N Korea and testing Nukes

[Mirak]

[In closeing, you either believe the Bible to be the Word of God or you don't. The evidence is too overwelming for the predictions within it to have been fulfilled by "mere chance".]

Which "overwhelming" evidence are you refering to?

[/quote]

[vtmarik]

[In closeing, you either believe the Bible to be the Word of God or you don't. The evidence is too overwelming for the predictions within it to have been fulfilled by "mere chance".]

Which "overwhelming" evidence are you refering to?

[/quote]

Mirak, trust me, don't get him started. You can do a simple google search for an evangelistic/apologist website about "fulfilled biblical prophecy"


Unfortunately for the apologists and evangelists, the biblical prophecies can easily be interpreted about a dozen different ways. "When the legend becomes the truth, print the legend."

[jay_a2j]

This overwheming evidence:

http://books.google.com/books?id=CW5nxq ... 7EtQEUBUs8


http://books.google.com/books?id=CW5nxq ... t7gEW9fznU


Now, you can go on denying what is plain as day or you can look into it more on your own time and discover for yourself.

[jay_a2j]

yada,yada,yada

[Mirak]

Thanks for the links Jay

I am totally underwhelmed...

[jay_a2j]

Thanks for the links Jay

I am totally underwhelmed...

You're welcome.


And thats what those in the psychology field call DENIAL.

[heavycola]

Thanks for the links Jay

I am totally underwhelmed...

You're welcome.


And thats what those in the psychology field call DENIAL.

JAY for god's sake some people DISAGREE WITH YOU. I think this is what pisses me off most. He reads your links, decides he believes it's a load of bollocks and he's in denial? meanwhile yours is the only correct reading of the bible, let alone the only valid belief system.

here's the difference - most rational people would answer, asked whether Jaya2j's belief that Zechariah predicted nuclear war, that they do not know. The rest is mere opinion. You, on the other hand, believe you know everything, as do the rest of your fundamentalist buddies. The arrogance is overwhelming.

but then that's no surprise.
Jesus - hung out with and quite liked poor people, preached humility and love for one's neighbour.
Jay/evangelicals - think anyone on welfare is lazy and unproductive, too arrogant to countenance any different viewpoints and hate muslims.

I can see how those can be reconciled.

I am reading a book about the evangelical movement in the US and it struck me how selfish it all is - proclaiming a'personal relationship' with jesus. ED Mcateer or whover it is goes to Israel and jesus speaks personally to them on the shore of Galilee. These guys are so holy they got chosen for a one-on-one with the son of god. Yeah right.
And the support for Israel is hardly altruistic - kick the Palestinians out of their homes, shit all over the neighbours and jesus will reappear.

Xtianity - a peaceful, moderate religion that has helped millions of people all over the world. US-brand evangelism - a destructive force that is turning the US into a single-faith theocracy and is affecting the rest of us whether we believe in or like it or not.

[Mirak]

Jay-

And thats what those in the real world call PATRONISING

You are already convinced therefore anything that remotely endorses your belief you see as "overwhelming" evidence

Everything else you ignore...who is in denial?
By the way I love you avatar

[vtmarik]

See? What did I tell you, google and ye shall find.

The problem with this overwhelming evidence is that it all relies on the Bible, there is no independent way of confirming any of this, so we cannot draw any kind of conclusions other than "These guys like their bibles."

Jay, it's not denial we suffer from, it's masochism. The masochist urge to continue this pointless argument wherever it may arise.

[jay_a2j]

Thanks for the links Jay

I am totally underwhelmed...

You're welcome.


And thats what those in the psychology field call DENIAL.

JAY for god's sake some people DISAGREE WITH YOU. I think this is what pisses me off most. He reads your links, decides he believes it's a load of bollocks and he's in denial? meanwhile yours is the only correct reading of the bible, let alone the only valid belief system.

here's the difference - most rational people would answer, asked whether Jaya2j's belief that Zechariah predicted nuclear war, that they do not know. The rest is mere opinion. You, on the other hand, believe you know everything, as do the rest of your fundamentalist buddies. The arrogance is overwhelming.

but then that's no surprise.
Jesus - hung out with and quite liked poor people, preached humility and love for one's neighbour.
Jay/evangelicals - think anyone on welfare is lazy and unproductive, too arrogant to countenance any different viewpoints and hate muslims.

I can see how those can be reconciled.

I am reading a book about the evangelical movement in the US and it struck me how selfish it all is - proclaiming a'personal relationship' with jesus. ED Mcateer or whover it is goes to Israel and jesus speaks personally to them on the shore of Galilee. These guys are so holy they got chosen for a one-on-one with the son of god. Yeah right.
And the support for Israel is hardly altruistic - kick the Palestinians out of their homes, shit all over the neighbours and jesus will reappear.

Xtianity - a peaceful, moderate religion that has helped millions of people all over the world. US-brand evangelism - a destructive force that is turning the US into a single-faith theocracy and is affecting the rest of us whether we believe in or like it or not.

wow, I guess I have to explain myself as posting threads on an internet website dose not fully permit the reader to know or understand the "poster".


Most of my "little jabs" ie. the denial comment, is sarcasm and or just plain fun. Yes, people disagree with me. However the old saying, "You think you are always right" should apply to just about every person in the world. Because if you don't think you are right, why are you talking? No religion/faith would survive if it relied on comments like, "In my oppinion I believe this..... but I could be wrong." FAITH is being sure of what you hope for and certain of what you do not see. (HEB11:1)


Let me also be clear on the Zechariah verse. The meaning given (nuclear) is an interpretation and not my own. A mere possibility, not a fact. There are facts in scripture that can be validated. (see links in prior posts) The fact that Jesus' virgin birth for example, is just too accurate to have been predictied 100's of years before being fulfilled, to be a mere coincidence. Also that He would be crucified, hundreds of years before crucifixtion was even invented.

You can't say the Bible is self-fulfilling prophesy because the original writtings have been "dated". Therefore it can be proven that say Daniel wrote his prediction long before Mark wrote about its fulfilment.

The evidence is there, if we take the time to look for it. Please don't misake my confidence in my Faith for arrogance.


I don't hate muslims. Jesus came, not to condemn the world, but to save it.

[jay_a2j]

The problem with this overwhelming evidence is that it all relies on the Bible,

And in your view, the Bible is inherintly wrong. Yet have no evidence what so ever to back that claim. (See other threads possibly Truman's Bible Contradictions)

It is a "fairy tale" or Santa Claus comparasin per backglass.

[vtmarik]

And in your view, the Bible is inherintly wrong. Yet have no evidence what so ever to back that claim. (See other threads possibly Truman's Bible Contradictions)

It is a "fairy tale" or Santa Claus comparasin per backglass.

No, my view is that the Bible is unprovable because the only evidence of it's accuracy is the Bible. A claim cannot use itself as proof of the claim.

Since it cannot be proven right or wrong using this test, we must discard it completely, and try to find something that proves the Bible's accuracy outside of the Bible. Prophecy cannot do this because prophecy (like so many things in the Book) is open to interpretation.

It's more a book of fables than a fairy tale. There are some lessons worth learning (The story of Jonah, and it's moral: "Don't be stubborn") but I don't believe it to be God's Irrefutable and Immutable Truth™. Until we can find some method of verification outside of the Bible, I will continue to consider it a book of fables and not divine word.

[Mirak]

No the Bible is not inherently wrong...but the claim that it is the divine word of God is inherently wrong until demonstrated otherwise by irrefutable and rational (as opposed to emotional) arguments.

Ultimately we all know that this is not possible.

That's why its called faith...I respect the faithful...but find the "certain" exasperating...

Loved your jokes in the joke thread

[Sammy gags]

didnt i make this topic like 6 months ago?

[jay_a2j]

No the Bible is not inherently wrong...but the claim that it is the divine word of God is inherently wrong until demonstrated otherwise by irrefutable and rational (as opposed to emotional) arguments.

Ultimately we all know that this is not possible.

That's why its called faith...I respect the faithful...but find the "certain" exasperating...

Loved your jokes in the joke thread

I appoligise for being "exasperating" then.


And thanks, but not my jokes got em from some joke site.

[2dimes]

whover it is goes to Israel and jesus speaks personally to them on the shore of Galilee. These guys are so holy they got chosen for a one-on-one with the son of god. Yeah right.

Uh Jesus specifically warned not to believe people that say that.

Something about him coming back will be like lightning. Everyone will see it at the same time.

23Men will tell you, 'There he is!' or 'Here he is!' Do not go running off after them. 24For the Son of Man in his day will be like the lightning, which flashes and lights up the sky from one end to the other.

So yeah Heavy I think you're right that guy's probably not hanging out with the real guy from the bible and stuff.

[Mirak]

Jay--



"And thanks, but not my jokes got em from some joke site. [/quote]"


Presumably thats where you get ALL your material from...