The CUBE

[Tieryn]

Cheers DiM

XML is here

Note: I haven't done map co-ordinates yet, but everything else validates in jota's tester.

I'll get to co-ordinates soon. Just wanted to make sure that the map sizes were okay before I did them.

Edit: Coordinates now done, for the current map size... but the small map is outside the 600px width limit... Has this been approved? Also while the large map is great for proportions, I noticed a couple of "1 pixel off" gaps between spaces (usually 141, but sometimes 140). Also some of the armies are not centred in the circles. I suggest reading Widowmaker's XML circles tute, as you'll need to re-make the circles for the small map, but the large map is looking great and fitting perfectly

[FreeMan10]

Yipes! That's a LOT of XML. Does all that have to be hand written or are there tools to generate some of that?

I know there are validation tools, but... yikes....



/shudders

[Tieryn]

Frankly, I used excel spreadsheets to generate it all.

Just set up a sheet with each territory, and what it connected to, and then each continent, its components, and its bonuses, and with a bit of playing with and dumping and referencing etc, I was able to create most of the body of the XML.

It was inparticular easier in this map due to the symmetrical patterend approach to it, but I'll use this excel format (if not the exact structure) for all my XML in the future.

If anyone would like a look at the excel file I don't mind sharing it.

This one was also particularly large since it had 64 territories, and 135 continents

[Lone.prophet]

^^ wow nice idea can i have a look

[Tieryn]

sure mate, just pm me your e-mail address, or add me to msn, tieryn@coman.com.au

[Tieryn]

Bump.

I'm going to be looking at the base image for the large version and just adjusting it slightly to make circles all even distances apart, and centre armies in them nicer.

Can anyone else see any major or minor issues in the images? They're looking great to me, top work paulk

Also can I get feelings/opinions on the bonuses situation? is it okay now? or should it go back to the way it was before the overrides. (as worded on the map) where you would get each panel as a continent, and then +3. (note this means you count each ball 3 times, once in each panel it corners)

[paulk]

how about this:

keep:
for each quadrant you get 1 bonus (gives that EACH minicube = 6)
for each minicube you get an additional +3 (gives that EACH minicube = 6+3 = 9)

and instead of:
+1 for each yellow ball (gives that MIDDLE minicube = 6+3+(4*6) = 33)

that:
+1 for each yellow ball is ONLY COUNTED ONCE (gives that MIDDLE minicube = 6+3+8 = 17)

That is actually how I pictured it from the beginning, only didn't think about how it added up.

[Tieryn]

Makes a lot more sense, and I like. I'll update XML later today

[Tieryn]

So we have:

Outer Corner Minicube: 6+3+1 = 10
Outer Edge Minicube: 6+3+2 = 11
Outer Face Minicube: 6+3+4 = 13
Centre Minicube: 6+3+8 = 17

XML here

[paulk]

So we have:

Outer Corner Minicube: 6+3+1 = 10
Outer Edge Minicube: 6+3+2 = 11
Outer Face Minicube: 6+3+4 = 13
Centre Minicube: 6+3+8 = 17

Perfect! Now someone has to take it to the next level?

[Tieryn]

uhh... I vote we take it to final forge for tweaking/perfecting?

[DiM]

uhh... I vote we take it to final forge for tweaking/perfecting?

sorry but i doubt it.
here's what oaktown said 2-3 weeks ago and since then the situation hasn't changed:

I'm still waiting to hear from all of the fans of this map - i know there are some out there, but I'd like to see more feedback going into making this map forge-able. My concern is that the interest just isn't there - you all should prove me wrong!

if you want the map to move forward then you need support. the greatest idea with the best graphics will die soon if people just don't like it or if they like it but don't post here to support it.

[gimil]

[Move to Final Forge]

Sorry but I had to edit the title:

1. You dont tell the cartoes when to move you

2. You don't ever use square brackets in your title Official use only.

[paulk]

if you want the map to move forward then you need support. the greatest idea with the best graphics will die soon if people just don't like it or if they like it but don't post here to support it.

how about all the support for the idea that was expressed in the old thread?

[DiM]

if you want the map to move forward then you need support. the greatest idea with the best graphics will die soon if people just don't like it or if they like it but don't post here to support it.

how about all the support for the idea that was expressed in the old thread?

well, get those people to post here and help the map advance. this map could have 10 thousand fans but if none of them posts here it's useless.

you have 61 posts and you're asking for forge, well look at the forged maps and see how many posts they have. and it's not just about posts it's also about how many people make them. if i look on the last page most posts are from you or Tieryn.

the map will never move ahead unless support is shown. go and advertise your map. gather supporters, gather people to give you feedback.

usually when people stop posting in a map there are 2 reasons:

1. good case: map is ready to be moved ahead as nobody has any concerns to express
2. bad case: map isn't interesting enough and people don't bother.

so far with 60 replies and a handful of posters in this thread i'm afraid we have #2. as i said, advertise it. make it attractive. try to find out why people don't like it. perhaps it's the graphics or the gameplay or both.

[paulk]

1. good case: map is ready to be moved ahead as nobody has any concerns to express
2. bad case: map isn't interesting enough and people don't bother.

I take it you don't like it?

[DiM]

1. good case: map is ready to be moved ahead as nobody has any concerns to express
2. bad case: map isn't interesting enough and people don't bother.

I take it you don't like it?

i do and i don't.

i like the idea. i don't like the graphics or the gameplay.

aside from the nice background (did you make it?) the graphics are very simplistic and somewhat poor. and to be honest it doesn't give me the feeling of a hypercube. all i see is an x-ray of a cube. when i hear hypercube i expect something sci-fi. something spectacular. not some simple lines.

as for the gameplay it's very hard to play especially on speedgames and basically a lottery because of the bonus system. i wouldn't be surprised if people start with a 20 bonus in a 1v1 game.

have you seen the hypercube movies? perhaps get some inspiration from there. make certain weird connections add trap rooms spice it up a bit.

[James Vazquez]

looks interesting i like it alot better than crossword. thats just my humble opinion

[lancehoch]

The wording on how bonuses are achieved is a little confusing. Right now, it seem that I would get a bonus if I held B1, D1, J1, L1 (or maybe B1, C1, D1, F1, G1, H1, J1, K1, L1), since this is a 3x3 square. However, I know this is not the case. If you were to say 1x1 square or adjacent territories in a 1x1 square, it may be a little less abstract.

[paulk]

hehehe, I know. My graphic skills are not A+ all the time but the thing is that this was developed from 2 basic ideas:

1) lots of small bonuses.
2) attack in 3D

I first did a much smaller version, a 3x3x3, but people cried for a larger cube, so therefore the 4x4x4 was made.

The graphics are as they are, because I have tried making it somewhat understandable where you are and how you get to the next point, without getting totally lost in your head.

I fear any additional info (trap rooms, twisted lines etc) would make it close to impossible to understand where you are in the cube.

Did you take a look at the previous maps? They are represented by thumbnails in the first post. Just click and you will be taken to a site where you see the full scale version. And there is also a previous thread (also in first post) where many aspects of size and background have been discussed.

The texts could be tweaked a little probably. I still am looking for the best way to explain the 1 point basic bonus - the quadrant. Any suggestions are warm welcome.

[Battle-Rage]

I like the concept, and look forward to playing this map.

The background is of little consequence, so long as the cube and players remains visible when the assorted colours are present.

[paulk]

The wording on how bonuses are achieved is a little confusing. Right now, it seem that I would get a bonus if I held B1, D1, J1, L1 (or maybe B1, C1, D1, F1, G1, H1, J1, K1, L1), since this is a 3x3 square. However, I know this is not the case. If you were to say 1x1 square or adjacent territories in a 1x1 square, it may be a little less abstract.

good point! thank you.

[feralmeerkat]

It is very unique and almost mathematically oriented. It seems difficult, but fair. I'd like to see it become a real map and throw all the best players on it.

[Tieryn]

Yes, I like the wording of 1x1 square, over "quadrant"... that term never really expressed the idea that it was describing... Another possible description would be to have a small picture of a 1x1 square next to the bonus, and call it a "minicube face" and also a small pic of a 1x1x1 cube next to the "minicube" bonus.

I prefer this as a straightforward attack along the lines map. It's mathematical, and shouldn't need to be twisted and twiny... On the other hand, I agree with DiM about the wording "Hypercube", and that word still doesn't ring true with me for that map. I think a better name would just be "3-D Cube", the Hypercube is in actuality a 4 dimensional shape, which is not what we have here... (nor can you depict 4 dimensions statically in 2D)

On a final note, in order to combat the possible massive bonuses in two player games, I think the middle 8 Yellow cubes should start as neutral, although not huge, just 3. This will mean that it is not possible to start holding a minicube, only individual faces (if you're lucky), and then only +1 faces. This will drastically reduce the unfairness for going first in low player games. If people like this idea I'll update the XML presently.

[barterer2002]

Paul since you asked for my thoughts here we are.

In general I like lots of different maps available and for that reason I would throw my support behind each concept just to provide more choices, however with that being said, I think someone would have to play this one a lot to get a firm grasp of it. Of course the same can be said of Waterloo, Pearl Harbor and a myriad of other maps so that's not a bad thing. The question I have is whether the map would be played enough to make it worth while. I'd play it but I'm a CC whore and play any map that comes along. I don't know that everyone would (or that many would). I worry that we could have another Conquerman on our hands with this one.

I don't generally comment on the graphics/gameplay becase I'm simply not knowledgable about them.