Re: 1v1: Promontory Summit [10.3.14] BETA

[isaiah40]

Just a wild idea here cairns. What if you just had the autodeploy on Sacramento and Omaha as the only troops you get? This will replicate the bringing in of supplies and men. Also I know that the building of the RR had its problems. If I remember correctly, the Union Pacific had Indian raids while the Central Pacific had problems with land slides etc. Maybe you can add in some killer neutrals to replicate that? Oh maybe have 3 or 4 spikes at Promontory Point. If I remember from just recently reading on it, they used an iron spike, a silver one, the gold one and I can't remember if they used a fourth or not. Each spike represented something. Just my $0.02 rambling. It might make the game a little more interesting.

[cairnswk]

Just a wild idea here cairns. What if you just had the autodeploy on Sacramento and Omaha as the only troops you get? This will replicate the bringing in of supplies and men. Also I know that the building of the RR had its problems. If I remember correctly, the Union Pacific had Indian raids while the Central Pacific had problems with land slides etc. Maybe you can add in some killer neutrals to replicate that? Oh maybe have 3 or 4 spikes at Promontory Point. If I remember from just recently reading on it, they used an iron spike, a silver one, the gold one and I can't remember if they used a fourth or not. Each spike represented something. Just my $0.02 rambling. It might make the game a little more interesting.

isaiah40, that's the sort of input that makes me smile...all creating further gameplay options....far more than $0.02 worth. thank-you.
not sure what i can use yet but let me think on it.

[Jippd]

Not sure if I like the overall idea of a map that is as linear as this one is. Sure it is easy for people that don't want to use strategy and just roll some dice. To me that is not what risk is about though. It is about strategy and decision making with luck involved. I also don't like the idea of a map that is only playable for 1 v 1. Is there special coding in the site now that will not allow people to make this map anything but 1 v 1 if it did get released?

Also the bonus structure doesn't seem to make complete sense and could probably use some tweaking. I'd much rather start on the left and get +2 auto deploys to start for taking a n3 as opposed to starting on the right and getting +1 for killing n2. Especially in trench mode it would be very unbalanced.

This map reminds me of the st patricks day map and if any of you have played it we all know how fun and challenging that map is. (sarcasm)

Just my honest opinion.

If there were more dimensions as others have mentioned I think I would be more open to this idea

[cairnswk]

Not sure if I like the overall idea of a map that is as linear as this one is. Sure it is easy for people that don't want to use strategy and just roll some dice. To me that is not what risk is about though. It is about strategy and decision making with luck involved. I also don't like the idea of a map that is only playable for 1 v 1. Is there special coding in the site now that will not allow people to make this map anything but 1 v 1 if it did get released?

Also the bonus structure doesn't seem to make complete sense and could probably use some tweaking. I'd much rather start on the left and get +2 auto deploys to start for taking a n3 as opposed to starting on the right and getting +1 for killing n2. Especially in trench mode it would be very unbalanced.

This map reminds me of the st patricks day map and if any of you have played it we all know how fun and challenging that map is. (sarcasm)

Just my honest opinion.

If there were more dimensions as others have mentioned I think I would be more open to this idea

thanks jippd for those comments...
which of the other dimensions would you like to see implemented?

[isaiah40]

Not sure if I like the overall idea of a map that is as linear as this one is. Sure it is easy for people that don't want to use strategy and just roll some dice. To me that is not what risk is about though. It is about strategy and decision making with luck involved. I also don't like the idea of a map that is only playable for 1 v 1. Is there special coding in the site now that will not allow people to make this map anything but 1 v 1 if it did get released?

Also the bonus structure doesn't seem to make complete sense and could probably use some tweaking. I'd much rather start on the left and get +2 auto deploys to start for taking a n3 as opposed to starting on the right and getting +1 for killing n2. Especially in trench mode it would be very unbalanced.

This map reminds me of the st patricks day map and if any of you have played it we all know how fun and challenging that map is. (sarcasm)

Just my honest opinion.

If there were more dimensions as others have mentioned I think I would be more open to this idea

thanks jippd for those comments...
which of the other dimensions would you like to see implemented?

All of them!!

[Seamus76]

A map like this, you know, some times you just want to roll the dice, and not think about all the other stuff. Ahh, but there is other stuff...deciding when to attack, how much to attack, when to stop, etc. are all strategies. To say there is no strategy or this is just neutral bashing is like saying Treasures of Galapagos is the same way, which we all know it is not.

[LLLUUUKKKEEE]

A map like this, you know, some times you just want to roll the dice, and not think about all the other stuff. Ahh, but there is other stuff...deciding when to attack, how much to attack, when to stop, etc. are all strategies. To say there is no strategy or this is just neutral bashing is like saying Treasures of Galapagos is the same way, which we all know it is not.

I agree totally, plenty of maps have killer nuetrals and people like them.
We do need a 1v1 map, i.e. a race. I understand your theme based on only 1 route to travel and it will work. Yes it will involve strategy as to say stack on Promontory Points or attack.

And I think auto deploy on sacremto and Omaha would be great.
I can see this being a great advantage to players who dont miss ther turn (purpose or not).

And i am sick of the complicated maps( waterloo, stalingrad etc). This is a quick fire fun map.

Well done cairnswk......................... again!

[Oneyed]

random deployment? i guess you mean the 3 troops deployed at beginning of your turn...at bottom of map...maximum deploy is +1, not +3....so you can only deploy +1.

no. I mean if you get +2 for Sacramento - Reno, or if each station gets +2 auto.

I agree that all maps are based on lucky. yes also strategy is important on some maps, but it is still lucky for example if you can not beat 3 troops with 11...

the bonus structure is unbalanced, I think. because this is 1v1 game and because strategy here has low role add to each player the same (or very similar) position.

Sacramento-Reno: 7 regions to beat, 21 neutrals. then you get +16 units.
Omaha-Chayenne: 8 regions to beat, 19 neutrals. here you get +9 units.

the big difference, I think.

Oneyed

[koontz1973]

Alright cairns, make sure you send a PM to nobodies for 1v1 approval then. Seems like a few want this in the stable of maps.

[Funkyterrance]

If this was just another rail map I would totally agree that it would be a waste of energy but yeah this one looks very interesting/unique to me. Besides, there's this weird psychological thing about attacking neuts that makes you sometimes abandon your reason since they aren't actual players. It takes composure to fight neuts!

[codierose]

not sure they had spies in them days could it be raiding Indians or train robbers just thoughts

[cairnswk]

not sure they had spies in them days could it be raiding Indians or train robbers just thoughts

Because of the nature of the way money was given to the companies building the railroad, they were sometimes known to sabotage each other's railroads to claim that land as their own.

- Perkins, J. R. (2003). "CENTRAL PACIFIC–UNION PACIFIC RACE". Encyclopedia.com. Retrieved 2010-04-24 for inclusion in Wikipedia

From the beginning, then, the building of the transcontinental railroad was set up in terms of a competition between the two companies...

Dangers and Difficulties

After General Grenville Dodge, a hero of the Union Army, took control as chief engineer, the Union Pacific finally began to move westward in May 1866. The company suffered bloody attacks on its workers by Native Americans--including members of the Sioux, Arapaho and Cheyenne tribes--who were understandably threatened by the progress of the white man and his "iron horse" across their native lands. Still, the Union Pacific moved relatively quickly across the plains, compared to the slow progress of their rival company through the Sierra. Ramshackle settlements popped up wherever the railroad went, turning into hotbeds of drinking, gambling, prostitution and violence and producing the enduring mythology of the "Wild West."

In 1865, after struggling with retaining workers due to the difficulty of the labor, Charles Crocker (who was in charge of construction for the Central Pacific) began hiring Chinese laborers. By that time, some 50,000 Chinese immigrants were living on the West Coast, many having arrived during the Gold Rush. This was controversial at the time, as the Chinese were considered an inferior race due to pervasive racism. The Chinese laborers proved to be tireless workers, and Crocker hired more of them; some 14,000 were toiling under brutal working conditions in the Sierra Nevada by early 1867. (By contrast, the work force of the Union Pacific was mainly Irish immigrants and Civil War veterans.) To blast through the mountains, the Central Pacific built huge wooden trestles on the western slopes and used gunpowder and nitroglycerine to blast tunnels through the granite.

http://www.history.com/topics/transcontinental-railroad

[nolefan5311]

Just a quick note cairns, the actual junction of the two railroads was called Promontory Summit.

[cairnswk]

Just a quick note cairns, the actual junction of the two railroads was called Promontory Summit.

yes i noticed, i'll change that

[cairnswk]

A map like this, you know, some times you just want to roll the dice, and not think about all the other stuff. Ahh, but there is other stuff...deciding when to attack, how much to attack, when to stop, etc. are all strategies. To say there is no strategy or this is just neutral bashing is like saying Treasures of Galapagos is the same way, which we all know it is not.

Yes, there's a couple of maps where neutral bashing is required, and i agree, there is some strategy involved.

[cairnswk]

...
And I think auto deploy on sacremto and Omaha would be great.

Considered LLLUUUKKKEEE!

And i am sick of the complicated maps( waterloo, stalingrad etc). This is a quick fire fun map.
Well done cairnswk......................... again!

Ah LLLUUUKKKEEE, you've mentioned my maps there OUCH!. but you are right, a little change-up will be good.

[cairnswk]

random deployment? i guess you mean the 3 troops deployed at beginning of your turn...at bottom of map...maximum deploy is +1, not +3....so you can only deploy +1.

no. I mean if you get +2 for Sacramento - Reno, or if each station gets +2 auto.

OK I understand. well at present those are on the map, but that will prob change in gameplay

I agree that all maps are based on lucky. yes also strategy is important on some maps, but it is still lucky for example if you can not beat 3 troops with 11...

you mean it is unlucky Oneyed. i had that happen quite a few times.

the bonus structure is unbalanced, I think. because this is 1v1 game and because strategy here has low role add to each player the same (or very similar) position.
Sacramento-Reno: 7 regions to beat, 21 neutrals. then you get +16 units.
Omaha-Chayenne: 8 regions to beat, 19 neutrals. here you get +9 units.
the big difference, I think.
Oneyed

as stated, that will change.

[cairnswk]

Alright cairns, make sure you send a PM to nobodies for 1v1 approval then. Seems like a few want this in the stable of maps.

thank-you koontz.

[cairnswk]

If this was just another rail map I would totally agree that it would be a waste of energy but yeah this one looks very interesting/unique to me. Besides, there's this weird psychological thing about attacking neuts that makes you sometimes abandon your reason since they aren't actual players. It takes composure to fight neuts!

Yes, and i have found that itr usually takes a lot more troops to conqeur them

[cairnswk]

Version 3....adding a few options for Indian attacks.

[Oneyed]

you could write names of 15 Tunels and Newcastle as other stations (like stations under indian attacks).
I can not see what these "unluckies" do? losing units?

Oneyed

[isaiah40]

To expand on the idea of having four spikes, here's some good info:

On May 10, in anticipation of the ceremony, Union Pacific No. 119 and Central Pacific No. 60 (better known as the Jupiter) locomotives were drawn up face-to-face on Promontory Summit. It is unknown how many people attended the event; estimates run from as low as 500 to as many as 3,000; government and railroad officials and track workers were present to witness the event.[3]

Before the last spike was driven, three other commemorative spikes, presented on behalf of the other three members of the Central Pacific's Big Four who did not attend the ceremony, had been driven in the pre-bored laurel tie:

- a second, lower-quality gold spike, supplied by the San Francisco News Letter was made of $200 worth of gold and inscribed: With this spike the San Francisco News Letter offers its homage to the great work which has joined the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.
- a silver spike, supplied by the State of Nevada; forged, rather than cast, of 25 troy ounces (780 g) of unpolished silver.
- a blended iron, silver and gold spike, supplied by the Arizona Territory, engraved: Ribbed with iron clad in silver and crowned with gold Arizona presents her offering to the enterprise that has banded a continent and dictated a pathway to commerce. (Source: Deseret Morning News, Salt Lake City, April 24, 2007)

The golden spike was made of 17.6-karat (73%) copper-alloyed gold, and weighed 14.03 troy ounces (436 g). It was dropped into a pre-drilled hole in the laurel ceremonial last tie, and gently tapped into place with a silver ceremonial spike maul. The spike was engraved on all four sides:

The Pacific Railroad ground broken January 8, 1863, and completed May 8, 1869.
Directors of the C. P. R. R. of Cal. Hon. Leland Stanford. C. P. Huntington. E. B. Crocker. Mark Hopkins. A. P. Stanford. E. H. Miller Jr.
Officers. Hon. Leland Stanford. Presdt. C. P. Huntington Vice Presdt. E. B. Crocker. Atty. Mark Hopkins. Tresr. Chas Crocker Gen. Supdt. E. H. Miller Jr. Secty. S. S. Montague. Chief Engr.
May God continue the unity of our Country, as this Railroad unites the two great Oceans of the world. Presented by David Hewes San Francisco.[3]

[cairnswk]

you could write names of 15 Tunels and Newcastle as other stations (like stations under indian attacks).
I can not see what these "unluckies" do? losing units?

Oneyed

Bombarded by your opponent Oneyed....don't you follow what is written in the top legend with regards to bridges and Indian attacks?
OR is that not clear for you?

[cairnswk]

To expand on the idea of having four spikes, here's some good info:
...

Isaiah40...so do you propose that there should be four spikes instead of one...?
and should they all be the goal, or just two of each..?
or the gold spike plus two of the other three..?
please tell me what you are thinking....you will lessen the amount of roundabouts we have to go through to get to the end

[Jippd]

what about spikes in the middle...it is a one way attack from each end...left or right...and once on the spikes the spikes can only attack other spikes in terms of troops that have been advanced. Just throwing that possibility out there.