plotting, just a reassurance and clarification). Outcast has used this opportunity to create unnecessary drama because he has taken the game way too personally. I will read the game rules again to familarise myself with all the aspects - I'm just a casual and occasional player, as seen by my 90 games over the past 6 years.

Cheers,
Alfred

by **WingCmdr Ginkapo** on Thu Dec 10, 2015 11:23 am

Alfred dont worry, the first level of modration is a warning for precisely this reason. You now know there is a rule to follow and we all know it wong happen again now. Process has served its purpose.