Wishy-Washy Mafia (7/13) Endgame: Forgiveness (Town Win)

[Melkor52]

Again, the part at the end of my post where I believe it's a SKer plus cult recruiter combo. Certainly this theory is moot if a mafia member turns up dead, but balance-wise, the game is too small to support both a mafia faction and a cult recruiter IMHO.

That's what I was thinking. I realize I'm the noob, but if we started with 13 players (now down to 11) how many are town? I assume there are at least 3 Mafia scum and for a cult there must be at least 2 there. That leaves only 6 towns folk at most. If a Mafia scum or a cult player isn't eliminated soon it's going to be a short game. And as far as I can tell nobody is really giving any tells as to who is scum. Is there any way to launch a covert investigation in these games? Are there no cops?

[safariguy5]

I assume the cop/cops turned up an innocent result and other possible investigative roles found nothing interesting (watcher didn't see anything, tracker's target didn't go anywhere). At this point in the game, it's not a good idea for a cop to be clearing any townies because the SKer or cult recruiter will just target them the next night and we'd lose the cop for good.

[jonty125]

Again, the part at the end of my post where I believe it's a SKer plus cult recruiter combo. Certainly this theory is moot if a mafia member turns up dead, but balance-wise, the game is too small to support both a mafia faction and a cult recruiter IMHO.

That's what I was thinking. I realize I'm the noob, but if we started with 13 players (now down to 11) how many are town? I assume there are at least 3 Mafia scum and for a cult there must be at least 2 there. That leaves only 6 towns folk at most. If a Mafia scum or a cult player isn't eliminated soon it's going to be a short game. And as far as I can tell nobody is really giving any tells as to who is scum. Is there any way to launch a covert investigation in these games? Are there no cops?

If this was a straight mafia-town shoot-out I would say 3 mafia, but the presence of a cult recruiter, I would probably have an SK (as someone previously metioned) for balance purpose but maybe a 2 man mafia could work.

[Flow520]

My top 3 right now would have to be melkor, virus, and benga in no particular order. One of the main reason melkor is on the list is because he was targeted by Anark and now Anark is dead and recruited both of which would get him off melkor. The other two are on the list for their behavior yesterday

Personally, I've found kratos & melkor scummy. Kratos, seemed very quick to jump on the saf wagon, but that's about it and Melkor skims and sheeps which is definitely a worse crime, but he's new, and like I said previous I get a n00b feel rather than a scum feel from him.

I have too agree, and I think we should get things moving along.
Vote Melkor

[benga]

Just got back, will have something more to say after I re-read.

[virus90]

Vote Gregwolf for scummarining
since the start of the game he has not even voted (seriously) neither has he taken any stance in any discussion whatsover. understand he has taken exams, but he promised more, and it never came.

i quote all he has said, since we quit jokevoting:

sorry all i'm starting finals now so i haven't had as much time as i would have liked to devote to this forum, also unvote as i believe it was a joke one and no reason to keep it there.

the reason i haven't been posting is that i was taking finals, i'm going to finish them today so i'll be able to post more regularly, and contribute starting tomorrow.

hmm well at the very least know that we know there is a recruiter, which is just good to know so we can try to defend against them. for anything else i would have to reread to see what i can come up with

[Nebuchadnezer]

Well, I would say that either Melkor or Greg are good cases. Melkor has at least been posting...while Greg has given us nothing but hollow promises of posts to come.

Okay, I'll go with Greg to see what he's got to say...VOTE Gregwolf

[rishaed]

Vote Count:

gregwolf121 (2) - virus90, Nebuchadnezer
Melkor52 (1) - Flow520

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. I'm running low on replacements, I will if I have to, but the recent mass inactivity is something that I'm not going to tolerate. I already performed a mass prod D1, and I will modkill/replacement before mass prodding every day if this keeps up.

[HotShot53]

I haven't been as active in this game as my other, because not much has been going on so not much to post about really. In order to get some action going, and because he has posted nothing of value so far, I will join and vote gregwolf121 so we can get at least a claim and see where we go from there

[virus90]

Vote Count:

gregwolf121 (2) - virus90, Nebuchadnezer
Melkor52 (1) - Flow520

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. I'm running low on replacements, I will if I have to, but the recent mass inactivity is something that I'm not going to tolerate. I already performed a mass prod D1, and I will modkill/replacement before mass prodding every day if this keeps up.

totally understandable, and must be frustrating for you aswell.

I haven't been as active in this game as my other, because not much has been going on so not much to post about really. In order to get some action going, and because he has posted nothing of value so far, I will join and vote gregwolf121 so we can get at least a claim and see where we go from there

there kind of is a problem with claiming, cause the only viable claim would be powerrole, since every VT has the same name i highlt doubt that i would be easily convinced that someone who claimed VT would actually be VT, it atleast needs secure rereading of comments made and votes made. in case of gregwolf, because of lack of posting, hard anyhow.
well thats my point of view anyway.

[HotShot53]

Vote Count:

gregwolf121 (2) - virus90, Nebuchadnezer
Melkor52 (1) - Flow520

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch. I'm running low on replacements, I will if I have to, but the recent mass inactivity is something that I'm not going to tolerate. I already performed a mass prod D1, and I will modkill/replacement before mass prodding every day if this keeps up.

totally understandable, and must be frustrating for you aswell.

I haven't been as active in this game as my other, because not much has been going on so not much to post about really. In order to get some action going, and because he has posted nothing of value so far, I will join and vote gregwolf121 so we can get at least a claim and see where we go from there

there kind of is a problem with claiming, cause the only viable claim would be powerrole, since every VT has the same name i highlt doubt that i would be easily convinced that someone who claimed VT would actually be VT, it atleast needs secure rereading of comments made and votes made. in case of gregwolf, because of lack of posting, hard anyhow.
well thats my point of view anyway.

Very true... so how else can we find scum other than waiting for night cops or something to find them? Are you saying we should just pass on the day because making people claim won't do anything anyway?

[jonty125]

I'd rather see greg, replaced than lynched, but according to the rules we have 12 RL days per game day, so by my count deadline is 9 Jan. So push, has come to shove vote gregwolf L-2.

[virus90]

Very true... so how else can we find scum other than waiting for night cops or something to find them? Are you saying we should just pass on the day because making people claim won't do anything anyway?

well find scum by reading the messages from others and try to find scummy signs in them, this one of yours could be considered very scummy for instance. Because hinting a no lynch is not an good idea at all, if we have something like a recruiter that would mean chances are that we are losing 2 townies each night, and an investigation by any cop might be worthless the next day because someone might have switched sides.

and if we find a powerrole, we can always hope that we also have a doc, who can save the power-role.

I'd rather see greg, replaced than lynched, but according to the rules we have 12 RL days per game day, so by my count deadline is 9 Jan. So push, has come to shove vote gregwolf L-2.

of course replacing is always better then lynching, but rishead suggested modkills so keep that in mind, but modkills that would hit mafia are not bad for us ofcourse. i am not saying gregwolf is an ideal target, but he has brought up nothing and is highly inactive. hope to atleast wake him up. it just is hard to find good cases with people not posting that much and i wasn't convinced by the melkor case so did not want to continue on that, the evidence in that case is not very strong, and i kind of get the feeling that people just suspect him because someone once suspected him day one. And i noticed in valkyria chronicles mafia, for the people that play/read that too. that once someone says you might be mafia, anything you say will be turned against you, that highly frustrated me. that does not mean that he cant be mafia, the case is just not convincing me yet.

so to conclude i am looking forward to any cases against others then gregwolf, fact is he kind of has to claim in my opinion because he kind of screwed up not posting, or that might be scummarining.

[benga]

Not sure why so many experienced mafia players are so quiet.

FOS on TFO, he just seems dropping line here and there, flying below radar, using this situation of everybody accusing everybody.

[HotShot53]

Very true... so how else can we find scum other than waiting for night cops or something to find them? Are you saying we should just pass on the day because making people claim won't do anything anyway?

well find scum by reading the messages from others and try to find scummy signs in them, this one of yours could be considered very scummy for instance. Because hinting a no lynch is not an good idea at all, if we have something like a recruiter that would mean chances are that we are losing 2 townies each night, and an investigation by any cop might be worthless the next day because someone might have switched sides.

and if we find a powerrole, we can always hope that we also have a doc, who can save the power-role.

I wasn't suggesting a no-lynch, I had already voted on gregwolf. I was just wondering if that's what you were suggesting. And from the night 1 scene we apparently do have a fan club recruiter... so why would you say "if" we have one?

[benga]

Very true... so how else can we find scum other than waiting for night cops or something to find them? Are you saying we should just pass on the day because making people claim won't do anything anyway?

well find scum by reading the messages from others and try to find scummy signs in them, this one of yours could be considered very scummy for instance. Because hinting a no lynch is not an good idea at all, if we have something like a recruiter that would mean chances are that we are losing 2 townies each night, and an investigation by any cop might be worthless the next day because someone might have switched sides.

and if we find a powerrole, we can always hope that we also have a doc, who can save the power-role.

I wasn't suggesting a no-lynch, I had already voted on gregwolf. I was just wondering if that's what you were suggesting. And from the night 1 scene we apparently do have a fan club recruiter... so why would you say "if" we have one?

so how many VT you suppose we have?

pushing for lynch seems to scummy???

[virus90]

hot shot kind of messed up quoting, EBWOP perhaps? now using my message as his own.
and becuase of this; benga is your question directed to me? (who wrote what is in hotshots message) or to hotshot ?

[HotShot53]

Very true... so how else can we find scum other than waiting for night cops or something to find them? Are you saying we should just pass on the day because making people claim won't do anything anyway?

well find scum by reading the messages from others and try to find scummy signs in them, this one of yours could be considered very scummy for instance. Because hinting a no lynch is not an good idea at all, if we have something like a recruiter that would mean chances are that we are losing 2 townies each night, and an investigation by any cop might be worthless the next day because someone might have switched sides.

and if we find a powerrole, we can always hope that we also have a doc, who can save the power-role.

I wasn't suggesting a no-lynch, I had already voted on gregwolf. I was just wondering if that's what you were suggesting. And from the night 1 scene we apparently do have a fan club recruiter... so why would you say "if" we have one?

EBWOP

Sorry, I messed up on the quote, wanted to only quote part of virus' post and it didn't post the way I expected it to.

[Flow520]

hot shot kind of messed up quoting, EBWOP perhaps? now using my message as his own.

I think this was HotShot's part:

I wasn't suggesting a no-lynch, I had already voted on gregwolf. I was just wondering if that's what you were suggesting. And from the night 1 scene we apparently do have a fan club recruiter... so why would you say "if" we have one?

[benga]

Meant on both of you, since you both so eager for lynch..

[virus90]

because someone was speculating a SK.
to answer benga, we need to lynch because that is the only way we are gonna get mafia, at night they get us and with the modkill/no lynch of the first day the other parties kind of had the advantage, luckily they recruited / killed the same person (anarkist) else we had bigger problems. so it means that unless we lynch the forces against us grow by 1 and we lose 1 each night.

so how many VT you suppose we have?
pushing for lynch seems to scummy???

i am not sure how many VT we have.. 2 are down. we were with 11

13 people to start with
1 fanclub recruiter (since i guess more members would be to much to begin with, unbalance it with only 13)
3 mafia
4 PR
5 VT and
2 death VT i am also VT. so i guess not much VT left.
maybe 1 more VT 1 powerrole less. thats all up to the mod. but because of the 3 parties i think atleast 3 pro-town powerroles guess 4 becuase of the possibility of a powerole going to the fanclub.

and i did not exactly get what you meant by 2nd sentence in the quoted message ("pushing for a lynch") is that an allegation to me? or someone else?

[kratos644]

Meant on both of you, since you both so eager for lynch..

They're both eager for a lynch because a no lynch really hurts. It doesn't give town any information at all and ends up with 2 lost townies each night unless mafia/sker and recruiter both target the same person again. It might just be new behavior but I'm still suspicious of benga due to his blatant BW vote D1 and he just hasn't seemed town friendly overall. Virus is on my radar as well but not nearly as high as benga is. I would have to do a reread to see who else has appeared scummy to me. So in conclusion I will Vote Benga pending Gregwolf's claim.

Fast posted

[Melkor52]

Once again I risk getting the FOS pointed at me for asking a noob question, but, might it not be easier to find the power role players than the mafia scum? Then at least we would have a smaller suspect base for lynch votes. Or is this a stupid idea and just as difficult as finding scum?

[safariguy5]

Once again I risk getting the FOS pointed at me for asking a noob question, but, might it not be easier to find the power role players than the mafia scum? Then at least we would have a smaller suspect base for lynch votes. Or is this a stupid idea and just as difficult as finding scum?

How do you mean power role players? Like get them to claim or something? At least with them not known, it makes it harder for the recruiter or mafia/SKer to target them.

As for greg, I think it's important to eliminate dead weight if we cannot get a replacement. It might be difficult to get enough votes to push through lynches in the later days. I will vote him if he does not respond soon.

[Flow520]

Once again I risk getting the FOS pointed at me for asking a noob question, but, might it not be easier to find the power role players than the mafia scum? Then at least we would have a smaller suspect base for lynch votes. Or is this a stupid idea and just as difficult as finding scum?

That feels like a bad idea to me.
What if there is no doc?
What if a mafia claims to be a town power role?