D2 of The Mafiosi Vincent Vega Vengeful game

[Extreme Ways]

Vote EW

I don't like that he has gone AWOL early doors D1.

understandable tbh.

Strike is so far not surprising me in a bad way, but also nothing clearing. Information instead of analysis on no lynch but it's an obligatory message that needs to be said.

I dont understand jfm's response to Rag. The way people respond is how you read them, but this is on the basis of being uninformed vs informed. Probing into something in which everybody is uninformed (the nature of flavour and exact setup) will not help. Even more exemplified by Sonic's previous game in which Strike and I, masons, received so much information about the setup and yet were still in the dark.

[Extreme Ways]

Im getting the feeling that EW and Strike are almost deliberately ignoring it

I just hadnt read it until I read my warning (and even then I didnt read it)]

@ Sonic might be useful to announce when someone is self-dousing in thread/keep it part of the "votecount" messages.

[strike wolf]

Could you be loved?

Well I'll tell you one thing. I didn't shoot the deputy. Or the sheriff for that matter.

[kongming3]

Point of note for town night action planning, there apparently is a chance that any supposed town doctors are actually quacks without knowing it and therefore could be unexpectedly useless.

[Ragian]

Unvote

Nice to have you back at least. I fear you soft-playing me, though (but I have just seen you in action as scum when I was modding the latest game).

@Charle, I know! Why on earth would you do that? Would you prefer everyone silent and just going to night?

[Loose Canon]

unvote extreme vote strike

[SoN!c]

Official vote count

Kingm (1): Extreme Ways
Strike wolf (1): Loose canon

[Loose Canon]

The tik tok threw me onto a no lynch vote for a while.

The gripe I have about a D1 default position of no lynch is mafia have to take a disingenuous stance on suspicions, as opposed to town who just have to take stances that come from an honest place at the time.

And every subsequent post by mafia whether it is doubling down on a stance or retracting from it is also then disingenuous.

So I think no lynch voting D1, by townies, sorta delays the point at which mafia have to start to be disingenuous and is therefore suboptimal.

[Charle]

The tik tok threw me onto a no lynch vote for a while.

The gripe I have about a D1 default position of no lynch is mafia have to take a disingenuous stance on suspicions, as opposed to town who just have to take stances that come from an honest place at the time.

And every subsequent post by mafia whether it is doubling down on a stance or retracting from it is also then disingenuous.

So I think no lynch voting D1, by townies, sorta delays the point at which mafia have to start to be disingenuous and is therefore suboptimal.

I agree in this game, but igRaan and EW suggest we should kill one of our own to get some results from who was voting or maybe a claim that is worth for Scum to know and decreasing our numbers.

[Ragian]

Vote Charle

At no point have I said that a D1 lynch MUST happen. The threat of it has to be present, however. If people vote no lynch early doors D1, everyone is let off free. Mafia can just cruise into night knowing full well that no townie has any idea who should be targeted for any available night actions. Charle, you're agreeing with EW that doing nothing D1 hands the first move to scum. Now, you're also agreeing with LC (whose basically on the same page as me). Still, you're voting no lynch. And you're (perhaps deliberately) misrepresenting my point. You've earned your D1 vote at least

[SoN!c]

Official vote count

Kingm (1): Extreme Ways
Strike wolf (1): Loose canon
Charle (1): Ragian

[SoN!c]

I need a mojito. And so does Vinnie

[Kingm]

Unvote Vote Devante

[SoN!c]

Official vote count

Kingm (1): Extreme Ways
Strike wolf (1): Loose canon
Charle (1): Ragian
Devante (1): Kingm

[Extreme Ways]

I take the biggest issue with kingm going for on lynch because they argued that a lot of this was guessing (which is true), and voting no lynch makes that worse. Sonic also requires a majority to end the day in a lynch, so a lynch is highly unlikely because I'm not voting willy-nilly for just about everyone.

Votes help in analysing nightkills too. If I die, it may be because kingm is mafia. It's a bit wifom, but Mafia do like to kill people who suspect them or are afraid of if they can get away with it.

[SoN!c]

Im getting the feeling that EW and Strike are almost deliberately ignoring it

I just hadnt read it until I read my warning (and even then I didnt read it)]

@ Sonic might be useful to announce when someone is self-dousing in thread/keep it part of the "votecount" messages.

Deadline D1 countdown timer:

show

https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/to?iso=20250413T10&p0=337&msg=VVV+D1+ENDTIME&font=cursive&csz=1

Current "self-dousing" standings:
2 players are on active countdown (auto-prime mechanic triggered): Maxleod and EW. 1 is getting mighty close (Devante).

[Loose Canon]

Has anyone seen anything by a player that could be a hint to mafia that they are secretly mafia aligned?

[Extreme Ways]

Has anyone seen anything by a player that could be a hint to mafia that they are secretly mafia aligned?

Yes, I think Kingm is mafia-aligned for wanting to just let d1 pass. It's that, or they are a powerful town pr believing the night to be useful (so cop or jailkeeper. Usually I'd add vigilante too but vig would want to have some basis for vigging someone).

@Sonic for the jailkeeper mod, I assume it's the roleblock + protect one right?

[Kingm]

I take the biggest issue with kingm going for on lynch because they argued that a lot of this was guessing (which is true), and voting no lynch makes that worse. Sonic also requires a majority to end the day in a lynch, so a lynch is highly unlikely because I'm not voting willy-nilly for just about everyone.

Votes help in analysing nightkills too. If I die, it may be because kingm is mafia. It's a bit wifom, but Mafia do like to kill people who suspect them or are afraid of if they can get away with it.

First of all, I have always thought that no lynch day 1 made the most sense, since there is like zero to go on, but I'm still a scrub in this game, and I have started to read the mafiauniverse game EW posted earlier today, and ok I probably was a bit "trigger happy" with the no vote.
But I still do not get how no lynch is the best for scum, would not a lynch (with the bad odds we have now) be the best for scum? Or is it something I'm not getting?

And EW, I feel you comment now almost guaranteed death for 2 townies (if you are town that is), because why would not scum jump on the opportunity to kill you and also kill another townie and stay safe from D2 lynch?
But you are way to good at this game, so you made yourself a target for some reason, and probably hope that doctor/jailkeeper protects you N1? Or maybe you are scum yourself? But your comment does not feel scummy at all, nah I have to stop thinking for now, and wait and see some more new post.

Also Unvote

[Extreme Ways]

I take the biggest issue with kingm going for on lynch because they argued that a lot of this was guessing (which is true), and voting no lynch makes that worse. Sonic also requires a majority to end the day in a lynch, so a lynch is highly unlikely because I'm not voting willy-nilly for just about everyone.

Votes help in analysing nightkills too. If I die, it may be because kingm is mafia. It's a bit wifom, but Mafia do like to kill people who suspect them or are afraid of if they can get away with it.

First of all, I have always thought that no lynch day 1 made the most sense, since there is like zero to go on, but I'm still a scrub in this game, and I have started to read the mafiauniverse game EW posted earlier today, and ok I probably was a bit "trigger happy" with the no vote.
But I still do not get how no lynch is the best for scum, would not a lynch (with the bad odds we have now) be the best for scum? Or is it something I'm not getting?

And EW, I feel you comment now almost guaranteed death for 2 townies (if you are town that is), because why would not scum jump on the opportunity to kill you and also kill another townie and stay safe from D2 lynch?
But you are way to good at this game, so you made yourself a target for some reason, and probably hope that doctor/jailkeeper protects you N1? Or maybe you are scum yourself? But your comment does not feel scummy at all, nah I have to stop thinking for now, and wait and see some more new post.

Also Unvote

Maybe I confused you with kongming then?

The odds is lynching town is highest right now, but the odds of mafia killing town are even higher. Without power roles, the best chance to lynch a mafia is to wait until you have to. The best chance to win the game is to lynch as much as you can such that patterns emerge. If Sonic and I were never under pressure from Loose last game, we would never have buddied up so hard. The "pattern" was that Sonic was defending me without really questioning whether I was mafia, and I was not unsuspecting of Sonic but never actually pushed or voted him.

If you add power roles to the mix, we can assume mafia has power roles as well and the arsonist/pyromaniac makes it that effectively 2 townies die every night (with some caveats).

TLDR: mafia push an agenda, and if town doesn't utilise their lynch power the agenda pushes itself without mafia interference.

[SoN!c]

Has anyone seen anything by a player that could be a hint to mafia that they are secretly mafia aligned?

Yes, I think Kingm is mafia-aligned for wanting to just let d1 pass. It's that, or they are a powerful town pr believing the night to be useful (so cop or jailkeeper. Usually I'd add vigilante too but vig would want to have some basis for vigging someone).

@Sonic for the jailkeeper mod, I assume it's the roleblock + protect one right?

The jailkeeper is the classic version: the one that protects its target from any number of kills, but also Roleblocks the target at the same time. That protection includes the "prime" action or "ignite" kill of the arsonist (or any other scum night action).

The jailkeeper is the only strong town role that has not been soft-altered (Because firefighter and jailkeeper are the 2 main roles to counter the arsonist).
Only the jailkeeper and the firefighter will protect town against the arsonist "ignite kill" (The "ignite-kill" pierces Doctor and Bulletproof protection). Because Jailer is also a Roleblocker, the Jailkeeper is never allowed to self-target, while the firefighter is. The firefighter's actions are ofcourse solely focussed on the arsonist while the jailkeeper actions also targets or counters the mafia.

[jfm10]

Still not seeing anything but a lynch day 1 would end up being a townie.

[Extreme Ways]

Still not seeing anything but a lynch day 1 would end up being a townie.

And a night 1 kill wouldnt?

[strike wolf]

I take the biggest issue with kingm going for on lynch because they argued that a lot of this was guessing (which is true), and voting no lynch makes that worse. Sonic also requires a majority to end the day in a lynch, so a lynch is highly unlikely because I'm not voting willy-nilly for just about everyone.

Votes help in analysing nightkills too. If I die, it may be because kingm is mafia. It's a bit wifom, but Mafia do like to kill people who suspect them or are afraid of if they can get away with it.

First of all, I have always thought that no lynch day 1 made the most sense, since there is like zero to go on, but I'm still a scrub in this game, and I have started to read the mafiauniverse game EW posted earlier today, and ok I probably was a bit "trigger happy" with the no vote.
But I still do not get how no lynch is the best for scum, would not a lynch (with the bad odds we have now) be the best for scum? Or is it something I'm not getting?

And EW, I feel you comment now almost guaranteed death for 2 townies (if you are town that is), because why would not scum jump on the opportunity to kill you and also kill another townie and stay safe from D2 lynch?
But you are way to good at this game, so you made yourself a target for some reason, and probably hope that doctor/jailkeeper protects you N1? Or maybe you are scum yourself? But your comment does not feel scummy at all, nah I have to stop thinking for now, and wait and see some more new post.

Also Unvote

It's as others pointed out, the day doesn't have to end in a lynch but the discussion and pressure put on players can lead to slips that are helpful in analyzing the game going forward. Automatically committing to no lynch at the beginning of the day just means that everyone can be relaxed, not have to try as hard and, barring a successful investigation which is unlikely N1,come into D2 with little more info than we had to work on D1.

[Ragian]

Where did Charle go? Why did all you "there's nothing to go on" not at least bother to comment on what I said about him? Patterns, people! I need patterns!