Gen.LeeGettinhed [Banned] DCR

[rhp 1]

One thing I've wondered though... is how GLG gets his opponents to consent to the game? Either they're incredibly gullible, or he'd make a damn good salesman.

it's actually really easy to convince a low ranker to play with you if you're a conqueror.
first of all there's the potential of getting big points vs losing just a few which is appealing to anybody.
but more than that, you have the chance of beating the conqueror on his own turf under his own terms. it's the ultimate bragging thing for a lot of people.

That definitely could be the case more often than not. That never came to light.

not that it was intended this way, but this supports my position perfectly... now take it easy analogy police because this isn't too far off in humble opinion..

this makes me think of mike tyson in his prime... now I know a lot of people don't think GLG is a top player like tyson was a top boxer but hear me out...

the people who stepped in the ring with tyson, thought (at least some) that they could beat the champ... most on-lookers would have scoffed at the very notion of some of fighters who challenged him.. this thread would be akin to tyson being banned from the sport for "farming" unsuspecting boxers who he went on to physically destroy in most fights... this is ludicrous of course, but is not the worst analogy...

[jghost7]

...
Gen.LeeGettinhed was banned for 1 month as per the situation guidelines for Gross Abuse of Game, which is a major offence. The unofficial term for the particular problem is "Ranching". Simply speaking, it is the case of someone abusing the game by purposefully inviting people who have no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win.

Now, it isn't the fact that he is making these games that resulted in this. It is the fact that he would purposely seek out players with little to no experience on the maps, create the games, and invite them to private matches. This was under the guise of limiting losses, but regardless of the reason, it is still a gross abuse of our gaming system. People will say other players do this. Other players will start games, multiple ones, on maps that they are good at. I myself start 10+ Poland games whenever I get the urge to, as I feel it is my strongest map. But they do not purposely hunt down players who don't understand the maps and invite them under the guise of education, whether there was education or not. Again, this is abusing our system. After examining the situation, it was decided that this indeed did qualify as a Gross Abuse, and the infraction was handed down as per our guidelines. Any questions or comments (within reason), feel free to post in here. The same rules I posted earlier apply though: I won't tolerate any flaming, baiting, or anything of the sort. Keep the remarks clean. Thank you.

This reasoning manufactured specifically to hang this player is utterly ridiculous. For one there is no way you can prove intent or that he purposely invited people with no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win. You are assuming that this is the case. It is only circumstantial evidence that they don't. He may have sought them out but you cannot prove that he did, and for what reasons.

Also, by inventing this interpretation of gross abuse, you set a precedence that allows for any condemnation of anyone who might invite someone to a map that they may not know. I feel that this slippery slope could lead to more reaching by mods to wrap rules around frustrating players rather than enforcing existing rules regularly.

This also does not take into account the rights of the other players to have a game against a player of their choice, be it GLG or some other strong player. There are no rules stating you must have experience on a map or settings before playing said maps or settings, and therefore it is also not against the rules for the opposite either. It is pretty lame to force players to maprank every potential opponent prior to agreeing to a game like an interview.

I don't particularly pay much attention to the antics and fanfare that is GLG nor do I condone any such tactics. But it simply is a fact that the handling of the GLG cases and its subsequent manipulation and twisting of rules is an atrocious and disreputable use of the mods use of interpretation of the existing rules. And to me that is a bigger issue than anything that GLG has done, whether he farmed or not.

We rely on the volunteers that make up the C&A to be fair and to do the right thing according to the rules that are set in place to keep order here and allow us to enjoy the site. There must have been alot of pressure to have some results against this player, but I still think that it should have been done within the rules already in place.

Thanks,

J

[codeblue1018]

...
Gen.LeeGettinhed was banned for 1 month as per the situation guidelines for Gross Abuse of Game, which is a major offence. The unofficial term for the particular problem is "Ranching". Simply speaking, it is the case of someone abusing the game by purposefully inviting people who have no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win.

Now, it isn't the fact that he is making these games that resulted in this. It is the fact that he would purposely seek out players with little to no experience on the maps, create the games, and invite them to private matches. This was under the guise of limiting losses, but regardless of the reason, it is still a gross abuse of our gaming system. People will say other players do this. Other players will start games, multiple ones, on maps that they are good at. I myself start 10+ Poland games whenever I get the urge to, as I feel it is my strongest map. But they do not purposely hunt down players who don't understand the maps and invite them under the guise of education, whether there was education or not. Again, this is abusing our system. After examining the situation, it was decided that this indeed did qualify as a Gross Abuse, and the infraction was handed down as per our guidelines. Any questions or comments (within reason), feel free to post in here. The same rules I posted earlier apply though: I won't tolerate any flaming, baiting, or anything of the sort. Keep the remarks clean. Thank you.

This reasoning manufactured specifically to hang this player is utterly ridiculous. For one there is no way you can prove intent or that he purposely invited people with no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win. You are assuming that this is the case. It is only circumstantial evidence that they don't. He may have sought them out but you cannot prove that he did, and for what reasons.

Also, by inventing this interpretation of gross abuse, you set a precedence that allows for any condemnation of anyone who might invite someone to a map that they may not know. I feel that this slippery slope could lead to more reaching by mods to wrap rules around frustrating players rather than enforcing existing rules regularly.

This also does not take into account the rights of the other players to have a game against a player of their choice, be it GLG or some other strong player. There are no rules stating you must have experience on a map or settings before playing said maps or settings, and therefore it is also not against the rules for the opposite either. It is pretty lame to force players to maprank every potential opponent prior to agreeing to a game like an interview.

I don't particularly pay much attention to the antics and fanfare that is GLG nor do I condone any such tactics. But it simply is a fact that the handling of the GLG cases and its subsequent manipulation and twisting of rules is an atrocious and disreputable use of the mods use of interpretation of the existing rules. And to me that is a bigger issue than anything that GLG has done, whether he farmed or not.

We rely on the volunteers that make up the C&A to be fair and to do the right thing according to the rules that are set in place to keep order here and allow us to enjoy the site. There must have been alot of pressure to have some results against this player, but I still think that it should have been done within the rules already in place.

Thanks,

J

Received this yesterday mate; the authors name was removed. If this isn't seeking players out, I'm not sure what is; he clearly took advantage of others mate.

Sent: Wed Jul 11, 2012 12:13 pm
From:
To: codeblue1018 

Hey bro,
When I was a Private, I got a PM from GLG. He invited me to play a speed game. I said I don't know much, just started a month ago. He said, it will be fun, come on...

So I followed into the slaughter.
A. I never played a speed game before. My internet download speed was preschool to his High speed broadband.
B. I played freestyle once prior,
C. I never played City Mogul before...
D. The game was Fog. I had no clue what to do...
E. The game was 1-2 minute speed.

GLG, must be using BOB to see who has not played City Mogul before and ask them to play. I had zero chance of winning. When the game started, I asked him how to play, he said he would tell me in live chat after the game... I told him that this was silly that he should just have a donation box. But I was knew and I thanked him for the game, but inside I was frustrated that he did that to me...

[rhp 1]

...
Gen.LeeGettinhed was banned for 1 month as per the situation guidelines for Gross Abuse of Game, which is a major offence. The unofficial term for the particular problem is "Ranching". Simply speaking, it is the case of someone abusing the game by purposefully inviting people who have no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win.

Now, it isn't the fact that he is making these games that resulted in this. It is the fact that he would purposely seek out players with little to no experience on the maps, create the games, and invite them to private matches. This was under the guise of limiting losses, but regardless of the reason, it is still a gross abuse of our gaming system. People will say other players do this. Other players will start games, multiple ones, on maps that they are good at. I myself start 10+ Poland games whenever I get the urge to, as I feel it is my strongest map. But they do not purposely hunt down players who don't understand the maps and invite them under the guise of education, whether there was education or not. Again, this is abusing our system. After examining the situation, it was decided that this indeed did qualify as a Gross Abuse, and the infraction was handed down as per our guidelines. Any questions or comments (within reason), feel free to post in here. The same rules I posted earlier apply though: I won't tolerate any flaming, baiting, or anything of the sort. Keep the remarks clean. Thank you.

This reasoning manufactured specifically to hang this player is utterly ridiculous. For one there is no way you can prove intent or that he purposely invited people with no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win. You are assuming that this is the case. It is only circumstantial evidence that they don't. He may have sought them out but you cannot prove that he did, and for what reasons.

Also, by inventing this interpretation of gross abuse, you set a precedence that allows for any condemnation of anyone who might invite someone to a map that they may not know. I feel that this slippery slope could lead to more reaching by mods to wrap rules around frustrating players rather than enforcing existing rules regularly.

This also does not take into account the rights of the other players to have a game against a player of their choice, be it GLG or some other strong player. There are no rules stating you must have experience on a map or settings before playing said maps or settings, and therefore it is also not against the rules for the opposite either. It is pretty lame to force players to maprank every potential opponent prior to agreeing to a game like an interview.

I don't particularly pay much attention to the antics and fanfare that is GLG nor do I condone any such tactics. But it simply is a fact that the handling of the GLG cases and its subsequent manipulation and twisting of rules is an atrocious and disreputable use of the mods use of interpretation of the existing rules. And to me that is a bigger issue than anything that GLG has done, whether he farmed or not.

We rely on the volunteers that make up the C&A to be fair and to do the right thing according to the rules that are set in place to keep order here and allow us to enjoy the site. There must have been alot of pressure to have some results against this player, but I still think that it should have been done within the rules already in place.

Thanks,

J

Received this yesterday mate; the authors name was removed. If this isn't seeking players out, I'm not sure what is; he clearly took advantage of others mate.

Sent: Wed Jul 11, 2012 12:13 pm
From:
To: codeblue1018 

Hey bro,
When I was a Private, I got a PM from GLG. He invited me to play a speed game. I said I don't know much, just started a month ago. He said, it will be fun, come on...

So I followed into the slaughter.
A. I never played a speed game before. My internet download speed was preschool to his High speed broadband.
B. I played freestyle once prior,
C. I never played City Mogul before...
D. The game was Fog. I had no clue what to do...
E. The game was 1-2 minute speed.

GLG, must be using BOB to see who has not played City Mogul before and ask them to play. I had zero chance of winning. When the game started, I asked him how to play, he said he would tell me in live chat after the game... I told him that this was silly that he should just have a donation box. But I was knew and I thanked him for the game, but inside I was frustrated that he did that to me...

really? this is your sheep? "must be using BOB"? lmao.. yea.. completely clueless player with g-m add-ons... ok...

[codeblue1018]

RHP,

Apparently you cannot grasp the "point" made here. I would expect better from you, very disappointing

One of many, many cases mate, hence the reason for the warning and now ban. If you have a problem with the "noobs" falling prey to GLG, feel free to do something about it instead of adding useless comments eh.

[jgordon1111]

...
Gen.LeeGettinhed was banned for 1 month as per the situation guidelines for Gross Abuse of Game, which is a major offence. The unofficial term for the particular problem is "Ranching". Simply speaking, it is the case of someone abusing the game by purposefully inviting people who have no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win.

Now, it isn't the fact that he is making these games that resulted in this. It is the fact that he would purposely seek out players with little to no experience on the maps, create the games, and invite them to private matches. This was under the guise of limiting losses, but regardless of the reason, it is still a gross abuse of our gaming system. People will say other players do this. Other players will start games, multiple ones, on maps that they are good at. I myself start 10+ Poland games whenever I get the urge to, as I feel it is my strongest map. But they do not purposely hunt down players who don't understand the maps and invite them under the guise of education, whether there was education or not. Again, this is abusing our system. After examining the situation, it was decided that this indeed did qualify as a Gross Abuse, and the infraction was handed down as per our guidelines. Any questions or comments (within reason), feel free to post in here. The same rules I posted earlier apply though: I won't tolerate any flaming, baiting, or anything of the sort. Keep the remarks clean. Thank you.

This reasoning manufactured specifically to hang this player is utterly ridiculous. For one there is no way you can prove intent or that he purposely invited people with no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win. You are assuming that this is the case. It is only circumstantial evidence that they don't. He may have sought them out but you cannot prove that he did, and for what reasons.

Also, by inventing this interpretation of gross abuse, you set a precedence that allows for any condemnation of anyone who might invite someone to a map that they may not know. I feel that this slippery slope could lead to more reaching by mods to wrap rules around frustrating players rather than enforcing existing rules regularly.

This also does not take into account the rights of the other players to have a game against a player of their choice, be it GLG or some other strong player. There are no rules stating you must have experience on a map or settings before playing said maps or settings, and therefore it is also not against the rules for the opposite either. It is pretty lame to force players to maprank every potential opponent prior to agreeing to a game like an interview.

I don't particularly pay much attention to the antics and fanfare that is GLG nor do I condone any such tactics. But it simply is a fact that the handling of the GLG cases and its subsequent manipulation and twisting of rules is an atrocious and disreputable use of the mods use of interpretation of the existing rules. And to me that is a bigger issue than anything that GLG has done, whether he farmed or not.

We rely on the volunteers that make up the C&A to be fair and to do the right thing according to the rules that are set in place to keep order here and allow us to enjoy the site. There must have been alot of pressure to have some results against this player, but I still think that it should have been done within the rules already in place.

Thanks,

J

Except you missed the posts that were provided with him specifically asking these players to start the games and send him the invites,GLG never denied doing this either,the only defence he put forward was these players had experience and that they invited him. Yes they did at his request.

[lord voldemort]

About time...point reset??

[deathcomesrippin]

All of the games were private. This really is more of a hammer on the head than anything in my opinion as a C&A mod. He refused at any time to make the games public or play anything with anyone outside of his hunting grounds. If the games were public, and anyone could join, then there never would have been an issue. I joined a game of his back in the day, when it was Waterloo, and it was public. Also, I joined a Herpes game when they were public. Both times I was schooled. It is more the fact that he is seeking out opponents who have literally no chance of winning barring some kind of massive dice foolishness. He doesn't just open it up and beat any opponent who comes along. And before someone pipes up with "Well now you are just telling us who we can and can't play", no we are not. We are telling you it isn't ok to seek out people inexperienced in aa game style and constantly invite them for points. Yes, they were captain. A captain who has never played FS City Mogul is essentially an NR when it comes to facing GLG. If they were public, and the captain joined, tough crap. But this is case of tracking these players down, refusing anyone else a game, and playing only those with no shot of winning. THAT is abuse.

Mike Tyson would take on all challengers. He knew he was the best. GLG did not, even though there was probably a good chance he was one of the best on those settings.

EDIT: As for point reset, that currently is not in the scale for this. I wouldn't hold your breath. Seeing as how he gained his conquerer rank from it, I will bring it up though. As for the scoreboard, that is not a C&A issue and outside of this forum I am as powerless as the rest of the community.

[rhp 1]

All of the games were private. This really is more of a hammer on the head than anything in my opinion as a C&A mod. He refused at any time to make the games public or play anything with anyone outside of his hunting grounds. If the games were public, and anyone could join, then there never would have been an issue. I joined a game of his back in the day, when it was Waterloo, and it was public. Also, I joined a Herpes game when they were public. Both times I was schooled. It is more the fact that he is seeking out opponents who have literally no chance of winning barring some kind of massive dice foolishness. He doesn't just open it up and beat any opponent who comes along. And before someone pipes up with "Well now you are just telling us who we can and can't play", no we are not. We are telling you it isn't ok to seek out people inexperienced in aa game style and constantly invite them for points. Yes, they were captain. A captain who has never played FS City Mogul is essentially an NR when it comes to facing GLG. If they were public, and the captain joined, tough crap. But this is case of tracking these players down, refusing anyone else a game, and playing only those with no shot of winning. THAT is abuse.

Mike Tyson would take on all challengers. He knew he was the best. GLG did not, even though there was probably a good chance he was one of the best on those settings.

agree with most of what you said... I will always stick to the fact that these players... any of them, at anytime could have said no and CHOSE TO SAY YES... they are not NR's... they are players with some experience... that said, if you think it's abuse, fine.. not my site, not my say.. knock yourself out...

And if you think boxers, tyson included, took on anyone who wanted to fight them, then you know little about boxing... boxers control who they compete against more than any other sport that comes to mind... but that's for a different forum...

[jghost7]

...
Gen.LeeGettinhed was banned for 1 month as per the situation guidelines for Gross Abuse of Game, which is a major offence. The unofficial term for the particular problem is "Ranching". Simply speaking, it is the case of someone abusing the game by purposefully inviting people who have no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win.

Now, it isn't the fact that he is making these games that resulted in this. It is the fact that he would purposely seek out players with little to no experience on the maps, create the games, and invite them to private matches. This was under the guise of limiting losses, but regardless of the reason, it is still a gross abuse of our gaming system. People will say other players do this. Other players will start games, multiple ones, on maps that they are good at. I myself start 10+ Poland games whenever I get the urge to, as I feel it is my strongest map. But they do not purposely hunt down players who don't understand the maps and invite them under the guise of education, whether there was education or not. Again, this is abusing our system. After examining the situation, it was decided that this indeed did qualify as a Gross Abuse, and the infraction was handed down as per our guidelines. Any questions or comments (within reason), feel free to post in here. The same rules I posted earlier apply though: I won't tolerate any flaming, baiting, or anything of the sort. Keep the remarks clean. Thank you.

This reasoning manufactured specifically to hang this player is utterly ridiculous. For one there is no way you can prove intent or that he purposely invited people with no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win. You are assuming that this is the case. It is only circumstantial evidence that they don't. He may have sought them out but you cannot prove that he did, and for what reasons.

Also, by inventing this interpretation of gross abuse, you set a precedence that allows for any condemnation of anyone who might invite someone to a map that they may not know. I feel that this slippery slope could lead to more reaching by mods to wrap rules around frustrating players rather than enforcing existing rules regularly.

This also does not take into account the rights of the other players to have a game against a player of their choice, be it GLG or some other strong player. There are no rules stating you must have experience on a map or settings before playing said maps or settings, and therefore it is also not against the rules for the opposite either. It is pretty lame to force players to maprank every potential opponent prior to agreeing to a game like an interview.

I don't particularly pay much attention to the antics and fanfare that is GLG nor do I condone any such tactics. But it simply is a fact that the handling of the GLG cases and its subsequent manipulation and twisting of rules is an atrocious and disreputable use of the mods use of interpretation of the existing rules. And to me that is a bigger issue than anything that GLG has done, whether he farmed or not.

We rely on the volunteers that make up the C&A to be fair and to do the right thing according to the rules that are set in place to keep order here and allow us to enjoy the site. There must have been alot of pressure to have some results against this player, but I still think that it should have been done within the rules already in place.

Thanks,

J

Except you missed the posts that were provided with him specifically asking these players to start the games and send him the invites,GLG never denied doing this either,the only defence he put forward was these players had experience and that they invited him. Yes they did at his request.

No, I did not miss that, however there is nothing wrong with him asking if they would like a game. DCR said that he "purposefully invited people who have no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win." What I am referring to is that they cannot say that he mapranked each opponent and only invited those with little or no experience, they only suspect it. Now they expand beyond NR's and even beyond the lower ranks to include more veteran players. If the map and settings are the issue then ban them instead of the player. It goes too far to have a ban based on a maprank of individual maps of every player he plays.

It is just too much. It would be much better to address the problem globally through the site rather than try to micromanage the players by bending and adding interpretations as we go. It is obviously a symptom of the failure of the scoring system that CC uses. I know that there have been many attempts to address this in suggestions, including josko's new suggestion, but nothing has come from them as yet.


Thanks,

J

[deathcomesrippin]

All of the games were private. This really is more of a hammer on the head than anything in my opinion as a C&A mod. He refused at any time to make the games public or play anything with anyone outside of his hunting grounds. If the games were public, and anyone could join, then there never would have been an issue. I joined a game of his back in the day, when it was Waterloo, and it was public. Also, I joined a Herpes game when they were public. Both times I was schooled. It is more the fact that he is seeking out opponents who have literally no chance of winning barring some kind of massive dice foolishness. He doesn't just open it up and beat any opponent who comes along. And before someone pipes up with "Well now you are just telling us who we can and can't play", no we are not. We are telling you it isn't ok to seek out people inexperienced in aa game style and constantly invite them for points. Yes, they were captain. A captain who has never played FS City Mogul is essentially an NR when it comes to facing GLG. If they were public, and the captain joined, tough crap. But this is case of tracking these players down, refusing anyone else a game, and playing only those with no shot of winning. THAT is abuse.

Mike Tyson would take on all challengers. He knew he was the best. GLG did not, even though there was probably a good chance he was one of the best on those settings.

agree with most of what you said... I will always stick to the fact that these players... any of them, at anytime could have said no and CHOSE TO SAY YES... they are not NR's... they are players with some experience... that said, if you think it's abuse, fine.. not my site, not my say.. knock yourself out...

And if you think boxers, tyson included, took on anyone who wanted to fight them, then you know little about boxing... boxers control who they compete against more than any other sport that comes to mind... but that's for a different forum...

Tyson was both arrogant and insane. He probably would have accepted a challenge from most people

That being said, I am now trolling my own case. Let me back away from this.

For the record, I would like to thank everyone for keeping a clear head about all of this and not posting any slurs or negative comments. I know there are differing sides, and we all in C&A appreciate the support whether you agree or disagree with the ruling.

[Serbia]

I think this ruling is spot-on. Thank you, DCR and the rest of the C&A Team.

[jgordon1111]

Now I understand what you were saying jghost,and I agree with you for the most part. As you say no way to tell if he map ranked them for sure,If not he got real lucky in picking his opponents.

As DCR pointed out if he would have played a few open games this would have been a different story.

Oddly enough I agree DCR,GLG on that map with those settings could have probably held his own against a large percentage of CC.

That he did not choose public games showes he cared more about the number 1 spot,than he did about competition.

I had a few conversations with GLG, I expressed my opinion and he told me his on a few issues.

It comes down to this I dont like farming or ranching of any sort, But you have to give GLG this,the single minded focus to play those games,find those players,convince them to play a map they knew the had zero chance on,well thats focus,keeping your eye on the prize. Think about it,that had to have got boring after a while just for six to sixteen points. He could have probably been one of the best players on this site if he had kept it on the up and up.

[HighlanderAttack]

All of the games were private. This really is more of a hammer on the head than anything in my opinion as a C&A mod. He refused at any time to make the games public or play anything with anyone outside of his hunting grounds. If the games were public, and anyone could join, then there never would have been an issue. I joined a game of his back in the day, when it was Waterloo, and it was public. Also, I joined a Herpes game when they were public. Both times I was schooled. It is more the fact that he is seeking out opponents who have literally no chance of winning barring some kind of massive dice foolishness. He doesn't just open it up and beat any opponent who comes along. And before someone pipes up with "Well now you are just telling us who we can and can't play", no we are not. We are telling you it isn't ok to seek out people inexperienced in aa game style and constantly invite them for points. Yes, they were captain. A captain who has never played FS City Mogul is essentially an NR when it comes to facing GLG. If they were public, and the captain joined, tough crap. But this is case of tracking these players down, refusing anyone else a game, and playing only those with no shot of winning. THAT is abuse.

Mike Tyson would take on all challengers. He knew he was the best. GLG did not, even though there was probably a good chance he was one of the best on those settings.

EDIT: As for point reset, that currently is not in the scale for this. I wouldn't hold your breath. Seeing as how he gained his conquerer rank from it, I will bring it up though. As for the scoreboard, that is not a C&A issue and outside of this forum I am as powerless as the rest of the community.

I know of at least a few players that do this regularly--they just do not do it to the scale of conqueror. With a tool like map rank--it is not very hard. I personally would get no enjoyment of winning like that as it would not be fun. This does open up for a lot more C&A. I personally do not care either way--but it is ironic that this is probably a very wide spread infraction that occurs more often than not.

[jghost7]

All of the games were private. This really is more of a hammer on the head than anything in my opinion as a C&A mod. He refused at any time to make the games public or play anything with anyone outside of his hunting grounds. If the games were public, and anyone could join, then there never would have been an issue. ...

If they were public, and the captain joined, tough crap. But this is case of tracking these players down, refusing anyone else a game, and playing only those with no shot of winning. THAT is abuse.

There is no rule in place dictating that there are any requirements regarding the use for private games. It is his option to choose who he plays with. He is certainly a notorious CC celebrity that plenty of players would like to take shots at, but I don't think that he has to accept games he doesn't want to in order to satisfy the mob about abuse. It is also not against the rules to decline games. The players he does choose to play have the option to decline as well, but instead have chosen to play. Now their decisions to play are belittled and are not even given weight in the case. You are basically saying that he is not permitted to play those maps and settings, unless he plays it our way.

And before someone pipes up with "Well now you are just telling us who we can and can't play", no we are not. We are telling you it isn't ok to seek out people inexperienced in aa game style and constantly invite them for points. Yes, they were captain. A captain who has never played FS City Mogul is essentially an NR when it comes to facing GLG.

Actually, that is exactly what you are intimating. Also it is irresponsible of you to state that you can make a NR out of a player who is not a New Recruit. This whole line of reasoning is flawed and is only used to try to link it to the farming rule that was already in place. That statement shows that this whole ruling was created specifically for GLG and that it was a desperate move to try to pin a scarlet letter on this player who it was stated by his antagonists to be untouchable. Think about it, a rule with a players name in it...This red statement sums up CC's attempt at justice, a slanted statement based on your opinion on who you think he should be playing. It is insulting, and in no way should that captain be compared to a New Recruit. It is not accurate or fair, nor does it reflect the aforementioned captains right to choose to have a game with GLG.


Thanks,

J

[Evolution299]

WOW.

This could be the most controversial decision made in a long time. Personally I like it. GLG is a used car salesman, and he finally has been punished for abusing the website and its patrons.

[lynch5762]

What a strange situation this is because I actually agree with both sides of the argument here. This is a very thin line and it is hard to determine the best way to draw the "line" in a way that everyone understands and agrees with.

For the record, I am pleased with the ruling. That being said, I also wholeheartedly understand what jghost is trying to say and that is where the slippery slope lies. I will go on record to say that I totally disagree with the way that GLG chooses to approach the game. IMHO... It is disturbing and he displays a predator type of mentality. I am quite certain that this is appalling to many and also the reason behind him getting so much attention.

On the other side of the coin... It is sad that people had to resort to loose interpretations of the rules just to try and curb this behavior. I would just hate to see this result in countless C & A reports that would pointlessly bog down the system.

Again I will state that his way of thinking is disturbing to me, and to be honest with you, I am pretty stunned that the public humiliation was not enough to curb the behavior. This reminds of way more disturbing situations in our societies but I will not dare to go there.

I guess the only point that I would make is this: I still feel like the scoring and ranking system is set up in a way to allow this. I am not sure that there is anything that can be done but for the sake of CC... we should try (Note: that last statement can also be said for the other most popular C & A report at the moment)

[deathcomesrippin]

All of the games were private. This really is more of a hammer on the head than anything in my opinion as a C&A mod. He refused at any time to make the games public or play anything with anyone outside of his hunting grounds. If the games were public, and anyone could join, then there never would have been an issue. ...

If they were public, and the captain joined, tough crap. But this is case of tracking these players down, refusing anyone else a game, and playing only those with no shot of winning. THAT is abuse.

There is no rule in place dictating that there are any requirements regarding the use for private games. It is his option to choose who he plays with. He is certainly a notorious CC celebrity that plenty of players would like to take shots at, but I don't think that he has to accept games he doesn't want to in order to satisfy the mob about abuse. It is also not against the rules to decline games. The players he does choose to play have the option to decline as well, but instead have chosen to play. Now their decisions to play are belittled and are not even given weight in the case. You are basically saying that he is not permitted to play those maps and settings, unless he plays it our way.

And before someone pipes up with "Well now you are just telling us who we can and can't play", no we are not. We are telling you it isn't ok to seek out people inexperienced in aa game style and constantly invite them for points. Yes, they were captain. A captain who has never played FS City Mogul is essentially an NR when it comes to facing GLG.

Actually, that is exactly what you are intimating. Also it is irresponsible of you to state that you can make a NR out of a player who is not a New Recruit. This whole line of reasoning is flawed and is only used to try to link it to the farming rule that was already in place. That statement shows that this whole ruling was created specifically for GLG and that it was a desperate move to try to pin a scarlet letter on this player who it was stated by his antagonists to be untouchable. Think about it, a rule with a players name in it...This red statement sums up CC's attempt at justice, a slanted statement based on your opinion on who you think he should be playing. It is insulting, and in no way should that captain be compared to a New Recruit. It is not accurate or fair, nor does it reflect the aforementioned captains right to choose to have a game with GLG.


Thanks,

J

Purposely going out of your way to track down players who have little to no experience playing on your gaming style, then getting them to set up a private match so no one better or more experienced can join, is an abuse of the gaming system. It is an abuse in any organized system to prey on the weak, unless there is a certain amount of sadism involved. As stated previously, if he would have just created public matches, not even all of them needed to be public, we are not banning private matches, this probably never would have been an issue. Would he be conquerer if he would have taken on anyone? Who knows, he didn't bother to accept any challenges and he also didn't bother listening to his first warning. As much as I appreciate both sides of the case, the truth is it has happened, and now we move forward from here. This will add to our caseload. Of course it will. But, like all of our precedent setting cases, this will mark a new step in keeping the game clear of exploitation and rule-breaking. There is no doubt that this was an exploit. Whether it was his fault or not originally, he was issued a warning about continuing the behavior. He chose to ignore that warning and attempted to circumvent it. This resulted in his ban. If you don't agree with it I allowed for people to post here, and will continue to do so until tomorrow, at which point this will be closed. A warning in and of itself simply means if you do it again, you suffer for it. If you don't, the warning simply sits there. He could have gone on for the rest of this sites' lifespan without another issue if he simply would have stopped it, regardless of his own feelings about it. The warning was issued, he ignored it, now he has taken his medicine.

[Woodruff]

Also, by inventing this interpretation of gross abuse, you set a precedence that allows for any condemnation of anyone who might invite someone to a map that they may not know. I feel that this slippery slope could lead to more reaching by mods to wrap rules around frustrating players rather than enforcing existing rules regularly.

You have a valid concern here. However, I DON'T believe this sets the precedent you refer to simply because of the enormous number of instances of his doing this (between his first warning and this second ruling in which he was clearly flaunting the first warning). It seems to me that the vast number of instances does in fact overwhelm the need for caution regarding precedence.

This also does not take into account the rights of the other players to have a game against a player of their choice, be it GLG or some other strong player. There are no rules stating you must have experience on a map or settings before playing said maps or settings, and therefore it is also not against the rules for the opposite either. It is pretty lame to force players to maprank every potential opponent prior to agreeing to a game like an interview.

I don't believe this does anything of the sort. Again, the number of instances combined with the fairly recent warning for what is essentially the same thing is the point.

[Jdsizzleslice]

I apologize. I did not explain to anyone apart from GLG why he was given a ban. I will now, and we will see if it is ok with everyone. I am also going to unlock the thread, allow for people to post their (respectful) thoughts and comments, and attempt to answer them as much as I can.

Gen.LeeGettinhed was banned for 1 month as per the situation guidelines for Gross Abuse of Game, which is a major offence. The unofficial term for the particular problem is "Ranching". Simply speaking, it is the case of someone abusing the game by purposefully inviting people who have no experience with certain settings to guarantee a win.

Now, it isn't the fact that he is making these games that resulted in this. It is the fact that he would purposely seek out players with little to no experience on the maps, create the games, and invite them to private matches. This was under the guise of limiting losses, but regardless of the reason, it is still a gross abuse of our gaming system. People will say other players do this. Other players will start games, multiple ones, on maps that they are good at. I myself start 10+ Poland games whenever I get the urge to, as I feel it is my strongest map. But they do not purposely hunt down players who don't understand the maps and invite them under the guise of education, whether there was education or not. Again, this is abusing our system. After examining the situation, it was decided that this indeed did qualify as a Gross Abuse, and the infraction was handed down as per our guidelines. Any questions or comments (within reason), feel free to post in here. The same rules I posted earlier apply though: I won't tolerate any flaming, baiting, or anything of the sort. Keep the remarks clean. Thank you.

FINALLYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

[Swimmerdude99]

*applause*

[jltile1]

jltile1 wrote:
Simple as this. . .


if you telling someone the map and setting to make you are there setting up the game right?
-NO. creating the game is setting the game up
-someone else creating the game is THEM setting it up
-what I do now is JOIN their game
. . . please use a dictionary

Now why if you want to play a game with those setting would you not just create it and put it up as a waiting speed game?
-because someone like a CCCW member would join, and I don't like them
-AND I can get distracted, and forget it is set up. . .has happened

Unless you want a certain player to play your game right?
-NO.
-the certain players I WANT to join are female, naked and local.
-but I'll play people I think are friendly and beatable. no rule against that. It's called "Point management"

NEXT!. . .

He clearly says it here he want to play people that are beatable, not a good game or fair game this is the point. He also states that they are friendly how would he know ?

This was a very good decision but further more he should loose points at least all the farmed games and maybe should just be reset. Now if he is worthy of being on top he can just get them right back fair and square. I'm glad something was done and this abuse should of never taking place Great job.

[jefjef]

you set a precedence that allows for any condemnation of anyone who might invite someone to a map that they may not know. I feel that this slippery slope could lead to more reaching by mods to wrap rules around frustrating players rather than enforcing existing rules regularly.

Not at all. Large difference between a few invited games and 5000 points worth of invited games...

[agentcom]

This thread has been interesting to follow despite my severe distaste for all things GLG (detractors, stop smiling, you're included, too). That said, I generally agree with this ruling. The extremely selective way of picking opponents was just too much. But that is a very difficult thing for a person like me to say. I like and support the brightline standards that exist and wish that more would be implemented.

More importantly, but along the same lines, I sincerely appreciate the C&A staff taking the time to explain such a monumental ruling (as far as CC goes). The lack of explanation can be frustrating at times, but here we have a mod volunteering to take the time to have a little Q&A after the fact. Respect.

[jghost7]

Purposely going out of your way to track down players who have little to no experience playing on your gaming style, then getting them to set up a private match so no one better or more experienced can join, is an abuse of the gaming system.

A. You cannot prove that he tracked down players who have little to no experience on his gaming style.
B. A private match has nothing to do with abuse. It just allows for him to play his match with his consensually agreed partner.
C. Not playing a public match is not a requirement of CC, nor does it constitute abuse.

...As stated previously, if he would have just created public matches, not even all of them needed to be public, we are not banning private matches, this probably never would have been an issue.

Once again, not playing a public match is not a requirement of CC, nor does it constitute abuse. Why is he required by CC law to engage in a public match?

Would he be conquerer if he would have taken on anyone?

I don't believe this has anything to do with the alleged abuse. It is simply a product of maintaining the highest score on CC. Everyone knows that this does not necessarily equate to game skill.

Who knows, he didn't bother to accept any challenges...

Accepting challenges is not a requirement of CC nor of holding the title of conqueror. If being conqueror is perceived as being part of the problem, then why is something not done to work on the scoring system or the conqueror title itself?

...and he also didn't bother listening to his first warning.

I think he did. I think that it is possible that he likes his style of play and tried to enjoy his time but with higher ranked players as rank was evidently a main part of his warning. But evidently, everyone is a potential NR, so he was set up from the start. I believe you should have been more specific from the start to make a better warning. In essence, you should have just warned him off his preferred map and settings and have been done with it.

... this will mark a new step in keeping the game clear of exploitation and rule-breaking.

Yep, it seems fill in the blank rules could be the new vogue here at CC. One won't know the rule they break till after they receive their warning. More and more invented rules to patch a system sorely in need of an upgrade, making maneuvering the CC rule minefield an interesting dance.

There is no doubt that this was an exploit.

Hmmm...I do think there is some room for doubt.

Whether it was his fault or not originally, he was issued a warning about continuing the behavior. He chose to ignore that warning and attempted to circumvent it. This resulted in his ban.

He apparently tried to work within the guidelines that were set within his warning. I just think that the warning was dodgy from the start and not written clearly enough. Probably should have been something like this: You are forthwith banned from using X maps with Y settings. Any attempt to use these without the express written consent of the ruling counsel of mods is prohibited and will result in your escalation of your warning to a ban. ...because that is mostly what it works out to.




Thanks,

J