Closed roprotem - Racism/Baiting

[eddie2]

I'm not sure with whom I'm agreeing or disagreeing here... but the video, just as a video, on its own, is not racist in my view. It involves black people but that doesn't make it racist, any more than a video of an Olympic 100 metres since about 1936 or a ladies tennis final of the last 15 years. It's not saying anything specific to, or derogatory about, black people or black culture, unless you believe that only a black person would behave that way, which I do not think would be the case.

Using it in this way, and the comments added though, do make the motivation racial, so I believe it would be incorrect just to consider the video on its own.

The comment being "is that owen at 01:27 ?" I still don't see anything racist.

This is what i am saying to the letter. If he said is owen that black white portugese indian guy then it could be classed towards racist because of past events. But he did not say that. They are going on his previous behaviour which got him warned. So this post was a bait that im afraid to say owen and co fell for. And in the procesess they are slagging one of my long term cc friends.

Edit.
Raz is one of the most stand up players i have meet onsite. I brought him into the clan world, live chat etc. And honestly he will do anything for anyone to his limits. Which he has done. Owen you took this case out of his hands and into admins hands. They were going to stay with 24 hour temp ban (because the post in ? Was not racist. But raz got this increased to 72 hour. He done this for you and all you can do is slag him off. Again grow up.

[owenshooter]

I'm not sure with whom I'm agreeing or disagreeing here... but the video, just as a video, on its own, is not racist in my view. It involves black people but that doesn't make it racist, any more than a video of an Olympic 100 metres since about 1936 or a ladies tennis final of the last 15 years. It's not saying anything specific to, or derogatory about, black people or black culture, unless you believe that only a black person would behave that way, which I do not think would be the case.

Using it in this way, and the comments added though, do make the motivation racial, so I believe it would be incorrect just to consider the video on its own.

The comment being "is that owen at 01:27 ?" I still don't see anything racist.

This is what i am saying to the letter. If he said is owen that black white portugese indian guy then it could be classed towards racist because of past events. But he did not say that. They are going on his previous behaviour which got him warned. So this post was a bait that im afraid to say owen and co fell for. And in the procesess they are slagging one of my long term cc friends.

no, your long term cc friend does not understand the nuances of racism and neither do you. the post is racist, period. you obviously have not read why it is racist. defend your friend to the end, does not change that he made himself look like a buffoon with his idiotic post concerning racism and how news casts can't be racist. right over his head. so, the rule now is, be clever about your racist comments and the chat mods aren't very bright concerning racism, so you will get away with it... keep slagging me, your friend made himself look very questionable as someone in charge of making rulings on racism.

since you also seem to be a bit dense on why this is racist, i'll repost the great example from page one, that you obviously never read:

the issue with this nvideo post is not the content in isolation only, but the context; context of a guy warned for racially derogatory posts makes another post of people of that race behaving badly and then asks if the person entering the footage at a certain time in the video is a person he's been warned to stop taunting

it is not the video, it is the context and his past racist antics/actions. had he never called a member a porch monkey or a coon or a mick, i'd probably say, "hey, he is just being funny." but he did all of those and MORE... keep defending him, it does not make what he did or what the mods ruling was, any less racist or out of touch with what exactly racism/bigotry is... thank you for your input, as misguided as it is...-Jésus noir

[eddie2]

I'm not sure with whom I'm agreeing or disagreeing here... but the video, just as a video, on its own, is not racist in my view. It involves black people but that doesn't make it racist, any more than a video of an Olympic 100 metres since about 1936 or a ladies tennis final of the last 15 years. It's not saying anything specific to, or derogatory about, black people or black culture, unless you believe that only a black person would behave that way, which I do not think would be the case.

Using it in this way, and the comments added though, do make the motivation racial, so I believe it would be incorrect just to consider the video on its own.

The comment being "is that owen at 01:27 ?" I still don't see anything racist.

This is what i am saying to the letter. If he said is owen that black white portugese indian guy then it could be classed towards racist because of past events. But he did not say that. They are going on his previous behaviour which got him warned. So this post was a bait that im afraid to say owen and co fell for. And in the procesess they are slagging one of my long term cc friends.

no, your long term cc friend does not understand the nuances of racism and neither do you. the post is racist, period. you obviously have not read why it is racist. defend your friend to the end, does not change that he made himself look like a buffoon with his idiotic post concerning racism and how news casts can't be racist. right over his head. so, the rule now is, be clever about your racist comments and the chat mods aren't very bright concerning racism, so you will get away with it... keep slagging me, your friend made himself look very questionable as someone in charge of making rulings on racism.

since you also seem to be a bit dense on why this is racist, i'll repost the great example from page one, that you obviously never read:

the issue with this nvideo post is not the content in isolation only, but the context; context of a guy warned for racially derogatory posts makes another post of people of that race behaving badly and then asks if the person entering the footage at a certain time in the video is a person he's been warned to stop taunting

it is not the video, it is the context and his past racist antics/actions. had he never called a member a porch monkey or a coon or a mick, i'd probably say, "hey, he is just being funny." but he did all of those and MORE... keep defending him, it does not make what he did or what the mods ruling was, any less racist or out of touch with what exactly racism/bigotry is... thank you for your input, as misguided as it is...-Jésus noir

You just said it all owen. Its people who go on past actions that make real racists go free. If the video was white people then alls ok and would not of been racist. But because it was it is. Plz think of what you are saying. This is exactly what i was saying, the racist card when not racist.

[iAmCaffeine]

The fact there is a history of racist comments from roprotem towards Owen adds further connotation to this specific occurrence. That's what you're not taking into account.

[owenshooter]

The fact there is a history of racist comments from roprotem towards Owen adds further connotation to this specific occurrence. That's what you're not taking into account.

exactly. but he does not seem to be able to understand this. why? kid is obtuse due to his fanboy love for a mod that made one of the most ignorant statements concerning racism, EVER , on this site... that is saying a lot.. that beats out a lot of the past buffoonish statements by people like Optimus Prime (love ya!!), star scream (what was his name? some robot name), good ol' Andy (love you andy), etc... the fact that they can not understand how this is racist is just so sad, it makes me feel for them and their ignorance concerning racism. i hope ropro posts a science video of chimps and makes a comment about me, so we can hear how that national geographic videos can not be racist.

eddie, you are just looking very ignorant by defending an ignorant statement made by your friend. you should learn that when someone says something that insanely stupid, you can defend the person, but not the statement. "hey, he is a good guy, i'm sure he just misunderstood," goes a lot further than, "he is my friend, he is right, there is no way this racist baiting antic by a member with multiple racist comments on his belt, is factual." you can also go and get bent, at least the mods have the good sense to avoid this thread and avoid the adult conversation that is going on here... go back to the kid's table and lick your friends wounds...-Jésus noir

[eddie2]

Lol owen.

1st) i understand the past history.
2nd) after warning he posts a video.
3rd) you scream racist.
4th) you are the kind of person who actually make non racists, had enough of all this crap.
5th) the video had no rasism in it. (And like i have previously said was a bait. So unfortunate you lot fell for it.)
6th) I DO NOT HAVE TO DEFEND RAZ. YOU WENT TO ADMIN ABOUT IT TAKING THE CASE AWAY FROM HIM. AND AS ADMITED ABOVE COULD NOT BE BOTHERED TO READ THE RESPONSE FROM THEM.

sorry you want to cause a fight, arguement ok lets do it. You go about for years calling yourself the black jesus (knowone knows. I don't believe was one) everytime you post you add videos slagging off op's. Come on lets have it. Do your best. But if this site defends racists that much like you say. Then why the hell do you always come back. I seen what i done wrong and changed. YOU OWEN ARE A BULLY AND DONT SEEM TO CARE ABOUT WHAT YOU SAY. RAZORVICH IS A VERY GOOD PERSON. AND YOU THINK YOU CAN SIT ON YOUR FAT ARSE EATING JUNK SLAGGING EVERYONE OFF BECAUSE YOUR LIFE IS THAT SAD, its okay. Bullshit grow up.

[Serbia]

Well then.

Bollocks in 2015.

[owenshooter]

YOU OWEN ARE A BULLY AND DONT SEEM TO CARE ABOUT WHAT YOU SAY. RAZORVICH IS A VERY GOOD PERSON. AND YOU THINK YOU CAN SIT ON YOUR FAT ARSE EATING JUNK SLAGGING EVERYONE OFF BECAUSE YOUR LIFE IS THAT SAD

aaaand, this is the sort of thing that would get me put on a time out... just saying... now i'm a bully because of another persons inability to understand racism ("newscasts cannot be racist")? interesting... and, see what you did there? you proved another one of my points. you can say or do whatever you want to me in global chat or the forums and nothing will happen to you. i know you are up the punishment scale, i know a good solid violation for something like FLAMING IN THE FORUM would get you a vacation. will it happen? nah, i'm involved... has to be my fault... your friend made a horrible statement and you are being equally as horrible...-Jésus noir

p.s.-it was racist, it is still racist... and until you have dealt with racism in your life, i doubt you'll ever truly understand. stay in your bubble, it suits you well.

[eddie2]

YOU OWEN ARE A BULLY AND DONT SEEM TO CARE ABOUT WHAT YOU SAY. RAZORVICH IS A VERY GOOD PERSON. AND YOU THINK YOU CAN SIT ON YOUR FAT ARSE EATING JUNK SLAGGING EVERYONE OFF BECAUSE YOUR LIFE IS THAT SAD

aaaand, this is the sort of thing that would get me put on a time out... just saying... now i'm a bully because of another persons inability to understand racism ("newscasts cannot be racist")? interesting... and, see what you did there? you proved another one of my points. you can say or do whatever you want to me in global chat or the forums and nothing will happen to you. i know you are up the punishment scale, i know a good solid violation for something like FLAMING IN THE FORUM would get you a vacation. will it happen? nah, i'm involved... has to be my fault... your friend made a horrible statement and you are being equally as horrible...-Jésus noir

p.s.-it was racist, it is still racist... and until you have dealt with racism in your life, i doubt you'll ever truly understand. stay in your bubble, it suits you well.

Omg a video with a white person towards me thats racist.

[eddie2]

exactly. but he does not seem to be able to understand this. why? kid is obtuse due to his fanboy love

Lol so now im gay really you respond in a bigatory way calling me white living in a buble then call me a fanboy, this is exactly what i mean you post racism but use bigotry to defend it, and racism im white so must live in a bubble.

[MagnusGreeol]

YOU OWEN ARE A BULLY AND DONT SEEM TO CARE ABOUT WHAT YOU SAY. RAZORVICH IS A VERY GOOD PERSON. AND YOU THINK YOU CAN SIT ON YOUR FAT ARSE EATING JUNK SLAGGING EVERYONE OFF BECAUSE YOUR LIFE IS THAT SAD

aaaand, this is the sort of thing that would get me put on a time out... just saying... now i'm a bully because of another persons inability to understand racism ("newscasts cannot be racist")? interesting... and, see what you did there? you proved another one of my points. you can say or do whatever you want to me in global chat or the forums and nothing will happen to you. i know you are up the punishment scale, i know a good solid violation for something like FLAMING IN THE FORUM would get you a vacation. will it happen? nah, i'm involved... has to be my fault... your friend made a horrible statement and you are being equally as horrible...-Jésus noir

p.s.-it was racist, it is still racist... and until you have dealt with racism in your life, i doubt you'll ever truly understand. stay in your bubble, it suits you well.

Omg a video with a white person towards me thats racist.

- I believe Raz is a good person, I also believe if he cared enough he could show up and speak for himself, You Eddie have taken up on a Clansmen crusade in which you decide to make what the majority feels is wrong seem right. Lay back and don't fan the fire. Owen has the right to be upset, and he has more who support him in this then don't, Your a good guy too, but your constant rooting for injustice I believe could be downgrading your status Bro, so lay low.

\MGM/ Italiano Stalliano spoken in tone of noir with canoli on the side.

[MagnusGreeol]

exactly. but he does not seem to be able to understand this. why? kid is obtuse due to his fanboy love

Lol so now im gay really you respond in a bigatory way calling me white living in a buble then call me a fanboy, this is exactly what i mean you post racism but use bigotry to defend it, and racism im white so must live in a bubble.

- Actually, I believe the white boy part has nothing to do with the bubble thing, Owen looked for a picture of Samuel L. Jackson in a bubble but couldn't find one, the bubble part I believe constitutes you not in touch with the outside issues. Fanboy love is more in text I think with a groupie type attitude with your clansman Raz. My opinion on Owens post,but he could correct me?

\MGM/ ♎

[eddie2]

No magnus owen knows how bans work forum (he has had 6 month ban) used live chat to communicate. So now saying its wrong they are not joined is a contradiction. Also i have said his previous posts are racism. But the one he is argueing about was not. This has nothing to do with clansman, raz was a reg speeder (feudal at 10 am uk time) for 1 year before we jjoined a clan. I understand owen is upset, but to personally atttack razs personality is wrong. Raz could of argued owens poont but owen pmed admin slagging raz off. This was his downfall and him playing the racist card.

[MagnusGreeol]

- Ropes should have zero communication with Owen, if both are on GC together thèy should both continue chatting like neither are there and not acknowledge each other, Owen was there talking about whatever, and Ropes made a choice to communicate and direct a video assault on Owen while he was minding his own business,,,,just tell me if that was right or wrong??

-MG

[eddie2]

- Ropes should have zero communication with Owen, if both are on GC together thèy should both continue chatting like neither are there and not acknowledge each other, Owen was there talking about whatever, and Ropes made a choice to communicate and direct a video assault on Owen while he was minding his own business,,,,just tell me if that was right or wrong??

-MG

Wrong totally agree. Dont agree was racist, was a bait though. I know the past and can agree was not good. But i hate racist card being used when not racist.

[Donelladan]

- Ropes should have zero communication with Owen, if both are on GC together thèy should both continue chatting like neither are there and not acknowledge each other, Owen was there talking about whatever, and Ropes made a choice to communicate and direct a video assault on Owen while he was minding his own business,,,,just tell me if that was right or wrong??

-MG

Wrong totally agree. Dont agree was racist, was a bait though. I know the past and can agree was not good. But i hate racist card being used when not racist.

+1 - what you described Magnus was wrong but not racist, and this is exactly what happened.

Owen has the right to be upset, and he has more who support him in this then don't

That is irrelevant.

now i'm a bully because of another persons inability to understand racism

Would you, and all thinking the same than you, just take a minute and consider, what if we are not right ?
I see you all coming here and saying "it's so obvious, it's racist, you are stupid" - sorry but that's not an argument.
As many I can't stand racism, and in case you would like to give me the bubble argument, I am not white, my color skin is close to the arab one which isn't a very good one in France or Germany.

I am ready to believe, he may have meant to be racist to you, and that's how you felt it, but still none of the action presented in your first post are meant to be racist.
Nowhere he make a mention of skin color. He showed a video of people fighting and mentionned you. What if it has been a video of a dog fight let's say, and he say is that you ? That can be considered gross, rude, bait, flame, not racist.

But anyway, case is closed, as eddie said, admin ruled it whatever what we think that's done we should do smthg else.
But as eddie I really dislike the way you people are adressing Raz.
Saying he is totally unable to understand racism is not very smart. He said the video in itself wasn't racist and he is right about it. Stop coming back to it.

[MagnusGreeol]

- I respect you Don, but it seems a point is being overlooked, the video itself would not be considered racist "IF" there has never been any previous racist remarks towards Owen from Ropes, BUT, since there has been past history of racist remarks makes the interruption of Owen minding his own business and from out of nowhere a video of black girls fighting and stamping a time on video saying " that's Owen", makes Ropes intensions all the more seem racist with a heeping of flame hooked with bait. I never called Raz stupid, And believe he is a great guy, it just seems a point has been overlooked and the video is being seen by some wearing blinders, periferial vision is being narrowed.

\MGM/

[WingCmdr Ginkapo]

It would be Roprotem's intentions that would make it racist. No-one other than Roprotem could know what his intentions were.

There is little point arguing it as there is no way of proving it either way. Both sides of this argument need to understand this. The mod team cannot rule it to be an infringement when there is no conclusive proof that it is. This is the methodology with which they manage all infringements, its the same as not banning people for deadbeating when they havent necessarily done it intentionally.

Past history is suggestive, but it is not conclusive.

[MagnusGreeol]

- So for instance, a man in court faces the charges of spoucil abuse, he says he did not hit her, but the judge see's his past record stating he's hit her before on a few occasions, will the judge take into consideration that he's done it a few times before? Or say he didn't mean to hit her this time?

-MG

[WingCmdr Ginkapo]

- So for instance, a man in court faces the charges of spoucil abuse, he says he did not hit her, but the judge see's his past record stating he's hit her before on a few occasions, will the judge take into consideration that he's done it a few times before? Or say he didn't mean to hit her this time?

-MG

This is not a court of law. This moderation system is managed differently. If you disagree with that contribute to the new rules as Roz has said.

But no, no judge will find him guilty on the basis of her statement alone. There will need to be evidence such as bruising, and also lack of alibi.

[MagnusGreeol]

- There is no bruising with open hand slaps to the head or pushing hard, If a judge saw past history of abuse the guy is in deep shit, and it would be his fault regardless if its true or not because his decisions he made to do it in the past.All are accountable for their actions, and when you build a rap sheet it stays with you like an evil shadow you can't get rid of, and that shadow is what you cast to be viewed by others as your past history. We can't see it as trying to be clever to hide it when it's obviously there, then it becomes a defiant argument.

\MGM/

[eddie2]

- So for instance, a man in court faces the charges of spoucil abuse, he says he did not hit her, but the judge see's his past record stating he's hit her before on a few occasions, will the judge take into consideration that he's done it a few times before? Or say he didn't mean to hit her this time?

-MG

Do you know how stupid this sounds.
1)previous offenses are not used to find someone guilty. They are used to sentence them after found guilty.
2) there was no racism and if there was then owen has been guilty of it many a time. Even this thread owen posted a white guy in a bubble towards me. That is a racist comment in yours and owens own context.

Let me explain how i see owens video.
Now white people sit in a bubble protected for being racist and protected from racism. Sorry but look at the uk . i will give examples now and you say racist or not.

1)friend worked in cash safe for big security firm (had worked 32 years for them.) paid off due to not being able to speak polish/portugese. In case a emergency happened in safe and his co workers went back to home language.(they got positions in safe complaining that employer was being racist not letting them work in the safe.)
2)walking down uk highstreet and shops advertising jobs in different language and not english.
3) schools and work place canteens classrooms shop floor. People speaking there own language in the presence of people who cannot. This is singleing them out because brittish. You see racism is a lot deeper than skin colour . in the uk everyday we get classed as racist when in fact we are subject of it as well.
4) i worked in kitchens and had 2 applicants for a kp job. 1 was white english speaking, one was mixed race and could only speak portugese. I gave the job to the white person. Because he could speak english. This made the portugese speaking member complain of racism because i did not have a interpritor at the interview, and singled him out because of his nationality. Was this like what he said racist.


Now plz tell me i do not understand racism. Plz tell me that because i am a english speaking white person i do not experiance racism and just sit in a bubble above it all.

[MagnusGreeol]

- No one is perfect, We all have our moments, We here all belong to the same site. There will always be difference in opinions and view things in different perspectives.I say we all bury a hatchet in the stump of life, If Ropes had it in him to come and apologize to Owen for all past comments, and Owen accepted, Maybe we could all just get along as Brothers and Sister's belonging to the same community? I for one would just like to see everyone get along and be their best, the only C&A reports I'd like to see is about multis and SD. Raz is a good guy, and so are you Eddy, I don't have any animosity towards anyone, Lets all end this.

\MGM/

[eddie2]

Yep agreed magnus.