Ultra Mafia I Game [DAY ONE START]

[Whatsausage]

No, I'm left out of any QT's as well. Sent in my WinCon quote to Streaker though. If you're town you have nothing to worry about

Bullshit. I doubt the mod would allow outside comms if the town wincons were all the same. It's like modding 101.

Even if the town wincons were all the same, now streaker (and anyone else who is privy to the info) can just fakeclaim based on wincons.

How lame.

Well you beat me to it. (I was gone all weekend for thanksgiving om nom, it appears I didn't miss much in game. QT's I guess?)
It seems awful scummy of Streaker to be asking for town win conditions as his "proof" of town. It has already been stated that this play could be done by a fool/jester, but I doubt there is one in this game. (And if there is, it would be dumb if it ended the game with his WC.) Perhaps I am just using personal opinion about the role (I don't like it) but I think if that's what someone is; we should just lynch them now. They aren't going to do anything to benefit the town, really just try to avoid being a nightkill target. So we lose a distraction and a day by lynching a fool. I say worth it at this point.
Not totally sure where we are in relation to the deadline, but I think its time for a vote. (To get something moving in thread, I dunno how active the QT's are, if there are any going.)

yeah, doesn't matter though. so what if he didn't know the wincon, all town have the same one. (likely) very unlikely towns would have different win cons.

depends on what he does with the information is the key

I agree that they are all the same most likely, otherwise faking would be waaaay too easy.
I don't think a town streaker would gain very much from this play, unless he truly believed all the town would PM him and no scum would risk it.
Vote streaker

[StorrZerg]

So what does mafia streaker gain by asking for wincons of everyone?

what advantage will he gain from this?

[DoomYoshi]

So what does mafia streaker gain by asking for wincons of everyone?

what advantage will he gain from this?

yeah, doesn't matter though. so what if he didn't know the wincon, all town have the same one. (likely) very unlikely towns would have different win cons.

If you believe this, then nothing.

That is totally unbelievable to me though.

[DoomYoshi]

Rule 3 is important for balance. You can take rule 3 away, but for balance to be maintained the wincons need to be different.

[Whatsausage]

The advantage he gains is that he has either:
a. The town win-con provided to him so he can set up a fake-claim that the whole town will match (If all are the same)
or
b. A town win-con provided to him to make up a fake claim that will be reasonable (If a few WCs exist)

However doomyoshi does bring up a good point about balance in what the "quoting" allows. If they are indeed all the same, then it is likely that scum would've been provided a fake-claim. (Assuming the game is balanced)

So if it is case a, (as I believe it likely is) then this doesn't make streaker scum, since scum would likely know the WC anyway. It is still possible that he is scum and was searching for the third party to avoid possible fool ending the game (very unlikely imo) or that he is the third party (also somewhat unlikely, and not auto-lynch offense since we have no guarantee of what the role is). Neither of these has a high enough probability for me right now to push this

Given this rethought, I will unvote

[StorrZerg]

exactly, if he is scum he scored the win con. no biggie, considering we are used to playing with out pasting a full role pm. So catching someone like that shouldn't be expected.

I see more town tendency to what he is doing. Specially since he got the idea from reading pregame chat... So i consider it a town mindset for what they are doing with what they are asking for. depending on what they do with that information is another story.

[crasp]

Streaker sent his win con to me first before i sent him my pm. as far as i know i was the first to contact him.

[Streaker]

Streaker sent his win con to me first before i sent him my pm. as far as i know i was the first to contact him.

Correct. This whole out of thread communication is bogus. We figured we had something good to play the game at, but alas. At least we tried. It has given me an inner circle of a few people who played our game pretty well, and a few who tried. Unfortunately I no longer trust Rory's. Nobody does apparently.

[Streaker]

I have successfully found the Third Party: DoomYoshi. He is obviously hiding, thus trying to survive.

Vote DoomYoshi

Also, STEP RIGHT UP STEP RIGHT UP. Still several more spots in my grand TOWN QT open!

Lol. So right after I call him out, he shows up 'forgot this existed'. Convenient.
After this, he made a few posts, all of which are related to game mechanics.

forgot about game. back tonight or so.

No, I'm left out of any QT's as well. Sent in my WinCon quote to Streaker though. If you're town you have nothing to worry about

Bullshit. I doubt the mod would allow outside comms if the town wincons were all the same. It's like modding 101.

Even if the town wincons were all the same, now streaker (and anyone else who is privy to the info) can just fakeclaim based on wincons.

How lame.

Rule 3 is important for balance. You can take rule 3 away, but for balance to be maintained the wincons need to be different.

This contributes absolutely nothing. These are great posts after you are being called out for inactivity, since they are good for your post count but do nothing to hunt scum.
Probably the most scummy play in this game (in this thread).

Keeping my vote on Doom, now for slightly more serious reasons.

[DoomYoshi]

While I understand your reasons, I can vouch that I am in at least 1 quicktopic. Those in my quicktopic are free to speak up if I have been active in a QT. I have not, and did legitimately forget about the game.

As per saying things game related; many games are still in jokephase 5 pages in. Most of the communication in this game has gone on behind the scenes, so there isn't much I can say. I appreciate your efforts for spurring the only aspect of conversation so far. What is rory's?

[virus90]

its all fun the QT's and stuff but lets try to get more conversation in this thread. i think nobody is 100% sure they only have town in their QT, and with more discussion in this thread we might get some cases rolling. Point is. its hard to hunt scum without any conversation. I dont know how many QT's there are, or PM's for that matter. but the only team that this is aiding so far is mafia in my opinion.
cause i for sure have no clue at all at the moment, and i think there are others aswell who are willing but dont have much to start with.

[Streaker]

Ofcourse you are active in a QT (probably mafia's).
Rory's is the name of the QT where I thought to have owned this game.

This is utter bullocks. There is no content here whatsoever to get a lynch going. All mafia are just gonna say the same thing: But i'm not inactive, we are talking a lot in a QT.

What would you all say we random.org 1 or 2 players in the playerlist and push them to L-2 for a claim? At least we'll get somewhere to start.

[DoomYoshi]

Ofcourse you are active in a QT (probably mafia's).
Rory's is the name of the QT where I thought to have owned this game.

This is utter bullocks. There is no content here whatsoever to get a lynch going. All mafia are just gonna say the same thing: But i'm not inactive, we are talking a lot in a QT.

What would you all say we random.org 1 or 2 players in the playerlist and push them to L-2 for a claim? At least we'll get somewhere to start.

I'm game. Rando-away.

[aage]

I think the beauty of this game is that most of the conversation doesn't happen in-thread. It's also a curse, but it allows for very interesting things.

I have successfully found the Third Party: DoomYoshi. He is obviously hiding, thus trying to survive.

Vote DoomYoshi

Also, STEP RIGHT UP STEP RIGHT UP. Still several more spots in my grand TOWN QT open!

Lol. So right after I call him out, he shows up 'forgot this existed'. Convenient.
After this, he made a few posts, all of which are related to game mechanics.

forgot about game. back tonight or so.

No, I'm left out of any QT's as well. Sent in my WinCon quote to Streaker though. If you're town you have nothing to worry about

Bullshit. I doubt the mod would allow outside comms if the town wincons were all the same. It's like modding 101.

Even if the town wincons were all the same, now streaker (and anyone else who is privy to the info) can just fakeclaim based on wincons.

How lame.

Rule 3 is important for balance. You can take rule 3 away, but for balance to be maintained the wincons need to be different.

This contributes absolutely nothing. These are great posts after you are being called out for inactivity, since they are good for your post count but do nothing to hunt scum.
Probably the most scummy play in this game (in this thread).

Keeping my vote on Doom, now for slightly more serious reasons.

Actually, Doom is right, and saying his posts don't contribute is bogus. Saying his posts are scummy is even more bogus, since you're actively trying to root out the scum based on the same mechanics.
I don't know why Ultra excluded my vote from his latest VC, but it's still on you and I see no reason to change it.

[Streaker]

I'll counter: how are THOSE posts contributing?

Also I did not say the posts themself are scummy. I said this is scummy:
Hiding in shadows, being called out, immediatly after that posting, and then no content except mechanics?

You don't agree that it is scummy?

---

I random'd all names, these came up:

-virus
-Streaker (lol).

Le't's get some pressure going

[DoomYoshi]

While I disagree of the mechanics of Streaker's attempt, I have a slight town lead since he is actually trying something.

vote virus

[StorrZerg]

While I disagree of the mechanics of Streaker's attempt, I have a slight town lead since he is actually trying something.

vote virus

ding ding ding we have a winner winner chicken dinner

[crasp]

Ok. vote virus. Reason. What streaker said.

[pancakemix]

Ofcourse you are active in a QT (probably mafia's).
Rory's is the name of the QT where I thought to have owned this game.

This is utter bullocks. There is no content here whatsoever to get a lynch going. All mafia are just gonna say the same thing: But i'm not inactive, we are talking a lot in a QT.

What would you all say we random.org 1 or 2 players in the playerlist and push them to L-2 for a claim? At least we'll get somewhere to start.

This may be the worst suggestion ever made. The discussion has been had (fairly recently, in Rish's game in fact) that D1 lynches aren't random by virtue of being based on something. At all. This is literally a random lynch and as that scenario ultimately gave consensus to, not beneficial. And I know you're not saying lynch but pressure, but honestly what's the difference? How does one defend oneself against the nothing that is? Why should that be cause for a claim?

As for QT discussion, you could just quote QT conversations to prove you were discussing and not just BSing. Would that defeat the purpose? I don't think so. Especially if it's a wider point that needs discussion.

Vote Streaker for the silliness that is this post.

[StorrZerg]

Doing a random lynch is bad for several reasons. Pushing / suggesting it isn't scummy though.

Its an idea, it isn't mafia favored if the lynch can proved to be random. (not gamed)

The random aspect leaves out who pushed who for legit or false reasons, pulls away from the emotional aspect of the game, and distances people which is in favor of mafia if the person being lynched isn't mafia.

Is streaker scummy for suggesting this? absolutely not.

It is what it is, poor form in how to play.

[UltrasPlot]

aage, that was moderator error. votecount coming right up

[UltrasPlot]

Votecount 1.4
DoomYoshi(1) - Streaker
StorrZerg (1) - HotShot53
Streaker (2) - aage, pancakemix
virus90 (2) - DoomYoshi, crasp

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch. Plurality applies, as stated before.

[Whatsausage]

Ok. Vote crasp. Reason. What ____ said. (Am I doing it right?)

Real reasoning.
First, @storr
I don't see how what you said doesn't add up to scummy other than the idea that it is "an idea"
You say yourself it doesn't give town any info. The "random" target cannot do anything to defend themselves other than choose whether or not to claim. And since the idea is to push for a claim, it is basically pushing to test someone's claim. The way I see it, pushing a bad play IS scummy.
There is no way to prove that the target is truly random, unless they flip scum. It would be incredibly easy for scum to put out two "random" town targets and use the random defense as there are more town than scum. He seems to have tried to prove its randomness by placing himself as one of the targets. This just doesn't sit right with me. Maybe its because if I had done it; I probably wouldn't have included myself at all in the RNG. It is a 23/132 chance of your own name coming up, so its definitely possible, but it just seems to me to try to be "proving" the randomness. Again just the feeling I got from it.

So why crasp instead of streaker?
For being the third on it (Second vote). He hadn't really been in on discussing it with doom and streaker (As far as I can see) so he is jumping in as a sort of third party pushing this bad idea. This vote could be used to try really gain momentum for the "random" claim (if he assumes streaker will join, makes it go over halfway to L2), which really benefits mafia more whether it is truly random or not. Even it is random, it is more likely to be a town PR than scum (I think town usually has more PRs than scum).

[Streaker]

Ofcourse you are active in a QT (probably mafia's).
Rory's is the name of the QT where I thought to have owned this game.

This is utter bullocks. There is no content here whatsoever to get a lynch going. All mafia are just gonna say the same thing: But i'm not inactive, we are talking a lot in a QT.

What would you all say we random.org 1 or 2 players in the playerlist and push them to L-2 for a claim? At least we'll get somewhere to start.

This may be the worst suggestion ever made. The discussion has been had (fairly recently, in Rish's game in fact) that D1 lynches aren't random by virtue of being based on something. At all. This is literally a random lynch and as that scenario ultimately gave consensus to, not beneficial. And I know you're not saying lynch but pressure, but honestly what's the difference? How does one defend oneself against the nothing that is? Why should that be cause for a claim?

As for QT discussion, you could just quote QT conversations to prove you were discussing and not just BSing. Would that defeat the purpose? I don't think so. Especially if it's a wider point that needs discussion.

Vote Streaker for the silliness that is this post.

My idea is utterly brilliant. I'm not pushing a random lynch. The difference between lynch and pressure is that in 1 of the 2, someone gets killed. If there is no talk at all in this thread, then how can we EVER get to a consensus? There is no deadline. Worst case scenario, someone has to claim and maybe there is something in that claim that can help us.

Now the biggest reason for my post is to get conversation going. Here is what I suggested: let's just not talk and just vote on some random people...
Look and behold, there are actually people interested in this: DoomYoshi and crasp.

Note that I didn't actually move my vote.
A huge FoS on crasp for sheeping the stupidest wagon ever, but my vote remains on Doom for the case stated above, + voting virus randomly.

WS gets the most town points for condemning crasp, PCM also gets town points from me for calling me out.

[DoomYoshi]