D400 (Official Clan Ranking) - November 2024 Ranking

[benga]

top finished 5th in PL not sure why you think it's harder to be 2nd in 2nd div then 5th in PL, didn't they face top clans there?

[iAmCaffeine]

top finished 5th in PL not sure why you think it's harder to be 2nd in 2nd div then 5th in PL, didn't they face top clans there?

I mean if you want to use one piece of evidence and ignore all the others to make your argument then okay.

[benga]

top finished 5th in PL not sure why you think it's harder to be 2nd in 2nd div then 5th in PL, didn't they face top clans there?

I mean if you want to use one piece of evidence and ignore all the others to make your argument then okay.

if we are talking about recent form not sure how can anyone put lhdd above top
do you really think rgv is that much better than dbd?

CC Q4 will show each of the clans form and strength, can we agree on that?
are you willing to put top above foed if they win?

[rockfist]

General thoughts:

I tend to rank FOED higher than most people would because they give me fits.

I would not say LHDD performed badly against TOFU. They played us tough, but came up short. It was not a blow out. For a blow out in the CC finals see our lackluster performance vs S&M in CC4.

I think anyone is bat shit crazy if they discount S&M. They have a trophy case that even TOFU is envious of. With Josko playing, I would bet on them being in the finals this year. Would I be shocked if Fallen or LHDD was there instead, no, but I would put S&M at 40-45% to go through and Fallen and LHDD would make up 50-55% of the rest.

TOP achieved a high ranking but never won any trophies, so yeah I don't rate them that high...and their performance in CL was so-so. If they beat FOED and then play us tough in the CC semi finals or beat us, I'll move them up accordingly, but I suspect they will lose to FOED.

[benga]

I understand that all have bias of how they see the ranking, but it's still a bias
CC is the best showing in my mind how is everybody performing
we'll see

[Caymanmew]

TOP is not the clan they where a year ago. They have added a number of players from Tank Squad and PACK (lower ranked clans) and have lost a number of their original members. Looking at recent results they finished 5th in CL(1 point above 8th) and only beat DBD by 5 points in round 2 of CC9.

That group from from Tank Squad would've been accepted into just about any clan.

That may be true but we are talkign about what was/should of been a top 3 clan.(they where ranked 2nd)

Honestly though, when it comes to TOP they have lost a lot of what made them rank 1.

I looked through there wars and when comparing everyone who played a game in the TOP vs DBD war recently to the TOP vs OSA war of CC8, TOP lost 7 people. if we go back to their last win vs a top ranked clan we are going to their win in 2016 vs OSA. they lost 14 from that roster to now. And only 3 players who have left since CC8 war with OSA played in the 2016 OSA war.

Add to that Macken has not played since early march and is off the scoreboard and old TOP has lost a lot of player. TS and PACK players although good are not going to replace the group that was lost and maintain top level rankings.

I see things as TOFU number 1, LHDD, S&M, and FALL number 2-4. After that is think there is a bit of a drop off to FOED in 5th followed by the next group of A^, TOP, OSA, and ATL fighting for 6th to 9th. Not sure there is a clear number 10 between LOW and AFOS and not sure if those 2 are on the level of 6th through 9th or a level slightly below.

OSA just got relegated from the Clan League so not really sure they can be considered top 10, but then they've just acquired some of SOH's best players, so hard to judge them until they play. Ascension are also better than TOP and ATL in my opinion.[/quote]

I was putting OSA in as they added the 3 Serbians form SOH. Time will tell how they preform. They have not had a great start to their war with ATL but that is understandable with roster instability.

CWC i think will prove to be a great test on a number of close clans. ATL, FOED, A^, LOW, AFOS, and OSA are all involved, the only one really missing form here is TOP to get a good look at clans ranked 5th through 11th.

I'm definitely excited for the match up with A^, it is only 24 games but i believe we can have a very close match up. ATL might not have the higher ranked players you see out of many clans but we are a real solid group. outside the TOFU war we have been putting together a number of good performances.

top finished 5th in PL not sure why you think it's harder to be 2nd in 2nd div then 5th in PL, didn't they face top clans there?

I would question the level of focus a clan like LHDD would have playing in CL second division. I am sure they where putting a lot more energy into CC8 and was only in CLX so they could join CL11 in PD.

CLX PD was very scrappy, 1 point separated 5th and 8th. That means you lose 2 more games in a set you won 5v3 and your relegated.

top finished 5th in PL not sure why you think it's harder to be 2nd in 2nd div then 5th in PL, didn't they face top clans there?

I mean if you want to use one piece of evidence and ignore all the others to make your argument then okay.

if we are talking about recent form not sure how can anyone put lhdd above top
do you really think rgv is that much better than dbd?

CC Q4 will show each of the clans form and strength, can we agree on that?
are you willing to put top above foed if they win?

I'll throw my thoughts here as well....

DBD are for sure better then RGV.

In recent history DBD has beat TS and FSC, had a relatively close war with ATL(they lost by 7)
RGV on the other hand has gotten their ass kicked by LOW(30-8), A^(28-13), and OSA (32-17). They did beat ID by 7 though.

Big thing is DBD lost by 5 to TOP, RGV is down 14 games 20 games into the LHDD war.

If your suggesting DBD and RGV are close to the same level of clans (i don't think they are) how can you possibly suggest TOP is above LHDD?

[benga]

no I am saying dbd is way above rgv
they have a lot of tnc players in them so in short
we'll see how CC Q4 ends to have a better picture

[rockfist]

I honestly don't know how hard it is to be a certain rank in the second division of CL. I think the top three or so teams in second division could be very competitive in Premier Division...the bottom part of second division would get smashed by the top teams in the Premier division with almost no effort. What I think is different about PD is that you don't get "weeks off"...just ask us or S&M what happens when you take a week off.

[Caymanmew]

no I am saying dbd is way above rgv
they have a lot of tnc players in them so in short
we'll see how CC Q4 ends to have a better picture

The one thing i look at for this is the ATL vs DBD war in September/October that had ATL win by 7 points. TOP beat DBD by 5, i'd assume TOP and ATL are roughly the same level of clan right now. That level should be safely under LHDD though imo.

But yes CC9 Q4 vs FOED as well as how other clans stack up to FOED in CWC will help place TOP better.

[iAmCaffeine]

TOP is not the clan they where a year ago. They have added a number of players from Tank Squad and PACK (lower ranked clans) and have lost a number of their original members. Looking at recent results they finished 5th in CL(1 point above 8th) and only beat DBD by 5 points in round 2 of CC9.

That group from from Tank Squad would've been accepted into just about any clan.

That may be true but we are talkign about what was/should of been a top 3 clan.(they where ranked 2nd)

Honestly though, when it comes to TOP they have lost a lot of what made them rank 1.

I looked through there wars and when comparing everyone who played a game in the TOP vs DBD war recently to the TOP vs OSA war of CC8, TOP lost 7 people. if we go back to their last win vs a top ranked clan we are going to their win in 2016 vs OSA. they lost 14 from that roster to now. And only 3 players who have left since CC8 war with OSA played in the 2016 OSA war.

Add to that Macken has not played since early march and is off the scoreboard and old TOP has lost a lot of player. TS and PACK players although good are not going to replace the group that was lost and maintain top level rankings.

Stop talking to me like I'm disagreeing with you about TOP. I quoted just the points you made that I wanted to highlight. They have way more of their best players than just macken who are also inactive. There's Lex Usi, naruto isn't playing clan games, FF123, zips5000. But again, I didn't disagree about TOP. In fact you copied half your arguments from me lol.

CWC i think will prove to be a great test on a number of close clans. ATL, FOED, A^, LOW, AFOS, and OSA are all involved, the only one really missing form here is TOP to get a good look at clans ranked 5th through 11th.

If you group LOW, ATL and AFOS in the same tier as A^ and FOED then you don't know what you're talking about.

[Caymanmew]

TOP is not the clan they where a year ago. They have added a number of players from Tank Squad and PACK (lower ranked clans) and have lost a number of their original members. Looking at recent results they finished 5th in CL(1 point above 8th) and only beat DBD by 5 points in round 2 of CC9.

That group from from Tank Squad would've been accepted into just about any clan.

That may be true but we are talkign about what was/should of been a top 3 clan.(they where ranked 2nd)

Honestly though, when it comes to TOP they have lost a lot of what made them rank 1.

I looked through there wars and when comparing everyone who played a game in the TOP vs DBD war recently to the TOP vs OSA war of CC8, TOP lost 7 people. if we go back to their last win vs a top ranked clan we are going to their win in 2016 vs OSA. they lost 14 from that roster to now. And only 3 players who have left since CC8 war with OSA played in the 2016 OSA war.

Add to that Macken has not played since early march and is off the scoreboard and old TOP has lost a lot of player. TS and PACK players although good are not going to replace the group that was lost and maintain top level rankings.

Stop talking to me like I'm disagreeing with you about TOP. I quoted just the points you made that I wanted to highlight. They have way more of their best players than just macken who are also inactive. There's Lex Usi, naruto isn't playing clan games, FF123, zips5000. But again, I didn't disagree about TOP. In fact you copied half your arguments from me lol.

You do realize you defended the TS players when i sited them as well as PACK guys joining TOP as a sign that TOP was not as good. Perhaps that was not your intent and i can clearly see your not of the mindset TOP is among the top 4-5 clans but given the odd response IMO and Benga still arguing TOP>LHDD i felt it was a fine place to expand on what i see from TOP's player roster.

And yes Macken is one of many losses, i highlighted him as he is the most recent.

CWC i think will prove to be a great test on a number of close clans. ATL, FOED, A^, LOW, AFOS, and OSA are all involved, the only one really missing form here is TOP to get a good look at clans ranked 5th through 11th.

If you group LOW, ATL and AFOS in the same tier as A^ and FOED then you don't know what you're talking about.

As i said earlier i put LOW and AFOS into the 10th and 11th spots right now. CWC is a good test though as all but 1 clan ranked 5th through 11th is involved. ATL i for sure put right around A^ and FOED. i see no reason not to do that. if we are behind it is not by much.

[Donelladan]

I understand that all have bias of how they see the ranking, but it's still a bias
CC is the best showing in my mind how is everybody performing
we'll see

I completely agree with that.
We are just giving our thoughts here, the truth will be known through the CC9


@Cayamanew, ATL is getting up again at the moment, but you've been far from top 10 for a while ( you were around the 14-16 rank for couple of months).
FOED has been performing really well all the time ( I can't remember seeing them out of top 10) and won the 1st div of the previous edition, finishing 3rd of this one.

I do think you are a bit far from FOED.

Nevertheless I agree with you that CWC would be interesting with those clans in it, and that ATL could surprise us seeing your most recent performances.

[iAmCaffeine]

You do realize you defended the TS players when i sited them as well as PACK guys joining TOP as a sign that TOP was not as good. Perhaps that was not your intent and i can clearly see your not of the mindset TOP is among the top 4-5 clans but given the odd response IMO and Benga still arguing TOP>LHDD i felt it was a fine place to expand on what i see from TOP's player roster.

Yes, I realise what I said, thanks for checking lol. You used the fact that Tank Squad were low ranked as reasoning for TOP not being as good, but considering the players they took on from that clan, I would disagree.

As i said earlier i put LOW and AFOS into the 10th and 11th spots right now. CWC is a good test though as all but 1 clan ranked 5th through 11th is involved. ATL i for sure put right around A^ and FOED. i see no reason not to do that. if we are behind it is not by much.

Funny.

[Caymanmew]

I understand that all have bias of how they see the ranking, but it's still a bias
CC is the best showing in my mind how is everybody performing
we'll see

I completely agree with that.
We are just giving our thoughts here, the truth will be known through the CC9


@Cayamanew, ATL is getting up again at the moment, but you've been far from top 10 for a while ( you were around the 14-16 rank for couple of months).
FOED has been performing really well all the time ( I can't remember seeing them out of top 10) and won the 1st div of the previous edition, finishing 3rd of this one.

I do think you are a bit far from FOED.

Nevertheless I agree with you that CWC would be interesting with those clans in it, and that ATL could surprise us seeing your most recent performances.

The thing with ATL is that it rapidly changed. A year ago they totally where a clan that fit into the 14-16 ranks but since then 9 people have been added to the active roster and 5 removed. That is a large change as we are as clan of 18 active people right now. The new additions have greatly improved ATL as a whole, especially considering ATL did not lose what was it's best players. We are much deeper now and able to handle much better opponents.

As for our ability vs FOED, we will be facing them in a few weeks (only 24 games though) so we will get a bit of a measure there.

You do realize you defended the TS players when i sited them as well as PACK guys joining TOP as a sign that TOP was not as good. Perhaps that was not your intent and i can clearly see your not of the mindset TOP is among the top 4-5 clans but given the odd response IMO and Benga still arguing TOP>LHDD i felt it was a fine place to expand on what i see from TOP's player roster.

Yes, I realise what I said, thanks for checking lol. You used the fact that Tank Squad were low ranked as reasoning for TOP not being as good, but considering the players they took on from that clan, I would disagree.

well given the players TOP has been losing i think it is fair to say the TS replacements are not up to that level. TOP is still a top 10 clan no doubt and the TS guys fit well into that but i don't believe they are able to fully replace the losses TOP has been suffering player wise. (and ya i used TS rank of 18th as part of the argument, and that might of been unfair)

[iAmCaffeine]

well given the players TOP has been losing i think it is fair to say the TS replacements are not up to that level. TOP is still a top 10 clan no doubt and the TS guys fit well into that but i don't believe they are able to fully replace the losses TOP has been suffering player wise. (and ya i used TS rank of 18th as part of the argument, and that might of been unfair)

TOP never deserved their rank in the first place so it's kind of a moot point. They lost very good individual players, and gained a good team of players with Tank Squad.

Also, you very recently lost to FOED.

[Caymanmew]

well given the players TOP has been losing i think it is fair to say the TS replacements are not up to that level. TOP is still a top 10 clan no doubt and the TS guys fit well into that but i don't believe they are able to fully replace the losses TOP has been suffering player wise. (and ya i used TS rank of 18th as part of the argument, and that might of been unfair)

TOP never deserved their rank in the first place so it's kind of a moot point. They lost very good individual players, and gained a good team of players with Tank Squad.

Also, you very recently lost to FOED.

Yes we did, it was a "fun" war with preset maps, far form your normal war. Additionally we had 2 other active wars going at the same time(with basically 14 active members) and it was the first war i ran.

I feel we would do much better vs them now, although that is of course speculation.

[iAmCaffeine]

well given the players TOP has been losing i think it is fair to say the TS replacements are not up to that level. TOP is still a top 10 clan no doubt and the TS guys fit well into that but i don't believe they are able to fully replace the losses TOP has been suffering player wise. (and ya i used TS rank of 18th as part of the argument, and that might of been unfair)

TOP never deserved their rank in the first place so it's kind of a moot point. They lost very good individual players, and gained a good team of players with Tank Squad.

Also, you very recently lost to FOED.

Yes we did, it was a "fun" war with preset maps, far form your normal war. Additionally we had 2 other active wars going at the same time(with basically 14 active members) and it was the first war i ran.

I feel we would do much better vs them now, although that is of course speculation.

11 games isn't a close war, and before that FOED lost to TOFU by just 3 games. I understand knowing the potential of your clan but you have to take into account your bias. ATL is showing potential with the refresh but they're fighting for top 10, not just outside top 5. At the end of the day though, only results speak as everyone else has said.

[rockfist]

ATL seemed better when we played them in this year’s CC than in the past, but a top five clan would almost always play us tighter than that score, IMO. Still I was somewhat surprised.

[conquerhero]

400 from the bottom, 500 from the top. It would be best if we played clans from position 8 to the bottom.

[Donelladan]

[benga]

[CC9] R2: RET (19) vs OSA (24)
Game 19017335
05/06/2019

not sure if needed anymore

[Donelladan]

[josko.ri]

This June we mark 10 years of having F400/D400 Clan rankings on CC.
Therefore I publish a special statistics that I am running, with 3 categories:

1. The highest score while holding #1 ranking
2. Total number of months being ranked in Top 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 (Theoretical maximum is 120 months)
3. Total number of consecutive months being ranked in Top 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 (* indicates that the streak is still active)

1. The highest score while holding #1 ranking
1. TOP 1489 Dec 17
2. S&M 1468 Mar 18
3. TOFU 1460 May 17
4. ACE 1413 Mar 14
5. FALL 1384 Oct 16
6. EMP 1367 Dec 11
7. THOTA 1333 Dec 09

2a. Total number of months being ranked in Top 1
1. TOFU 47
2. S&M 38
3. TOP 13
4. FALL 10
5. THOTA 8
6. ACE 3
7. EMP 1

2b. Total number of months being ranked in Top 2
1. TOFU 86
2. S&M 64
3. TOP 27
4. THOTA 22
5. FALL 14
6. LOW 6
7. ACE 5
8. TSM 5
9. LHDD 3
10. EMP 3
11. AFOS 3
12. PACK 2

2c. Total number of months being ranked in Top 3
1. TOFU 106
2. S&M 84
3. THOTA 29
4. TOP 28
5. FALL 20
6. LHDD 16
7. ACE 14
8. IA 14
9. PACK 12
10. TSM 10
11. EMP 9
12. LOW 7
13. AFOS 6
14. AOC 2
15. FOED 2
16. A^ 1

2d. Total number of months being ranked in Top 4
1. TOFU 109
2. S&M 96
3. TOP 34
4. THOTA 31
5. IA 27
6. FALL 26
7. TSM 25
8. LHDD 24
9. PACK 22
10. ACE 22
11. FOED 20
12. LOW 13
13. EMP 13
14. AFOS 9
15. AOC 3
16. A^ 2
17. ID 2
18. ATN 1
19. VDLL 1

2e. Total number of months being ranked in Top 5
1. TOFU 113
2. S&M 106
3. IA 41
4. LHDD 36
5. TOP 35
6. FALL 34
7. PACK 33
8. FOED 33
9. THOTA 32
10. TSM 30
11. ACE 23
12. LOW 23
13. EMP 20
14. AFOS 11
16. OSA 10
16. AOC 8
17. ID 5
18. A^ 2
19. ATN 2
20. ATL 1
21. VDLL 1
22. AOD 1

3a. Total number of consecutive months being ranked in Top 1
1. S&M 17
2. TOFU 12
3. FALL 10
4. S&M 10
5. TOFU 8*
6. TOFU 8
7. TOFU 8
8. TOP 7
9. THOTA 7

3b. Total number of consecutive months being ranked in Top 2
1. TOFU 38
2. S&M 25
3. THOTA 22
4. TOFU 20
5. TOP 18
6. S&M 13
7. S&M 13
8. FALL 12

3c. Total number of consecutive months being ranked in Top 3
1. TOFU 86*
2. S&M 53
3. TOP 28
4. S&M 26*
5. THOTA 22
6. TOFU 20
7. FALL 19
8. LHDD 13

3d. Total number of consecutive months being ranked in Top 4
1. TOFU 89*
2. S&M 65
3. TOP 34
4. S&M 31*
5. THOTA 31
6. FALL 23
7. ACE 20
8. TOFU 20
9. LHDD 19

3e. Total number of consecutive months being ranked in Top 5
1. TOFU 113*
2. S&M 72
3. TOP 35
4. S&M 34*
5. THOTA 31
6. FALL 31
7. PACK 31
8. LHDD 26
9. IA 24
10. ACE 23
11. LOW 23

[rockfist]

Interesting, thanks Josko.

[Extreme Ways]

Interesting. When did S&M fall out of the top5? Current streak indicates that they entered around 3 years ago, but my gut feeling says that S&M was still strong. Perhaps something with the merger that screwed with the stats?