C.C. Finals THOTA vs. KoRT [27-33] Kort WINS ! [FINAL]

[Bruceswar]

Good Grief... Must we go over the holiday's again? Must we go over what was already went over in PM's about pog?? And yes some people in KORT tend to cover for others more than some of us. I know on a personal level, the holidays were very busy for me, which not only included Christmas, but a funeral shortly after. Real life happens and if I need a sitter, it will surely be one of my clan mates. Oh and to top that off, some of us do work for a living.

Putting this all into perspective, sitting has happened since the beginning of time and will keep on happening where and when it is needed. Any other clan would be doing the same and not letting people miss when possible.

Lets enjoy the rest of this match and hope you guys can just play some games. I know that is what I am going to be doing. All this forum BS is for the birds.

gl

[Bruceswar]

Seems like a lot of people are set to continue make life miserable for KORT and especially Josko here. There's no rule against sitting for team mates, and the responsibility to help out team mates usually fall into the lap of some few dedicated players. That's typical for most clans, not just for KORT... Personally I don't think the "proof" of the wrongdoings are of a degree that means foul play, so I would like to say so as I find it unnecessary for this one-sidedness.

May the best team win! Good luck fighting it out.

If I'm not mistaken it has more to do with entering a player in team games who is not actually present to take his turns, which are subsequently taken by one of the clan's top flight players. It thus becomes less about sitting and more about using an account.

It does not matter who sits(unless you are a mod) when a sitter is needed. In fact many more times than not, you would rather have a sitter on the team, rather than someone who is not in the game. You of all people should know this. You are savey in team games, and this should not need to be explained.

[Chariot of Fire]

I think you misunderstand me Bruce. I know it doesn't matter who sits. It is the practice of entering a player in a game who is not going to be present to take his own turns that I would have an issue with.

We operate an absentee calendar so that any games that are being created or joined will not feature a player who is known to be taking a scheduled break, which seems pretty fair and logical. It also explains why some of our players take on more games than others. I'm retired so am available 24/7 whereas Kiwi & Tyche travel a lot and therefore participate in far fewer games, even though they are very capable players. Same holds true of a few others in our clan, especially during holiday seasons. It's why, against T4C for example, we took a month's break between batches - otherwise the same old faces would be appearing in all the games. We're simply not prepared to enter players who are going to take leave of absence; a policy that's not too hard to implement.

[reptile]

from the way i understood it, chuuuuck is the one that made the rule as well as enforced it ... there fore maybe we should leave kort alone... ? (as far as josko... i dont really have a clue what is going on there... but when in doubt i side with my brother from another mother (cof)

[ljex]

from the way i understood it, chuuuuck is the one that made the rule as well as enforced it ... there fore maybe we should leave kort alone... ? (as far as josko... i dont really have a clue what is going on there... but when in doubt i side with my brother from another mother (cof)

chuck did make the rule and to an extent enforce it, he gave KORT the option to implement a different penalty if they desired. They stuck with the 21 game penalty.

[Incandenza]

We're simply not prepared to enter players who are going to take leave of absence; a policy that's not too hard to implement.

That's a good policy, one I both endorse and adhere to. Sadly, doing so seems to lead to sniping from the opposition, as has already happened in this thread (by someone who should probably know better).

There's already been more account-sitting by Kort in 20 completed and a few just-begun games than by the Monkis in all 80 games of the THOTA-TSM battle. The fact that this is a recurring issue with Kort can't just be brushed aside, as much as they'd like to. And their expectation that this would go completely unremarked-on by us is insane.

I don't know, I guess it simply comes down to a matter of priorities. Trying to win by gaming the system rather than just playing the games seems beside the point to me. Surely josko can't be their only competent player, but that's the message they're sending.

[Dako]

Guess he needs to side with aog and create an army of two :p.

[josko.ri]

I agree to officially increase my total number of games played from batch 1 by 1,33, and increase on the same way my games played like sitter in batch 2&3.

still no answer on that. my account sitting may be properly validated with this, if you have problems with my sitting.
if we want to use advantage with 2-3 players play all turns then these 2-3 players would play max number of 20 allowed games, which will for sure nobody play. IMO nobody will play more than 15-16 in the finals.
like CoF said, it is logical that the most sitting will be done by players who are the most time of day online (in KoRT that are masli and me). and noone entered in game knowing that will go on holiday. stunna had emergency situation this weekend.

We're simply not prepared to enter players who are going to take leave of absence; a policy that's not too hard to implement.

That's a good policy, one I both endorse and adhere to.

well, 2 of THOTA players (Dustine, dbz) needed sitter in round 1 of batch 2, just like sitter played for stunna 2 times in round 1 batch 2. you asked us, we clarified stunna's issue, so with the same analogy I may then ask why they joined if they knew that cannot start games by them own?

you may exclude sitting for poguemahone in batch 1 (because you oficially receive offer to decrease his number of games played and increase his sitters') and then count number of sitting, and it will then not be big KoRT number of sitting turns, not a lot more than THOTA's number of sitting turns.

[Bruceswar]

There's already been more account-sitting by Kort in 20 completed and a few just-begun games than by the Monkis in all 80 games of the THOTA-TSM battle. The fact that this is a recurring issue with Kort can't just be brushed aside, as much as they'd like to. And their expectation that this would go completely unremarked-on by us is insane.

I don't know, I guess it simply comes down to a matter of priorities. Trying to win by gaming the system rather than just playing the games seems beside the point to me. Surely josko can't be their only competent player, but that's the message they're sending.

I have stayed away from all this, but I will make a quick response to this.

1. Yes KORT has had some sitting, and yes for me included when I was away for a day on work. Shocking people work.

2. KORT takes on players who have real lives also. Shocking to some also so it seems. Some cannot even afford to play on the weekends with a regular basis(Yes this is about stunna, who plays mainly from work.)

3. KORT does not put people in games who will be missing most or all of the turns. Nor do we join games for people so they can play. Yes people have unexpected things happen, such as pog, but no clan can plan for that.

4. Your point about the TSM battle. You might want to recheck that. Just because josko takes a turn, does not make things illegal. And also if he list taking a turn for 3 rounds in a row that is how it should be. Though most people post once and be done with it. Some people do not even post.

I will just close this with KORT is within the rules of CC as they are stated now. We do not need to bend or break the rules for anybody. This is a game and while we take it seriously, we do not need to cheat to win.

[khazalid]

indeed not.

on balance, i think you deserve your lead so far. good luck and good games in this set.

[InsomniaRed]

I think it's funny that Bruce is saying his clan is full of people who are so busy with their lives that they don't get online at least once a day. If this is the case with them, why are they in a 'competitive' clan? If they were such competitive people they would get online for a few minutes each day and take their turn. I just see a lot of the same excuses coming from the cows that have little or no support about this sitting nonsense. I understand when there are emergencies, vacations, and whatnot, but having turns taken randomly for different players throughout the war just seems petty.

[josko.ri]

I think it's funny that Bruce is saying his clan is full of people who are so busy with their lives that they don't get online at least once a day. If this is the case with them, why are they in a 'competitive' clan? If they were such competitive people they would get online for a few minutes each day and take their turn. I just see a lot of the same excuses coming from the cows that have little or no support about this sitting nonsense. I understand when there are emergencies, vacations, and whatnot, but having turns taken randomly for different players throughout the war just seems petty.

nice opinion Insomnia, it would be great if you copy-paste it in TOFU forum section, so your clan may take some useful point from it.

for now, in this war, 6 KORT players at all needed sitting (some of them only one turn), while in our semis vs your clan only one player (your clan leader) was sitting for 9 players

so I wonder how much TOFU is 'competitive' if more than half of TOFU's active players in semis needed sitting, and all that sitting was made by the same player. hmm very 'competitive' clan indeed

so I repeat your conclusion:

If that 9 players were such competitive people they would get online for a few minutes each day and take their turn.

[nikola_milicki]

There's already been more account-sitting by Kort in 20 completed and a few just-begun games than by the Monkis in all 80 games of the THOTA-TSM battle. The fact that this is a recurring issue with Kort can't just be brushed aside, as much as they'd like to. And their expectation that this would go completely unremarked-on by us is insane.

I don't know, I guess it simply comes down to a matter of priorities. Trying to win by gaming the system rather than just playing the games seems beside the point to me. Surely josko can't be their only competent player, but that's the message they're sending.

I have stayed away from all this, but I will make a quick response to this.

1. Yes KORT has had some sitting, and yes for me included when I was away for a day on work. Shocking people work.

2. KORT takes on players who have real lives also. Shocking to some also so it seems. Some cannot even afford to play on the weekends with a regular basis(Yes this is about stunna, who plays mainly from work.)

3. KORT does not put people in games who will be missing most or all of the turns. Nor do we join games for people so they can play. Yes people have unexpected things happen, such as pog, but no clan can plan for that.

4. Your point about the TSM battle. You might want to recheck that. Just because josko takes a turn, does not make things illegal. And also if he list taking a turn for 3 rounds in a row that is how it should be. Though most people post once and be done with it. Some people do not even post.

I will just close this with KORT is within the rules of CC as they are stated now. We do not need to bend or break the rules for anybody. This is a game and while we take it seriously, we do not need to cheat to win.

maybe u dont break or bend the rules with what ur doing but the way I see it its only cuz the rules are flawed or imperfect or w/e word would be good here..

cows, please quit making every other post about 'we have rl too', cuz guess what, so does everybody else in tofu, monkis, low, thota etc.. but we still manage to organize our shit and do our best not to have sitters in every other game.. when at the same time u use inactive players to fill many games so that the same player can sit for all of them

when a clan does so much sitting, with the same 2-3 members, repeatedly, it kinda stands out and makes u wonder.. maybe enough for mods to do their job?

heres something u can put right next to sitting list posted few pages back - from tofu challenge, dunno if something like this was posted b4

These were the most interesting ones:

2010-09-17 13:53:06 - Moonchild: josko.ri for moon next 6 days

2010-09-26 18:24:39 - #1_stunna: josko.ri for stunna this turn
2010-10-12 09:16:35 - #1_stunna: josko for stunna this turn
2010-10-17 19:58:29 - #1_stunna: josko again
2010-10-31 11:15:44 - #1_stunna: josko for stunna

2010-09-17 14:07:37 - Moonchild: josko.ri for moon next 6 days
2010-09-19 19:13:12 - #1_stunna: josko.ri for stunna this turn
2010-09-25 10:58:22 - #1_stunna: josko.ri for stunna during weekend

2010-09-15 18:41:58 - Moonchild: josko.ri for moon
2010-10-03 05:36:05 - Moonchild: josko fro moon this turn
2010-10-11 00:34:12 - #1_stunna: josko.ri for stunna
2010-10-12 09:20:44 - #1_stunna: josko for stunna

2010-11-17 01:58:35 - #1_stunna: josko.ri for stunna this turn. stunna will be away longer period

2010-11-02 00:45:42 - Moonchild: josko this turn
2010-11-09 01:23:44 - Moonchild: josko again

2010-11-03 03:29:53 - Bruceswar: josko.ri for Bruceswar
2010-11-03 18:36:04 - #1_stunna: josko.ri for #1_stunna
2010-11-04 18:45:27 - Foxglove: josko.ri for Foxglove
2010-11-08 00:45:55 - Bruceswar: josko.ri for Bruceswar
2010-11-14 01:54:38 - Bruceswar: josko sitting this turn
2010-11-21 22:50:03 - #1_stunna: bruceswar for stunna
2010-11-27 16:42:00 - #1_stunna: josko for stuna
2010-12-19 10:01:37 - #1_stunna: bruceswar for stunna

2010-11-01 09:06:48 - steve066: josko this turn
2010-11-14 02:18:21 - agonzos: josko played this turn

Moonchild got 9 and stunna got 7 games in that challenge!! I dont think theres a single game from these two without 'josko for XY' in chat
Agonzos also misses a lot of turns, Ive seen many ppl sit for him, if he is so busy why was he put in 12 games!

2. KORT takes on players who have real lives also. Shocking to some also so it seems. Some cannot even afford to play on the weekends with a regular basis(Yes this is about stunna, who plays mainly from work.)

so even tho its clear u cant count on certain ppl cuz they cant even play on weekends! and even tho u know ppl are about to leave for 7 days vacation, u still give them games?!?! and guess what happens next, josko sits them all, plays the whole game or sits for 2 or more of his partners! well f*ck me if this aint some sort of abuse! Congrats josko u have invented a new type of abuse that will go under Unwritten rules section sooner or later, maybe something like 'serial clanmate sitting' or 'systematical partner turn farming'

There's more!

Moonchild played his 6/7 games with josko against tofu and played/plays 8/9 games against thota in first 2 rounds! think they live in the same town and might be good friends in rl too, in fact so good that josko gets to sit for him so much and do half of his first turns

tofu vs kort:
2010-12-05 00:27:32 - Moonchild: josko for moon

2010-09-15 18:41:58 - Moonchild: josko.ri for moon

2010-11-02 00:45:42 - Moonchild: josko this turn

2010-09-17 14:07:37 - Moonchild: josko.ri for moon next 6 days

thota vs kort:
2010-12-04 11:24:50 - Moonchild: josko for moon. he was able to play this turn only in first 12 hours of the turn

2010-12-05 14:53:58 - Moonchild: josko this turn

2010-12-05 00:27:32 - Moonchild: josko for moon

kinda looks like moon requires a lot of hand holding.. makes u wonder if he came in a package with josko..

[Lubawski]

I think there has been enough banter back and forth. If THOTA thinks there is sitting-abuse, they can file a report. From what I've seen, it's not the case. Things happen in RL that pull people away. Over the course of a challenge, most people are going to need coverage at one time or another. I haven't seen KORT joining people in a game and then taking all the turns for that person so that they don't go over the 20 game max. Unless that happens, nothing more needs to be said. What happened or didn't happen in the TOFU v KORT challenge is over with. Let's move on. This is the championship of a great clan event. As spectators, let's focus on watching the actual games being played and worry less about the politics of the clan world. As players, the two clans involved should be focused on their games more than what people who are not in this challenge are saying (Most of them seem pretty focused). So on with the war. THOTA have been slow starters lately as they like the drama of a big comeback. I'm interested in seeing if KORT can hold them off, and if they do, if the world falls apart.

[josko.ri]

when a clan does so much sitting, with the same 2-3 members, repeatedly, it kinda stands out and makes u wonder.. maybe enough for mods to do their job?

feel free to write an e-ticket to mods if you think there was any abuse. I see you collected a lot of documentations about me(I am glad to become so popular in your eyes that cannot go to toilette without you document it ), so you may send that documentation to mods if you feel any rule breaking there. I wish you luck in your complaint

Moonchild is living in my town, we know each other from real life so that s why I am practically his only sitter, because he can send to me sms if he know that will not be able to come online on the time to play a turn.

I think there has been enough banter back and forth. If THOTA thinks there is sitting-abuse, they can file a report. From what I've seen, it's not the case. Things happen in RL that pull people away. Over the course of a challenge, most people are going to need coverage at one time or another. I haven't seen KORT joining people in a game and then taking all the turns for that person so that they don't go over the 20 game max. Unless that happens, nothing more needs to be said.

nice said Lubawski, THOTA has my offer about adding number of turns I played to my gamecount (still not answered), and also has right to file a report, so further discussion is not necesarry, THOTA knows what should be done if someone made some abuse (and it is not trolling in clan war thread).

[Chuuuuck]

I try to stay neutral and stay out of these discussions. But this is getting ridiculous. All discussion of sitting and such should stop now. There is nothing to gain from the discussion. THOTA/TOFU are always going to believe that KoRT is sitting too much and it is an abuse to site rules I believe. There is not a thing KoRT or anyone within KoRT can say to change their opinions of that.

On top of that, KoRT believes they have done nothing wrong and violated no site rules. There is not a single thing THOTA, TOFU or anyone in either of those clans can say to magically make them say "you are right, we did violate the rules." It isn't going to happen. So let's end all discussion of it here. That does not mean "let me get the last word in and then we will end discussion." It means, quit posting about it now.

If anyone reading this, whether they are in THOTA, TOFU, KoRT, any other clan, or not in a clan at all, feels that a site rule has been violated, then I encourage them to file a C&A report and have it looked into it. As far as managing the cup goes, there is no punishment for sitting unless it is found to of violated a site rule. If someone is found to of violated site rules in cup games, then a punishment in the cup will be imposed. But, as of right now, I have not seen anyone found guilty of violating any site rules, therefore, there is nothing to discuss in relation to sitting or the cup.

[Moonchild]

Wow, apparently I am not very active in the Sept. 2010. games eh ... I have no clue why is this TOFU-KORT semi dispute still going on. I think it is not fair against THOTA, we both got into finals and we are here to see who is the best.
Players on both sides should calm down and enjoy the fight or if they aren't interested in the fight itself, divert their attention elsewhere. Everything beyond that is waste of energy.
Although it might be a month or two overdue, all the best to THOTA, the games are challenging and interesting to the end.
Cheers all and try to have some sexy time!

[nikola_milicki]

Wow, apparently I am not very active in the Sept. 2010. games eh ... I have no clue why is this TOFU-KORT semi dispute still going on. I think it is not fair against THOTA, we both got into finals and we are here to see who is the best.
Players on both sides should calm down and enjoy the fight or if they aren't interested in the fight itself, divert their attention elsewhere. Everything beyond that is waste of energy.
Although it might be a month or two overdue, all the best to THOTA, the games are challenging and interesting to the end.
Cheers all and try to have some sexy time!

tofu-kort games are here to show pattern of what u guys are doing, and to show us how u cant play a clan game without holding holding with josko..

here's a little something of ur wall, interesting comments from josko



translated:

"I'll play world2.1 for you and I could do the rest of the games that need to be done till morning too"
by josko.ri
on Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:10 am

"I left u notes in wwii europe, cant come to msn, merry christmas"
by josko.ri
on Sat Dec 25, 2010 6:01 pm

I guess world 2.1 unlimited was too much to write in chat so josko just played it himself

[MrBenn]

For the record, not everybody loves CC enough to spend Christmas Day and New Years Eve/Day here. The comments above appear to relate specifically to covering these days rather than anything malicious.

[Rodion]

Nikola, really?

The guy is sitting for someone on Fri Dec 31 (when SEVERAL people travel and lose internet access). Also, considering he won World 2.1 doubles around december 18 and World 2.1 triples didn't start until last week, the game he referred to was vs. TSM for CL3. The game wasn't even "unlimited" as you stated!

My advice to you is you should tone your witch hunt down some and let clan leaders solve this between themselves (preferably, without investigations that lead to translations about sitting on holidays against another clan that isn't even here complaining, but I might be asking too much).

[josko.ri]

translated:

"I'll play world2.1 for you and I could do the rest of the games that need to be done till morning too"
by josko.ri
on Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:10 am

"I left u notes in wwii europe, cant come to msn, merry christmas"
by josko.ri
on Sat Dec 25, 2010 6:01 pm

I guess world 2.1 unlimited was too much to write in chat so josko just played it himself

hehe nikola, you makes me laugh as posting something that has no clue about.

about TOFU thing, dont worry, we were reported by TOFU for account sitting abuse to multihunters and we were cleared by king achilles. maybe you know account sitting rules better than Head of multihunters, dont you?

about posts from moon wall, you guessed totally worng.
world 2.1 was Game 8087580(where do you see unlimited I dont know, nice imagination btw ) so there may be seen that I played turn for him on 31st of December, because he was going to New Year's Eve one day before I was going so I covered that one day. if you are going to research, I was sitting in 30-31 December in his several games, mostly of them 6 player standard games, in no way connected with clan things (probably we wanted to take some advantage with my sitting in that standard games, didnt we? ). the information on his wall was to inform him when his last turn will be played (in the morning), so he could know from when he have to watch, as he was playing on that 2-3 days from his mobile, and playing from mobile is here very expensive, so i helped with sitting until I could. as day earlier I didnt know on which time I will leave home (30th evening or 31st morning), the information on his wall was to let him know it will be 31st December in the morning. all clear now?

seriously, why do you not report me to multihunters when I break so lot account sitting rules?

honestly, when see how I am popular in your eyes, I am really affraid to go on toilet next time, maybe you will follow me and find some sitting (on toilet) abuse

[Chuuuuck]

I rarely lose my cool here but are each and everyone of you retarded? What don't you all get about the fact that not a single one of you is going to convince the other clan that you are right and they are wrong. There will be no epiphany moment for anyone where they say "wow, I see the error in my ways, you are right." Either file a C&A report or don't, but quit trying to convince each other here, you can discuss all of these fun facts in the C&A report if one is ever filed and I will not read any of it until a decision is made by the hunters.

[josko.ri]

I rarely lose my cool here but are each and everyone of you retarded? What don't you all get about the fact that not a single one of you is going to convince the other clan that you are right and they are wrong. There will be no epiphany moment for anyone where they say "wow, I see the error in my ways, you are right." Either file a C&A report or don't, but quit trying to convince each other here, you can discuss all of these fun facts in the C&A report if one is ever filed and I will not read any of it until a decision is made by the hunters.

you should read this nikola, I have to respond when he wrong accuse me for doing something against rules, I dont know who would only read and doing nothing when someone accuse him wrong for breaking rules.

please nikola, if you have any doubts that I broke any sitting rule, report me to multihunters so it will be solved where it should be, not in other places. ok? let s stop this or, if you want continue, do it in C&A, here really is not right place for this.

[Eyestone]

Let's get retarded! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c04EMCF9lyI

[lord voldemort]

yer i kinda agree...whilst the witch hunt is funny to watch and read...its getting well annoying. if and when josko does something wrong people will know about it. until then why dont we hug it out