Sumer - The First Civilization (v1.4)

[Teflon Kris]

This map is too small (21 territories) to make it through the foundry. I have other concerns about the map, but the smallness of it makes it little more than a crap-shoot.

Please elaborate.

Small maps are actually better for 1 v 1 - at least maps with less than 11 starts.

Plus, there are plenty of small maps that mave made it - Lux, Mad, Dood, USA West, WWII Poland, D & C, Gr China, Indoch, USA SE, Cyprus, San Mar, Ireland, Egypt x 3 ...

... even Wales and Mexico are relatively small ( )

Surely, a map of this size is acceptable if it has something different about the gameplay?

How many territories are considered sufficient these days? Cyprus has 28, 8 of which are neutral, meaning 20 regions to start.

I'm not saying this map wouldn't benefit from a couple more regions, just wondering what the size rationale is really.

[Industrial Helix]

Ok, I'm getting some feedback from my colleagues and two primary concerns have been raised.

1) Could the Sumerians fly? They would need this ability to jump from city to adjacent city without first taking the the river territory. So you're probably going to drop this rule. Perhaps you could introduce a decay on the river territories simulating the hardship of maintaining a standing army.

2) The map could be so much more... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumer#City-States
It seems that more territories are in order.

[Teflon Kris]

Ok, I'm getting some feedback from my colleagues and two primary concerns have been raised.

1) Could the Sumerians fly? They would need this ability to jump from city to adjacent city without first taking the the river territory. So you're probably going to drop this rule. Perhaps you could introduce a decay on the river territories simulating the hardship of maintaining a standing army.

2) The map could be so much more... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumer#City-States
It seems that more territories are in order.

Decay would be a cool, and highly appropriate, feature for this map.

And, the link does suggest more cities.

[theBastard]

this map looks interesting. but I agree with Helix´s last post and also OliverFA´s point about bonuses sounds fine.

if you will think about more regions/towns here are some maps

show

[Victor Sullivan]

Ok, I'm getting some feedback from my colleagues and two primary concerns have been raised.

1) Could the Sumerians fly? They would need this ability to jump from city to adjacent city without first taking the the river territory. So you're probably going to drop this rule. Perhaps you could introduce a decay on the river territories simulating the hardship of maintaining a standing army.

2) The map could be so much more... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumer#City-States
It seems that more territories are in order.

1) Alright, I agree the decay would be a better way to resolve the problem.
2) I do see I've missed a couple, but some of those are actually Akkadian...

this map looks interesting. but I agree with Helix´s last post and also OliverFA´s point about bonuses sounds fine.

I'll look at Oliver's suggestion again.

-Sully

[Teflon Kris]

How about a few more cities which become starting regions and decay elsewhere with neutral starts?

Perhaps cities start with 4 (or 3 and an auto-deploy), neutrals between cities are 2, other neutrals 1 and players get 2 troops per turn (plus any bonus)?

The map would then be a mini-oasis style.

[Victor Sullivan]

I'll try putting up another draft this week for y'alls.

[Industrial Helix]

How's the update coming?

[Victor Sullivan]

How's the update coming?

Still working on it. Haven't had as much time to work on it as I thought because of interims and such. I should have all the interim stuff done tonight, so I'm hoping I'll be able to finish it tomorrow. Cross your fingers

-Sully

[Victor Sullivan]

Voila!

Click image to enlarge.

Added a couple cities, changed the rules a bit. Thoughts?

-Sully

[Industrial Helix]

The bonus system seems good enough for fine tuning in the gameplay workshop but one concern of mine remains. How is it that an army in Uruk could attack Larsa withough first conquering the river territory Gilgamesh? Change this and we'll get this map on its way.

[Victor Sullivan]

The bonus system seems good enough for fine tuning in the gameplay workshop but one concern of mine remains. How is it that an army in Uruk could attack Larsa withough first conquering the river territory Gilgamesh? Change this and we'll get this map on its way.

Hm... I was just thinking it would open up the cities more, but alright. I'll post it on Monday, as I can't access the file until then.

-Sully

[Victor Sullivan]

Fixed:

Click image to enlarge.

[Industrial Helix]

Awesome, time for this one to move on.

[Victor Sullivan]

Beanz!!!! Thanks Helix...(as soon as it's in the GP workshop, anyways )

Now taking gameplay comments (well, I suppose I was before, but you get the idea...)

-Sully

[Victor Sullivan]

Lol you moved it as I typed that.

[Evil DIMwit]

Are there neutrals? Starting positions?

[Victor Sullivan]

Are there neutrals? Starting positions?

Yes, most likely. I've been thinking about it for awhile. I'll get back to you when I have an answer

[Victor Sullivan]

Okay, my initial thought is to make the land territories starting positions, then have the cities dealt out normally, but that may or may not be fair for someone that gets Gilgamesh versus someone who gets Ubaid. Thoughts?

[Evil DIMwit]

Note that if each player in an 8p game only starts with one territory, it's far too easy to eliminate someone. Even two is a stretch.

[Victor Sullivan]

Okay, my initial thought is to make the land territories starting positions, then have the cities dealt out normally, but that may or may not be fair for someone that gets Gilgamesh versus someone who gets Ubaid. Thoughts?

Methinks you need to read more carefully...

[Evil DIMwit]

Ah, my mistake. As I said, that's still a stretch. It doesn't help that some players are going to have to share a land territory and some won't.

[Victor Sullivan]

Ah, my mistake. As I said, that's still a stretch. It doesn't help that some players are going to have to share a land territory and some won't.

What do you mean? Like multiple people will have a city in the same land territory, or what exactly?

[Evil DIMwit]

Like you said. There's going to be a few players starting in Gilgamesh, but whoever starts with Ur would have a river territory all to themselves.

[Victor Sullivan]

Like you said. There's going to be a few players starting in Gilgamesh, but whoever starts with Ur would have a river territory all to themselves.

Theoretically, I suppose. But likely what will happen is someone will start with Nanna and someone else with Ur. I don't see how that could be too much of a problem. Can't I set things so that someone can't get a land territory and the city within it anyway?