kraphtone- extreme noob farming [warned]

[lord voldemort]

Feudal War Colonel213 +1787 273 from 373(73%) 631 Warmonger (88%)143 N00b Farmer (0.413)
Map rank of standard public casual games (feudal obviously)
It gives us a relative look at the ranks in the games. Though very rough

Yeah, the map rank really doesnt matter, because it changes with his score, and it would be low if he played all players that had played 6 games or more too.

The main factors are:

% new recruits in games compared to number of non new recruits

%games with new recruits.

If these numbers are high, it shows systematic farming, though in this case, the sheer quantity of new recruits actually shows there was farming, almost regardless of the percentage. The percentage will be high anyways I think, though.

Valid point...But there is no set % of what constitutes neewbie farming. Then the argument becomes what is a fair number
20%? 40%? larger, smaller??

[KraphtOne]

Feudal War Colonel213 +1787 273 from 373(73%) 631 Warmonger (88%)143 N00b Farmer (0.413)
Map rank of standard public casual games (feudal obviously)
It gives us a relative look at the ranks in the games. Though very rough

my feudal war map rank is +4550, so obviously i make my bones on feudal w/out playing these...

maybe, just maybe i set up a bunch of casual feudal games because i like to play the map and i'm good at it...

but let's just assume i'm point hoarding instead of playing a map that i like

i was a colonel when i started all these games, kinda hard not to have a point hoarding rank

[lord voldemort]

Feudal War Colonel213 +1787 273 from 373(73%) 631 Warmonger (88%)143 N00b Farmer (0.413)
Map rank of standard public casual games (feudal obviously)
It gives us a relative look at the ranks in the games. Though very rough

my feudal war map rank is +4550, so obviously i make my bones on feudal w/out playing these...

maybe, just maybe i set up a bunch of casual feudal games because i like to play the map and i'm good at it...

but let's just assume i'm point hoarding instead of playing a map that i like

i was a colonel when i started all these games, kinda hard not to have a point hoarding rank

This is also true. It is understood that you play lots of feudal and that you just set up casual pulic games to play a favourite map.
This would all be easy if feudal wasnt in the maps new players can join

[KraphtOne]

exactly, and i even started a thread over a month ago stating that new recruits shouldnt be allowed to join the game

[alster]

Valid point...But there is no set % of what constitutes neewbie farming. Then the argument becomes what is a fair number
20%? 40%? larger, smaller??

This is an interesting subject. I will review past C&A threads as well as the accused's games and provide some recaps/stats tonight.

[JOHNNYROCKET24]

exactly, and i even started a thread over a month ago stating that new recruits shouldnt be allowed to join the game

but yet, we continued to start the same games/options over and over to continue the farming vs new recruits. your flat out admitting that you continued to farm for a month knowing only new recruits were going to join.

[AAFitz]

exactly, and i even started a thread over a month ago stating that new recruits shouldnt be allowed to join the game

You are completely correct, but the point is, all you had to do, was not to play so many games with new recruits in them, you knew they were joining, you continued to set them up, and did absolutely nothing to stop it.

By continuing to set up games that so many new recruits joined, you broke the rules. It clearly isnt as blatant as joining 1v1s, or joining new recruits, but the overwhelming number is blatent, and cant possibly be dismissed because you didnt see it happening. Its impossible to think this was all accidental, because anyone could have avoided playing this many new recruits if they wanted to. Certainly any kraphtone could.

I just rechecked the list too, all of those games have new recruits in them...though the ones with only one, really shouldnt be included as farming, but the list is only a month long. To suggest this happened accidentally over the last 35 days or so, is just ridiculous. I actually take back that there should be only a warning.

This is as much a systematic targeting that ive personally ever seen, since the new rules were passed.

[Ace Rimmer]

From KraphtOne's thread on Johnny, that was closed.

What is it
"Farming" New Recruits is where a user or group of users deliberately target New Recruits and encourage them to join their games so they may easily win and reap the New Recruit's points. This creates a rather unwelcoming atmosphere for New Recruits who are attempting to join the Community and are essentially being undercut by greedy individuals. Targeting may be done via PM's, often coming out of the blue, via Wall postings, via Game Chats, Live Chats, and Forum posts.
Targeting may also occur by specifically being the last one to join games filled with New Recruits.

Key words are new recruits.

IMO, KraphtOne is not farming because he is not invited people to join via PM/wall post/etc nor is he joining games with New recruits. Seriously, ask Lack to take Feudal off the list of maps NRs can play and that will fix this.

Jake

[AAFitz]

IMO, KraphtOne is not farming because he is not invited people to join via PM/wall post/etc nor is he joining games with New recruits. Seriously, ask Lack to take Feudal off the list of maps NRs can play and that will fix this.

Jake

Here are the actual rules though:

New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby lackattack on Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:07 pm
"Newbie Farming" is the technique of setting up as many games as possible (either by starting or joining them) with New Recruits to gain easy points by taking advantage of difficult game options and the fact the New Recruits are more likely to deadbeat.

In your opinion, is what Kraphtone did here, not exactly what is described here? Ie, starting games with new recruits to gain easy points by taking advantage of difficult game options. He violated this on ever aspect of the rule. I do think this will get feudal added to the list though. Obviously, people cant be trusted to not take advantage of it at this point.

[lord voldemort]

From KraphtOne's thread on Johnny, that was closed.

What is it
"Farming" New Recruits is where a user or group of users deliberately target New Recruits and encourage them to join their games so they may easily win and reap the New Recruit's points. This creates a rather unwelcoming atmosphere for New Recruits who are attempting to join the Community and are essentially being undercut by greedy individuals. Targeting may be done via PM's, often coming out of the blue, via Wall postings, via Game Chats, Live Chats, and Forum posts.
Targeting may also occur by specifically being the last one to join games filled with New Recruits.

Key words are new recruits.

IMO, KraphtOne is not farming because he is not invited people to join via PM/wall post/etc nor is he joining games with New recruits. Seriously, ask Lack to take Feudal off the list of maps NRs can play and that will fix this.

Jake

Targeting may be done via PM's

[KraphtOne]

broken record arguing with you idiots...
"Farming" New Recruits is where a user or group of users deliberately target New Recruits and encourage them to join their games so they may easily win and reap the New Recruit's points.
i have not encouraged new recruits to join my games, i have actually foed quite a few of them

This creates a rather unwelcoming atmosphere for New Recruits who are attempting to join the Community and are essentially being undercut by greedy individuals.

Targeting may be done via PM's, often coming out of the blue, via Wall postings, via Game Chats, Live Chats, and Forum posts.
I have not done this either... i actually posted in forum that i did not want new recruits joining my games

Targeting may also occur by specifically being the last one to join games filled with New Recruits.
and clearly i have not done this...

you're arguing that i should stop setting up games that i have seen alot of new recruits joining...

i play the 4 man feudal games because they are easy to keep track of and less luck involved than a 1vs1 game...

i can't help the fact that new recruits join, i have even given suggestions that something should be done because they tend to ruin games...

but your argument is that people should stop playing 4 man feudals because new recruits join them...

4 man casual feudal is now off limits to everyone on CC...

only new recruits are allowed to play...

your argument makes no sense... you should be arguing in Suggestions forum like i have that there should be a way to keep new recruits out of feudal games...

instead you're doing it here...

johnny is doing it because i told him to f*ck off last week when he was being a dick to me and now he has to play me in a feudal tournament and is trying to weasel his way out of the games... fitz is doing it cause we don't like each other, and alster is doing it because he and johnny are constant partners and i brought up in another thread that they were targeting low ranked players in order to pad their stats and gain rank...

but that's cool with me, you three punkasses can continue to make your retarded argument... i've got logic on my side :0)

[AAFitz]

but that's cool with me, you three punkasses can continue to make your retarded argument... i've got logic on my side :0)

New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby lackattack on Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:07 pm
"Newbie Farming" is the technique of setting up as many games as possible (either by starting or joining them) with New Recruits to gain easy points by taking advantage of difficult game options and the fact the New Recruits are more likely to deadbeat.

Actually, you really dont. The fact that many continued to join, and you continued to create them...that many in just a months time, shows you were obviously targeting them. Its actually illogical to argue it. You should have just posted that you didnt even realize it was against the rules, and that you see that it is now. That would have been logical.

It is too bad youre getting so upset though. Honestly, the thread was just made so you stopped farming, and possibly get feudal blocked from new recruits...to protect the victims like you who get joined by so many new recruits.

If you want, logically argue how you started games, that included possibly hundreds or a hundred new recruits, and it isnt against this rule as clearly stated by lack himself, almost 11 months ago.

Oh, and Im not doing it because of any personal reasons. Again, I simply havent seen this many new recruits farmed since the rule was made. And those were just in the last 30 days. If you werent targeting, and this was a bogus thread, like the last one about johnny, id have posted that opinion too.

I honestly expected you to see this rule as stated and realize you had broken it. Instead you illogically still profess your innocence, which is why we keep trying to show you that you are wrong, because its clear that you broke the rules, to a degree that is simply over and above what one would expect someone to do accidentally. You even compared it to the 14 new recruits that joined 280 of my games, compared it to farming that took place in 2007, compared it to demonfork and herpes, who have NOT farmed new recruits after the rule was made.

You have broken that rule however, and smashed it really. The games listed only include the last 35 days. To suggest you couldnt have dropped some of those games simply isnt believable, nor is the idea that you didnt realize it was against the rules, or that you didnt want it to happen...because it happened over, and over and over again. You did nothing to stop it...you therefore either let it happen, or, wanted it to happen. Accept your responsibility, instead of crying victim, because it will be a hell of a lot more respected, because the case is so obvious, that fighting it is the only illogical thing to do here.

[BoganGod]

Close this already. Clear don't note it. Good to see that someone with rank starts public games.

[KraphtOne]

New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby lackattack on Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:07 pm
"Newbie Farming" is the technique of setting up as many games as possible (either by starting or joining them) with New Recruits to gain easy points by taking advantage of difficult game options and the fact the New Recruits are more likely to deadbeat.

Actually, you really dont. The fact that many continued to join, and you continued to create them...that many in just a months time, shows you were obviously targeting them. Its actually illogical to argue it. You should have just posted that you didnt even realize it was against the rules, and that you see that it is now. That would have been logical.

It is too bad youre getting so upset though. Honestly, the thread was just made so you stopped farming, and possibly get feudal blocked from new recruits...to protect the victims like you who get joined by so many new recruits.

If you want, logically argue how you started games, that included possibly hundreds or a hundred new recruits, and it isnt against this rule as clearly stated by lack himself, almost 11 months ago.

you keep only partially quoting that line from lackattack

"Newbie Farming" is the technique of setting up as many games as possible (either by starting or joining them) with New Recruits to gain easy points by taking advantage of difficult game options and the fact the New Recruits are more likely to deadbeat. Some players have been farming extensively - even sending hundreds of PMs to the latest members to get them into their games.

This is a gross abuse of the game. It gives the New Recruit "victims" a poor first experience and reduces the chances of them sticking around. As farmers move up the scoreboard it also harms the competitive nature of Conquer Club - the scoreboard is meant to measure skill in the game, not "harvesting" techniques.


which means you are not allowed to set up a game and invite new recruits...

not "you're not allowed to set up games that might have new recruits join"

[JOHNNYROCKET24]

broken record arguing with you idiots...
"Farming" New Recruits is where a user or group of users deliberately target New Recruits and encourage them to join their games so they may easily win and reap the New Recruit's points.
i have not encouraged new recruits to join my games, i have actually foed quite a few of them

This creates a rather unwelcoming atmosphere for New Recruits who are attempting to join the Community and are essentially being undercut by greedy individuals.

Targeting may be done via PM's, often coming out of the blue, via Wall postings, via Game Chats, Live Chats, and Forum posts.
I have not done this either... i actually posted in forum that i did not want new recruits joining my games

Targeting may also occur by specifically being the last one to join games filled with New Recruits.
and clearly i have not done this...

you're arguing that i should stop setting up games that i have seen alot of new recruits joining...

i play the 4 man feudal games because they are easy to keep track of and less luck involved than a 1vs1 game...

i can't help the fact that new recruits join, i have even given suggestions that something should be done because they tend to ruin games...

but your argument is that people should stop playing 4 man feudals because new recruits join them...

4 man casual feudal is now off limits to everyone on CC...

only new recruits are allowed to play...

your argument makes no sense... you should be arguing in Suggestions forum like i have that there should be a way to keep new recruits out of feudal games...

instead you're doing it here...

johnny is doing it because i told him to f*ck off last week when he was being a dick to me and now he has to play me in a feudal tournament and is trying to weasel his way out of the games... fitz is doing it cause we don't like each other, and alster is doing it because he and johnny are constant partners and i brought up in another thread that they were targeting low ranked players in order to pad their stats and gain rank...

but that's cool with me, you three punkasses can continue to make your retarded argument... i've got logic on my side :0)

yep, the whole world is against you and all the mods love me. Whats next to keep going off the subject that you farm ? you already tried to report me for farming. come up with another plan. sooner or later you will admitt to the farming.

[AAFitz]

New Years Resolution: Newbie Farming is not Cool.

Postby lackattack on Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:07 pm
"Newbie Farming" is the technique of setting up as many games as possible (either by starting or joining them) with New Recruits to gain easy points by taking advantage of difficult game options and the fact the New Recruits are more likely to deadbeat.

Actually, you really dont. The fact that many continued to join, and you continued to create them...that many in just a months time, shows you were obviously targeting them. Its actually illogical to argue it. You should have just posted that you didnt even realize it was against the rules, and that you see that it is now. That would have been logical.

It is too bad youre getting so upset though. Honestly, the thread was just made so you stopped farming, and possibly get feudal blocked from new recruits...to protect the victims like you who get joined by so many new recruits.

If you want, logically argue how you started games, that included possibly hundreds or a hundred new recruits, and it isnt against this rule as clearly stated by lack himself, almost 11 months ago.

you keep only partially quoting that line from lackattack

"Newbie Farming" is the technique of setting up as many games as possible (either by starting or joining them) with New Recruits to gain easy points by taking advantage of difficult game options and the fact the New Recruits are more likely to deadbeat. Some players have been farming extensively - even sending hundreds of PMs to the latest members to get them into their games.

This is a gross abuse of the game. It gives the New Recruit "victims" a poor first experience and reduces the chances of them sticking around. As farmers move up the scoreboard it also harms the competitive nature of Conquer Club - the scoreboard is meant to measure skill in the game, not "harvesting" techniques.


which means you are not allowed to set up a game and invite new recruits...

not "you're not allowed to set up games that might have new recruits join"

You are only partially translating it. It also includes setting up games that new recruits join repeatedly. You dont think it does perhaps, but it does. Others before you have been warned to stop doing this very thing. With the massive number you have, its clear it was intentional, and a clear gross abuse of the game, and obvious systematic targeting of new recruits. You just kept setting them up one after another...and now its getting obvious you were just hoping to get out by a loophole, and planned it all along.

You were continually and repeatedly setting up games knowing new recruits would join, and knowing you could take advantage of that. That IS systematic targeting by definition.

Again, this is the most new recruits killed in a month by any player on CC, and as systematic as any since the rule was made. Further, you have clearly shown that you spend enough time in this forum to see that, so its pretty clear this wasnt an accident.

[ETROPAL]

i believe Kraptone play CC just for obtain points and try come Conqueror.
and when he find a play feudal and more recrut join he said yeah!!! i create hundred and hundred

[KraphtOne]

you have a conquerers list with people inked off for farming...

johnny 90% of your games are against people ranked sergeant or lower...

and all i see is posts littering the forum of how great you are...

you might fool the cooks you play but ya don't fool me

[KraphtOne]

Hey fitz, link me a post where someone was warned to stop creating 4 man feudal games...

cause i can show a link where someone was cleared of this exact same charge

[JOHNNYROCKET24]

you have a conquerers list with people inked off for farming...

johnny 90% of your games are against people ranked sergeant or lower...

and all i see is posts littering the forum of how great you are...

you might fool the cooks you play but ya don't fool me

this thread is about you...not me. Lets stay focused here. BTW, your attempt on me was cleared

[Mr Changsha]

Not convinced that we as players have the responsibility to change our game style if new recruits keep joining. IF the map is unsuitable for new recruits (because of unique tactics or whatever) then Lack should take it off the available list.

If Kraphtone is setting up public 5 man standards and is not foeing in a Klobber-like fashion (therefore anyone can join) and is not targetting new recruits or inexperienced stripers when he sets them up, then I fail to see the issue.

Of course beating up the weak doesn't exactly improve Kraphtone's CC reputation, though as he says his OVERALL relative rank is +0.7 it doesn't seem that he has a major problem in this regard either.

[AAFitz]

Hey fitz, link me a post where someone was warned to stop creating 4 man feudal games...

cause i can show a link where someone was cleared of this exact same charge

Tell you what, you show me a link where someone was cleared of the charge with as many games with new recruits in them as you. Or post your link anyways, and we will compare the cases.

Also, I suggested a few times you figure out the percentage of your games in the last 30 days without new recruits in them. If the percentage of new recruits is low, you really arent as guilty and low enough..might not be guilty at all. The higher the percent, the higher the likelyhood that it was systematic.

And if before the last 30 days, if you werent doing the same thing, perhaps show that. Right now, all I can see is a massive list of games, all with new recruits. If this is just a small amount of your games, perhaps its just a coincidence.

[AAFitz]

Not convinced that we as players have the responsibility to change our game style if new recruits keep joining. IF the map is unsuitable for new recruits (because of unique tactics or whatever) then Lack should take it off the available list.

If Kraphtone is setting up public 5 man standards and is not foeing in a Klobber-like fashion (therefore anyone can join) and is not targetting new recruits or inexperienced stripers when he sets them up, then I fail to see the issue.

Of course beating up the weak doesn't exactly improve Kraphtone's CC reputation, though as he says his OVERALL relative rank is +0.7 it doesn't seem that he has a major problem in this regard either.

That would be true on a small scale, but if a player continues to set up the same map and style, after its obvious a majority of new recruits are going to join, it is systematic. Other players have been told if they see new recruits joining they actually have to drop those games. And in this case, the number is so large, and the percentage seemingly so high, that its impossible to think it wasnt on purpose. If you set up 50 games and mostly new recruits join, than you KNOW that if you set up another 50 mostly new recruits will join. When you set up that next 50, you know it, and its the intent to take advantage of it.

Without a doubt the possibility on this map should not be there, and without a doubt its not as bad as joining, but it still is systematic farming of new recruits, and is simply another way of doing it. Its not as bad as some, and not as blatent to be sure, but it still is farming and given the number of games, an obvious abuse of the rules.

[KraphtOne]

Re: Owenator ... I dont believe in improbable coincidence

New postby king achilles on Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:52 am
I checked if owenator is a multi with any new recruit and he is cleared. He also has a mixture of opponents.

For a newbie farming case possibility, I think it is no longer surprising that Feudal map is one of those maps that certain people have loved to use and create games from it, which coincidentally, many new recruits actually join. One question to ponder for one's intention is, would you love the map this much if you were not playing with new recruits most of the time?

I will be less strict from now on regarding this newbie farming rule as I do not want to dictate how a player wishes to enjoy the game on this site.

If the accused is the one joining the games and/or we see evidence that he/she is inviting new recruits, then we probably have a case to look at.

Still, if a player has mostly new recruits as his opponents in his collection of games with a specific setting, we might suggest to change your preferred settings from time to time in respect of the newbie farming rule.

If we get reports or comments about certain maps that have been 'abused' because they lure too many new recruits often, who knows, there could be some adjustments to further balance the games out there.



and clearly i love the map and would play it regardless of noobs joining because i play it all the time in speed and in tournament and clan war games

[AAFitz]

Well, it is unfortunate that King A translated it that way. You definitely have more games than owen did...and honestly I bet you knew of this when you set those games up and assumed youd get the same treatment as him.

You without a doubt broke the rules, and the intent of them completely, but may very well get away with it.

There have been players warned to drop games if they see lots of new recruits joining though.

I hate to say it, but I think King A made a mistake here, but its his mistake to make, and honestly not my concern if thats how the rules get applied. I do hope feudal gets blocked from new recruits though because of this. Youve clearly shown that they are purposefully being taken advantage of, and in a volume so great, that I wouldnt be surprised if you still get a warning, for what is obvious a gross abuse of the game. Its also obvious that its the exact behavior lack was trying to prevent.

For what its worth, ive killed many new recruits in my time, and many, many players are guilty of farming...but in the end its a game...and the rules are the rules, otherwise the game means nothing.