Power Role Draft Mafia - Town Wins!

[freezie]

I am going to keep my vote on SG7 for now. His explanations for his multiple 180' s doesn't really convince me.

As for myself, I have few reasons to beleive the double voter is more likely mafia than town. What, however, thought me to think of it as more likely is the fact he showed only after the quick hammer strategy was busted out. Was the DV planing to do this, or simply forget his role? I dont know. What I know is the timing is fitting if anything else. By showing up at that time, he's probably ( if mafia, that is ) trying to show he's here and not going to harm. But as long as we don't know who it is, we cannot be sure..

i don't follow. I understand that the DV would want to reveal his existence when we were talking about it, but I don't see how that makes it more likely for that DV to be mafia.

Like I said, it's when he chose to appear that makes me beleive so. We were talking about him and that we should watch the Vote counts about a possible shrouded speed hammer. It's likely that he chose to now make an appearance cause his plan wouldn't work anymore and is now trying to look townish.

Like I said..It doesn't say that much. Just slightly more likely mafia due to the timing.

[pmchugh]

Freezie wagon. I am going to come out right now and just say that I was very confused with all of the roles, etc, and it cause me to temporarily lose my normal activity in games (because I didnt want to be stupid and out a powerful role) so therefore, though I read this entire BW I never quite got why it was started, and really why he got put to L-3 (I do not believe L-3 is dangerous, but it seemed more like a joke wagon than anything).

You were active though.

Something I can defend myself against off the bat. It still is very relevant. It comes up on every page and is a main reason people were trying to accuse clever. You even brought it up against me in your last post, MAKING it relevant.

Maybe relevant is the wrong word. For instance, what is your view on the sg7 case? That case and this one seem like the "relevant" ones as they are the ones that could still go either way. Freezie and clever are not going to get lynched unless something new comes up and we will not mass claim, so they are less relevant issues.

Actually I confirmed that neither case in my opinion at the time overwhelmed the other one, and so I did not feel comfortable going against either. You know how that ends. If the one you defend is mafia, you are the next investigated, and if you are town that helps no one. You should know better PMC.

See again you are sounding fearful and decisively not taking sides, as opposed to an indecisive townie. I think mafia have far more to fear than a townie from being investigated. And townie's being cleared does help the town an a lot, not as much as a mafia result but really that is the cops fault not yours. I also don't buy into your, side with mafia on one issue = auto investigated.

Also @everyone else, what are your opinions on this? I don't want me and ghostly to argue for 200 consecutive posts while everyone else sits back and watches.

[shieldgenerator7]

From this, you can see that I think there's roughly a 50% chance that mafia would have wanted doublevoter, tho there are other roles that I think would be higher on the priority list. I'll explain further if requested, but I don't want to go into detail unnecsarily.

Anyway, there's your answer: "mildly useful" so yeah Ithink mafia might have gotten it.

FASTPOSTED

-SG7 ( )

So you wanted to get someone to claim as you believed they had a role which is "mildly useful" to mafia?

So following your logic, would you want alt to claim? Chances are as first in the list his role is at least "mildly useful" to mafia.

Wait, why are we talking about alt again? I thought we were talking about the doublevoter and Ragian, etc. i CAN'T get everyone whose role might be "mildly useful" to mafia to claim all at once, and the doublevoter was the current topic, so I followed Freezie and voted Ragian, the one believed to be DV at the time. It might be a good idea to test these otehr claims later (but not in a massclaim) but I don't think it'd be a good idea to go after everyone at the top just because they woud have gotten their first pick and may be mafia.

-SG7 ( )

[pmchugh]

What is the difference shield? Why does Raigan deserve pressure for having a mildly useful role to mafia while others do not? I do not see the difference.

[ghostly447]

Freezie wagon. I am going to come out right now and just say that I was very confused with all of the roles, etc, and it cause me to temporarily lose my normal activity in games (because I didnt want to be stupid and out a powerful role) so therefore, though I read this entire BW I never quite got why it was started, and really why he got put to L-3 (I do not believe L-3 is dangerous, but it seemed more like a joke wagon than anything).

You were active though.

Who are you to tell me I was active enough to become unconfused? I asked 1 question, and there was a wagon and therefore I sat back because it was one that didnt deserve noting. You seem to have skipped over the 2 FOS's I gave that could have more than easily been the wagons for today (nag and dazza's over-reaction at my joke vote) but yet you clearly hopped over that, and went on to the wagon and partial/complete role claiming. I waited for a slow spot to reintroduce my cases, but no quiet spot has shown up.

Something I can defend myself against off the bat. It still is very relevant. It comes up on every page and is a main reason people were trying to accuse clever. You even brought it up against me in your last post, MAKING it relevant.

Maybe relevant is the wrong word. For instance, what is your view on the sg7 case? That case and this one seem like the "relevant" ones as they are the ones that could still go either way. Freezie and clever are not going to get lynched unless something new comes up and we will not mass claim, so they are less relevant issues.

I think SG7 may be a little scummy, but not enough that it deserve my vote yet. I am waiting for a big slip, but for now it just seems he tried to call out the DV and got it wrong.

Actually I confirmed that neither case in my opinion at the time overwhelmed the other one, and so I did not feel comfortable going against either. You know how that ends. If the one you defend is mafia, you are the next investigated, and if you are town that helps no one. You should know better PMC.

See again you are sounding fearful and decisively not taking sides, as opposed to an indecisive townie. I think mafia have far more to fear than a townie from being investigated. And townie's being cleared does help the town an a lot, not as much as a mafia result but really that is the cops fault not yours. I also don't buy into your, side with mafia on one issue = auto investigated.

I do not choose sides in an undeveloped case unless it is spur of the moment such as choosing Jgordon over Everywhere in Fire and Ice Mafia, and that reaction is rare in me. I wait for cold hard facts to be brought out by constant pressure until someone I make a case against loses their countercase completely. Therefore, until 1 side proves townie to me, I will remain at my unbiased stance so I do not miss evidence against either party. Its just what I tend to do.

Also @everyone else, what are your opinions on this? I don't want me and ghostly to argue for 200 consecutive posts while everyone else sits back and watches.

[Some7hingCLEVER]

Freezie wagon. I am going to come out right now and just say that I was very confused with all of the roles, etc, and it cause me to temporarily lose my normal activity in games (because I didnt want to be stupid and out a powerful role) so therefore, though I read this entire BW I never quite got why it was started, and really why he got put to L-3 (I do not believe L-3 is dangerous, but it seemed more like a joke wagon than anything).

You were active though.

Who are you to tell me I was active enough to become unconfused? I asked 1 question, and there was a wagon and therefore I sat back because it was one that didnt deserve noting. You seem to have skipped over the 2 FOS's I gave that could have more than easily been the wagons for today (nag and dazza's over-reaction at my joke vote) but yet you clearly hopped over that, and went on to the wagon and partial/complete role claiming. I waited for a slow spot to reintroduce my cases, but no quiet spot has shown up.

Something I can defend myself against off the bat. It still is very relevant. It comes up on every page and is a main reason people were trying to accuse clever. You even brought it up against me in your last post, MAKING it relevant.

Maybe relevant is the wrong word. For instance, what is your view on the sg7 case? That case and this one seem like the "relevant" ones as they are the ones that could still go either way. Freezie and clever are not going to get lynched unless something new comes up and we will not mass claim, so they are less relevant issues.

I think SG7 may be a little scummy, but not enough that it deserve my vote yet. I am waiting for a big slip, but for now it just seems he tried to call out the DV and got it wrong.

Actually I confirmed that neither case in my opinion at the time overwhelmed the other one, and so I did not feel comfortable going against either. You know how that ends. If the one you defend is mafia, you are the next investigated, and if you are town that helps no one. You should know better PMC.

See again you are sounding fearful and decisively not taking sides, as opposed to an indecisive townie. I think mafia have far more to fear than a townie from being investigated. And townie's being cleared does help the town an a lot, not as much as a mafia result but really that is the cops fault not yours. I also don't buy into your, side with mafia on one issue = auto investigated.

I do not choose sides in an undeveloped case unless it is spur of the moment such as choosing Jgordon over Everywhere in Fire and Ice Mafia, and that reaction is rare in me. I wait for cold hard facts to be brought out by constant pressure until someone I make a case against loses their countercase completely. Therefore, until 1 side proves townie to me, I will remain at my unbiased stance so I do not miss evidence against either party. Its just what I tend to do.

Also @everyone else, what are your opinions on this? I don't want me and ghostly to argue for 200 consecutive posts while everyone else sits back and watches.

I'm agreeing with ghostly you are in no right to say if he has been active enough to be unconfused
Because I have been completely active reading every last word and hell im confused as shell

Ok and the sg7 case he doesn't seem that scummy and I thought I asked but just cause his vote moves does that honestly mean he isn't the dv cause all the real dv would have to do is send a pm and get himself safe

Well the whole choosing sides it is what ghostly tends to do in every game im in he is also in and that is how he usually acts

[spiesr]

Well, ghostly, you seem to still be sort of side stepping a major thrust of pmc's case. That is, why didn't you ever offer your thoughts/opinion/arguments on whatever the topic of the day was until after a general consensus had already been reached. If your answer to this is that you did not want to have been able to be identified as having sided if a scum member on any of these topics, then I have to say that such a reason sounds scummy to me.

[ghostly447]

Well, ghostly, you seem to still be sort of side stepping a major thrust of pmc's case. That is, why didn't you ever offer your thoughts/opinion/arguments on whatever the topic of the day was until after a general consensus had already been reached. If your answer to this is that you did not want to have been able to be identified as having sided if a scum member on any of these topics, then I have to say that such a reason sounds scummy to me.

Not completely. I just in general did not get how people could tell how important player roles may be (which by the way, I will address that after this). So, in the more major cases (this does not refer to the freezie wagon) I felt that until I could find out how the system worked, I did not want to take sides because I wanted to try to develop a powerful understanding of who may have which role. If you get what I mean.

Say someone is at the top of the list, or bottom. I do not think that matters, because scum may have put worse roles as their top one to blend in. Say they may have put 1 shot governor instead of JOAT at the top. Then they get the town thinking that they picked a strong role, when in all reality, they picked the worse of the two, so when we went over them saying "They must be the top picks of the majority", in all reality we have just missed 1 or 2 scum.

I think I answered your question?

[pmchugh]

Well, ghostly, you seem to still be sort of side stepping a major thrust of pmc's case. That is, why didn't you ever offer your thoughts/opinion/arguments on whatever the topic of the day was until after a general consensus had already been reached. If your answer to this is that you did not want to have been able to be identified as having sided if a scum member on any of these topics, then I have to say that such a reason sounds scummy to me.

Not completely. I just in general did not get how people could tell how important player roles may be (which by the way, I will address that after this). So, in the more major cases (this does not refer to the freezie wagon) I felt that until I could find out how the system worked, I did not want to take sides because I wanted to try to develop a powerful understanding of who may have which role. If you get what I mean.

Say someone is at the top of the list, or bottom. I do not think that matters, because scum may have put worse roles as their top one to blend in. Say they may have put 1 shot governor instead of JOAT at the top. Then they get the town thinking that they picked a strong role, when in all reality, they picked the worse of the two, so when we went over them saying "They must be the top picks of the majority", in all reality we have just missed 1 or 2 scum.

I think I answered your question?

I am not really satisfied by your answers, being confused does not absolve you of the other two incidents I brought up as I am sure you were capable of understanding the mechanics in those situations. It is so plainly obvious the reasons we started a BW on freezie so your point makes no sense:

Freezie wagon. I am going to come out right now and just say that I was very confused with all of the roles, etc, and it cause me to temporarily lose my normal activity in games (because I didnt want to be stupid and out a powerful role) so therefore, though I read this entire BW I never quite got why it was started, and really why he got put to L-3 (I do not believe L-3 is dangerous, but it seemed more like a joke wagon than anything).

Also.

You seem to have skipped over the 2 FOS's I gave that could have more than easily been the wagons for today (nag and dazza's over-reaction at my joke vote) but yet you clearly hopped over that, and went on to the wagon and partial/complete role claiming. I waited for a slow spot to reintroduce my cases, but no quiet spot has shown up.

O RLY?

... Also they have a point, your vote and post was very odd.

....

3. In the nag vs ghostly case I understand both sides, but the way dazza was acting in it seems a little off. I tend to incline towards the ghostly side of the argument.

.....

My current fos's then go to somethingclever and dazza.

[Rodion]

Vote count

1. everywhere116
2. ghostly447 - pmchugh
3. Some7hingCLEVER - MoB Deadly
4. pmchugh - nagerous, edocsil
5. edocsil
6. nagerous
7. dazza2008 - ???
8. Ragian
9. Djfireside
10. spiesr
11. MoB Deadly
12. soundman - Djfireside
13. alt1978
14. shieldgenerator7 - soundman, spiesr, freezie, everywhere116, dazza2008 (L-3)
15. freezie

Not voting: ghostly447, Some7hingCLEVER, Ragian, alt1978, shieldgenerator7

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Deadline in about 4 and a half days.

[ghostly447]

Well, ghostly, you seem to still be sort of side stepping a major thrust of pmc's case. That is, why didn't you ever offer your thoughts/opinion/arguments on whatever the topic of the day was until after a general consensus had already been reached. If your answer to this is that you did not want to have been able to be identified as having sided if a scum member on any of these topics, then I have to say that such a reason sounds scummy to me.

Not completely. I just in general did not get how people could tell how important player roles may be (which by the way, I will address that after this). So, in the more major cases (this does not refer to the freezie wagon) I felt that until I could find out how the system worked, I did not want to take sides because I wanted to try to develop a powerful understanding of who may have which role. If you get what I mean.

Say someone is at the top of the list, or bottom. I do not think that matters, because scum may have put worse roles as their top one to blend in. Say they may have put 1 shot governor instead of JOAT at the top. Then they get the town thinking that they picked a strong role, when in all reality, they picked the worse of the two, so when we went over them saying "They must be the top picks of the majority", in all reality we have just missed 1 or 2 scum.

I think I answered your question?

I am not really satisfied by your answers, being confused does not absolve you of the other two incidents I brought up as I am sure you were capable of understanding the mechanics in those situations. It is so plainly obvious the reasons we started a BW on freezie so your point makes no sense:

So then, you arent satisfied with the fact I havent ever played this kind of setup and dont know how to do it (You think I am capable of knowing how it works). I am still learning as I go, so clearly demonstrated when I called out alt just a page or 2 back. Your point here crumbled.

Freezie wagon. I am going to come out right now and just say that I was very confused with all of the roles, etc, and it cause me to temporarily lose my normal activity in games (because I didnt want to be stupid and out a powerful role) so therefore, though I read this entire BW I never quite got why it was started, and really why he got put to L-3 (I do not believe L-3 is dangerous, but it seemed more like a joke wagon than anything).

Also.

You seem to have skipped over the 2 FOS's I gave that could have more than easily been the wagons for today (nag and dazza's over-reaction at my joke vote) but yet you clearly hopped over that, and went on to the wagon and partial/complete role claiming. I waited for a slow spot to reintroduce my cases, but no quiet spot has shown up.

O RLY?

... Also they have a point, your vote and post was very odd.

....

3. In the nag vs ghostly case I understand both sides, but the way dazza was acting in it seems a little off. I tend to incline towards the ghostly side of the argument.

.....

My current fos's then go to somethingclever and dazza.

So you think that just a little recognition means that you examined it well? I could have sworn you were going against me for touching base on a case after it was irrelevant and not posting my opinion much on it? Well isnt that what you did on Dazza and Nag when they clearly over reacted? MY thing is, you did not spend much time on it, but yet you were going on about a mass claim for days. These over reactions could have been turned into a major case, but you didnt, for whatever reason, allow this one to develop, but you are willing to allow others to develop? You seem to be doing exactly what I am doing in that you are posting irrelevant stuff and not giving much input other than an FOS. So it looks like your in the same boat as myself with your logic.

By the way, sorry if I messed up on any of this. Clogged nose=pill=drowsiness.

[pmchugh]

I hope this is the pills talking and not you because honestly what you just posted made no sense.

I am not really satisfied by your answers, being confused does not absolve you of the other two incidents I brought up as I am sure you were capable of understanding the mechanics in those situations. It is so plainly obvious the reasons we started a BW on freezie so your point makes no sense:

So then, you arent satisfied with the fact I havent ever played this kind of setup and dont know how to do it (You think I am capable of knowing how it works). I am still learning as I go, so clearly demonstrated when I called out alt just a page or 2 back. Your point here crumbled.

Freezie wagon. I am going to come out right now and just say that I was very confused with all of the roles, etc, and it cause me to temporarily lose my normal activity in games (because I didnt want to be stupid and out a powerful role) so therefore, though I read this entire BW I never quite got why it was started, and really why he got put to L-3 (I do not believe L-3 is dangerous, but it seemed more like a joke wagon than anything).

Did you read what I said? I was clearly NOT talking about the mass claim situation.

So you think that just a little recognition means that you examined it well? I could have sworn you were going against me for touching base on a case after it was irrelevant and not posting my opinion much on it? Well isnt that what you did on Dazza and Nag when they clearly over reacted? MY thing is, you did not spend much time on it, but yet you were going on about a mass claim for days. These over reactions could have been turned into a major case, but you didnt, for whatever reason, allow this one to develop, but you are willing to allow others to develop? You seem to be doing exactly what I am doing in that you are posting irrelevant stuff and not giving much input other than an FOS. So it looks like your in the same boat as myself with your logic.

Can you not see the difference? Are you honestly trying to say I am doing what I have said you have done. Have I shirked giving opinions on any case in this thread? LMFAO.

Also the underlined bit makes me laugh. How on earth did I stop this from developing? I gave dazza an FOS and clearly agreed with you in my first post after you fos'd him. You are aware I cannot cover every single angle all of the time? You can state almost any disagreement in this entire thread and I will have an opinion on it somewhere and sometimes that opinion is very controversial. I have nothing to hide and I am not even remotely scared of being investigated or lynched.

I am the complete and utter opposite of you in this game.

Also there are so many lurkers/inactives right now.

Actually I can't stop there, let me re-quote this

You seem to be doing exactly what I am doing in that you are posting irrelevant stuff and not giving much input other than an FOS. So it looks like your in the same boat as myself with your logic.

Seriously? You are questioning my input?

Taxi for ghostly!

[everywhere116]

Also @everyone else, what are your opinions on this? I don't want me and ghostly to argue for 200 consecutive posts while everyone else sits back and watches.

I know what that's like.

I support you in this debate and think that ghostly deserves some scrutiny. On Day 2. First we lynch shield.

[ghostly447]

I am going back to bed and will try to respond to this again when I wake up. I cannot keep trying to answer things on mafia while I am this tired. Sorry PMC, you got me here, it was in fact the pills talking to me and it was the last thing I did before a 4 hour nap.

I hope this is the pills talking and not you because honestly what you just posted made no sense.

I am not really satisfied by your answers, being confused does not absolve you of the other two incidents I brought up as I am sure you were capable of understanding the mechanics in those situations. It is so plainly obvious the reasons we started a BW on freezie so your point makes no sense:

So then, you arent satisfied with the fact I havent ever played this kind of setup and dont know how to do it (You think I am capable of knowing how it works). I am still learning as I go, so clearly demonstrated when I called out alt just a page or 2 back. Your point here crumbled.

Freezie wagon. I am going to come out right now and just say that I was very confused with all of the roles, etc, and it cause me to temporarily lose my normal activity in games (because I didnt want to be stupid and out a powerful role) so therefore, though I read this entire BW I never quite got why it was started, and really why he got put to L-3 (I do not believe L-3 is dangerous, but it seemed more like a joke wagon than anything).

Did you read what I said? I was clearly NOT talking about the mass claim situation.

So you think that just a little recognition means that you examined it well? I could have sworn you were going against me for touching base on a case after it was irrelevant and not posting my opinion much on it? Well isnt that what you did on Dazza and Nag when they clearly over reacted? MY thing is, you did not spend much time on it, but yet you were going on about a mass claim for days. These over reactions could have been turned into a major case, but you didnt, for whatever reason, allow this one to develop, but you are willing to allow others to develop? You seem to be doing exactly what I am doing in that you are posting irrelevant stuff and not giving much input other than an FOS. So it looks like your in the same boat as myself with your logic.

Can you not see the difference? Are you honestly trying to say I am doing what I have said you have done. Have I shirked giving opinions on any case in this thread? LMFAO.

Also the underlined bit makes me laugh. How on earth did I stop this from developing? I gave dazza an FOS and clearly agreed with you in my first post after you fos'd him. You are aware I cannot cover every single angle all of the time? You can state almost any disagreement in this entire thread and I will have an opinion on it somewhere and sometimes that opinion is very controversial. I have nothing to hide and I am not even remotely scared of being investigated or lynched.

I am the complete and utter opposite of you in this game.

Also there are so many lurkers/inactives right now.

Actually I can't stop there, let me re-quote this

You seem to be doing exactly what I am doing in that you are posting irrelevant stuff and not giving much input other than an FOS. So it looks like your in the same boat as myself with your logic.

Seriously? You are questioning my input?

Taxi for ghostly!

[shieldgenerator7]

Also @everyone else, what are your opinions on this? I don't want me and ghostly to argue for 200 consecutive posts while everyone else sits back and watches.

I know what that's like.

I support you in this debate and think that ghostly deserves some scrutiny. On Day 2. First we lynch shield.

Alright! I haven't been lynched D1 since UNKNOWN!
I'm completely comfortable sitting back and watching as pmc and ghostly argue for 200 consecutive posts.
BTW, you still need 1 more vote to get me to claim

(ok this post was completely unhelpful but I had fun writing it)

-SG7 ( )

[spiesr]

Posts like that don't help your case at all shield. Also, you seem to be banking on your claim to be the basis of your defense. Are you forgetting that in this game a role-claim means nearly nothing when it comes to determining if you are scum? Or do you just not give a shit about this game at all? Or maybe you are a mason and think that claiming as such will prove you are town?

[shieldgenerator7]

Posts like that don't help your case at all shield. Also, you seem to be banking on your claim to be the basis of your defense. Are you forgetting that in this game a role-claim means nearly nothing when it comes to determining if you are scum? Or do you just not give a shit about this game at all? Or maybe you are a mason and think that claiming as such will prove you are town?

I've already defended myself, so it depends on whether or not people actually want my claim or whether they just want to lynch me, or target someone else (we have a few days yet). And you're right, it doesn't help my case very much; I was just trying to have a little fun with it

[pmchugh]

I can't hack this.

Number of people who haven't posted in the last:

24 Hours: 9
48 hours: 7
6 days : 3 - Alt. mob. nag
7 days: 2- MOB deadly, nag
10 days: 1- nag

Whats the point in joining a mafia game and then not posting in it for an entire week. After my games finish I am going to stop playing, its not fun with so many inactives.

[edocsil]

Right? It blows.

[Ragian]

Agreed.

MoB has indicated in our clan forum that RL has taken the best of him (happened a day or two after he joined this game), but hopefully he's back soon. I can't speak for the rest of them.

Also, I seem to have lost any overview that I thought I had in this game. When I get back from the pub, I'm going to reread the case on shield and his defence and pmc vs ghostly to form an opinion.

Toodles

[edocsil]

Unvote Vote shield Nothing else porductive will happen today, so lets go with what we have got.

[nagerous]

Sorry, I'll catch up and make a post later tonight.

[Rodion]

Vote count

1. everywhere116
2. ghostly447 - pmchugh
3. Some7hingCLEVER - MoB Deadly
4. pmchugh - nagerous
5. edocsil
6. nagerous
7. dazza2008 - ???
8. Ragian
9. Djfireside
10. spiesr
11. MoB Deadly
12. soundman - Djfireside
13. alt1978
14. shieldgenerator7 - soundman, spiesr, freezie, everywhere116, dazza2008, edocsil (L-2)
15. freezie

Not voting: ghostly447, Some7hingCLEVER, Ragian, alt1978, shieldgenerator7

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Deadline in about 3 and a half days.

MASS PROD SENT.

[pmchugh]

Unvote Vote shield Nothing else porductive will happen today, so lets go with what we have got.

I agree, although I have an inkling about whats going to happen.

I think you should claim shield.

[freezie]

Also @everyone else, what are your opinions on this? I don't want me and ghostly to argue for 200 consecutive posts while everyone else sits back and watches.

Hey, I haven't sit back and watched, I've been pursuing my own argument XD

Your case is good and I agree ghostly should be watched. However I won't change my vote today right now.