Conquer Club

Accused: obliterationX

The accused are suspected of:

Intentional Deadbeating

Comments: This one is a lay down misere. I recently rejoined CC after a long absence.
One of the new maps I came back to is City Mogul so I thought I'd try it out.
obliterationX had set up a whole raft of City Moguls with Manual/Freestyle parameters.
So I joined one.

He then missed his first turn, so I started to investigate and found that he has a lengthy
history of doing exactly that to almost every opponent.

Narrabri wrote:Accused:
obliterationX


The accused are suspected of:
Intentional Deadbeating


Games:
Game 7009355


Comments:
This one is a lay down misere. I recently rejoined CC after a long absence.
One of the new maps I came back to is City Mogul so I thought I'd try it out.
obliterationX had set up a whole raft of City Moguls with Manual/Freestyle parameters.
So I joined one.

He then missed his first turn, so I started to investigate and found that he has a lengthy
history of doing exactly that to almost every opponent.

With links.

Comment: This could be a cause for a warning in line with, if one can call it that, the b00060-precedent.

See:
http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=239&t=97871&hilit=manual+miss+turn#p2232990

Also, quoting the mod-statement:

king achilles wrote:Although there is nothing saying that you have to deploy first, however, to intentionally make the other player wait because you intend to miss the deployment stage is not right. With all those games provided here, you managed to let all those players wait(even though you are actually there to deploy your troops), just so that you can have the first turn? Whether there is an advantage in this or not, the whole setup, from creating manual/freestyle games and deliberately missing the deployment stage is already wrong.

And with that much games as evidence, b00060 has been warned for gross abuse of the game.

lol i was just about to do that lol

tims_girl_ashley wrote:lol i was just about to do that lol

you were about to quote a thread that was buried in Closed C&A reports 7 months before you joined the site...
perhaps we need to re-visit your situation

king sam wrote:

tims_girl_ashley wrote:lol i was just about to do that lol

you were about to quote a thread that was buried in Closed C&A reports 7 months before you joined the site...
perhaps we need to re-visit your situation

no what i ment is i was just about to do is fix the links meaning fix the players name thats all but he ahd already fixed it.... tell you the truth i had no clue about that thread.

if this is true i can give some more players that do this alot

king sam wrote:

tims_girl_ashley wrote:lol i was just about to do that lol

you were about to quote a thread that was buried in Closed C&A reports 7 months before you joined the site...
perhaps we need to re-visit your situation

Actually "tims_girl_ashley" made that post before I put up the quote. I fixed the links, went into the archive and added my text. The third post came up during the time it took me to do the last part.

eddie2 wrote:if this is true i can give some more players that do this alot

Please do.

However, for the record (as I've said before), I don't approve of this mod practice deeming this to be a "gross abuse" of the game. It's simply playing/taking advantage of the game engine. If the game engine allows for it, I see no point in deeming it to be a rule violation.

tims_girl_ashley wrote:

king sam wrote:

tims_girl_ashley wrote:lol i was just about to do that lol

you were about to quote a thread that was buried in Closed C&A reports 7 months before you joined the site...
perhaps we need to re-visit your situation

no what i ment is i was just about to do is fix the links meaning fix the players name thats all but he ahd already fixed it.... tell you the truth i had no clue about that thread.

word I may have been a bit hasty then my apologies..

thats fine no need to appoligize after looking through it i realize how it looked.

Hi. Firstly, I do not do this to "every opponent" - I'm sure the people pursuing this thread will find that out for themselves. Also, it would probably be for the best if the names of the other people doing this were thrown down, I see it as only fair.

I'd like to say, finally, that I won't be playing any more manual games in which the, what others see as, exploitation of the game engine can arouse such highly-fuelled emotional conflicts. It's not worth it - we're here to have fun, so let's do so without the hate! Also, if anyone is upset by what I've done, I would be more than pleased to have a rematch (or two!) on the same settings with automatic troop placement instead! I see a few games of good old Conquer Clubbing as the perfect solution to any ill-feeling I may have created - apologies on my part!

Thanks,
obliterationX.

I have posted this in several other threads as I have never played any game in my life where it is blatantly ok to abuse the rules i.e. missing a turn to gain an advantage. Like I have already said, if you did not give deferred troops i bet some of the abusers of this and there are plenty of others, would have 100% attendance. But no mods, just make your flippant comments on bury your heads.

hmsps wrote:I have posted this in several other threads as I have never played any game in my life where it is blatantly ok to abuse the rules i.e. missing a turn to gain an advantage. Like I have already said, if you did not give deferred troops i bet some of the abusers of this and there are plenty of others, would have 100% attendance. But no mods, just make your flippant comments on bury your heads.

Even if no deferred troops were given it would still be advantageous to miss turns in this fission as you dont actually do anything during deploy phase for this map.

I agree with previous comment, but hey set up games for manual or whatever the deployment terms and miss a turn = no armies, bet they would take their turns

hmsps wrote:I agree with previous comment, but hey set up games for manual or whatever the deployment terms and miss a turn = no armies, bet they would take their turns

On city mogul you get no troops to deploy for the manual deployment phase thus not deploying would still be an advantage...

I am wondering what has happened to the ethics on this site ??????

I just received this from another player who had the same tactic employed against him/her by ObliterationX

Quote:
Re: obliterationX

Sent: Tue May 25, 2010 8:44 am
From: alching
To: Narrabri
you complain and report him but youll turn out the one who gets banned hes a moderator and an bann anyone on here he is currently thinking of banning you

end quote

So it seems if you are a moderator you can ban anyone who takes exception to your lack of ethical behaviour.

If its true and he is a moderator then it seems expressing an opinion will be dangerous for everyone on CC.

I find it interesting that he hasn't had a single word to say to me since the game began.

The only thing he has done is place me on his Foe list to prevent me joining any other games of his, and that was BEFORE I complained to anyone, anywhere about his cheap tactic.

For me, given his now suspect rank, I am going to find it really difficult to assume that the ranking system has any credibility at all.

Narrabri wrote:I am wondering what has happened to the ethics on this site ??????

I just received this from another player who had the same tactic employed against him/her by ObliterationX

Quote:
Re: obliterationX

Sent: Tue May 25, 2010 8:44 am
From: alching
To: Narrabri
you complain and report him but youll turn out the one who gets banned hes a moderator and an bann anyone on here he is currently thinking of banning you

end quote

So it seems if you are a moderator you can ban anyone who takes exception to your lack of ethical behaviour.

If its true and he is a moderator then it seems expressing an opinion will be dangerous for everyone on CC.

I find it interesting that he hasn't had a single word to say to me since the game began.

The only thing he has done is place me on his Foe list to prevent me joining any other games of his, and that was BEFORE I complained to anyone, anywhere about his cheap tactic.

For me, given his now suspect rank, I am going to find it really difficult to assume that the ranking system has any credibility at all.

He is not a moderator...

As ljex said he is not a moderator. All moderators have their names highlighted in a color.

And moderators are not above the rules, if you took the time to research the Closed reports you would see a few cases that show just that. Everyone on the site is liable for following the rules and structure that is posted in the community guidelines and the rules tab on the home page.

King A has previously ruled this as abuse as noted on the first page in the b00060 case (posted by alster). Obviously this will be viewed under the same light and precedent that was done in that case and if it is determined to be one and the same it will be handled the same, which is according to the guidelines.

Much to everyone's surprise there is integrity and a cohesion from the staff and volunteers on this site. This includes this department. Because there are some cases where there is human error I will go ahead and say roughly 98% of the cases that are ruled upon are done so with the best abilities and knowledge at the given time of the ruling. Situations can occur that will be out of the norm and dictate differently but for the most part the standardization is about as good as your going to get when you get a collective bunch working for the greater good.

I know this case right now is being talked over and will be ruled upon shortly. One of the hunters/C&A mods will be by once they have concluded a decision on this case to give it to the public.

Just to give insight, I am not trying to pass the buck, I have personal matters to tend to and wont have access to the site for a week or so.

Please be patient.

KS

Edit: P.S. In the future do not copy a PM and repost it in the forum. Use the report a post function. Its the little exclamation point button in the corner.

Thanks KS - as I said in my first post on this topic - I have returned to CC after an extended absence. I always remembered how comfortable I felt in this community when I last played so was shocked when I found a high ranking player systematically deadbeating. I'd forgotten about the colour coding for mods and simply took alching at his word. His first PM to me was a scathing rebuke that I had dared to complain and that deadbeating was a legitimate tactic. I invited him to say so here and instead received the above reply.

Narrabri wrote:Thanks KS - as I said in my first post on this topic - I have returned to CC after an extended absence. I always remembered how comfortable I felt in this community when I last played so was shocked when I found a high ranking player systematically deadbeating. I'd forgotten about the colour coding for mods and simply took alching at his word. His first PM to me was a scathing rebuke that I had dared to complain and that deadbeating was a legitimate tactic. I invited him to say so here and instead received the above reply.

Just to clarify, this "scathing rebuke" is not from me, but from another person. Cleverly worded to imcriminate me by posting it in the same topic - consider taking this up elsewhere, if possible.

As mentioned earlier, I am not looking to create hassle and so am not denying these allegations of "intentional deadbeating", and any ill-feeling I have aroused I would be more than willing to make up for with some private games. My upmost apologies for potentially ruining your return to CC with an unexpected "shock". At least you learned the hard way against a "high ranking player", for minimal point-loss, right?

Have a nice day,
obliterationX.

PS: Oh, and I am a mod, watch out.

You may just get off the hook with a "noted" tag...

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=239&t=104403&hilit=city+mogul&start=45#p2371496

king achilles wrote:Creating manual freestyle games with the intention of missing the deployment stage is another annoying tactic. I agree that this is taking advantage of the game engine, but I will still consider this as a general abuse of the game because of the repeated times this has been done. You can't keep creating games with these kind of settings then wait until the deployment stage is over just so you can make the first turn. Since Brann2006 is already active in this thread, this report shall also serve as his warning to stop intentionally missing turns or missing the deployment stage for any tactical reason. You have done it too many times already. Play the game as it is intended to be.

Don't see the differences between Brann2006/b00060 myself, maybe attitude

Narrabri wrote:I am wondering what has happened to the ethics on this site ??????

I just received this from another player who had the same tactic employed against him/her by ObliterationX
Quote:
Re: obliterationX
Sent: Tue May 25, 2010 8:44 am
From: alching
To: Narrabri
you complain and report him but youll turn out the one who gets banned hes a moderator and an bann anyone on here he is currently thinking of banning you

alching must be a buddy of obliterationX's...cause he's lying.

obliterationX wrote:Hi. Firstly, I do not do this to "every opponent" - I'm sure the people pursuing this thread will find that out for themselves. Also, it would probably be for the best if the names of the other people doing this were thrown down, I see it as only fair.

I'd like to say, finally, that I won't be playing any more manual games in which the, what others see as, exploitation of the game engine can arouse such highly-fuelled emotional conflicts. It's not worth it - we're here to have fun, so let's do so without the hate! Also, if anyone is upset by what I've done, I would be more than pleased to have a rematch (or two!) on the same settings with automatic troop placement instead! I see a few games of good old Conquer Clubbing as the perfect solution to any ill-feeling I may have created - apologies on my part!

Thanks,
obliterationX.

You don't need to do it to "every opponent", only those where the game engine allocated first turn to them.

Here is my analysis of the batch you set up (the ones that were there when I joined), that led to my posting in this forum.

Game # Your 1st Turn
7009351 Missed
7009352 Missed
7009353 Missed
7009354 Missed
7009355 Missed
7009356 Played 1st
7009357 Played 1st
7009358 Played 2nd
7009359 Missed
7009360 Simultaneous start with opponent
7009361 Missed

Hard not to see a pattern there I think. All won by you, so those insignificant few points per head start to build up eh ?

Thanks for the apology, it is appreciated - pity it had to get this far before you spoke up.

lol 2 things to say

1)welcome to oblits phone book he has over 50 % of site on foe

2)just to chuck a spanner in the works but this would of definatly of came under what you are saying about abusing faults in the system.
[url]

viewtopic.php?f=239&t=107161&p=2413774&hilit=drisk#p2413774[/url]

also this bit is a bit off topic but i think c and a need to look at the way things opperate with people found guilty a good idea would be

you all gather information but only one of you put the punishment in place(this would stop differences in punishments for the same things)

also if you are wrong in some cases (not that often) admit it dont try cover it up(we can all make mistakes)

eddie2 wrote:
also this bit is a bit off topic but i think c and a need to look at the way things opperate with people found guilty a good idea would be
you all gather information but only one of you put the punishment in place(this would stop differences in punishments for the same things)
also if you are wrong in some cases (not that often) admit it dont try cover it up(we can all make mistakes)

You can feel free to take this to the appropriate forum if you think this is a liable suggestion