Few Role Questions

by **Mr. Squirrel** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:09 am

BGtheBrain wrote:Anyways, what does the mod say to P1? Does he say "You;ve been block" or does he say nothing?

It depends on the mod really. Some mods will tell you if you've been roleblocked, some won't. I generally only send roleblock notices to investigative players or anyone whom I had to give a PM response to.

by **strike wolf** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:13 am

I tend to tell people when they've been role blocked

by **BGtheBrain** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 9:01 am

by **safariguy5** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 1:47 pm

Mr. Squirrel wrote:
BGtheBrain wrote:Anyways, what does the mod say to P1? Does he say "You;ve been block" or does he say nothing?

It depends on the mod really. Some mods will tell you if you've been roleblocked, some won't. I generally only send roleblock notices to investigative players or anyone whom I had to give a PM response to.

I tell investigative players. Roleblocked protective or manipulative roles don't really need to know. And if their target ends up dead anyways, then they usually can figure out they got roleblocked.

by **BGtheBrain** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:13 pm

by / on Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:37 pm

It's because if the mafia hasn't been given fake claims they don't know what's safe to claim, the mafia only knows their own roles and what's been said in thread. If we were playing a disney themed mafia, would it be safe to fake-claim Goofy, or would it already be a role and be counterclaimed by the real one? Is it safe to claim town busdriver, or is there already a real town busdriver?

If the town knows mafia has been given claims, they know they won't be counterclaimed and then have to guess and work out if said character/role is in the game at all.

by **strike wolf** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:38 pm

/ wrote:It's because if the mafia hasn't been given fake claims they don't know what's safe to claim, the mafia only knows their own roles and what's been said in thread. If we were playing a disney themed mafia, would it be safe to fake-claim Goofy, or would it already be a role and be counterclaimed by the real one? Is it safe to claim town busdriver, or is there already a real town busdriver?

If the town knows mafia has been given claims, they know they won't be counterclaimed and then have to guess and work out if said character/role is in the game at all.

Yeah. Ran into this problem in South Park. No fake claims were given. I knew Randy Marsh wasn't in the game and he was a strong fake claim but I wasn't sure what role Evil had so I hesitated in completing the claim.

by **safariguy5** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:34 pm

BGtheBrain wrote:Next Question:

Whats it matter if the mafia is given fake claims by the mod or not? Cant the mafia just lie anyways? It allways seems people will say the mod did or didnt say there is fake claims.

This is much more of a problem in Theme games, where people like to Meta which characters are in the game and push for nameclaims early. Going by /'s Disney example, people would probably expect Mickey, Minnie, Donald, Pluto and Goofy to be town. But the mod could purposely not put Pluto in the game and give it to the mafia for a fakeclaim. That defeats town catching mafia by using weak or strong claims to push cases.

Incidentally, this was a bit of a problem with Mr. Squirrel's X-man game. All the original X-men were town characters in the game, and mafia were pretty easily spotted when they claimed minor characters or characters that didn't appear originally.

by **strike wolf** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:52 pm

safariguy5 wrote:
BGtheBrain wrote:Next Question:

Whats it matter if the mafia is given fake claims by the mod or not? Cant the mafia just lie anyways? It allways seems people will say the mod did or didnt say there is fake claims.

This is much more of a problem in Theme games, where people like to Meta which characters are in the game and push for nameclaims early. Going by /'s Disney example, people would probably expect Mickey, Minnie, Donald, Pluto and Goofy to be town. But the mod could purposely not put Pluto in the game and give it to the mafia for a fakeclaim. That defeats town catching mafia by using weak or strong claims to push cases.

Incidentally, this was a bit of a problem with Mr. Squirrel's X-man game. All the original X-men were town characters in the game, and mafia were pretty easily spotted when they claimed minor characters or characters that didn't appear originally.

Not completely true. Naxus was Banshee and I was Darwin and I don't remember who died night 1.

by **strike wolf** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 8:53 pm

Plus gambit was a mafia fake claim.

by **naxus** on Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:15 pm

strike wolf wrote:
safariguy5 wrote:
BGtheBrain wrote:Next Question:

Whats it matter if the mafia is given fake claims by the mod or not? Cant the mafia just lie anyways? It allways seems people will say the mod did or didnt say there is fake claims.

This is much more of a problem in Theme games, where people like to Meta which characters are in the game and push for nameclaims early. Going by /'s Disney example, people would probably expect Mickey, Minnie, Donald, Pluto and Goofy to be town. But the mod could purposely not put Pluto in the game and give it to the mafia for a fakeclaim. That defeats town catching mafia by using weak or strong claims to push cases.

Incidentally, this was a bit of a problem with Mr. Squirrel's X-man game. All the original X-men were town characters in the game, and mafia were pretty easily spotted when they claimed minor characters or characters that didn't appear originally.

Not completely true. Naxus was Banshee and I was Darwin and I don't remember who died night 1.

Banshee felt pulled out of squirells ass as a role :lol:

by **safariguy5** on Tue Aug 16, 2011 2:05 am

naxus wrote:
strike wolf wrote:
safariguy5 wrote:
BGtheBrain wrote:Next Question:

Whats it matter if the mafia is given fake claims by the mod or not? Cant the mafia just lie anyways? It allways seems people will say the mod did or didnt say there is fake claims.

This is much more of a problem in Theme games, where people like to Meta which characters are in the game and push for nameclaims early. Going by /'s Disney example, people would probably expect Mickey, Minnie, Donald, Pluto and Goofy to be town. But the mod could purposely not put Pluto in the game and give it to the mafia for a fakeclaim. That defeats town catching mafia by using weak or strong claims to push cases.

Incidentally, this was a bit of a problem with Mr. Squirrel's X-man game. All the original X-men were town characters in the game, and mafia were pretty easily spotted when they claimed minor characters or characters that didn't appear originally.

Not completely true. Naxus was Banshee and I was Darwin and I don't remember who died night 1.

Banshee felt pulled out of squirells ass as a role

I was referring to the fakeclaims. Of course we had some supporting X-men characters, but as I recall, the originals (Cyclops, Jean Grey, Iceman, Beast and Angel) all were town. Feel free to correct me on this, it's been a while. Wolverine was third party, but everyone else was townie. I might have not included one of the original 5 and given it to mafia as a fakeclaim, but it's just mod preference and really not important.

by **Mr. Squirrel** on Tue Aug 16, 2011 2:39 am

safariguy5 wrote:I was referring to the fakeclaims. Of course we had some supporting X-men characters, but as I recall, the originals (Cyclops, Jean Grey, Iceman, Beast and Angel) all were town. Feel free to correct me on this, it's been a while. Wolverine was third party, but everyone else was townie. I might have not included one of the original 5 and given it to mafia as a fakeclaim, but it's just mod preference and really not important.

Wolverine was town. I remember I gave nightcrawler and gambit as fakeclaims (which I thought were pretty good).

naxus wrote:Banshee felt pulled out of squirells ass as a role

I like Banshee so I wasn't going to leave him out. Plus, he was one of the earliest members of the X-men. He was brought in at the same time as Wolverine, Storm, Nightcrawler, and Colossus.

by **BGtheBrain** on Tue Aug 16, 2011 12:28 pm

by **safariguy5** on Tue Aug 16, 2011 2:15 pm

BGtheBrain wrote:Wow, that makes alot of sense and actually cracks me up. I could just picture somoeone claiming the same thing someone else had and being busted.

Thanks again

Actually, I think that happened in Mario (was not part of the game myself).

And in Terminator, naxus counterclaimed as mafia and got a townie lynched. Course he died the next day, but mafia did win that game pretty convincingly.

by **naxus** on Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:26 am

safariguy5 wrote:
BGtheBrain wrote:Wow, that makes alot of sense and actually cracks me up. I could just picture somoeone claiming the same thing someone else had and being busted.

Thanks again

Actually, I think that happened in Mario (was not part of the game myself).

And in Terminator, naxus counterclaimed as mafia and got a townie lynched. Course he died the next day, but mafia did win that game pretty convincingly.

Would of won off of that claim had rodion not been killed by the bomb. That And I love that game because I counterclaimed a cop and got him lynched

by **BGtheBrain** on Wed Aug 17, 2011 1:35 pm

by **safariguy5** on Wed Aug 17, 2011 5:08 pm

BGtheBrain wrote:Ok next question.

Normally if a Godfather is investigated by a cop (sane) does he shows as guilty? I read somewhere he should show as innocent.

He shows as innocent under sane cop investigation. Insane or paranoid cop investigation will show him as guilty still, and I had one instance where the mafia framer's target was busdriven with the godfather the same night as the cop investigated him, leading to a guilty result. Terrible luck there strike.

by **strike wolf** on Wed Aug 17, 2011 5:41 pm

safariguy5 wrote:
BGtheBrain wrote:Ok next question.

Normally if a Godfather is investigated by a cop (sane) does he shows as guilty? I read somewhere he should show as innocent.

He shows as innocent under sane cop investigation. Insane or paranoid cop investigation will show him as guilty still, and I had one instance where the mafia framer's target was busdriven with the godfather the same night as the cop investigated him, leading to a guilty result. Terrible luck there strike.

It was the cult framer...and I did kill him.

by **BGtheBrain** on Fri Aug 19, 2011 9:42 am

by **strike wolf** on Fri Aug 19, 2011 10:04 am

Simple answer is that if you don't bandwagon day 1 you don't get information. Most of the early leads in the game are based on who bandwagons who and inactivity. No lynch allows scum to be lazy and then they can just blend in.

by **BGtheBrain** on Fri Aug 19, 2011 10:06 am

by **Rodion** on Fri Aug 19, 2011 11:43 am

strike wolf wrote:Simple answer is that if you don't bandwagon day 1 you don't get information. Most of the early leads in the game are based on who bandwagons who and inactivity. No lynch allows scum to be lazy and then they can just blend in.

That is part of the reason.

No lynching D1 is also bad in a notably small game like C9 because it removes the right of mislynching once without losing the game plus it broadens the pool of possible suspects when you enter D2 (there is one more player alive to make decisions statistically harder for town).