Get Rich from the Bank [5/12] Town Wins!

[MoB Deadly]

Im going to attempt to keep my post short and sweet. Iron Butterfly I see your points about the bus driver, but I definitely think you are wrong. I don't understand why you got this vendetta on Rodion all of a sudden. In my eyes Rodion has not done anything wrong. However, I did not think Iron was mafia either before his claim. I think it was a misunderstanding that snowballed very quickly, I don't know why we are attacking each other so much in this game!

However, the claim is suspect in my eyes

[color=#0040FF]I am Maggie Silver Vanilla Townie

Your character is named the three other deaths were (ignoring roles)
- Bodybuilder
- Husband Eric
- Wife Ginger

These are all sort of jobs (well they're not v. obvious jobs) but my roles is a job as well so I'm not going to unvote but lets some other people throw their hat into the ring before I go all in on a lynch.

My role does not have a name associated with it either. So, it is a low risk lynch to lynch butterfly since he is not a power role and we can potentially get scum. But before the claim I did not get scum vibes, only vibes that he has a personal problem with Rodion at the moment.

My post from page 15 - It looks like I may have misinterpreted Jontys soft claim of a bank job. I thought he did not have a name, but maybe he does. I however, do not have a character name

[Iron Butterfly]

If you dont have a power/skill and you dont have a name. Then claim.

stop beating around the bush

[MoB Deadly]

I'm a "Teller" Town - By that I deduce I am a bank teller.

[Leitz]

What does a bank teller do in real life? Does that mean you can read tells? Can you tell who is mafia? :p

[MoB Deadly]

Bank Tellers are the ones that help customers out at the front desk. No, I have no night action

[Leitz]

You didn't get a special name? You just got told you were "Teller" Town?

That leaves only sundog on my gut feelings FOS list.. MoB, does your vote still stand on him or have you unvoted?

[MoB Deadly]

No, theres more to it, but I was hoping that what I have claimed so far was enough to clear me for at least right now. If it's not I will fully claim, but I would really prefer not to.

I have not unvoted but I don't know if he is the scummiest. I haven't put all my efforts into figuring out how there could be so many actions last night if me and IB claim to have no actions.

[Iron Butterfly]

Ok. I am going to give Mob the benifit of the doubt for several reasons.

Sundog had been pretty much invisible the whole game. Sure from time to time he pops up and offers his to cents but mostly his posts have been in stating the obvious or talking about stuff that has no relevance.

After the Night results I strted second guessing everyone. There are 4 people on my list to choose from. Mob and Sundog where at the top. I dont beleive Zimmah was lieing about his investigation on Lietz. This is a Team game. Zimmah wins if town wins.
I beleive Zimmah wants Town to win regardless of how the game played out for him.

Mob hasnt made alot of posts of late but I understand why. These games can suck the energy out of you.. He has been modding games and playing several games. I have had my doubts about him at times but I have read his posts thorougly and they convince me that he has the towns best interest.

Cat I beleive is Town just from her early play and severl things she has said. She has been absent as of late as well. I think most folks got burnt from all the drama. No one likes to be cursed at or called names. I know I dont.

Could I be wrong? Yup. But we need to make a choice sooner or later.

VOTE SUNDOG

[Leitz]

I completely agree with you IB although I'm still not completely convinced about MoB. He has popped to the surface again lately and had valid reasons for his absence so that, like IB said, will give him the benefit of doubt.

Initially I voted for sundog, if I step up again and vote for him that would put him at L-1 I think, maybe a bit too risky in case someone speed hammers him. He has been prodded and did promise us a case + vote today/tomorrow so depending on that I will cast my vote on him again or not.

[skillfusniper33]

Quick Vote Count:

sundog (2) - Mob, IB L-2

With 6 alive it takes 4 for a lynch

[catnipdreams]

yowza - I just spent several HOURS re-reading all the posts...

And I wish I had a clever case against someone, from carefully gleaned snippets that clearly say "Mafia!" No such joy.

IB - I am fairly convinced he is not Mafia, but he could be third party, and not have town's best interests at heart.

Leitz - I had forgotten that Zimmah could still "win" if Town wins, so I am now less suspicious of Leitz. Zimmah's investigation could have been messed with in some fashion, or Zimmah could have been in such a rage when he posted that he gave us the wrong information, so I'm not totally convinced about Leitz being town, but it seems likely that he is.

sundog - I just don't know - I'm 50/50 here. I'd like to hear more from him.

MoB - same as sundog; i just don't know.

deuce - I am really wondering here about deuce - his posts have been unhelpful. However, he was revived after the night kills, at least in the story line, so I think someone else is definitely mafia, otherwise who made the night kill? One possibility is that Rodion made the night kill before he was mod killed... But I do believe that deuce's role has been altered, and I am suspicious that it was altered in an anti-town fashion.

So I am left with the same two choices that others have come down to: sundog or MoB. I would really like to hear from them both, and at length, before casting my vote.

[Iron Butterfly]

yowza - I just spent several HOURS re-reading all the posts...

And I wish I had a clever case against someone, from carefully gleaned snippets that clearly say "Mafia!" No such joy.
I am still a begginer. Many times its the small things that add up. Even those small things can make us look wrong. lol I wish there was an easy way. Look at my case against Rodion. It was a small thing that made me latch on. Look at what he did to make me look like a best case to lynch

IB - I am fairly convinced he is not Mafia, but he could be third party, and not have town's best interests at heart.
I have to agree. I can not disprove i am Town. what we have is others records such as vting patterns and how we interact. One of the main reasons I beleive Mob is his exchange with Rodion when they where discussing Zimmahs crazy claim. Rodion subtlly suggested that Nob "speed hammered" Zimmah slyly implying that Mob may be Mafia. Rodion knew Zimmah would turn town

Leitz - I had forgotten that Zimmah could still "win" if Town wins, so I am now less suspicious of Leitz. Zimmah's investigation could have been messed with in some fashion, or Zimmah could have been in such a rage when he posted that he gave us the wrong information, so I'm not totally convinced about Leitz being town, but it seems likely that he is.
I do not beleive Zimmah would post the wrong info to screw Town. By doing so he would create a bad reputation in the CC Mafia community. He was emotional but I do not beleive he would go to that length


sundog - I just don't know - I'm 50/50 here. I'd like to hear more from him.

MoB - same as sundog; i just don't know.

deuce - I am really wondering here about deuce - his posts have been unhelpful. However, he was revived after the night kills, at least in the story line, so I think someone else is definitely mafia, otherwise who made the night kill? One possibility is that Rodion made the night kill before he was mod killed... But I do believe that deuce's role has been altered, and I am suspicious that it was altered in an anti-town fashion.

So I am left with the same two choices that others have come down to: sundog or MoB. I would really like to hear from them both, and at length, before casting my vote.

I agree that we need to hear from Sundog. I will tell you somthing about playing Mafia. You will never be fully sure until someone is dead. I thought for sure Zimmah was mafia. There were indeed times I wondered if I was wrong about Rodion. Hindsight is 20/20 as they say.

If you second guess yourself to much youll just drive yourself crazy. Sometimes you just have to choose with the information availiable.

[Sundog308]

I know how you feel Cat, I just spent an hour sifting through the last day as well. If I join another Mafia game I'll have to consider dropping out of my clan first to make the time available!

Note: If you wish to skip my logic and go straight to the heart of my thoughts, scroll straight down to the bottom of this post where the text is all in color.

Now to the game.

After an hour of sifting and note-taking, and cross-checking I will offer up some thoughts on the game and on various players:

The Night Scene
During the night scene there were two individuals killed within the game (I'm not including Rodion because he was killed by an outside force - the Mod, otherwise known as God). I don't believe that mafia would have killed mafia unless there was a busdriver involved... which still seems iffy. So, for now, we'll assume mafia killed Maximumbandit. But that means someone else had to kill Jonty, who flipped as mafia. Although it could make sense that Deuces did the killing as a revenge for the 'lover' death, I don't think that was the case. Deuces was not revived until after Jonty was killed. That leaves, most likely, a third party killer.

For the remaining six players in the game, I think there is:

1 - Mafia
1 - Third Party
4 - Town


Deuces
He frustrates me a little at this point. He's offered nothing concrete and useful to the discussion, even after a couple different players have requested that he bring something to the table. It feels like he is sure everyone else is convinced he is town, so he can just coast the rest of the way through the game knowing he won't be lynched. The sad part is I think he is right. Although Sniper did not specify the role when "wife Ginger" came back to life, I don't see any reason she would have switched allegiances. I think it most likely that the "Survivor" part of her role meant that whenever/however she was killed, she had the chance to come back to life again. Although I would like to see Deuces lynched because he is bringing nothing to the game, I don't think that is a good call at this point. I believe he remains Town.

Iron Butterfly
I do not believe Iron Butterfly is Mafia, but I also do not believe he is Town. Without rehashing the first 20 pages, he and Rodion went back and forth in a fight to the death - the WIFOM, if you will. The argument benefitted Rodion at the time because it helped him cast suspicion on many other individuals, while allowing him a slight degree of control over the game. Excellent strategy for mafia. I think the argument benefitted IB because he was a third party player. His role doesn't care if town gets hanged, 3rd parties normally have their own motives, not Town's survival, as a win condition. I've come to the conclusion of IB being third party also because of his posts from Day 3.

- He claimed an innocent town role very early on.
- He answered my question about Leitz being investigated by Zimmah with a resounding No!
- He posted the WIFOM argument (which was a pleasant break from the game, thank you).
- He also posted the extensive reasoning on why the percentages of mafia vs town should matter to us
- He tried to point out that Deuces was third party even though his role posted by Sniper says town.
- He then tries to push Mob to claim because Mob has been quiet for D3.

I am Town. I would not have argued with Rodion the way I did if I was Mafia. He would not let me go because he knew I was right about him and I had him pegged.

I don't agree with the way he played his role, but in the end he did turn town and he did investigate me the first night.

Quick noob question. Does the person being investigated normally know that they have been investigated?

No!

3 mafia would be 25% of Population.
Poisoner/survivor combined with mafia would be more then 33% for game balance..however that is offset by the duo being connected. You kill one and the other dies.

At the start of the game there were 5 people vs 7 town,

we have 2 confirmed dead mafia plus the lovers=4 we have still out there 1 more.

He has also declined to extensively respond to several of Leitz's requests for further explanations of his suspicions and his interpretations of the Night kills. I can't really quote examples here, because, well... he didn't say anything.

I think these all add up to equal IB muddying up the waters just enough to hide himself as a 3rd party killer. That said, IB will not get my vote for lynch because Town doesn't normally win by killing off third parties, they win be eliminating mafia. (Someone please correct me if I'm wrong on the win conditions!)

That leaves Cat, Leitz, and Mob.

Leitz
He has consistently tried to push us back on track by voting for me, or pushing suspicion my way.

Just to get things back on track again: I have a slight suspicion on Sundog being the third mafia player. It's a guts feeling, nothing in particular..

I suggest we get back on topic and find the last mafia and make this a town win! I am though keeping catnips correct suspicion of the event that wife "Ginger" might have come back as a mafia. But as this is snipers first mod came, I'm more keen to believe she was just unconscious or something like that..

I think IB, catnip & deuces to be town, so that leaves MoB & sundog. To get things going:

Unvote, vote sundog

He also believed that IB and I have some sort of connection.

Like I said, because this is snipers first mafia game as a mod I believe the setup to be rather simple. The return of wife Ginger was I believe more like an awaking after being unconscious after she found her husband dead. There is a possibility she returned as scum, but because of the first time mod I didn't really think that would be the case. I'm keeping it in mind, but for now am not taking it into account. That's why I choice sundog over Deuce.

The way you've been protecting sundog I'm thinking the both of you also have a connection. Not taking in consideration deuces possible turn of camps, there is one mafia left. So that would make the both of you town.

Unvote

I don't think this adds up to a clear indication of mafia or town for Leitz. He could be trying to set me up because I'm a likely suspect for the town to lynch, but he could also be just a townie looking to eliminate suspects. He's clearly suspicious of me, but that doesn't mean I'm going to rush to hang him.

Catnipdreams
Cat has played a fairly consistent game. True he did slow down a bit near the end as well, but all his other comments have been useful, insightful and brought actual content to the game. He hasn't ever really argued hard one way or the other, but always kept looking for more facts. Early on I believed he could likely be the cop, but that proved to be incorrect.
(And Cat, could you help with some confusion I am having. I can't tell from the way you write, or from your avatar or from your signature as to what your gender is. If you don't mind, would you let me know how you would prefer to referred to in gender: 'he' or 'she'? Of course, 'your awesomeness', would be considered as well.)
That leaves....

Mob Deadly
Although Mob initially started to defend me today,

Just to get things back on track again: I have a slight suspicion on Sundog being the third mafia player. It's a guts feeling, nothing in particular..

I had those same thoughts initially, but there are a lot of things that convinced me that hes town now. Ill look for quotes that shifted my thoughts on him

he quickly changed those thoughts when the Sundog Bandwagon became available, and then proceeded to drop out of the conversation. I don't want to vote on him because of real life getting busy though. I understand that all too well myself.
I will vote for him because he has been around just enough to be noticed, but not enough to be suspicious. When he did post, he posted enough to bring up another point for discussion, but not enough to really take a stance. But the key for me was his behavior at the end of Day 2.

I made a post indicating that I would reveal my thoughts and my vote soon:

I have some thoughts to post, but won't get them on here until my lunch break - in about three hours. I do believe at that time I will have a vote as well.

Could we get Skill to do another post confirming the lynching status? I think both Zimmah and IB are at L-2 right now?

I followed up as I promised, posting my thoughts and placing a vote on Zimmah. Mob followed my post with the hammer vote on Zimmah a mere 4 minutes later. That's FOUR minutes later.

vote Zimmah Thats a lynch.

Its very very probable Rodion is scum as well.

I think he also fingered Rodion, knowing that if we lynched IB and IB came back non-mafia, that would lead us to lynch Rodion. But since Rodion had already played out his hand in the argument to the death with IB, Mob stood to gain the most by aligning himself with town to gain trust through the rest of the game.

To sum up:
1 - mafia - Mob
1 - third party - IB
4 - town - the rest of us

Vote Mob Deadly

As for my role, I'm not prepared to claim, but I will admit to holding a Town power role, although I don't believe it would fall into one of the "traditional" power roles we would expect in a mods first game.

[catnipdreams]

Cat I beleive is Town just from her early play and severl things she has said. She has been absent as of late as well. I think most folks got burnt from all the drama. No one likes to be cursed at or called names. I know I dont.

It was a combination of recovering from all the drama, and trying to find time to wade through all the posts. I hope to have a better note taking system in place for future games!

If you second guess yourself to much youll just drive yourself crazy. Sometimes you just have to choose with the information availiable.

I also appreciated the WIFOM link

(And Cat, could you help with some confusion I am having. I can't tell from the way you write, or from your avatar or from your signature as to what your gender is. If you don't mind, would you let me know how you would prefer to referred to in gender: 'he' or 'she'? Of course, 'your awesomeness', would be considered as well.)

"your awesomeness" would be quite pleasant! I am female; I'm so used to being referred to on CC as a guy, that I barely register it anymore. I would correct folks in chat when I was new, but just gave up after a while. Although, "gg, gents" still grabs my attention - that's so much more male than "gg, guys"

So, at this point, I am waiting on MoB to post, and I totally get the irl constraints, so no pressure MoB to post in the next hour or two. Next day or two, though, would be nice.

[Iron Butterfly]

Ill make this easy for the lazy person.

viewforum.php?f=610

Here are the archives of CC mafia games.

You will not have 5 anti Town roles plus a survivor linked to one of them in a twelve man game. You will ususlly have 3 mafia and a third party at most. Now granted this is Snipers first game but I beleive he had the game checked for balance issues before hand.

In fact Safariguy checked the balance issues and hes A1 as far as all things Mafia on this site. He is the go to guy for game balance.

Second Sundog makes no mention of Town possibly having a night kill ability which is a very very strong possibility. We also have a Doc out there some where. Doc you know who you are.

The facts I posted about Game set up was there for a reason. It was not to mislead but to inform!

The fact that Safariguy double checked for game balance tells me there is one person at most left.

[Leitz]

Alright, some more action, love it!

Minus the drama what exactly do you consider "simple" about the set up so far?

When I initially voted for sundog at the beginning of D2 IB wasn't convinced about my believes that deuces would probably be town again as I thought the setup would be simple seeing this is snipers first mod game. In his defense against both catnip and sundog accusing him of being third party he brings up the fact that this is snipers first mod game and that it must balanced because safari checked it. It might be a small detail, but his change of mind might be because they both are spot on and IB is a third party in the end.

As this is only my second mafia game I have no idea what possible objectives a third party can have. Is it surviving? Is it winning if a specific person is lynched?

About Deuce I can't say much more than this: useless player. He's about as bad as eagleblade. If he pops up he doesn't bring anything useful to the game. In the end though I believe he is a town player so lynching him would not bring us anything helpful besides going to the next day with a mafia night kill too so that has to be avoided.

The problem I have with MoB Deadly is the fact that he jumped on the sundog bandwagon so easily. The vote I casted was an initial vote to get things going based on guts feeling. MoB defended by saying if it is him or sundog he'll obviously vote sundog and he immediately did! However, a page back he did claim "Teller" Town, but he still hasn't convinced me.

This is the biggest problem I have wrapping my head around this game. The numbers frankly do not add up at all. IB says he has no powers, and I will say I have no powers at all, so something is definitely very wrong here. I almost want to suggest a mass claim.

Whats also not adding up are the characters in the game. There are a lot of names in the game, and my role does not have a name, I am a "type of worker" in the bank. I think someone else claimed that too but I dont know at the top of my head.

I'm a "Teller" Town - By that I deduce I am a bank teller.

No, theres more to it, but I was hoping that what I have claimed so far was enough to clear me for at least right now. If it's not I will fully claim, but I would really prefer not to.

This strikes me as a bit odd: he first claims he has no powers. Then he claims town teller, but does not want to go deeper on what a teller exactly is/does. So that means he does have powers?

My gut feelings always said: sundog or MoB. And MoB never really managed to convince me his innocence so I too will vote for him:

Unvote, vote MoB Deadly

[MoB Deadly]

Sundog has been on my radar since Day 2. But this is my first game with him, I don't know how he really posts. And multiple people have said its either him or its me. So my vote is promised to be on him.

As for scum tells, there is one post that stuck out like a sore thumb.

Hmm, so Rodion and IB going back and forth makes for interesting, and convoluted reading. Without going back and re-quoting all of the little pieces of each of your arguments, I think you are both acting scummy, here is why.

At this point I think we should be able to agree that the poisoner did NOT manage to poison his victim. Rodion, your complaint about English not being your mother tongue seems weak to me. I understand that others have been confused as well, but IB is right, you do write pretty eloquently. I personally don't think it's that confusing of a sentence because I'm in a clan with Skill.... he just doesn't write that well. Seems to me we should be less worried about the sentence structure of the events, and more worried about it's outcome. I see several of you guys referencing a specific term: flavor. I'm guessing that this refers to the way a story or night kill is worded giving clues to who or what happened. In this case, it's just bad grammar. So one strike against Rodion for trying to cloud the issue.

IB, your theory of a bus driver makes sense, but I'm a little confused on why it's so important to you. Whether a bus driver is involved or not, PCM (roleblocker) is still dead, and his partner has committed suicide. I'm comfortable with assuming that the suicide victim was not part of the original four (I think that was ROdion's argument though, not yours). That leaves PCM, his victim, PCM's killer and the remaining mystery character. What if the remaining character was simply a watcher, or investigator? Seems to me like there are a lot of possibilities for the extra character without it being required that a bus driver being involved. While I still agree that a bus driver is a possible explanation, it just seems like you are sticking doggedly to this point. You and Rodion have gone sideways arguing about the melee vs ranged weapons, whether or not someone got poisoned, and various roles that may or may not appear in a mod's first mafia game. You are both muddling the issue, and it wouldn't surprise me if your are both mafia! That gives you one strike for clouding the issue, and one strike for being the first to suggest an unnecessary role.

Other's thoughts?

I just didn't like sundogs post. I think they are more likely to both NOT be scum, than to both BE scum. And I think as they were fighting you just wanted to fuel it to get the town to decide one player over another, even though there is a fairly good possibility neither of them are scum.

I am willing to vote IB or sundog at this point.

I also said I was willing to fully claim my role, I do not mind. It would just be a luxury if I didn't have to. I did softclaim no night actions at all. And I have no day actions. I have a passive effect. So I am not a killer or a reviver, I don't know if I really help solve the puzzle at all

[Sundog308]

My vote for Mob stands for now (my reasoning being shown in my post), but if anyone is still interested in voting off Deuces, I would change my vote in a heartbeat if you can show how we could do that and still give town a good shot at winning. (Or convince me why is no longer town)
As for Mob's vote for me - suspicion or not, I would expect him to vote for me given the circumstances, so no hard feelings against him .

[Leitz]

Sundog has been on my radar since Day 2. But this is my first game with him, I don't know how he really posts. And multiple people have said its either him or its me. So my vote is promised to be on him.

Is your vote on him because people say it is either you or him or do you real believe you can make a case on him besides the one post you just quoted?

I also said I was willing to fully claim my role, I do not mind. It would just be a luxury if I didn't have to. I did softclaim no night actions at all. And I have no day actions. I have a passive effect. So I am not a killer or a reviver, I don't know if I really help solve the puzzle at all

No night actions & no day actions, confusing!

My vote for Mob stands for now (my reasoning being shown in my post), but if anyone is still interested in voting off Deuces, I would change my vote in a heartbeat if you can show how we could do that and still give town a good shot at winning. (Or convince me why is no longer town)
As for Mob's vote for me - suspicion or not, I would expect him to vote for me given the circumstances, so no hard feelings against him .

Currently we have six players left. Let's do some numbers!
12 players, 6 dead:

3 Town killed (Role blocker, Cop & VT)
2 Mafia killed
1 Third party killed

For things to be balanced the amount of mafia could be:

3/12
4/12

Considering there are also third party players that would leave 4/12 non-town aligned. That leaves 8 town players. That in all fairness seems a lot to me. Yes, one of the VT is linked to the third party but let's not take that in account for a minute. Because 8 seems too much I'm thinking there is still in the game:

2 mafia
1 mafia & 1 third party

Say there are indeed two mafia left. Add the third party player that means 5/12 non-town aligned with one town linked to the third party. I doubt this will be the case so that leaves us with the only option:

1 mafia & 1 third party

So, six players left with one mafia and one third party between them. That leaves 4 town players. If we kill Deuce, assuming still Town Survivor, that leaves 3 town. Add the mafia night lynch that would leave

2 Town
1 Mafia
1 Third party

I'm not sure that this situation would be best for town despite outnumbering mafia.

My suggestion: wait with lynching Deuce despite his terrible attitude

[MoB Deadly]

Thats what Im saying, im not responsible for those night actions.

No, unfortunately I do not have any new evidence to bring to the table about sundog. Hes been noncommittal all game. I feel like thats the big difference between me and him.

I committed to lynching Zimmah, because his role was obviously a lie. Mafia lies, so thats how I determined the Zimmah lynch. I said more than once I didn't think Zimmah was scummy until he made his claim.

I would of been all over the rodion lynch if he hadn't been mod killed. He went 100% hard at IB, and in his modding experience I expected him to jump on zimmahs obvious fakeclaim, but he didnt. Instead he baited me into hammering him, and I was fed up so I did.

I feel like Sundog should claim to see if we can unfog the game a bit for us. I think it would be beneficial. I also dont like how he called IB Third-Party, that doesnt make sense

[catnipdreams]

Well, we need to do something to move this along. I too wish we could lynch deuce, but I do think we have one more mafia killer to uncover, who was active before deuce was revived.

I am wondering if this would be a good time for both sundog and MoB to fully claim, and give us all the information about what actions they have done. I don't know if this should happen at this point in the game or not; perhaps we should discuss it a bit and reach a consensus about fully claiming, before MoB and sundog do that?

The thing is, I am 50/50 about voting to lynch MoB or sundog, and flipping a coin seems, at a minimum, disrespectful of the game.

[Iron Butterfly]

Well, we need to do something to move this along. I too wish we could lynch deuce, but I do think we have one more mafia killer to uncover, who was active before deuce was revived.

I am wondering if this would be a good time for both sundog and MoB to fully claim, and give us all the information about what actions they have done. I don't know if this should happen at this point in the game or not; perhaps we should discuss it a bit and reach a consensus about fully claiming, before MoB and sundog do that?

The thing is, I am 50/50 about voting to lynch MoB or sundog, and flipping a coin seems, at a minimum, disrespectful of the game.

The thing is, I am 50/50 about voting to lynch MoB or sundog, and flipping a coin seems, at a minimum, disrespectful of the game.[/quote]

I agree Catnip. I think they both need to claim. While my vote is on Sundog that could change.

Mob has a history of interaction with the players in This game. Sundog makes posts and does not follow up, which is a very safe way to play in my opinion.


Mob needs to claim as does Dundog

[Sundog308]

Say there are indeed two mafia left. Add the third party player that means 5/12 non-town aligned with one town linked to the third party. I doubt this will be the case so that leaves us with the only option:

1 mafia & 1 third party

Leitz, I appreciated your post because it lays out in logical form what I had been trying to express earlier. I think we are looking at 1 mafia and 1 third party.

No, unfortunately I do not have any new evidence to bring to the table about sundog. Hes been noncommittal all game. I feel like thats the big difference between me and him.

I feel like Sundog should claim to see if we can unfog the game a bit for us. I think it would be beneficial. I also dont like how he called IB Third-Party, that doesnt make sense

I have a little problem with this because I don't understand how I have been noncommittal. No, I have not posted as much as others, but when I did, I posted exactly what I thought, how I got to that thought, and what my vote would be based on that thought. I committed to Zimmah as well, remember!
Sure, I'll claim, but I don't know why it'll help me unless everyone else does as well.
Calling IB third-party doesn't make me suspicious, it just shows my thought process - which happens to be the same as Leitz'.

Mob has a history of interaction with the players in This game. Sundog makes posts and does not follow up, which is a very safe way to play in my opinion.

This accusation I can deal with. Yep, I've been bad about following up. Don't really have any good excuses on that. Still learning the game and trying to catch up with it. And yes, it does look like a very safe way to play. I haven't started any huge arguments prior to this because I barely kept up with Rodion/IB. I knew if started throwing things out there people would ask me to back it up, and I'd never be able to do that. So I played conservative, just waiting until I had actual data and then stating what I thought to be true and what my stance was on it at that time. And my stance hasn't gone back and forth once I state an opinion. (Not that many others have either)

As far as claiming goes, I know I can't quote the PM, but here is the summary:
I am "Suicidal Hero". It seems to me like it's a vigilante role, but I can kill during either day or night phase. The exception is that when I make the kill, I die as well.

[MoB Deadly]

Well that IS and is also NOT what I was hoping for with Sundog. I thought for sure he had an ability that was contributing to the kills/revive that one night. But apparently not, if he is telling the truth.

And unfortunately, "Suicide Hero" is fairly convincing in a Bank Robbery. Do you by any chance have a name associated with your character Sundog?


Time for my full claim.

I am "Teller" Bullet-Proof Town. Another reason I didn't fully claim is because anything bulletproof usually screams a Fakeclaim for the Godfather. Unfortunately that is what I am stuck with.


Hopefully anyone has info that Sundog is lying?

[Iron Butterfly]

Interesting.

You two, Mob and Sundog, are saying neither of you killed anyone. So that would leave the remaining three of us to have revived Deuce, kill jonty, and kill maxbandit.

I can not imagine in this set up not having a doctor/protection role of some sort.

I understand you guys dont know weather I am 3rd party BUT those who are left and are town can do the math from their perspective.

Two different people did a night kill. Sundog and Mobs Role claimes can neither kill,r at least without consequence to themselves, nor can they protect.