Conquer Club

These two players I believe have created an alliance while talking in another language. I have played many games on here... and the way they have been playing is the same as an alliance. And i will no longer play with them or the game we are involved in.game #6389486

Accused:

Asturix
hugh whittam
xxxxxxx



The accused are suspected of:


Conducting Secret Diplomacy

Other: <Explanation>



Game number(s):

[game]xxxxxxx[/game]
[game]xxxxxxx[/game]
[game]xxxxxxx[/game]
[game]xxxxxxx[/game]



Comments:

alterbeast wrote:
Accused:

Asturix
hugh whittam




The accused are suspected of:


Conducting Secret Diplomacy


Game number(s):

Game 6389486




Comments: These two players I believe have created an alliance while talking in another language. I have played many games on here... and the way they have been playing is the same as an alliance. And i will no longer play with them or the game we are involved in.game #6389486

here is my shot at translation via google, obviously some of it is dicey but it is diplomacy in another language...

2010-02-12 12:19:34 - Asturix: Kill me, I have no chance ... Blue, defending our beloved Iberia
2010-02-13 10:03:37 - hugh Whittam I will do my best, red
2010-02-13 10:21:21 - hugh Whittam: Pink, I misdeployed .. and had no choice but to hit you .. sorry.
2010-02-13 13:41:48 - Asturix: Come as we ally ourselves rest of my life in the game, you say
2010-02-13 17:18:17 - hugh Whittam: OK
2010-02-14 08 : 01:22 - hugh Whittam: Attack yellow would be good for me. What do you think?
2010-02-14 14:18:24 - Asturix: come, but I need it or I will also attack gazpacho
2010-02-14 15:37:46 - hugh Whittam: OK I will. But you know I finished the soup, right?
2010-02-14 21:33:09 - Asturix: if it is, but before we make them heavy life to others
2010-02-14 21:39:08 - Asturix: indeed, before a knock back attack dejame the green

Under 'Rules' - subsection 'Community Guidelines':-

Rule #2 on the site states that all diplomatic discussions MUST take place within the Game Chat in English or a language all players can understand. This includes proposing alliances and discussing the strategies of those alliances. Keep this in mind because players who violate it may find themselves Blocked from playing with each other.


This is obviously a clear violation of this rule.

Well except of the expressions more or less is clear what they said even with the google,so I wont translate. But basically red who was almost over decided desesperately to help blue, so one (who talks spanish) win.Then blue said to attack yellow because its seams it was a threat for him...but also for red who said he will be smashed(were he talk about gazpacho) and blue agreed saing that for red this was useless because he is very weak,so read said that the reason was to make it difficult to win for the others...so in that moment blue was going to kill red(or simply attack) and he replied he wanted atleast to attack 1 round to green.


Lol finally i didnt a brief explanatory of their speech lol.

But if red was so weak,he recovered very fast,indeed this was some type of truce,but the funniest think is

2010-02-16 21:20:48 - hugh whittam: You should have said you didn't understand us and I would have gladly translated.

Because saying it is like saying that they didnt hide the alliance...well they did in spanish because they talk in that and no one said anything...as i can see they did because of not knowing much the rules,both of them together dont reach to the 100 games...and played together only this one.So i think they didnt do on purpose.

Ignorance of the rules shouldn't be an excuse !!!

Most of us actually read the rules. Now I will lose and lose points cause they didn't know? I don't see how that seems fair. I refuse to play in that game with them anymore. It's people like these that make it less fun to play this game.. and if issues like this keep up.. I won't be renewing my subscription to this site.

alterbeast wrote:Ignorance of the rules shouldn't be an excuse !!!

Most of us actually read the rules. Now I will lose and lose points cause they didn't know? I don't see how that seems fair. I refuse to play in that game with them anymore. It's people like these that make it less fun to play this game.. and if issues like this keep up.. I won't be renewing my subscription to this site.

1. Don't worry - ignorance of the rules is never an excuse. They will be warned for a rule # 2 violation.
2. However, a rule # 2 violation (as well as for any violation of the unwritten rules) does not entail players being kicked out of games (only a rule # 1 violation causes this). Instead, they are warned and subsequent violations are punished on an escalating scale. And this makes sense, after all, alliances are perfectly fine as such (but shady ones could result in a block playing games together). So you will loose points. Fair or not, get used to it. It's something inherited in the game, we all get our assess kicked in an unfair manner now and then. But in the long-run, it means little as long as people keep reporting rule-breakers.

alterbeast wrote:Ignorance of the rules shouldn't be an excuse !!!

Most of us actually read the rules. Now I will lose and lose points cause they didn't know? I don't see how that seems fair. I refuse to play in that game with them anymore. It's people like these that make it less fun to play this game.. and if issues like this keep up.. I won't be renewing my subscription to this site.

As alster said, they will be dealt with...but you were going to lose that game anyways, realistically.

As far as not being able to have fun with the site and leaving because a couple of kids team up on you every once in a while..well... thats your choice.

You could of course join private games with people who have no alliances though, or even go to callouts for them, or, choose settings that make it so you can kill them even if they do make an alliance, such as a big game on a big map...with escalating, where an alliance is more of an inconvenience to play, but does not stop you all the time.

AAFitz wrote:

alterbeast wrote:Ignorance of the rules shouldn't be an excuse !!!

Most of us actually read the rules. Now I will lose and lose points cause they didn't know? I don't see how that seems fair. I refuse to play in that game with them anymore. It's people like these that make it less fun to play this game.. and if issues like this keep up.. I won't be renewing my subscription to this site.

As alster said, they will be dealt with...but you were going to lose that game anyways, realistically.

As far as not being able to have fun with the site and leaving because a couple of kids team up on you every once in a while..well... thats your choice.

You could of course join private games with people who have no alliances though, or even go to callouts for them, or, choose settings that make it so you can kill them even if they do make an alliance, such as a big game on a big map...with escalating, where an alliance is more of an inconvenience to play, but does not stop you all the time.

People (kids or not) who make secret alliances are unacceptable, as is your inference that we the players should change the games we play to suit the cheaters. I too have thought about leaving the site because of this. I know lot's of others that 'have' left for the same reason.

As far as the "but you were going to lose that game anyways, realistically." comment. Do you think maybe it's possible he got in that position bc of the alliance...

alterbeast wrote:Ignorance of the rules shouldn't be an excuse !!!

Most of us actually read the rules. Now I will lose and lose points cause they didn't know? I don't see how that seems fair. I refuse to play in that game with them anymore. It's people like these that make it less fun to play this game.. and if issues like this keep up.. I won't be renewing my subscription to this site.

I never said that lets forget it because they didnt know the rules(that is not something sure) just something that I think they didnt do on purpose,but i said because i though that maybe they would got banned(but after reading in this post,it only aplies to rule 1)so after saying that it was for to tell them they should be warned and not banned(because i though mods depending on the situation give warned,ban temporally,permanent ban...)

Anyway I have talk to them about that(that you should talk about the game in a language that all the players understands) and rule 1 in the chat game and the red one replied:

I never hidded anything,all the conversation is there,if he was so curious,then should have asked o search in bablefish,there are so many translators.

Come on,how can i know wich language everyone understands,spanish should be allowed because its an official language on the UNO

The last part was the best. and more because and the begining of the chat he talked in english

I never hidded anything,all the conversation is there,if he was so curious,then should have asked o search in bablefish,there are so many translators.

Come on,how can i know wich language everyone understands,spanish should be allowed because its an official language on the UNO

You don't have to. You KNOW the language which everyone on CC plays with is English. Complaining that they should go use bablefish is elitist bullshit. What if I started chatting in pikey dialect or some other language they didn't know? Do I expect them to search for a fucking web translator? Go to the library?

Yes they put it in the chat, but why did they switch from English to Spanish and then back again? It's exclusionary, and they may have done it on purpose to be semi legal for having it "in the chat"

Snowgun wrote:It's exclusionary, and they may have done it on purpose to be semi legal for having it "in the chat"

I still don't think they have do it on purpose...but anyways is not "semi-legal" is completely illegal, because the rules says clearly

Any form of diplomatic discussion between opponents must be posted in the game chat in English or in a language that all opponents understand.

by the way the comment of blue,he translated so no work for me

Obviously, I agree with Asturix. Why should English be accepted as the 'Lingua Franca' of CC? I am sure that there are many who don't have English as their first language who are bewildered by what is said in the 'game chat' section. Do you hear them complain?
Anyway what happens to this game? Is it forfeit?

I just replied him that it was a fallacy because the page is in english and everyone who regiters...they shoud atleast know something of english in order to register.

P.S.This is my last reply for them in the game chat(dont want to make spam )

P.S.This seems another reason to make the instruccions multi-lingual . I would help to the spanish tranlation if needed.

I agree that a warning is NOT enuff...default any points either may win from the game and give to complainaint...if someone else wins(no active link)...let the points stand...
I have had my own probs with players conversing in NON-English lang...okay if EVERYONE is competent ain Swahili or any other language but not as a shroud for diplomacy...
Suggest a Warning AND STRIPPING OF POINTS and awarding points to complainaint if approp...

I still don't think they have do it on purpose...but anyways is not "semi-legal" is completely illegal, because the rules says clearly

yea, sorry, what I meant by this is was more like CYA, that if they got caught (which they did) they could say "Oh, we didn't realize it had to be ENGLISH, we would have translated if someone asked, hell, it was IN the chat! Just use babelfish!"

Obviously, I agree with Asturix. Why should English be accepted as the 'Lingua Franca' of CC? I am sure that there are many who don't have English as their first language who are bewildered by what is said in the 'game chat' section. Do you hear them complain?

This is also a fallacy because CC is not required TO DO SHIT. If they want a multi language site they can make one themselves, and have their own rules. Many multi-lingual's play on this site, have their own forums, ect. It's just mathematically obvious that the greatest common language to base rules off of is English.

Anyway, Don't mean to vent at you darth, you have been really helpful. This kind of thinking just pisses me off, and more so that it looks like they used languages barriers to cheat and then complain about it!. and I even speak more than one language....

Snowgun wrote:Anyway, Don't mean to vent at you darth, you have been really helpful. This kind of thinking just pisses me off, and more so that it looks like they used languages barriers to cheat and then complain about it!. and I even speak more than one language....

Vent at me? I didnt think about that because as I said I agree with you no with them(also said that what blue said it was a fallacy). But because there are multi lingual forums I think that atleast the FAQ,instrucctions and rules should be also in other languages(of course first one english) because I see many people in the international forum that dont know sufficient english to understand the rules.

Would be a good suggestion.

Just wanted to make sure you knew I wasn't aiming my rants at you or anything, some people can't really tell...

Well...the game finished with blue winning...this are the last comments if you are interested

red:here comes the inevitable,it was a pleasure to ally
blue:Thanks.bye
blue:thanks for your help
red:Ok bye


Well and after that they havent played another game together...yet.

If your going to complain about ignorance of the rules then you should really read them in their entirety to understand the disciplinary actions taken in a case that involves Secret Diplomacy.

alterbeast wrote:Ignorance of the rules shouldn't be an excuse !!!
Most of us actually read the rules. Now I will lose and lose points cause they didn't know? I don't see how that seems fair. I refuse to play in that game with them anymore. It's people like these that make it less fun to play this game.. and if issues like this keep up.. I won't be renewing my subscription to this site.

These 2 have been found guilty of conspiring together in a language that all users did not understand in the game chat area and thus have been Blocked from playing together in future games.

King Sam