CC is declining again!

[detlef]

Am I the only one who calls bullshit on the claim that 1 out of every 10 games on CC is in super league?

I would like to see some real numbers backing that up.

Especially considering this minute there are 7700 active games on CC. Does that mean there are 770 active super league games going on?

no, you're not the only one. I'm just trying really hard not to engage this effing nitwit anymore.

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Superleague actually does have all those active games.

But again it's a silly comparison. Also he picked this dates on purpouse or something that r1 of CC it's almost over. cause just 3 or 4 weeks ago Just on Conqueror's Cup there were like 120-140 active games and on Clan league there are ususally 240-300 active games, for instance 192 games starting tomorrow.

Now these are team games, not 1v1. So even more players playing for clans.

But the mooron can't see a thing

[xroads]

Show me 770 active super league games, cause I can't find them

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Show me 770 active super league games, cause I can't find them

use game finder, find tournaments, look for it on Active games. But again, Clans at given points have 300-400 active games but on team games.

Also he just cares about number of games, while reducing skill considerably

[Kingm]

Show me 770 active super league games, cause I can't find them

use game finder, find tournaments, look for it on Active games. But again, Clans at given points have 300-400 active games but on team games.

Also he just cares about number of games, while reducing skill considerably

Don't you know that 1v1 FR is the most skillful way to play CC, that's at least what I have read

[xroads]

Show me 770 active super league games, cause I can't find them

use game finder, find tournaments, look for it on Active games. But again, Clans at given points have 300-400 active games but on team games.

Also he just cares about number of games, while reducing skill considerably

I did, all I can find is completed games, nothing active.

[Caymanmew]

As much as most Mods (unpaid) are contributing to the demise of the site. They are a necessary evil and do have the best of intentions even if they don't have the skills to do much constructive to help the situation.

Sorry to Labour the point, but if we accept this from Clan Mods then it is NEVER GOING TO IMPROVE!

No one has said it yet Craig, so I'll go ahead and say it. The mods are burnt out. You say we mods need to do more, maybe you want to go as far as to say we should be fired to allow new mods to come in. But let me say, half the mod team would probably quit in a second if they could be legitimately replaced.

I won't name names, but we have had mods in positions as high as department heads(not clans), that had ZERO interest in being the department head. We have had mods offering their spot to basically anyone who would take it, and no one offers. We have open requests for new mods with basically no applicants. We have had mod teams completely empty (Tech) or completely inactive (I won't name names) for years. Sometimes this gets fixed (Tech now has a Chipv), other times it has yet to be fixed.

Want to talk clan mods? It is the worst job as the clan community is the most high-drama community on the site. I am burnt out, I barely read the clan forum and would love to quit. I have no time or energy to put into it anymore. Smurf feels the same way. If we had someone to replace us as Head CD, we would step down today. But as of now, we don't have that. So we are stuck, we can't leave. Again, we are not the first department heads to effectively be unable to quit due to a lack of a replacement. The mods team as a whole is not filled with new ideas or a passion to improve things. We are filled with burnt-out, tired veterans who are desperately holding on waiting for replacements that may never come. It sucks, but it is also the harsh reality.

[groovysmurf]

Just gonna throw this out there - everything I know of mods is not that they are passive. They are passionate, want changes and wish they could provide more to the end-user. The problem is not with the mods, who have
1) no way to change the site's interface or programming
2) Literally all but one or two? get paid a premium membership so are probably making like 10 cents an hour.
3) Ungrateful posts and actions aimed at mods will continue to make CC decline. Move your feedback at the owner, generally - and not the mods.
4) If you want to see this place fall apart, wear the mods down a little more.

100% agree with what Cayman just posted and this ^^^. Undercutting and putting down the moderators that work tirelessly to try to make this site better even though they are burnt out, even though they are not paid, is what is going to cause the site to fold faster. We are not robots. We have feelings, emotions, stuff in our own lives to deal with on a daily basis...yet we continue to TRY. Sometimes that is not easy, sometimes it seems absolutely impossible, but giving up or abandoning our positions is not something we can just do; no matter how much we may want to at times.

Whomever the head CD was when you tried to help, Craig, they are gone. I have made it clear to all that I am more than willing to not only listen to any advice, but to take steps to use that advice to make things better. There are so many hours put in behind the scenes that people don't see. The current CD team has been trying for the last few years to improve the clan scene in any way we can. It's easier said than done, though. Playing team games is far more demanding than playing 1v1 games. Not everyone has the patience or ability to be a good clan player. Dwindling member numbers of course means dwindling clan members; sadly there is nothing that we alone can do about that.

Please, Craig and everybody, remember that we moderators are human. When I read a post that says I am causing the site to die, it hurts me, greatly. You don't know me, you don't know what I am going through or what I have to deal with in real life. So, please, STOP putting me and other moderators down. STOP whining and bitching about what you THINK is not being done right and actually lend a hand to make things better! All you are accomplishing with your posts is making me cry, doubt myself and those I work with and causing me to not even want to log onto the site I hold so dear, the site I credit with saving my life.

Crystal

[ConfederateSS]

Just gonna throw this out there - everything I know of mods is not that they are passive. They are passionate, want changes and wish they could provide more to the end-user. The problem is not with the mods, who have
1) no way to change the site's interface or programming
2) Literally all but one or two? get paid a premium membership so are probably making like 10 cents an hour.
3) Ungrateful posts and actions aimed at mods will continue to make CC decline. Move your feedback at the owner, generally - and not the mods.
4) If you want to see this place fall apart, wear the mods down a little more.

100% agree with what Cayman just posted and this ^^^. Undercutting and putting down the moderators that work tirelessly to try to make this site better even though they are burnt out, even though they are not paid, is what is going to cause the site to fold faster. We are not robots. We have feelings, emotions, stuff in our own lives to deal with on a daily basis...yet we continue to TRY. Sometimes that is not easy, sometimes it seems absolutely impossible, but giving up or abandoning our positions is not something we can just do; no matter how much we may want to at times.

Whomever the head CD was when you tried to help, Craig, they are gone. I have made it clear to all that I am more than willing to not only listen to any advice, but to take steps to use that advice to make things better. There are so many hours put in behind the scenes that people don't see. The current CD team has been trying for the last few years to improve the clan scene in any way we can. It's easier said than done, though. Playing team games is far more demanding than playing 1v1 games. Not everyone has the patience or ability to be a good clan player. Dwindling member numbers of course means dwindling clan members; sadly there is nothing that we alone can do about that.

Please, Craig and everybody, remember that we moderators are human. When I read a post that says I am causing the site to die, it hurts me, greatly. You don't know me, you don't know what I am going through or what I have to deal with in real life. So, please, STOP putting me and other moderators down. STOP whining and bitching about what you THINK is not being done right and actually lend a hand to make things better! All you are accomplishing with your posts is making me cry, doubt myself and those I work with and causing me to not even want to log onto the site I hold so dear, the site I credit with saving my life.

Crystal

...
------------ ...
------------ I would mess with THE HIGH COMMAND from time to time...I like Historical Events....CRAIG...Screw CLANS...Try the public pool....Once, THE GREAT VOLUNTEER NAMED DUK...Told me to put up, or shut up...My Advice to you Craig...I am sure Monthly Challenges could use some help...When Duk told me that...I joined THE GREAT WAR....Working on projects, playing your own games and real life...It's a mountain...But it was awesome working on The Great War, but all time consuming...So a CD pissed on your parade Craig...Join an Event...Team...Put the time in...And then come back with your pathetic rants if you have any...Finally understanding what Volunteers put up with...... ConfederateSS.out!(The Blue and Silver Rebellion)...

[theelkspeaks]

Just gonna throw this out there - everything I know of mods is not that they are passive. They are passionate, want changes and wish they could provide more to the end-user. The problem is not with the mods, who have
1) no way to change the site's interface or programming
2) Literally all but one or two? get paid a premium membership so are probably making like 10 cents an hour.
3) Ungrateful posts and actions aimed at mods will continue to make CC decline. Move your feedback at the owner, generally - and not the mods.
4) If you want to see this place fall apart, wear the mods down a little more.

100% agree with what Cayman just posted and this ^^^. Undercutting and putting down the moderators that work tirelessly to try to make this site better even though they are burnt out, even though they are not paid, is what is going to cause the site to fold faster. We are not robots. We have feelings, emotions, stuff in our own lives to deal with on a daily basis...yet we continue to TRY. Sometimes that is not easy, sometimes it seems absolutely impossible, but giving up or abandoning our positions is not something we can just do; no matter how much we may want to at times.

Whomever the head CD was when you tried to help, Craig, they are gone. I have made it clear to all that I am more than willing to not only listen to any advice, but to take steps to use that advice to make things better. There are so many hours put in behind the scenes that people don't see. The current CD team has been trying for the last few years to improve the clan scene in any way we can. It's easier said than done, though. Playing team games is far more demanding than playing 1v1 games. Not everyone has the patience or ability to be a good clan player. Dwindling member numbers of course means dwindling clan members; sadly there is nothing that we alone can do about that.

Please, Craig and everybody, remember that we moderators are human. When I read a post that says I am causing the site to die, it hurts me, greatly. You don't know me, you don't know what I am going through or what I have to deal with in real life. So, please, STOP putting me and other moderators down. STOP whining and bitching about what you THINK is not being done right and actually lend a hand to make things better! All you are accomplishing with your posts is making me cry, doubt myself and those I work with and causing me to not even want to log onto the site I hold so dear, the site I credit with saving my life.

Crystal

Just want to say thank you for all the work you've put in! As a clan newbie (and site newbie) I'm grateful for what exists and I want to thank you and all the CDs for what you've done to make it possible! I look forward to seeing what you and the rest of the team have ahead - as well as any ideas anyone else has for ways it can be even better!

I could try to brainstorm a rough idea or two but I'm not entirely sure what the clan side of the site is looking for yet; either way though y'all are fantastic!

[Craig25]

ABORT MISSION...........

We have a Failing to Drink Situation Arising..........

I Repeat...........


THE DONKEYS HAVE BEEN LED TO WATER AND ARE FAILING TO DRINK!


And I thought the 'Mods are burnt out' comment was an absolute belter! Actually a laughing out loud moment!

[Craig25]

And my parting gift, this is what a proper Event looks like. Something of this nature covering every element of Clans is what you should aim for. And it's Season 24 we are on. 3,784 Games in that since 3rd March. But the normal number of games Averages around 5,000 Per Month:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1p8NopcJwcy-F9pm4s6YuMPE148DDpYBs5tCda26gC_g/edit?usp=sharing

[SoN!c]

"Lex Fuckin' Luthor" (somebody's nickname in the Super League who I will not reveal ), is just triggering the clan world to join his event. That's all. The mods should not
feel addressed at all. It's a PSY-OPS effort to Pump his SL numbers up because clanworld is the last pool he can fish..AND Nothing wrong with that. Super League is a bonkers great tournament and all credits go to Craig .

But clanworld and superleague will never be a match made in heaven.

If you want it to be such a match (and it could be a great idea), then the ranking system needs to change first. It should be based on highscore instead current rank if you want the Generals and Field Marshalls to join in.. Because highest rank for SL players is: (let's face it): Colonel (with once in a while a Brigadier for two days who has no chin strap on his fun hat).

Thuh proof iz in thuh pood-ing 'cause The GOAT of Super League is (mostly) on a Major rank..

[jusplay4fun]

Having now read MOST of this thread, and having read it on and off for some time, and reading Craig's other rants on his other Forum thread, (called 174 Users Online, in this same Forum), I will offer a few observations and comments.

I agree that our current group of Mods DO LOTS, and SHOULD be THANKED often for ALL their hard work and contributions. I am sure they spends HUGE amounts of time to do what they do. I have been fortunate to engage with GroovySmurf and TragalgarLaw01 during the CL16 Tournament.

Duk and TeeGee spend lots of energy trying to keep things civil in the Off-Topic Forum; that is another HUGE headache, and I have added to their headaches in the past. Sorry, Guys.

There are volunteers in the Society of Cooks Training Academy and I want to acknowledge what they do, especially Tamaynet (and others). IamCanton does great leading the Map development teams. And there are many other Mods and Volunteers that I have had little interactions with so far.

I agree with the main point made by Son!c in comparing one complainer to Lex Luthor. That is insightful, Sonic.

Thank you to ALL our Mods; they do what they can and are only human.

And now, my personal perspective regarding my Clan, GoN. I was asked to join in August 2013, shortly after I joined CC, and soon after getting a premium account. I was merely a happy warrior, and watched our Clan grow and saw people come and go. I saw our Leadership grow and then our Founder left. Then all the Leaders of GoN come and go, leaving only Bantam to DO ALL things by himself, for at least 3-4 years. I started to help a bit, and when there was a real danger of GoN folding, I stepped up to help Lead. Bantam came back, we added Sonic, and we added nearly 20 players from another Clan, TOP, lead by MagnusGreeol. We were doing fine. BUT people (and Leaders) came and went, AND many left GoN over time, from its very start. Things change and things evolve.

Being a Leader of a clan is NOT easy. I often spend 2-3 hours in one day setting up games and keeping massive records and files. Also managing people is not easy; managing a clan is NOT managing at a job, but there are skills needed, WITHOUT face to face interactions, for good or bad.

Just as in life, things change. People's entertainment options and tastes CHANGE and CC continued its long slow decline. I started to read the CC Forum in 2017 or so and was made aware of this slow decline about that time. (MookieMcGee made me aware of this.) The overall slow decline was interrupted, as was the REST of the World, during the COVID upheaval. BUT the decline now continues.

As I said, in other posts in this very thread, people's preferences change, and there are NOW more options for more and different and diverse entertainment, including gaming, CHANGES. Do you still play the same games as before? There have been some big changes. I used to play Risk and other games on a site called Pogo, and I was a paid member for some 10 years, starting in 2001 or so. They CHANGED as they dropped the programming feature whose name escapes me; it may be the FLASH feature or program. Risk on Pogo was based on this Flash thing. I got bored with Pogo and found CC around the same time. I ALSO now play some rather simple games on my iPad, and, happy for me, often with my nearly 5 year old granddaughter. She and I do lots of games together, and currently we like Plants vs. Zombies, something I played YEARS ago and I came back to it.

My son and his generation (and younger ones, too) use complex gaming systems, like the newest Playstation and whatever else rivals that. I never got into that, partly due to lack of time. I am of the generation who enjoyed board games as a child, and to me, other than playing games of Football and basketball with actual balls and outside, games with Cards (only) and boards (such as Monopoly and Clue) were the main way we had FUN. TV, too, but think of ALL the changes in that media. How many streaming services do you now have?

Those of us who enjoyed Risk as a child with an actual board is a limited "market" or demographic. Many of those players are dying. SAD. Others find other ways to spend their time. Some get ill and decrease their time on CC. There has been LOTS of discussion of trying to adapt this site to be played better on a cell phone. I have had discussions with BigWham directly on some of the suggested ideas to grow this site.

I do not think there is a real solution, other than making this work on a cell phone. BUT, part of the appeal of this game has always been its complexity, and the many maps and options HERE ON CC make this complex game of Risk even MORE complex. And making it "fit" and work with a cell phone IS HARD. If it were easy, I am sure it would have been ALREADY DONE.

I enjoy chess and checkers, too. Check the Other Games tab; you will see that I am near the Top of those games, Reversi too. Those games are:
1) games I learned and enjoyed as a child (Reversi I learned a long time ago, but not as a child, tbf).

2) Complex games that force me to think beyond how to shoot to kill or how to match 3. (And more complex than most card games; Poker and Bridge likely come close to such complexity that Risk offers.)

3) ALSO, I read that Risk takes into account the complexity of Chess with the randomness of dice and trying to "read" other human players, as in Poker. (I am not good at Poker.) ALL this makes Risk complex and FUN for many of us.

4) Risk is complicated and TAKES LOTS of time to play a game. I remember that we rarely finished a game of Risk as a child. It took at least one hour of actual game time, as long as Monopoly, and usually longer.

5) I recently (in the past 7 years or so) learned the card game called Coup. It moves fast, a game is over in 5-10 minutes, and it is fun. We have some 5-6 players join me during lunch about once per week. With a relatively small school enrollment, that is a good number. I have had to realize that Lunch is their time to socialize, so I cannot expect all to stay focused on that game all the time. And when we played after school, they have access to their cell phones and THAT is REALLY distracting from the game being played. The complexity and FUN of Coup is to figure out who is bluffing (and thus who is LYING).

6) I sponsored a chess club at my high school where I taught. I branched out to Risk after 2/3 of the school year past, after my annual chess tournament and the state Chess Tournament was over. In the past few years, before I retired, I was asked to host OTHER games and I agreed. We needed more space as we doubled active participants. We moved from my classroom to the school Library. The students liked fast and fun games, and chess was NOT that. Only a few came to do chess, but ENOUGH so that I took a few students to the State Tournament (held in March each year). Before video games, I took some 8 boys to the State tournament in one year. In the past few years, I took 5-6 to local tournaments and only ONE to the state tournament. Most students were NOT willing to spend the time and effort to learn that complex game. I taught them the game. (btw: we had a group play D&D; they were a small but loyal group.) And those of us who played Coup also tried new and different board games. We had a fourth group, usually Band students, play a card game.

We had usually 20-30 students total for all game formats and options most weeks. I brought soda, Sprite, to make it a bit more enjoyable. One of my main motivations for me to do ALL this was to get students to engage in Face to Face play and interactions. Too much time was spent by ALL students with their face GLUED to an electronic screen. I see this EVEN with my young grandchildren, all under the age of five. My wife and I play with them, running, hiding, and being physically active. Once the TV and/or iPad starts, very little interaction occur with anyone ELSE. SAD. Electronic games are amazingly addictive, because they engage lots of senses: vision, sound, and tactile (holding the game devices and manipulating that).

7) Time spent playing and complexity go hand in hand (but are not mutually exclusive). Lots of video games are complex with many decisions make quickly, with instant feedback. Risk is NOT that type of game and thus does not APPEAL to many young gamers.

Let me wrap this up before I lose it all.

CONCLUSION:

A) Risk has a small niche market.

B) Things change. (The only thing constant is change, stated by Heraclitus around 500 B.C.) And the options for games and entertainment grows each day.

C) We cannot hold thousands of players, especially younger players, to a 24 hour game.

D) We, CC, cannot get many to PAY to play such a complex game here on CC, not when there are so many other gaming options, cheaper and faster, and with LOTS of bells and whistles and more ADDICTIVE, too.

We Leaders and Mods do what we can.

[theelkspeaks]

"Lex Fuckin' Luthor" (somebody's nickname in the Super League who I will not reveal ), is just triggering the clan world to join his event. That's all. The mods should not
feel addressed at all. It's a PSY-OPS effort to Pump his SL numbers up because clanworld is the last pool he can fish..AND Nothing wrong with that. Super League is a bonkers great tournament and all credits go to Craig .

But clanworld and superleague will never be a match made in heaven.

If you want it to be such a match (and it could be a great idea), then the ranking system needs to change first. It should be based on highscore instead current rank if you want the Generals and Field Marshalls to join in.. Because highest rank for SL players is: (let's face it): Colonel (with once in a while a Brigadier for two days who has no chin strap on his fun hat).

Thuh proof iz in thuh pood-ing 'cause The GOAT of Super League is (mostly) on a Major rank..

I mean, I feel like in general playing primarily 1v1 and playing a wide range of maps instead of specializing in a small number of high skillcap maps would lead toward your rating having wilder swings, sure - if you primarily want to grind rating, you probably don't play assdoodles and you also probably play lots of team/poly games on maps you are specialized in.

I could honestly see some sort of SL-styled league with clan elements potentially working at least conceptually; though I'd have to know more about player priorities to actually mock up a concept.

Maybe there would be a Doubles League, a Triples League, and a Quads League, and each team entered would be made up of clanmates. It could have divisions with promo/rel from season to season, though probably at a slower pace than SL. You could earn points for your clan based on your placement of finish, and there be some sort of combined clan leaderboard.

I'm spitballing here, and maybe the majority of players would hate this. We'd want the game count to be a lot lower than SL, ofc - but I could see a world where it works?

[TrafalgarLaw01]

And my parting gift, this is what a proper Event looks like. Something of this nature covering every element of Clans is what you should aim for. And it's Season 24 we are on. 3,784 Games in that since 3rd March. But the normal number of games Averages around 5,000 Per Month:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1p8NopcJwcy-F9pm4s6YuMPE148DDpYBs5tCda26gC_g/edit?usp=sharing

Again you are an idiot who does not understand the difference between 1v1 and team game. There is no way in world Clans want 5000 games per month. That would actually drive people off clans not in clans.

Not everything works like the SL and for a good reason. Even if there were double the clans. (Which I'd love to have) getting more than 1200 team games would be dumb. But of course someone who has never been in a clan should know about it.

[TrafalgarLaw01]

"Lex Fuckin' Luthor" (somebody's nickname in the Super League who I will not reveal ), is just triggering the clan world to join his event. That's all. The mods should not
feel addressed at all. It's a PSY-OPS effort to Pump his SL numbers up because clanworld is the last pool he can fish..AND Nothing wrong with that. Super League is a bonkers great tournament and all credits go to Craig .

But clanworld and superleague will never be a match made in heaven.

If you want it to be such a match (and it could be a great idea), then the ranking system needs to change first. It should be based on highscore instead current rank if you want the Generals and Field Marshalls to join in.. Because highest rank for SL players is: (let's face it): Colonel (with once in a while a Brigadier for two days who has no chin strap on his fun hat).

Thuh proof iz in thuh pood-ing 'cause The GOAT of Super League is (mostly) on a Major rank..

I mean, I feel like in general playing primarily 1v1 and playing a wide range of maps instead of specializing in a small number of high skillcap maps would lead toward your rating having wilder swings, sure - if you primarily want to grind rating, you probably don't play assdoodles and you also probably play lots of team/poly games on maps you are specialized in.

I could honestly see some sort of SL-styled league with clan elements potentially working at least conceptually; though I'd have to know more about player priorities to actually mock up a concept.

Maybe there would be a Doubles League, a Triples League, and a Quads League, and each team entered would be made up of clanmates. It could have divisions with promo/rel from season to season, though probably at a slower pace than SL. You could earn points for your clan based on your placement of finish, and there be some sort of combined clan leaderboard.

I'm spitballing here, and maybe the majority of players would hate this. We'd want the game count to be a lot lower than SL, ofc - but I could see a world where it works?

BTW CL16 166 different maps were used in the league. So awild variety of maps are played. And events like Random League make it even more interesting.

There are some ideas that's we would love to hear and introduce. Like those you say could be disscussed.

But when Craig comes just saying bullshit then there is no disscussion to be had.

I would like to hear more of those ideas that you have

[Swimmerdude99]

Yawn.

[SoN!c]

Rank is important. I used to say i did not care about rank at all, just wanna play fun games but the more years you are in CC the more important rank gets. Sometimes, i find myself "uhuhh don't join that game because you will get farmed, ranched or spanked.

So if i have it i think we all have it to some degree.

And what do you want in the end? A dead site or good fun?


Traf's Poly league with some finetuning concept idea's and the help of Anila8 and Ewebasher among others would be the next big thing on the site.

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Rank is important. I used to say i did not care about rank at all, just wanna play fun games but the more years you are in CC the more important rank gets. Sometimes, i find myself "uhuhh don't join that game because you will get farmed, ranched or spanked.

So if i have it i think we all have it to some degree.

And what do you want in the end? A dead site or good fun?


Traf's Poly league with some finetuning concept idea's and the help of Anila8 and Ewebasher among others would be the next big thing on the site.

I'd certainly would love some help to run that

[SoN!c]

Rank is important. I used to say i did not care about rank at all, just wanna play fun games but the more years you are in CC the more important rank gets. Sometimes, i find myself "uhuhh don't join that game because you will get farmed, ranched or spanked.

So if i have it i think we all have it to some degree.

And what do you want in the end? A dead site or good fun?


Traf's Poly league with some finetuning concept idea's and the help of Anila8 and Ewebasher among others would be the next big thing on the site.

I'd certainly would love some help to run that

My hero


Traf: nobody does it better.