Malta [Quenched]

[Ruben Cassar]

Latest version of the map - Version 4.9

I think that the legend right border is too similar with sea line connection... maybe you could change or modify the colour and or the shape of one of them order to make them seem more different.

PS: Great graphics! About Comino, please you should really take
into account my previous proposal....

Hi Lupo. I honestly don't think that the right border of the legend is similar to a sea route. It's obvious that it doesn't connect to anywhere either.

About Comino, I checked the Space Map and while I think that something like what you are proposing is feasible for a "fantasy" map I don't think it is a good idea to make Comino part of both Malta and Gozo as in real life it just isn't. None of the other real maps use this formula either.

[Ruben Cassar]

i think the legend is to big..

Okay, but what do you propose that I should do about it? I mean the names are what they are and even though the legend is slightly big it does its job (i.e. it gives the required information about the map) and doesn't detract from the gameplay either.

[Bad Speler]

I agree completly with you, the legend is fine as it is.

[Marvaddin]

Although many continents still need to be reworked, like gray, light blue, dark blue, red, etc, due to excess of borders, lets now talk about the legend. I cant believe he really need continents named like IL-PONTA TA' GHAWDEX U KEMMUNA. These names are too big, and we know you can use something else instead. Anyway, why use caps? Malta and Ghawdex... why we have continents with same names, just changing these words? Is it like South Malta and South Ghawdex? Just trying to understand, so we can think better about it.

Also, the map has wasted space. We have already a great picture, but with wasted space to west. Why dont you use the space with those photos to the main legend, and the space under Gozo to the other things and your name?

Again, think about borders, maybe removing a continent or 2, and if that helipad idea is really necessary, when we have already the sea routes. And, the lands end symbol... do you think that red square fits well? Couldnt we have the symbol without that square?

[Ruben Cassar]

Although many continents still need to be reworked, like gray, light blue, dark blue, red, etc, due to excess of borders, lets now talk about the legend. I cant believe he really need continents named like IL-PONTA TA' GHAWDEX U KEMMUNA. These names are too big, and we know you can use something else instead. Anyway, why use caps? Malta and Ghawdex... why we have continents with same names, just changing these words? Is it like South Malta and South Ghawdex? Just trying to understand, so we can think better about it.

Also, the map has wasted space. We have already a great picture, but with wasted space to west. Why dont you use the space with those photos to the main legend, and the space under Gozo to the other things and your name?

Again, think about borders, maybe removing a continent or 2, and if that helipad idea is really necessary, when we have already the sea routes. And, the lands end symbol... do you think that red square fits well? Couldnt we have the symbol without that square?

Do you ever write a positive comment Marvaddin? I have been following your posts about other maps in other threads and it's impossible to please you and I have given up on that ages ago because you always find a hundred things that you don't like in other people's maps. Actually if you take the time to read all the previous posts in this thread you will find answers to most of your questions...

[Bad Speler]

I agree with marvaddin on one point. The red squares marking lands end seems to be out of place, visually speaking. The concept is good, but perhaps change the symbol

[Ruben Cassar]

I agree with marvaddin on one point. The red squares marking lands end seems to be out of place, visually speaking. The concept is good, but perhaps change the symbol

Okay I can modify the symbol or remove the red square in the next update.

[AndyDufresne]

Regarding marv, he may always seem 'negative', but he just likes to see the quality of maps the best they can be. Sometimes the harsh truth has to be stated. Anyways...lets see...

The map is indeed looking better, but still some work can be done.
• The bonus legend is interesting, and a vast improvement. But I do agree with Marv on why the use of all caps? I think one thing that could improve your Legend visual would be to add 'levels'...and in the sense of everything not exactly the same. Perhaps if you made the continent names like regular words (not all caps), and then perhaps shrunk the details of capital, helipad, etc down in size slightly, it would help increase a visual look to the eye.
  
• Also regarding the legend, I'm not a huge fan of the shapes next to the names. They look a little odd, fuzzy and pixely, and out of place. Experiment with other possibilities.
• I like the use of the pictures to the upper right, but perhaps you should play around with the placement of everything, like someone stated earlier. Perhaps put the title in the upper right, or the bonus legend (though I like the bonus legend where it is, with some minor tweaks in size and look). Maybe even play around with putting the photos beneath the title of the bonus legend. Right now, it seems like the map might be too busy.
• I like the compass and the way it looks. Perhaps not the placement. Look into other possible areas to place it.
• I also like the wisps connecting the various countries and continents.
• I think you can improve on the actual continent visuals though. Consider adding a black outline barrier between the sea and land, so it doesn't look so pixely and more professional. Also consider making the division lines between the countries slighter thicker and more prominent.
• What happened to your other impassable borders? I liked that 'Tire Stone Wall' on page 5...it looked more realistic than these balls. But if you go with the one on page 5, consider making it a little less of a repeated pattern, I.E. fill in some of the 'tires'.
• Regarding the army shadows, I understand reasoning behind having different shades...but I think it over all detracts from the visual appeal. Perhaps instead of having a varying array of army shadow tones and shades, alter the continent colors until you can get a well balanced visual look that will allow you to have only one type of army shadows.
• And, I also agree with Marv that the Land's End symbol seems odd and out of place. Look into another symbol, or perhaps 'fading it', and darkening the red, almost similar to what the photos look like, and then moving it out into the sea slightly, but enough on the land so people can understand it represents 'x' area.

--Andy

[Ruben Cassar]

Okay Andy I will try to address as many of these issues as I can in the next update. However Marvaddin just makes negative comments and basically opposes 90% of the map features. On the Europa thread which is not currently active he just wrote that he disliked the map and that it sucked. Not the kind of constructive comments by a person that wants a better map...

[AndyDufresne]

Once you stay in the Foundry for a while, you'll see how Marv is, and how he's a staple around here. You can't always take him seriously, and he always offends those new to the atmosphere.


--Andy

[Wisse]

i think marv don't leave negative feedback but arguments how to make the map better
and when i look too your map i look 75% to the legend, its looks too important, more important than malta

edit:
its too bussy i think, if you make the legend smaller and put the compass more southwards. then i think it would be good to play

[Ruben Cassar]

i think marv don't leave negative feedback but arguments how to make the map better
and when i look too your map i look 75% to the legend, its looks too important, more important than malta

edit:
its too bussy i think, if you make the legend smaller and put the compass more southwards. then i think it would be good to play

Wisse I can assure you that if you are working hard to try to create a map for the community and the only comment a person like Marvaddin can add is "I dislike your map and it sucks" as he did on the Europa thread you don't appreciate it.

Now about the legend. I can try reducing the size but quite a number of people seemed to like it just like it is. I used big fonts for the regions so that it would be legible when using a smaller resolution of the map. Also, as I said earlier I don't think it detracts from the gameplay in any way...

[CaraLucia]

It is the first time I look at this map, and I love it. I hope that the Conquer-Club will ad this lovely map to the club-maps. I can't wait to play it.

CC come one and look at this map.

greetings: Cara

[Ruben Cassar]

It is the first time I look at this map, and I love it. I hope that the Conquer-Club will ad this lovely map to the club-maps. I can't wait to play it.

CC come one and look at this map.

greetings: Cara

Thanks for the support!

[Ruben Cassar]

Okay I have made some improvements to the map. This is version 4.10. Let me know if you prefer this version to the previous one.

Amendments:
1. Added border to islands
2. Modified Land's End symbols
3. Modified Bonus Legend - changed fonts
4. Modified Bonus Legend - reduced size of bonus box
5. Added Maltese fonts to the map (Note different letters unique to the Maltese alphabet - Ħħ, Ċċ, Ġġ, Żż)

[Wisse]

that looks much better i think it must be the final forge now andy?

[Marvaddin]

Ok, Ruben, how old is the post in the Europe map thread? How many like it I did in this one? Whats you problem, guy? Ah, my comments are negative... its because I prefer point those things I think could be better instead of make pointless posts about "how Im thirsty" about a map being quickly released. If you want you can ignore my comments, since I also can ignore this thread and your map at all, but as it is the regular way the maps are produced in this foundry, I can always place my comments about how I think your map stinks... capiche?

Ps: Feel free to do the same about the maps Im making, comments are not a problem to me.

Ps2: Should all people really read all the thread to have answers about those names in the legend, etc? Looks like you dont want to be much cooperative to those that are wanting to help you, huh? And, by the way, you dont seem inclined to do any changes in this great map you created already, huh? Opinions are unwelcome, by the way.

Now, lets stop to talk about forum etiquete and lets talk about continents with 4 countries and 4 borders? Oh, wait... I think Andy needs to ask about it, so you can THINK about change something, right? Please forgive me if you had already mentioned it before, in fact, this one is not the most interesting to me.

Ok, Im just tired about trying to help and people becoming angry about my comments. This is a free forum, and I can file any comments about playability and visual of any map, Im never offending anyone, why is this always happening? Do people thinks their maps are perfect? The guy asked for a suggestion about legend, and then this! Argh!

[hulmey]

well i think ruben's map is visually one of the best maps on this site...And if the guy wants to have 4 borders let him...It will bring a different type of game style to conquer club.

[Ruben Cassar]

Ok, Ruben, how old is the post in the Europe map thread? How many like it I did in this one? Whats you problem, guy? Ah, my comments are negative... its because I prefer point those things I think could be better instead of make pointless posts about "how Im thirsty" about a map being quickly released. If you want you can ignore my comments, since I also can ignore this thread and your map at all, but as it is the regular way the maps are produced in this foundry, I can always place my comments about how I think your map stinks... capiche?

Ps: Feel free to do the same about the maps Im making, comments are not a problem to me.

Ps2: Should all people really read all the thread to have answers about those names in the legend, etc? Looks like you dont want to be much cooperative to those that are wanting to help you, huh? And, by the way, you dont seem inclined to do any changes in this great map you created already, huh? Opinions are unwelcome, by the way.

Now, lets stop to talk about forum etiquete and lets talk about continents with 4 countries and 4 borders? Oh, wait... I think Andy needs to ask about it, so you can THINK about change something, right? Please forgive me if you had already mentioned it before, in fact, this one is not the most interesting to me.

Ok, Im just tired about trying to help and people becoming angry about my comments. This is a free forum, and I can file any comments about playability and visual of any map, Im never offending anyone, why is this always happening? Do people thinks their maps are perfect? The guy asked for a suggestion about legend, and then this! Argh!

The post on the Europa map is 6 days old and you never replied to my comment after all. Well yes, if you are to make any comments on a map you should read what others have written before you in the thread. Seeing that you make lengthy comments that shouldn't be a problem for you...right?

About me not changing anything in this map...you must be joking right? I had to start the map from scratch three times! Didn't you see that this is the fourth version of the map? Didn't you notice the difference between the other versions? I basically had to change everything! Oh sorry...I forgot you don't read the whole thread and you probably forgot all about the previous versions...

[KEYOGI]

Ok, Im just tired about trying to help and people becoming angry about my comments. This is a free forum, and I can file any comments about playability and visual of any map, Im never offending anyone, why is this always happening? Do people thinks their maps are perfect? The guy asked for a suggestion about legend, and then this! Argh!

Why was this paragraph made so small?

I've been on the receiving end of Marv's comments, and while you might not like the way he gets his point across, in the end he's just there to help.

[qeee1]

K, I can see there's some hostility here, and I don't have time to read the whole thread, (so if this has already been addressed I apologise) but I think the map would benefit from some extra walls to create continents with less borders.

Visually this map has improved hugely, and Gozo has been hugely improved gameplay wise, but I think mainland malta needs to be looked at from a gameplay perspective.

[hulmey]

i like the idea of having more borders..why not? I hate escalating cards in games coz theres no stragey. Everyone has personnel opinons!! What about getting more armies instead of having less borders?

[Ruben Cassar]

K, I can see there's some hostility here, and I don't have time to read the whole thread, (so if this has already been addressed I apologise) but I think the map would benefit from some extra walls to create continents with less borders.

Visually this map has improved hugely, and Gozo has been hugely improved gameplay wise, but I think mainland malta needs to be looked at from a gameplay perspective.

I apologise for the bickering between me and Marvaddin. I realise it shouldn't be cluttering this thread and I promise it will end here.

Now about extra walls. I am trying to create a map where a player would have to think a lot about defence and not only about attack, that's why there are many territories with borders. A player would have to think carefully before over expanding and leaving his territories unguarded.

I realise that this formula might not be like that of most of the other maps available, but I am trying to create something different. Apart from thinking more about defence, I think this would make the outcome of the game more unpredictable. What do you think?

[Marvaddin]

Ah, looks like you arent talking about the real, first and only Europe map. I was just thinking, I couldnt remember about talking that in the real Europe map thread.

About that thread (I will comment here since you are calling me to do it), I said "never do that" refering to your words about mess with current Europe map, but I thought it was clear enough. Looks like its you that are not accostumed to read all the thread, huh? About the reasons for what I disliked the map (the one dafranca posted), it was well explained: regions with excess of borders and very different importance to the main countries (like Sweden being 1 country, and France, for example, having 6 countries). That was all well explained. What were you wanting me to reply? Your post then had no substance about the discussion, was just saying that was a rough draft and talking you dislike my maps and comments. I was not interest in low my level of discussion, nor continue talking about that Europe map, as it was better as defunct, to me.

This one... 4 versions already?!?! Oh really?!?! Dont you imagine how many versions are usually needed to complete a map, do you? Like you said about me, you would be more usefull revamping your map, and again, and again, instead of just qualifying my opinions as negatives. Want me being sincere? Your map as it is now is a piece of shit (this is my opinion). Dont want opinions? They are negatives? Discuss them. Or, feel free to leave, friend.

And thanks to those that understand my good intentions

Edit: I apologize, too, about this silly discussion. This is not the goal of the foundry. You just could be more receptive to opinions, huh? You asked for help, than flamed me. Dont do that again, ok?

[hulmey]

im really interested in this map for obvious reasons. How about conducting a poll...C what mate the masses want?