Once Upon A Killer Mafia (14/17) A Writers Block:Endgame

[Streaker]

You tunneled ultra in the first day whose lover which is confirmed same alignment flipped town. You went so hard as to risk losing two townies but asking virus not to save him.

Early in day 2 you then say we should be looking at the people who pushed virus' lynch. Hypocrisy at its finest. It looks like an easy way for scum to get some attention onto some townies.

Then you counter claim Hotshot with a role that is not the same thinking that there cant be two roles similar. This is a game of 17, if you dont think there are going to be more than one role that can block and action you are a fool. This looks like scum trying to push a lynch through on a townie. Not disagreeing that you are a roleblocker, just that you used your role as tool to try and confirm that Hotshot is scum.

Now I am not 100% that you are scum but I am not comfortable with any of the other lynchs offered up today and you would be my next choice. I could probably lynch PCM or dd5 today as well.

Vote Streaker

Tunneling: guilty. I genuinly believed him scum, and if virus wasn't lynched today I'd still be going after him. I wanted Ultra lynched, I also didn't buy his claim to having no powers. Virus saving Ultra made no sense as that would deny my whole point.

I never voted virus, and it was only certain AFTER virus flipped town that the lover claim had merit to it. I laid off at this point. It was the people going after Virus that are thus scummy. It was the votes on Virus that risks the 2 deaths more so then the votes on Ultra. I was opposed to lynching Virus, so it's not that farfetched that I looked into this D2. Hypocrisy? I don't think so. Very good play by me? In hindsight ofcourse not. If I were mafia, I would not stick my head out like I did going for a town lynch. There was plenty of attention to either Ultra or Virus lynch, it didn't need what i did to get a lynch off.

Second part of your case: Yes, bad play by me. This is the second point why there should be more attention on me. Agreed. I explained this in the previous posts why I Cc'd and no follow up. Apparently I am a fool, but let's wait and see what happens, shall we? Though, I did indeed use my role to prove HotShot scum. That's the point of counterclaiming. This accusation holds nothing.

I believe either Aage, Storr or dd are the better lynches today.
I'll put those in order of my own:
-Aage
-dd
-Storr

[Zivel]

"the support from mtam just confirms they are lovers not town" -- Where the hell do you come up with this shit? You seemed town to me, but this just makes me think there is a scum lover pair because you still think there is. The only reason I could see that you think that is if you are the scum lover pair, but I have no other facts besides that bit of tinfoil so I'm going to go ahead and just say that you're not really thinking it through
Also, you're the 3rd person to say they think streaker is scummy (myself included). So I'm going to go ahead and vote Streaker for now

Where the hell do I come up with this?

Well lets look at a few things here ya?

You stated that it was obvious who your partner was and said that we were stupid not to see it. Well if its that obvious then it has to be Mtam.

You say that there is no way that there is a scum pair? Well I would say that a game with two town lovers is not balanced. A game with three town lovers is even more unbalanced. It gives scum way to many options to get a two for one. So one way to balance it would be to give scum a pair of lovers as well. The mod didnt tell me that the lovers are confimed town pairs, he confirmed that they were the same alignment. There is the strong possibility that there is a scum pair.

Your play has been dodgy and streaker picked up on it earlier today. I am not going to do a full read of you tonight but I will tomorrow for ya. But I dont like your play and you are in my scum reads, others have pointed this out and I would say that most townies dont have you in their town reads. Actually streaker said it well in his post so answer that while you wait for my reads.

What about Mtam, your supposed lover.... claims to have a reviver that can revive anyone at the cost of himself. Never counter claimed the other reviver in the game when they came out. And that other reviver could only save their partner, Mtam states he can save anyone. This is not balanced.... if there is a scum pair it is you two. I dont want to lynch Mtam because he can save a townie if we mislynch, but f*ck it, confirm to me that you are his partner and we will discuss it further. Till then you get my vote.

Unvote. Vote dd515087

[aage]

Storr, what makes you think aage is clean and hotshot is scum? furthermore aage what makes you think Storr is clean?

His play of D2 pretty much since its precipice fits town watcher near perfectly. We basically have mod confirmation that Storr is a watcher, and his gambit on HotShot screams town, not scum.

[Army of GOD]

Yeah, I think Storr is pretty damn town at this point. There would've been some doubt if rish never came out and said a mistake was made on his part, but I think that confirms that Storr is the watcher.

My two biggest scum reads atm are dd (still from D1, he's really only added to his scuminess by role fishing me and being relatively inactive) and Hotshot.


actually, I'll unvote vote dd51508675309 because I still think one of the lover pairs are scum and I think Zivel is town.

[dd515087]

DD: disappeaered completely, right until someone said his name out loud. He jumped right onto that post with a simple: Don't worry, I'm here.

Has anyone noticed how dd disappears every time we stop pressuring him?

imo scum lead

I'm here, just too busy to post anything worthwhile. I've been keeping up so that once I'm less busy I don't have too much to go back and read. If you have anything specific to ask me I can try and answer it with more in depth thoughts, later tonight.

Basics: I think HotShot is town. Still haven't decided on Storr, neutral. Streaker, whatsausage, and crasp are suspicious IMO. Still haven't decided on aage, leaning scum. Ultra and AoG, I don't like your play, but I'd have to say Ultra = town and AoG = leaning scum. Strike's play isn't as good as D1, but I'm still reading town on him. I think our best bet is to lynch Streaker at this point. Aage, whatsausage, crasp could also be good lynches for laying low, but still being somewhat active. Other relatively inactives could be good targets as well, but not for lynch, maybe your 2 shots just to get them out.

You are saying absolutely nothing here. A little promise to post something better later.

A promise to post something more if anyone asks. Yes, I came back right after I was called out, I felt no reason to post anything before that. Kind of like how you dissappear for a couple RL days at a time and pop in every once in a while...

His follow up post was a little more extensive then that:

Jebus.... I go away for a couple of hours and shit hits the fan. So AoG comea out looking alright, aage and Hotshot in the middle and Storr... well storr just got two full claims and is pushing for a third. Mafia watcher maybe. I don't buy that just cause he is faster than the mod to the forum that makes him conf town.... someone explain.

I can't see strike being scum. He is one of my top town reads and his rebuttals of storrs points only confirms this more.

I think PCM has looked a bit dodgy this day and would be worth a look. I could happily lynch dd as the support from mtam just confirms they are lovers not town. My strongest scum is Streaker. Counter claims hotshot to push the lynch through but doesn't mean shit really and the stuff at the end of day 1 just seems to scummy.

Cant make a full post as I am the phone but lets lynch dd or streaker.

He revealed what he knew as soon as he found out is what makes him look town IMO. He also didn't push for aage IIRC, only HotShot.
I think strike could be scum, but if he is he's damn good at it. There are definitely better leads to look into though.
PCM has been a bit dodgy, whatsausage and crasp have also. I think lynching one of them would be good. Personally the latter two are scummier to me.
"the support from mtam just confirms they are lovers not town" -- Where the hell do you come up with this shit? You seemed town to me, but this just makes me think there is a scum lover pair because you still think there is. The only reason I could see that you think that is if you are the scum lover pair, but I have no other facts besides that bit of tinfoil so I'm going to go ahead and just say that you're not really thinking it through
Also, you're the 3rd person to say they think streaker is scummy (myself included). So I'm going to go ahead and vote Streaker for now

Why you think strike scum? You say nothing here.
Again, pointing fingers at PCM, Ws, and Crasp. Anyone of these lynches will do for you? Good, maybe some reasoning why?
THIS is the reason you think there is a scum lover pair? Not because 3 town lover pairs are insane? Also, no reasoning as to why you think Mtam is town, or scum. Tinfoil hat as reasoning? Lol.
And then the vote on me. Going about your business eh? You vote me because other people think I'm scummy. Stronk case. Like I said, I'm definitely due for some attention but this is not what I was thinking. Stronk case.

Storr made a case against him. All I said is that I could see it ending up true, but I also think it's not likely.
Why? Not really that active, don't like the quality of their posts. Crasp and Whatsausage have been scum reads of mine since D1.
I don't know if there is a scum lover pair at all. If you don't know why I know mtam is town then you're much dumber than I give you credit for.
"other people"? I said in my very first post quoted at the top that I thought you were the best lynch. Come on, read my posts before you comment on them.

After dissecting this post, which is full of nothing and less, right after someone called him out for submerging, I'd love to hear from Mtamb why he can never be scum... I'd love to lynch DD right now, but that's just OMGUS talking I guess.

let's continue:

hm, ok, I'll come out.

I also visited mtam last night. So either someone is lying or someone got blocked. I'm not going to give info about my role but I will if you guys want.

I think you should give info. We already have at least partial claims from HotShot, Aage, and Storr. So one out of you 4 is most likely lying (unless there's some weird game mechanic with someone's role)

Following up his stronk case building with claim fishing post? Cool. I just believe we have pleeeenty of information, including claims, for today. And tomorrow. And the day after. A mass claim won't do us good (or me at least, i'm not very familiar with this flavour).

Hmm, just checking my post and I switched the 2 posts from dd around: he followed up his 'i'm here' post with the fishing attempt, and then made that utterly empty post. It doesn't change anything.

This was before the mod confirmed that he messed up, I no longer believe he should give info.
With the whole I disappeared thing, you've done it multiple times this game. You only check in every once in a while and post. Me? I've been here since D1 when the lover thing came out. I did stop posting for a while because I didn't have anything substantial to add

[StorrZerg]

Aog, why still on hotshot?

If something doesn't line up night wise you should speak up, and remember you did visit mtamburini, no block happened to you.

[dd515087]

"the support from mtam just confirms they are lovers not town" -- Where the hell do you come up with this shit? You seemed town to me, but this just makes me think there is a scum lover pair because you still think there is. The only reason I could see that you think that is if you are the scum lover pair, but I have no other facts besides that bit of tinfoil so I'm going to go ahead and just say that you're not really thinking it through
Also, you're the 3rd person to say they think streaker is scummy (myself included). So I'm going to go ahead and vote Streaker for now

Where the hell do I come up with this?

Well lets look at a few things here ya?

You stated that it was obvious who your partner was and said that we were stupid not to see it. Well if its that obvious then it has to be Mtam.

You say that there is no way that there is a scum pair? Well I would say that a game with two town lovers is not balanced. A game with three town lovers is even more unbalanced. It gives scum way to many options to get a two for one. So one way to balance it would be to give scum a pair of lovers as well. The mod didnt tell me that the lovers are confimed town pairs, he confirmed that they were the same alignment. There is the strong possibility that there is a scum pair.

I never said that. I would say that at the very beginning the mod said it may be unbalanced. I would also say that for all we know there are only 2 scum and the game is actually really balanced. Unlikely, but none of us know.

Your play has been dodgy and streaker picked up on it earlier today. I am not going to do a full read of you tonight but I will tomorrow for ya. But I dont like your play and you are in my scum reads, others have pointed this out and I would say that most townies dont have you in their town reads. Actually streaker said it well in his post so answer that while you wait for my reads.

What about Mtam, your supposed lover.... claims to have a reviver that can revive anyone at the cost of himself. Never counter claimed the other reviver in the game when they came out. And that other reviver could only save their partner, Mtam states he can save anyone. This is not balanced.... if there is a scum pair it is you two. I dont want to lynch Mtam because he can save a townie if we mislynch, but f*ck it, confirm to me that you are his partner and we will discuss it further. Till then you get my vote.

Unvote. Vote dd515087

1.The other reviver wasn't a reviver in the same sense that mtam is claiming.
2. Mtam read virus as town all along. Why would he cause confusion if he believed this?
3. Lets do some math: You believe mtam can save a townie (making him townie). Lovers are confirmed the same alignment by the mod. Therefore, what is the logical conclusion here? Oh guess what, I'm townie.

Why did you need it to be said flat out that mtam and I are lovers? You and your scum buddies don't want to mess up with your NK? Everyone else had pretty much accepted it at this point. Hmm... Scummy

Also you changed your vote to streaker and then to me within an hour or so. Why the sudden flip?

[dd515087]

Yeah, I think Storr is pretty damn town at this point. There would've been some doubt if rish never came out and said a mistake was made on his part, but I think that confirms that Storr is the watcher.

My two biggest scum reads atm are dd (still from D1, he's really only added to his scuminess by role fishing me and being relatively inactive) and Hotshot.


actually, I'll unvote vote dd51508675309 because I still think one of the lover pairs are scum and I think Zivel is town.

That was before the mod cleared things up. I no longer want any info on your role. (Also storr wanted info as well, but he's "pretty damn town". Whats up with that?
I am town. Honestly look at Zivel's last few posts, if anything he is the most likely to be the "scum lover pair".

[dd515087]

@Zivel: that's kinda the point I'm trying to make. There are a couple good reasons to look into me, granted. Thing is that NOBODY is bothering to actually put a case together.

I'm even looking forward to the first person that actually builds a case on me, more then OMG YOU ARE SCUM, OTHER PEOPLE SAY THIS ALSO SO IT MUST BE TRUE VOTE NOW.
Not gonna defend myself if this is all being thrown at me.

I don't have hours to go back through the thousand posts and put together a case. My bad that I have other shit to do. I think you're scummy so I voted you. You think I am so you voted me. That's how it works.

[StorrZerg]

@Streaker surly it can't be that hard to figure out why mod said he messed up. The order of who was first doesn't matter since the result is the same. Nor does it matter how he noticed the mess up.

Explain why anyone should be lynched within aage, hotshot, storr, aog.

I assume you will say that aage and i are together, if that's the case, I want you to explain what motivation we would of had to do the push on hotshot, and force the claim of 1 towns person, and claiming 2 mafia roles

[mtamburini]

yo storr you around who did streaker roleblock since its very difficult to get a one word answer out of him.

[mtamburini]

Weve got just about half the people outtd as roles so might as well get a massclaim and then deduce what night actions should be used on who and then we can figure out based on who dies who the mafia is. Its very easy just because you are not smart enough to deduce logically what night actions should go where to create auto doesnt mean you get to say my idea is BS kay thanks

[StorrZerg]

yo storr you around who did streaker roleblock since its very difficult to get a one word answer out of him.

ultra

[mtamburini]

yo storr you around who did streaker roleblock since its very difficult to get a one word answer out of him.

ultra

Ty I know that must of cause a lot of trouble for you to give me this simple answer

[StorrZerg]

Weve got just about half the people outtd as roles so might as well get a massclaim and then deduce what night actions should be used on who and then we can figure out based on who dies who the mafia is. Its very easy just because you are not smart enough to deduce logically what night actions should go where to create auto doesnt mean you get to say my idea is BS kay thanks

before any of this can happen, (i'm not saying i agree that this is the best plan) its important that we talk and confirm with at least the majority of town that the lynch should not be

mtamb/dd5 (lovers, including a reviver, and commuter likely both could die tonight since dd5 cannot protect himself this night) (not to mention 4 people visited mtamb, and it seems likely none of them carried out a kill on him)
hotshot/storr/aog/aage ( i've all ready explained this, but we have 2 informative roles, and 2 protective/block able roles)
If there is one person, that carried out the shot in this group, it would probably of been aage or AoG. (likely aage more so because of AoG claim)

Once an agreement has been made with the majority (fairly certain all 6 involved that i named, don't want to lynch within the group) So that leaves, 2 more people to agree.

Once this happens, we can better focus our efforts in finding a lynch, since we will have a more focused approach.

[StorrZerg]

yo storr you around who did streaker roleblock since its very difficult to get a one word answer out of him.

ultra

Ty I know that must of cause a lot of trouble for you to give me this simple answer

honestly just ask me next time directly and you will get a response.

[Whatsausage]

Well, well, well. More claims. and mtam wants a massclaim. @this, too soon. Especially because (With the three lover pairs) this game seems to be a little unconventional, a massclaim wouldn't be able to solve anything.

I am still of the mind that one of the lover pairs is scum, and with zivel stating this and pushing dd, I think that shows him(zivel) as town. So with ultra basically confirmed town, I think it is quite likely that the remaining pair is scum. So I will vote dd

I believe the extension was approved? So I should be able to change my vote if anything new comes up

A couple others I see as scum: streaker and aog

Aog: With the whole watcher situation, I believe that storr is a town watcher, and his push on hotshot was justified (because of the thought a kill was stopped and he had two people on one target, decent chance one is scum). I also believe that hotshot is a jailkeeper, town, and stopped a kill. So that leaves aage and aog as potential killers. Of these two I am more inclined to believe aage as town. My only doubts on this is how much it seemed that he and storr appeared to be working together on hotshot followed by storr kinda backing off hotshot when this was pointed out (This becomes a moot point as I believe storr to be town), and aage's ever changing role. So that leaves aog as the killer.

Streaker: As I mentioned before, his CC seemed off, and he admitted it was a bad play. I'm not sure how I feel about admitting a bad play vs defence (which is scummier), but it just doesn't sit right with me.

Out of time for now

FP'd 4x
Storr, how does aog claim make aage more likely?

[mtamburini]

again with the DD bw, jesus christ you guys are dense and stupid.

ME AND DD ARE LOVERS WITH EACHOTHER. This is how I know he is town. This is why I am almost certain that all the lovers are town. Now lets lynch in between the people that are voting for him because Mafia is going for a 2 for one lynch today.

[mtamburini]

I sfoted yesterday saying I would use my power on myself if he got lynched was to bring him back to prove both of us as town. The fact that so many actions were used on me last night almost proves someone figured that shit out yesterday and tried to kill me.

So cross between people who want DD dead and people who targeted me last night. Lynch one shoot the rest Ultra

[StorrZerg]

Well, well, well. More claims. and mtam wants a massclaim. @this, too soon. Especially because (With the three lover pairs) this game seems to be a little unconventional, a massclaim wouldn't be able to solve anything.

I am still of the mind that one of the lover pairs is scum, and with zivel stating this and pushing dd, I think that shows him(zivel) as town. So with ultra basically confirmed town, I think it is quite likely that the remaining pair is scum. So I will vote dd

I believe the extension was approved? So I should be able to change my vote if anything new comes up

A couple others I see as scum: streaker and aog

Aog: With the whole watcher situation, I believe that storr is a town watcher, and his push on hotshot was justified (because of the thought a kill was stopped and he had two people on one target, decent chance one is scum). I also believe that hotshot is a jailkeeper, town, and stopped a kill. So that leaves aage and aog as potential killers. Of these two I am more inclined to believe aage as town. My only doubts on this is how much it seemed that he and storr appeared to be working together on hotshot followed by storr kinda backing off hotshot when this was pointed out (This becomes a moot point as I believe storr to be town), and aage's ever changing role. So that leaves aog as the killer.



Storr, how does aog claim make aage more likely?

because AoG claim makes hotshot claim most likely. Thus on order of possibility, hotshot falls to my level. aka next to nill. (i assume the question is in regards to most likely submitting a "kill"
Secondly, i don't believe how aage claimed, or the evolution of his claim to be scummy. Often we assume sometimes how our power works, and only when things are brought to our attention, do we question things more. For example, i never asked the mod ahead of time how watcher worked with jailer, it just didn't occur to me. Now its clear, that aage power is probably true, it fits his claim, and it shows that he asked the mod a head of time about this role, or if there was something similar, (he linked another role similar that was a bit more complex) So considering what aage claimed, i don't see that as threat worthy.

Regardless of what i think about aage, the uncertainty of AoG when he claimed, indicated that a "jail" had happened, thus why his action failed. Couple that with my ability to confirm he did make it to mtamb, means he wasn't roleblocked, thus something else prevented his result = hotshot.

Now, with Aog in the mix, with how he claimed, i think it was more out of a town reason. Not for scummy motivation, the only reason i can see this claim is if he is doing it to pull pressure off hotshot, which seems unlikely. If he is scum, he is probably confused why town watcher didn't pick him up, and he would consider that fortunate. Now knowing who is best to be killed at night within the 3, and he would have motivation to make sure one of the 3 was lynched.

Secondly, we have a claim of streaker, claiming to block ultra. Seems unlikely in AoG situation, that they are trying to draw out an additional "block" claim if he is unsure. So i think the simplest solution is likely to be correct, AoG is acting alone, and thinks he may have caught "storr" in a trap since "storr" didn't announce him at mtambs. Hence his claim.

With all the claims, this is what i think most likely happened in the night.
1. Given all that has come to light its still more probable that mtamb was not targeted by mafia as a kill. Since he was the main person to push AoG, thus a good person to pressure day 2.
2. Streakers claim of blocking ultra, seems to come from a more town sided approach. (his reason to counter claim doesn't make that much sense, since blocker + jailer are not the same)
3. Ultra was probably targeted by 3rd party, or a town vig. It seems very unlikely that mafia would shoot ultra over virus. Specially since ultra claimed no power. Its only likely imo that mafia shoot ultra and or streaker (if mafia) blocks ultra, if the mafia team have a lover pair.


fp tambo.
I don't think you got targeted by a mafia kill, with the claims and the claims being able to be backed up. (as above)

[mtamburini]

f*ck that shit one of those was a kill shot

[StorrZerg]

f*ck that shit one of those was a kill shot

Only way it was hotshot, is if AoG is a liar.
(AoG doesn't claim here with hotshot, as the person who sent the kill, or even alone) Seems very silly for him to tie himself to this fiasco as the killer, when someone else is likely to take the fall for him.

aage is the only one that can't really be backed up, yet has played the most town out of all of them. Specifically, how he pushed hotshot, how he delt with the claiming, what he claimed.

Sorry tambo, just because lots of people visited you, and 2 people claimed "possible protection" doesn't mean a killshot happened on you. You pushed the wrong person day 1, so the most reasonable solution, is actually mafia didn't shoot you.

[mtamburini]

Revenge kill by AOG 10/10

[StorrZerg]

Revenge kill by AOG 10/10

No. Stop being stubborn.

If you want to continue this talk, you must explain why he claimed.

It is possible a mafia visited you, I won't deny that. But the claims and logic point to you not being a target for a kill.

[strike wolf]

Thoughts:

Hotshot: With all the tests, he passed from Storr's analysis, it seems very reasonable to assume that he is indeed telling the truth. As for Storr's question about the flavor of his claim, it's not perfect but it does not contradict the flavor that is known of the game or the character. I would say he is likely town at this point.

Aage-Weakest claim and border line buddying up to Storr. Reasonably strong town play that was called into doubt by HotShot. Considering I have mostly town read him, I am unwilling to vote him right now without rereading his posts for myself. If he indeed scum who is trying to buddy up to Storr, I would actually find it slightly more likely that Storr is town as I see a scum Aage being more hesitant about defending a scum buddy. Again since Storr asked me about the flavor here as well: Doesn't contradict the game and could fit the character.

Storr-Tunneled Hotshot past the claim. Dislike much of his play. Watcher claim confirmed, alignment uncertain.

DD5-Claimed name seems to contradict game flavor. Lover role has some differences from what was seen of Zivel's and Ultra's claims. Was posting more townie earlier but has kind of fallen back more into scummier postings:

Jebus.... I go away for a couple of hours and shit hits the fan. So AoG comea out looking alright, aage and Hotshot in the middle and Storr... well storr just got two full claims and is pushing for a third. Mafia watcher maybe. I don't buy that just cause he is faster than the mod to the forum that makes him conf town.... someone explain.

I can't see strike being scum. He is one of my top town reads and his rebuttals of storrs points only confirms this more.

I think PCM has looked a bit dodgy this day and would be worth a look. I could happily lynch dd as the support from mtam just confirms they are lovers not town. My strongest scum is Streaker. Counter claims hotshot to push the lynch through but doesn't mean shit really and the stuff at the end of day 1 just seems to scummy.

Cant make a full post as I am the phone but lets lynch dd or streaker.

He revealed what he knew as soon as he found out is what makes him look town IMO. He also didn't push for aage IIRC, only HotShot.

Don't have any issue with this statement actually. The logic is reasonable.

I think strike could be scum, but if he is he's damn good at it. There are definitely better leads to look into though.
PCM has been a bit dodgy, whatsausage and crasp have also. I think lynching one of them would be good. Personally the latter two are scummier to me.

This seems more like him saying it just because he doesn't want to be put into the spotlight. Possibly from Storr especially with how vocal Storr has been.

"the support from mtam just confirms they are lovers not town" -- Where the hell do you come up with this shit? You seemed town to me, but this just makes me think there is a scum lover pair because you still think there is. The only reason I could see that you think that is if you are the scum lover pair, but I have no other facts besides that bit of tinfoil so I'm going to go ahead and just say that you're not really thinking it through

Highly defensive. He's not actually putting up any reasons why the statement is bad, he is just calling it bad.

Also, you're the 3rd person to say they think streaker is scummy (myself included). So I'm going to go ahead and vote Streaker for now

Baa Baa black sheep. Have you any wool?

My biggest hesitancy on DD is it is possibly two townies and it does feel a bit like the easy lynch today.

Mtam: If you are reviver, why didn't it strike you as scummier when you thought Ultra was claiming the same role as you? And yes, I want to hear Mtam answer this not DD for him.

AoG: His counter claim was an attempt to prove someone was lying. This doesn't prove his role but it puts him in a pretty strong town light.

Streaker: Similar to AoG in that he tried to disprove a claim with his claim but not quite as solidly. The thought that a jail keeper and a role blocker are both town isn't impossible and I am 99.5% sure it's been done a few times outside of a game that had limited attempt at balance. Freely admits that some of his moves were bad. Don't disagree. Right now I am leaning town on Streaker.

PCM: Haven't really gotten around to examining his posts today more closely. Seemed to miss some key details which might be scummy or might be because of limited time. Fuller read pending.

Whatsausage: My view here hasn't really changed much. He's said somethings I agreed with in regards to calling out Storr on not backing up a town read and the fact that day 1, we really did need to get more information from the lovers' situation. But he has said other things I didn't like as much. His half thought out reasoning on why the counter claim wasn't as townie sticks out. Again will reread.

that's my abridged views on at least the major people who have really been pushed as possible lynch candidates today.

From the viewpoints of gives us the most information probably Aage as the best candidate. As far as weaker claims, Aage or DD would be a toss up. Scummy play, right now I would lean DD at least until I've reread Aage. Easier wagon for scum to hide on, probably DD. Regardless of what I reread, I no longer feel like Storr is the correct lynch at this point. If nothing else, his back and forth with Hotshot after the claim was more townie than scummy for similar (if more abstract) reasons as AoG and Streaker. He may have tunneled a bit at the end of it but tunneling is not necessarily a scum behavior. Unvote Storr. I will be rereading Aage tonight, hopefully get around to PCM and Whatsausage as well to see if how much merit there is at this point.

Right now I am against mass claiming, the protective roles that have not claimed if no others are probably better left unclaimed so that mafia can't zero in on them and if we are going to leave them unclaimed, it would be necessary to have others left unclaimed so that mafia can't zero in on them anyways because they are the only ones unclaimed. If all of the claimed were solidly town, that might be different but that's not really how I am reading the situation as of yet.

Reading up before posting: Storr has a point, mafia might try to kill Mtam as DD's lover but they are also likely to leave him alone and let town throw their resources at him. Revenge kill by AoG would at the very least assume that he was in charge of the mafia kill and no one was able to convince him out of it.