TRAFALGAR [12.4.2012] QUENCHED (V65)

[cairnswk]

In my AP European HIstory class today we were talking about Trafalgar and Napoleon, and i asked if the Spanish were involved. My teacher got really mad at me and said that Spain had been a third rate power since Britain defeated their armada in like 1508 or something....are you sure they were in this?

Kaplowitz....i really have to wonder what the teachers are teaching out there today.
It is very well documented that the Spanish were in this battle with the French, against the British.
Check out wiki or thousands of others sites if you're unsure.
And look, there is no saying what you're teacher said may have been wrong...but....

[cairnswk]

Version 20 below:

Click image to enlarge.

[gimil]

Cairns in my opinion, this is the most beautiful map you have started since waterloo. Although as always I am here to give out the nasties

Firstly Argonauta seems to be a fair distance from its Spanish ship (I am assuming that it is spanish since there is a spanish ship with no name nearby).

My big concern just now is that when ships are packed together some names become difficult to distiguish which ships they belong to while other names overlap the boats and become harder to read. Would a nice glow around each terr name that represents the colour of their fleet be to much to ask please? e.g. british name has a red glow, french name has a blue glow. I think this will make the whole experience of playing this map much easier and efficient.

I am also seeing that some on the english ships have turned a shade towards orange, is this intentional? or am I jsut seeing things?

I really like how you have caught a naval theme here cairns, great work!

[cairnswk]

Cairns in my opinion, this is the most beautiful map you have started since waterloo....

Goes to show how much our taste varies, doesn't it?

Firstly Argonauta seems to be a fair distance from its Spanish ship (I am assuming that it is spanish since there is a spanish ship with no name nearby).

yes that's simply a name out of place that i forgot to move to its ships.

My big concern just now is that when ships are packed together some names become difficult to distiguish which ships they belong to while other names overlap the boats and become harder to read. Would a nice glow around each terr name that represents the colour of their fleet be to much to ask please? e.g. british name has a red glow, french name has a blue glow. I think this will make the whole experience of playing this map much easier and efficient.

I'll try that to see what it looks like.

I am also seeing that some on the english ships have turned a shade towards orange, is this intentional? or am I jsut seeing things?

You're correct, I'll fix.

[yeti_c]

Here's a legend suggestion for you...

Instead of

Weather Line
- - - - - - - - - - -
Lee Line
French W
Spanish W
British W
French L
Spanish L
British L

You could do...

British W
French W
Spanish W
Weather Line
- - - - - - - - - - -
Lee Line
British L
French L
Spanish L

There are 2 changes here...

1 position above/below the line.
2 ordering of fleets from left to right.

I plan to have a look at the game play on this shortly - but my CC time is limited these days - so I'll see if I can devote some time to it.

C.

[cairnswk]

Version 21.

1. Gimil's glow implemented
2. C's alterations to legend done.

Click image to enlarge.

[Gypsys Kiss]

I like the new bonus wording.

The first time I looked at the glow, I liked it. The second time I didn't. Having looked at both versions, large and small, the large one seems less 'in your face', more washed out, if that makes sense. Its the one I prefer. If, indeed, they are different, it is 10.30 pm and several small vodkas have passed my lips

[cairnswk]

I like the new bonus wording.

The first time I looked at the glow, I liked it. The second time I didn't. Having looked at both versions, large and small, the large one seems less 'in your face', more washed out, if that makes sense. Its the one I prefer. If, indeed, they are different, it is 10.30 pm and several small vodkas have passed my lips

The large map is a simple upsize of the small map, so if there is any difference, it is probably because of "size distortion effects".
Vodka eh? Mmmmm. My preferred drink years ago was OP Rum.
Anyway, back to topic....

[The Neon Peon]

I have fine vision, but the legend text on the small map could be made more clear.

The glow on the small map could also be reduced, it looks odd on the small map. Reduces only slightly. I think a little less will make it look better.

[cairnswk]

I have fine vision, but the legend text on the small map could be made more clear.

The glow on the small map could also be reduced, it looks odd on the small map. Reduces only slightly. I think a little less will make it look better.

I haven't split these maps yet, so could you keep the glow for later, and i'll see what i can do with the legend text.

[Incandenza]

Okay, this is kind of a gameplay thing, but it's mostly because I'm a history weenie:

There's no indication really that the French and Spanish were on the same side, not in the legend, certainly not in the fact that there's 3 pairs of french and spanish ships locked together without an additional locked-in british ship to at least make it look good. Plus there's the whole "opposing nations" part of the locked-ship instructions, and the history weenie in me wants to remind teenagers playing on this map that will certainly be their first detailed exposure to the Battle (high school history class doesn't leave a lot of room in the broader context of the age of napoleon to dedicate to a ship-by-ship analysis of trafalgar) that the french and spanish are technically not opposing sides.

It's really those 3 pairs (Intrepid-Rayo, Indomptable-San Leonardo, and Berwick-Argonauta) that present the problem, since you do need at least some level of connectivity between the fleets. I don't want to get rid of the connections, but I'm wondering if there's a better,more historically accurate way to depict them (though I'm buggered if I know off the top of my head what that might be, but I suspect it would just be a rewording of the instructions). If there isn't, then so be it, and I'll tell the history weenie to stfu.

EDIT: oh, and Bellerplion should be Bellerophon

[cairnswk]

Okay, this is kind of a gameplay thing, but it's mostly because I'm a history weenie:

There's no indication really that the French and Spanish were on the same side, not in the legend, certainly not in the fact that there's 3 pairs of french and spanish ships locked together without an additional locked-in british ship to at least make it look good. Plus there's the whole "opposing nations" part of the locked-ship instructions, and the history weenie in me wants to remind teenagers playing on this map that will certainly be their first detailed exposure to the Battle (high school history class doesn't leave a lot of room in the broader context of the age of napoleon to dedicate to a ship-by-ship analysis of trafalgar) that the french and spanish are technically not opposing sides.

It's really those 3 pairs (Intrepid-Rayo, Indomptable-San Leonardo, and Berwick-Argonauta) that present the problem, since you do need at least some level of connectivity between the fleets. I don't want to get rid of the connections, but I'm wondering if there's a better,more historically accurate way to depict them (though I'm buggered if I know off the top of my head what that might be, but I suspect it would just be a rewording of the instructions). If there isn't, then so be it, and I'll tell the history weenie to stfu.

1. I've changed the Nations Involved to British Vs French & Spanish. That should cover the sides involved.
2. Changed the Board Vessels - Opposing Nations to Boarding Ships - Opposing Sides (now that there is sides apparent from the Nations Involved.
3. Changed Board Vessels - Same Nation to Boarding Ships - Same Nation
4. Added Same Side with row boat indicators instead of having the same side ships locked together, that should be better.
5. had to re-arrange whole legend
6. reduced the glow on the tert names

EDIT: oh, and Bellerplion should be Bellerophon

Fixed

Version 22 below:

Click image to enlarge.

[Incandenza]

Ah, that'll shut the history weenie up. Thanks, cairns, tho you might want to futz with the rowboat graphics so they look less like insects.

More later... this evening sometime I'll have a few pops and take a nice long look and see what I can come up with.

[cairnswk]

Ah, that'll shut the history weenie up. Thanks, cairns, tho you might want to futz with the rowboat graphics so they look less like insects.

Good. pleased to hear you like that solution....although....6 men in row boat with oars...that's gotta not look like insects...where's you're imagination man!!? I'll see about them.

[cairnswk]

Here's a legend suggestion for you...

Instead of

Weather Line
- - - - - - - - - - -
Lee Line
French W
Spanish W
British W
French L
Spanish L
British L

You could do...

British W
French W
Spanish W
Weather Line
- - - - - - - - - - -
Lee Line
British L
French L
Spanish L

There are 2 changes here...

1 position above/below the line.
2 ordering of fleets from left to right.

I plan to have a look at the game play on this shortly - but my CC time is limited these days - so I'll see if I can devote some time to it.

C.

Legend done for you. What a shame you're lessening your time. Still, i'll be in that boat shortly as soon as uni starts.
Can you have look over the gameplay please and wording etc when you get a chance. Thanks C.

[Incandenza]

One thing that might help is, since you have a graphic in the legend depicting the whole rowboat thing, you might be able to get away with not having the lines connecting the ships thru the rowboats.

And yes, any gameplay input from yeti would be kickin', make my job easier.

[cairnswk]

Version 23.
1. Removed the oars from the row boats - to make them look less like insects.
2. changed the black lines to coloured lines representing the sides.

Click image to enlarge.

[The Neon Peon]

Heros connection still has oars. Row boats look better now, though.

[cairnswk]

Heros connection still has oars. Row boats look better now, though.

Bugger. Missed that one. Please refresh to view the fix.

[cairnswk]

Cannon sorted.

Added bevel to the ship. does this help any?

Any comments?

Click image to enlarge.

[The Neon Peon]

Santissima Trinidad name is a mile away from the ship to which it belongs.

[the.killing.44]

On the large, could you move Santissima Trinidad closer to the ship? Right now it's floating in the middle of nowhere …

.44

EDIT: fastposted … just proves the point

[cairnswk]

Santissima Trinidad name is a mile away from the ship to which it belongs.

Oops. Fixed. Please refresh.

[saraith]

Nice work.. I'm impressed

One thing I can suggest, though... Wouldn't it be more accurate to call the Victory, the Santissima Trinidad, and the Bucentaure flagships instead of Commanders?

[the.killing.44]

One thing I can suggest, though... Wouldn't it be more accurate to call the Victory, the Santissima Trinidad, and the Bucentaure flagships instead of Commanders?

I agree with that.

.44