Copyed maps(Andy read)

[gimil]

OMG, you guys are just talking shit!! Conquer Club knocked of Risk Hasbro!! Did Conquer Club get sued?

So just imagine RJ sueing Grand stragey LMFAO!

as usual humley your spouting shit

CC is a clone of the risk game, lack created this site from nothing. Wrote the code, got the first maps made etc

Mr GD has taken RJ's image and poorly used photoshop to tweek that image this in effect means he stole the image and disguised it. Its not like lack stole the code for CC is it?

[RjBeals]

Here's the 2 large italy maps on top of each other. The maps blink in and out so you can compare the 2. He obviously traced my map, as the borders aren't as accurate (or as smooth). But even so, he used the same textrues and drop shadows and water routes...

(.2 sec per frame)
http://www.rjbeals.com/italy/2_italy.gif


and here's the same image slowed down to 1sec per frame.
http://www.rjbeals.com/italy/2_italy2.gif

[RjBeals]

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 7074#47074

I have good relations with the guys from W@W and LandGrab. We have a lot of respect each other's work and appreciate the friendly rivalry between our websites. We'd never stoop down to the level of directly targeting each other's userbase.

If that's they way you do things, bryanbr, so be it. I won't censor your posts promoting your game site here.

But mark my words - CC will always be two steps ahead of GS.

[hulmey]

OMG, you guys are just talking shit!! Conquer Club knocked of Risk Hasbro!! Did Conquer Club get sued?

So just imagine RJ sueing Grand stragey LMFAO!

as usual humley your spouting shit

CC is a clone of the risk game, lack created this site from nothing. Wrote the code, got the first maps made etc

Mr GD has taken RJ's image and poorly used photoshop to tweek that image this in effect means he stole the image and disguised it. Its not like lack stole the code for CC is it?

Im talking shit!! LMAO....Well you try to take Grand stragey to court and see if you get anywhere. I really wish you good luck with that. You never know you may here something back in 20 years time. Tv and film companies have massive problems in stopping privacy over the internet, so ireally doubt how successful you are going to be!

As to the lack question! Yes he did porn the Risk idea of Hasbro! But he didnt copy it compelety or use it names. Copyright is very delicate issue and even the slighest difference in the product can null and void the copyright!

So good luck with that Gimil!!!

[TheShiningSun]

Lol so I looked up the guy's username on CC and found out that back in May of '06 I actually played a game with the guy lol.

I think im gonna go and set him a neg forward luckily never have left him a feedback. I think its not too late nearly 2 years later eh?

Edit: Darn seems like its too late

[DiM]

wtf??? he even uses jota's coordinate xml creator.

look here: http://denizengames.com/grandstrategy/maphelp.faces

this guy is really an ass

[hulmey]

please send all compliants and querys here>>>> bryanbrun@yahoo.com

[RjBeals]

So just imagine RJ sueing Grand stragey LMFAO!

hulmey - I cant imagine me suing GS so please stop laughing. It's not meant to funny. It's the simple fact that I spent 10 months creating that map, and it hits me personally to see that guy blatantly ripping it off for his site. I know that he simply traced my map, so it's "his" image, kind of the same as I traced an online map originally to produce my map. So I'm sure I don't stand a chance to start throwing the law at him. If only he would have changed some colors at least?!?! The guys simply an ass. He probably had some harsh words with Lack and now he's out to prove something. Man... If I only had better computer hacking skills.

[bryguy]

So just imagine RJ sueing Grand stragey LMFAO!

hulmey - I cant imagine me suing GS so please stop laughing. It's not meant to funny. It's the simple fact that I spent 10 months creating that map, and it hits me personally to see that guy blatantly ripping it off for his site. I know that he simply traced my map, so it's "his" image, kind of the same as I traced an online map originally to produce my map. So I'm sure I don't stand a chance to start throwing the law at him. If only he would have changed some colors at least?!?! The guys simply an ass. He probably had some harsh words with Lack and now he's out to prove something. Man... If I only had better computer hacking skills.

wonder if you can find where he lives, then when he leaves his house get on his computer, delete all his files/wipe his hard drive, then take all his stuff

[Kaplowitz]

So just imagine RJ sueing Grand stragey LMFAO!

hulmey - I cant imagine me suing GS so please stop laughing. It's not meant to funny. It's the simple fact that I spent 10 months creating that map, and it hits me personally to see that guy blatantly ripping it off for his site. I know that he simply traced my map, so it's "his" image, kind of the same as I traced an online map originally to produce my map. So I'm sure I don't stand a chance to start throwing the law at him. If only he would have changed some colors at least?!?! The guys simply an ass. He probably had some harsh words with Lack and now he's out to prove something. Man... If I only had better computer hacking skills.

wonder if you can find where he lives, then when he leaves his house get on his computer, delete all his files/wipe his hard drive, then take all his stuff

that may be illegal............... .

[bryguy]

So just imagine RJ sueing Grand stragey LMFAO!

hulmey - I cant imagine me suing GS so please stop laughing. It's not meant to funny. It's the simple fact that I spent 10 months creating that map, and it hits me personally to see that guy blatantly ripping it off for his site. I know that he simply traced my map, so it's "his" image, kind of the same as I traced an online map originally to produce my map. So I'm sure I don't stand a chance to start throwing the law at him. If only he would have changed some colors at least?!?! The guys simply an ass. He probably had some harsh words with Lack and now he's out to prove something. Man... If I only had better computer hacking skills.

wonder if you can find where he lives, then when he leaves his house get on his computer, delete all his files/wipe his hard drive, then take all his stuff

that may be illegal............... .

hmmm..... anybody feel like being an outlaw for a day??

[OnlyAmbrose]

What a jerk.

Still, this kinda thing makes you proud to play on CC, the original source

[WidowMakers]

legally youcan't do anything even if it's a blatant copy. the thing is he didn't actually make it identical.

If the person creating a second work had access to the original work and the works are virtually identical, copying is likely to be presumed even if the chance of access is remote.

Copyright does not give an owner the right to sell or distribute a work. For example, consider one person's drawing of another's painting. Even if copyrightable (and it may not be), the drawing would infringe copyright in the original painting.

See DiM. The drawing is different BUT not different enough to not infringe on the copyright.

It is VERY obvious that he copied RJ's map, based on the original (the map is virtually identical). He violated the copyright.

Now as RJ said, what is there that he can really do. Probably not much (for lack of time or money) but the fact remains, RJ's map and others have had copyright infringement.

WM

[asl80]

enough with the talk of suing, it's one of the most corrupting and ridiculous aspects of our law.

as for this guy copying the maps, I don't support him, but a bit of distanced reflection will show us that it's really not the most horrible thing that he's done. (Someone's gotta stick up for the little guy).

Picture this - which might be the absolute farthest from the truth, but we must of course give our adversaries the best benefit of the doubt - bryan, or what ever his name is, just wanted a risk site of his own to tweak and setup how he likes, not having any power to change things in a bigger site like cc, so he goes and sets up his own with no real pretentions to originality (i really hope he hasn't branded the copied maps with his own name here - but hey, if he did, least the changes are his responsibility, i.e. artistic and self-reflective/representative responsibility). So he copies some maps and methods and procedures in order that his site can run sufficiently. We could here say, so what, he's got his own site to play with, and he gets along happily, what do we care, we've got our own, and, as we stick here, we must actually think it's more interesting, and so, happy with our own site, what do we care what someone else is up to. The point is that just because we (and i obviously don't really mean me as i have no part in it at all) have created something that's good and works, doesn't mean we should deny someone else the priveledge of taking what we have created and exploring it further themselves.

This brings to the second point; patent's are the second most ridiculuos aspect of our legal tradition (or somewhere in the vicinity).

Final point for illustration; COnsider our great artistic and philosophical traditions. Activity 1; has any great painter or writer ever worried that someone has learnt, internalised and developed on their work? ... Answer 1; i would say no, {but of course, i'm sure, as rj and others are perfectly right in feeling, that our great artists and philosophers would have been beside themselves to know that their works had been misconstrued and followed in the wrong, or contrary, directions - but this still is just a part of life, and of the honour, priveledge, and responsibility to be engaged in a creative tradition. [don't worry rj, the better products are always remembered most]} - and as an aside, it is the very essence of our philosophical and artistic traditions that they are a development on what has come before ... and not always for the better, it would be a mistake to believe that either tradition is a matter of positive progression, of onwards and upwards, no no, we move even here in cycles.

So take it as it comes, and remember to laugh (hard and deeply).
let him go, what harm can he do you? i say he can only break down our impulse to gather, guard and fend off,

... let it be, let life be as such.

[WidowMakers]

So basically you are saying that if you spent 20 hours making a video game program or painting a picture, taking a photograph and someone stole it an d passed it off as there own to make money you would not care? I doubt it.

I am all for sticking up for the little guy, but not if he is a thief.

Lets see you make a map for this site and have me take it, spend 5 minutes "tweaking" it to "make" it my own "art" and see if you are not a little unhappy.

WM

[gimil]

So basically you are saying that if you spent 20 hours making a video game program or painting a picture, taking a photograph and someone stole it an d passed it off as there own to make money you would not care? I doubt it.

I am all for sticking up for the little guy, but not if he is a thief.

Lets see you make a map for this site and have me take it, spend 5 minutes "tweaking" it to "make" it my own "art" and see if you are not a little unhappy.

WM

Agrred, you obviously never worked hard on a piece of art. I know that after months of hard labour and many many hours in form of a comp, if i found feudal war on another site i would be horribly mad

[Unit_2]

So basically you are saying that if you spent 20 hours making a video game program or painting a picture, taking a photograph and someone stole it an d passed it off as there own to make money you would not care? I doubt it.

I am all for sticking up for the little guy, but not if he is a thief.

Lets see you make a map for this site and have me take it, spend 5 minutes "tweaking" it to "make" it my own "art" and see if you are not a little unhappy.

WM

Agrred, you obviously never worked hard on a piece of art. I know that after months of hard labour and many many hours in form of a comp, if i found feudal war on another site i would be horribly mad

Yes...If Japan is EVER got copied i will never rest untill i make the person who stole it live a living HELL...

I spent 4 months on it so far(I know I didn't do the graphics but I am the master mind behind it and tell Telvannia what needs done so he doesn't have ot take a hour to read the forum, think about what needs done and do it), Bryan, don't you DARE think about stealing my map, because if you do i will do what is said above.

[hulmey]

I can all respect your artistic talents and so on!! Many people in life steal ideas and so on...

Mibi stole my D-day map idea. I could not have made such a beautiful map as his, but he still stole my idea without even asking me if i mind. Did i mind NO!! But i would have liked him to ask me if its ok!!

This is where the true matter lies. I'm quite sure that RJ wouldnt have minded his map being put up on Grand Stragey if they only asked him. it is afer all a huge compliment to him that they really wanted his map. Grand Stragey only copy Maps from CC that have good graohics and good game play.

[edbeard]

I had always thought you two both had the same idea and you were just the first one to actually post it.

But, I'll let mibi fight his own battle.

[RjBeals]

... The point is that just because we have created something that's good and works, doesn't mean we should deny someone else the priveledge of taking what we have created and exploring it further themselves.

I like you asl. You look at the big picture and try to put it in perspective. At first read, I was like... "Yeah, why should I care if this Bryan kid uses my map on his site. He's not making money and other people are enjoying playing on the map." But it's human nature to covet what is yours. Like WM said - I'm not against the little guy, and frankly don't care at all about this guy and his risk style website. I do care that he's STEALING from this site and using on his own, without acknowledging the creators. So therefore, I don't agree with your quote above. If he would have asked, I probably would have said sure. But he didn't, and erased my name from my map.

...and as an aside, it is the very essence of our philosophical and artistic traditions that they are a development on what has come before ... and not always for the better, it would be a mistake to believe that either tradition is a matter of positive progression, of onwards and upwards, no no, we move even here in cycles.

Yeah - that kind of blew my mind. It sounds poetic, but I can't seem to relate it to the topic.

[BaldAdonis]

I do care that he's STEALING from this site and using on his own, without acknowledging the creators

The best part is that he makes it inferior, not only by tracing but by changing the game play. If only they knew what they were missing.

[DiM]

legally youcan't do anything even if it's a blatant copy. the thing is he didn't actually make it identical.

If the person creating a second work had access to the original work and the works are virtually identical, copying is likely to be presumed even if the chance of access is remote.

Copyright does not give an owner the right to sell or distribute a work. For example, consider one person's drawing of another's painting. Even if copyrightable (and it may not be), the drawing would infringe copyright in the original painting.

See DiM. The drawing is different BUT not different enough to not infringe on the copyright.

It is VERY obvious that he copied RJ's map, based on the original (the map is virtually identical). He violated the copyright.

Now as RJ said, what is there that he can really do. Probably not much (for lack of time or money) but the fact remains, RJ's map and others have had copyright infringement.

WM

i think this is about the "virtually identical" thing.

from that i understand it has to be identical to the very last pixel which is not, that's why i said that even if it is a blatant copy it isn't identical. but perhaps i'm wrongly understanding this.

[gimil]

legally youcan't do anything even if it's a blatant copy. the thing is he didn't actually make it identical.

If the person creating a second work had access to the original work and the works are virtually identical, copying is likely to be presumed even if the chance of access is remote.

Copyright does not give an owner the right to sell or distribute a work. For example, consider one person's drawing of another's painting. Even if copyrightable (and it may not be), the drawing would infringe copyright in the original painting.

See DiM. The drawing is different BUT not different enough to not infringe on the copyright.

It is VERY obvious that he copied RJ's map, based on the original (the map is virtually identical). He violated the copyright.

Now as RJ said, what is there that he can really do. Probably not much (for lack of time or money) but the fact remains, RJ's map and others have had copyright infringement.

WM

i think this is about the "virtually identical" thing.

from that i understand it has to be identical to the very last pixel which is not, that's why i said that even if it is a blatant copy it isn't identical. but perhaps i'm wrongly understanding this.

It has to be reasonable similar, not identical

Also RJ can prove his image was the origonal by the creation date of his PSD file

[Wisse]

just passing by, this is....
i guess the only thing we could do if he doesn't want to remove the maps, is saying that his account will be banned and his ip adress too if he still refuses

[asl80]

hahaha. (in general)

cheers. (and good on you to rj - you know what your labours have been)

and as a response to widowmakers;
... campbels soup. (or how ever you spell it)
{i spoke not of feelings or taste - but only of a just approach}
[and part of the point above was that the little guy could be nothing but a thief - which i know isn't true in itself, but of a matter of us taking the best approach] - p.s WM, for the record, i agree with your need to "scare quote" "art", but this is only a matter of taste.
Also; i work hard on what is dear and important to me, and for me i can only present as my own what truly is, and be proud of it as so, to whatever degree of merit others would place on it. So yes, your right, to make something your own you really have to labour over something, and pour yourself into it, however demanded, and those who skip these essentials can not escape the fact that they have done so. This is more of a burden than public reproachment, which is often in the end all that is wished for, and it is only at this point that public justice enters, when we consider the responsibility of addressing the needs of others.

but unit_2, i know your young, but surely this would be a good time to consider that transgressions need not always be met with punitive reactions - which leads to the other older guys, we pass on values through discussion, response and action ... so make sure we offer the best of ourselves when we do.

p.s. thanks for the avenue for some verbal diahorea, and thought teasing. nothing like a bit of debate to keep us human.

... but I can't seem to relate it to the topic.

damn, that's what my teachers always tell me. hehe ... ahh, what do they know.