TO; Qualify World Cup 2010 - UEFA [Qualifiers PG 1&28]

[amazzony]

Reminder of the UEFA qualifying system

• This Region will consist of 53 teams
• 13 of them will qualify to World Cup 2010 South Africa (final tournament)
• Round 1. 8 Groups of 6 teams and 1 Group of 5
  - Winner of each Group qualifies to WC 2010 South Africa
  - 8 best Runner-ups qualify to Round 2
• Comparing runner-ups. The results versus the 6th placed teams are taken away, so all have 8 matches for the runners-up table.
• Round 2. 8 teams will be put into 4 pairs where they play 1 home and 1 away team. Winners will qualify to WC 2010 South Africa.

Right now, we are ending Round 1 (10 games to finish) and then MarVal updates the scoreboard and we'll see who are the winners of each group (automatic qualification to final tournament) and 8 best runner ups who will play in second round.

Probably a week or two before we proceed to second round


Your referee,
amazzony

[rebelman]

As it's Flat Rate and both of you have 5 cards then I believe that rebelman would have won the game (and other factors that favour rebelman) and so he will get the 3 winning points. I hope that both of you agree with that decision.

thanks for that for the recordI have a blue set so if the bug had not happened in my next turn i would be getting 8 cards for my blue set with a bonus 2 on siberia and 2 on western australia i would also be getting 7 men for terrs +2 for oceania and +3 for africa with these 20 men on top of my existing army I would probably have won this turn as he had 2 pair and was unable to cash.

as his score is 1677 and mine 1334 the "score in this match would be I gain 25 pts he loses 25 pts"

[amazzony]

As it's Flat Rate and both of you have 5 cards then I believe that rebelman would have won the game (and other factors that favour rebelman) and so he will get the 3 winning points. I hope that both of you agree with that decision.

thanks for that for the recordI have a blue set so if the bug had not happened in my next turn i would be getting 8 cards for my blue set with a bonus 2 on siberia and 2 on western australia i would also be getting 7 men for terrs +2 for oceania and +3 for africa with these 20 men on top of my existing army I would probably have won this turn as he had 2 pair and was unable to cash.

as his score is 1677 and mine 1334 the "score in this match would be I gain 25 pts he loses 25 pts"

As there seems to be an argue when you would of won the game (under or over 10 rounds) then there's a possibility that you might have to play again (or we'll find another possibility how to even things and make sure that things are fair to both of you).

Things are harder because I don't know who had how many men in which territory etc.

I'm sorry for giving you that much hope but I might of been a bit hasty with my answer


I don't understand what the hell is going on with this region I have never had any problems with tournaments and this region seems to go from one problem to another


Your referee,
amazzony

[rebelman]

As it's Flat Rate and both of you have 5 cards then I believe that rebelman would have won the game (and other factors that favour rebelman) and so he will get the 3 winning points. I hope that both of you agree with that decision.

thanks for that for the recordI have a blue set so if the bug had not happened in my next turn i would be getting 8 cards for my blue set with a bonus 2 on siberia and 2 on western australia i would also be getting 7 men for terrs +2 for oceania and +3 for africa with these 20 men on top of my existing army I would probably have won this turn as he had 2 pair and was unable to cash.

as his score is 1677 and mine 1334 the "score in this match would be I gain 25 pts he loses 25 pts"

As there seems to be an argue when you would of won the game (under or over 10 rounds) then there's a possibility that you might have to play again (or we'll find another possibility how to even things and make sure that things are fair to both of you).

Things are harder because I don't know who had how many men in which territory etc.

I'm sorry for giving you that much hope but I might of been a bit hasty with my answer


I don't understand what the hell is going on with this region I have never had any problems with tournaments and this region seems to go from one problem to another


Your referee,
amazzony

i would have finished him off in round 6 if the bug never appeared i had 8 men protecting africa that would have easily held off his 7 (4+3) worst case scenarion he would have broken my africa bonus but with my blue set i would have cleared home in round 6 as he did not cash in rd 5.

[rebelman]

Hello rebelman,

Due to technical difficulties game 1608059, which you joined, had become corrupted beyond repair and had to be deleted.

We apologize for any inconvenience this causes.

Regards,
The Conquer Club

[scottie]

Game 1608064 - brikb (Macedonia) win

Game 1608065 - scottie (Scotland) win

[Lucifer4o]

since Slovenia beat Northern Ireland once then the outcome of the second game (which I rule totally right now too) is not important in any way...I win group 3...yay me...possibly the team with most points overall too...hello WC Africa 2010

[amazzony]

As it's Flat Rate and both of you have 5 cards then I believe that rebelman would have won the game (and other factors that favour rebelman) and so he will get the 3 winning points. I hope that both of you agree with that decision.

thanks for that for the recordI have a blue set so if the bug had not happened in my next turn i would be getting 8 cards for my blue set with a bonus 2 on siberia and 2 on western australia i would also be getting 7 men for terrs +2 for oceania and +3 for africa with these 20 men on top of my existing army I would probably have won this turn as he had 2 pair and was unable to cash.

as his score is 1677 and mine 1334 the "score in this match would be I gain 25 pts he loses 25 pts"

As there seems to be an argue when you would of won the game (under or over 10 rounds) then there's a possibility that you might have to play again (or we'll find another possibility how to even things and make sure that things are fair to both of you).

Things are harder because I don't know who had how many men in which territory etc.

I'm sorry for giving you that much hope but I might of been a bit hasty with my answer


I don't understand what the hell is going on with this region I have never had any problems with tournaments and this region seems to go from one problem to another


Your referee,
amazzony

i would have finished him off in round 6 if the bug never appeared i had 8 men protecting africa that would have easily held off his 7 (4+3) worst case scenarion he would have broken my africa bonus but with my blue set i would have cleared home in round 6 as he did not cash in rd 5.

Will your opponent say the same thing? Aka that the only place where he could of attacked you was africa and it was defended by 7?

[rebelman]

Will your opponent say the same thing? Aka that the only place where he could of attacked you was africa and it was defended by 7?

yes he will but as you said he has pmed me indicating that there was no certainty that I would win within 10 rounds. Also in him he admits he lost 12 men attacking this force in Africa trying to break it. I don't want to include his pm here without his permission. I believe the reason my opponent is protesting to this is if I get 3 pts and he gets 0 he will drop to 3rd in the table and i will go top. He is suggesting I get 3 and he gets 1 - that would give him 1st place and me 2nd. But this would be unfair on the rest of the group. I was playing this game to win within 10 rounds as I knew based on the table I would be out of the competition if i did not. I am as certain as anyone can be in a game that involves luck that I would have achieved this.

[hulmey]

why dont you follow uefa rules on this one?

[amazzony]

why dont you follow uefa rules on this one?

Care to explain more? I'm not that familiar with all the rules

[hulmey]

Well reb's match was cancelled/abdoned for whatever reason (be it technical/weather or crowd control issues). Thus the game has to be replayed again from the beginning or from the initial score line!!

The latter would be hard to do though

[rebelman]

Well reb's match was cancelled/abdoned for whatever reason (be it technical/weather or crowd control issues). Thus the game has to be replayed again from the beginning or from the initial score line!!

The latter would be hard to do though

hulmey in this game i was well in control my opponent knowingly or otherwise took his moveand gained a huge advantage from the bug - I'm sure a replay would be all that fair the other option would be my preference but thats impossible.

[jcaste5]

I feel I need to come in here and defend myself and explain my stance on the situation. Let me preface this by saying I had no idea that there was a glitch going on and wouldn't have taking my turn had i known. After clicking begin turn there was nothing else to do then attack. The situation of the game is that rebelman was the clear cut leader in the game but i did still have 4 armies in kamchatka, 4 in greenland, 7 total in s. america and a couple singles in europe. The bottom line is that I feel he would have struggled to eliminate all of that, with nuetral countries that he would also have had to go through on his next turn. Even if he came up just one army short i had a multi set to cash on my next turn, so i would have had another 13 armies to deploy. From there if you ask me anything is possible. As I explained to the tourney runner and to my opponent I have seen much larger leads lost than the lead my opponent had. Would he have won the game? In all honesty, yes he would have. But to say that he would have won within the next 4 rounds is just a guess and in a game of complete chance, I don't think that is fair. I have made 2 very fair suggestions on how to move foward that rebelman can gladly post if he feels the need. It is not my purpose to sabotage the tournament in any way, but a fair solution for everyone is what we should be searching for. Keep me posted.

[rebelman]

I feel I need to come in here and defend myself and explain my stance on the situation. Let me preface this by saying I had no idea that there was a glitch going on and wouldn't have taking my turn had i known.

thats fair enough although you had aprox. 20 more hours to take your turnand there had been multiple forum posts by the time you did move according to the game log but I take what you say at face value.

After clicking begin turn there was nothing else to do then attack. The situation of the game is that rebelman was the clear cut leader in the game but i did still have 4 armies in kamchatka, 4 in greenland, 7 total in s. america and a couple singles in europe.

once you began your turn and saw this you could have reported the bug and not deployed let your move time out as many did. Even if this bug was unique to this game that would have been the tried and tested procedure.

The bottom line is that I feel he would have struggled to eliminate all of that, with nuetral countries that he would also have had to go through on his next turn. Even if he came up just one army short i had a multi set to cash on my next turn, so i would have had another 13 armies to deploy. From there if you ask me anything is possible.

this is true i had a maybe a 90 - 95% chance of pulling it off but no guarantee if i failed to do it in rd 6 i would still have 4 more rounds though and my oceania bonus was rock not to mention card cashing.

[rebelman]

But to say that he would have won within the next 4 rounds is just a guess and in a game of complete chance, I don't think that is fair. I have made 2 very fair suggestions on how to move foward that rebelman can gladly post if he feels the need. It is not my purpose to sabotage the tournament in any way, but a fair solution for everyone is what we should be searching for. Keep me posted.

i agree its a best guess but no guarentee your solutions were that i get 3 pts and you get 1 - this to me is unfair on the others in our group. As it guarentees you 1st and me 2nd. If anything what would make more sense is me 4 pts and you 1 pt ie treat the game as a win for me and a draw but again this is unfair on the others in our group

your other solution to me seemed fairer if the tournie organisers and other competitors want to go along with it:

to gurantee you 3 points but to replay the game and if I won or played to a draw then we would both recieve our respective points.

the effect of this is i will get 3 pts anyway but we have another game where pts are again up for grabs.

I am happy with whatever decision is reached.

[amazzony]

I'll make the decision tomorrow because it's late in here and my mind ain't working well right now.

[rebelman]

I'll make the decision tomorrow because it's late in here and my mind ain't working well right now.

fair enough im happy to leave it in your hands, also I want to make it publicly clear based on his post above anf from what I know of him I don't believe there was any intentional fowl play by my opponent.

[jcaste5]

To put this to rest before amazzony makes his decision, like 99% of the players on CC I go right into my games, not the forum upon signing on so there was no way to know of a glitch. Either way I am very pleased with the way everyone listened to each other's stances and are trying to work this out as it was no fault of any of ours.

[amazzony]

It is not an easy decision and whatever I decide, one of the players will be treated unfair. So, there won't be any double giving points (aka 1 gets winners points and the other draw points as, rebelman mentioned, this is not fair to others in the group). I believe that rebelman had a really strong position to win the game but it's also true that we can't say if it would have happened before 10 rounds or not.

So, we'll basically use the same tactics that lack used for clearing the mess. All games were deleted and points given back (aka the games were treated as a failure and there were no winners, no losers). What I'm trying to say that the game will be played again and points will be counted as usually.
But with one exception. As rebelman had an advantage in the game then the game will be freestyle and rebelman will be joining second.

It definitely not the best solution but it assures that the person who had advantage still has it (this is as close to real UEFA as possible).

For now, this is my decision. If there are strong and reasonable arguments against it then I'm opened for discussion. Game will be made in 24 hours.


Your referee,
amazzony

[rebelman]

i accept your decision but as I never play freestyle (very rarely anyway) I'm fairly certain I am now doomed to loose and loose badly

if a replay is your decision, I really wish it was seq. (don't mind what other settings are involved)

[jcaste5]

I obviously am ok with this decision and the benefit of freestyle to you is that you will have the first go. If you prefer seq. then obv. i do too. Either way is fine with me.

[amazzony]

If you really don't wish freestyle then I will change it to sequential (all other settings will be the same as they were in the previous game). But in 1v1 sequential only gives the going first advantage to the player who joins second, otherwise there's nothing different. Just don't play right away after your opponent plays so he couldn't play again and don't wait 12h to play, otherwise your opponent can play before you

Final decision is up to you, rebelman, if you wish sequential or freestyle (it's the best I can do).

I'm sorry that all of it happened but it's only because people wanted a better classic map and couldn't see the armies And sadly I can't do much to fic the problem But I'm glad that you both deal with it nicely and don't go out of your mind and start yelling and screaming


Your referee,
amazzony

[rebelman]

make it sequential so it truly will be a replay - and let the best player win (hopefully that's me )

[amazzony]

Good luck to both of you!


There's still 6 games that need to end before MarVal can gather final results and update the tabel with those who advance to next round. I think that it will take appr. a week.


Your referee,
amazzony