[GP/UI] Automatic Game Start Snapshots

by **jcmagno** on Mon Feb 23, 2015 7:14 pm

DaveH wrote:Snapshots to avoid 12 Hour Fog Waiting Time Rule

Concise description:
Automatic snapshot at start, available to each player

How this will benefit the site and/or other comments:
Avoids 12 hour wait
Overcomes problems when players forget to wait
Saves time for investigating and ruling on breaches of the rule

+1

rule or not, i want the autosnap!

by **JamesKer1** on Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:57 pm

by the way; built in screenshots exist. automatic screenshots exist after you finish your turn. having the option to get an automated screeshot when the game starts sounds like it would take 1 line of coding.

Technically this is a bug I believe, like polymorphic deadbeats. Automatic snapshots at the beginning were attempted when the feature was released. Unfortunately, it was problematic, and snapshots were incorporated as part of the end fortifications command. A little bit more than one line of coding, as well as lots more server load to check pages that you don't have open.

Why would you want an option? You can turn the snaps off if you absolutely hate it, but why make an option for just one snapshot? That's a bit ridiculous. If this was to be fixed and implemented, then it would definitely need to apply to everyone. I understand trying to incorporate everyone's feelings, but this is pretty clear cut, we don't need compromises like that.

by **betiko** on Tue Feb 24, 2015 5:21 am

JamesKer1 wrote:
by the way; built in screenshots exist. automatic screenshots exist after you finish your turn. having the option to get an automated screeshot when the game starts sounds like it would take 1 line of coding.

Technically this is a bug I believe, like polymorphic deadbeats. Automatic snapshots at the beginning were attempted when the feature was released. Unfortunately, it was problematic, and snapshots were incorporated as part of the end fortifications command. A little bit more than one line of coding, as well as lots more server load to check pages that you don't have open.

Why would you want an option? You can turn the snaps off if you absolutely hate it, but why make an option for just one snapshot? That's a bit ridiculous. If this was to be fixed and implemented, then it would definitely need to apply to everyone. I understand trying to incorporate everyone's feelings, but this is pretty clear cut, we don't need compromises like that.

As mentioned by others previously in this thread, some people don't want to play with autosnapshots on game launch in order to hide information if they are first to start. Therefore, in order to keep everyone happy, we could have it as an option in the game settings. If it's too complicated, well screw that and make it a mandatory autoscreenshot on game launch for fog games.

by **Metsfanmax** on Tue Feb 24, 2015 9:32 am

No, I agree with James on this one. I think it's interesting to play a mode where no one has the information at game start, but why would I ever intentionally cut off my own access to that information when I have to assume that all my opponents have it? If we put it in, it has to be there and automatic for everyone. At worst, if you really don't want the information, then just don't access the snapshot.

by **betiko** on Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:09 am

Metsfanmax wrote:No, I agree with James on this one. I think it's interesting to play a mode where no one has the information at game start, but why would I ever intentionally cut off my own access to that information when I have to assume that all my opponents have it? If we put it in, it has to be there and automatic for everyone. At worst, if you really don't want the information, then just don't access the snapshot.

suggesting to make it optional was taking into consideration what you wrote there:

Metsfanmax wrote:I am simply saying that there are also people who like the advantage they get from being first into a fog game, and you have to weigh the costs to them against the benefits to yourself before declaring that this is an obvious win. My stance is that it comes out roughly neutral, so I'm neither for nor against this change from that perspective. However, I am definitely for it from the perspective of consistency, if we went to all this trouble to put in the screenshot software and therefore make fog easier, we might as well make it fully functional.

If there are such people that like the advantage of being first without letting opponents the time to take the screenshot, I have no problem to let it that way for them as long as we can chose to be in such games or not.

by **Metsfanmax** on Tue Feb 24, 2015 1:30 pm

betiko wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:No, I agree with James on this one. I think it's interesting to play a mode where no one has the information at game start, but why would I ever intentionally cut off my own access to that information when I have to assume that all my opponents have it? If we put it in, it has to be there and automatic for everyone. At worst, if you really don't want the information, then just don't access the snapshot.

suggesting to make it optional was taking into consideration what you wrote there:

Metsfanmax wrote:I am simply saying that there are also people who like the advantage they get from being first into a fog game, and you have to weigh the costs to them against the benefits to yourself before declaring that this is an obvious win. My stance is that it comes out roughly neutral, so I'm neither for nor against this change from that perspective. However, I am definitely for it from the perspective of consistency, if we went to all this trouble to put in the screenshot software and therefore make fog easier, we might as well make it fully functional.

If there are such people that like the advantage of being first without letting opponents the time to take the screenshot, I have no problem to let it that way for them as long as we can chose to be in such games or not.

Oh, I just misunderstood; I thought you were referring to individual snapshots for the players, but you were referring to a setting for the entire game that means no one gets a snapshot. While that would be interesting, I am almost certain the owner will say no to this straight out.

by **clangfield** on Wed Feb 25, 2015 8:21 am

This could be got round by an alternative suggestion, which was to be able to rewind every move (not undo, just put the map back to where it was before the move). If this were possible then anyone would have the option to rewind before move 1 and see what the state of things was. I appreciate that this would take a considerable database and so is unlikely.
Personally, if I'm playing a 24 hour fog game, I'm not going to wait to take my first move, and I don't expect or want any opponent to. It's fog, you can only see what's in front of you, that's part of the fun

by **iAmCaffeine** on Thu Feb 26, 2015 8:15 am

clangfield wrote:This could be got round by an alternative suggestion, which was to be able to rewind every move (not undo, just put the map back to where it was before the move). If this were possible then anyone would have the option to rewind before move 1 and see what the state of things was. I appreciate that this would take a considerable database and so is unlikely.
Personally, if I'm playing a 24 hour fog game, I'm not going to wait to take my first move, and I don't expect or want any opponent to. It's fog, you can only see what's in front of you, that's part of the fun

Why not just create a site wide script that records every game so people can see exactly how each person in the game played, fog or not?

by **jcmagno** on Mon Mar 02, 2015 1:31 am

this is a great suggestion, but admins will not do nothing because you guys make all so difficult... :roll:

by **iAmCaffeine** on Mon Mar 02, 2015 9:15 am

jcmagno wrote:this is a great suggestion, but admins will not do nothing because you guys make all so difficult...

Yeah, that's exactly why. Thanks for the insight.

by **u suck** on Tue Jun 14, 2016 5:44 pm

Tenured players usually give an opponent a chance to "get a snap" of the map in foggy games. It's a common courtesy really. But it's usually violated in non-tournement games putting the player that created the game at a disadvantage 50% of the time.

Is there a way we can build something in so that you can always reference back to the original drop even after a player has taken their turn?

This would make all foggy games much more fair.